Official TJ Admissions Decisions Results for the Class of 2025

[Anonymous]

Look, if poor people can't do it or have it, it shouldn't exist. Simple as that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:[quote=Anonymous
No, the argument is that there's inherent value in sports, music, arts, math clubs, robotics etc. These make for a good life, good society and represent value to children and adults regardless of their effect (which is usually miniscule if at all) on college admissions. Test prep has no inherent value to life. It's just aimed at an artificial hoop--performance on a particular measure--not on a valued skill.
There is a strong resistance to test prep culture in the US and interest in figuring out how to stop putting families in a position where it feels necessary to get a good education.

You're assuming that places like Curie spend the bulk of their time teaching test prep, rather than also spending a lot of time teaching math, writing, and other academic topics.

I'd be fine with those places if they didn't do test prep. (But they always seem to do it.) I personally don't believe it's best for children's long-term learning to have extra hours of academic instruction as opposed to play/enrichment in areas of interests that varies from school (e.g., robotics, music lessons, math competitions), but I don't see need to impose that view on others. But I also don't think extra academic instruction should result in disproportionate access to educational opportunities over alternate enrichment. The immediate rewards of extra instruction might show up more on near-term assessments whereas the longer term (but likely more relevant) impact of robotics competitions and the like will make better STEM professionals. We shouldn't have admissions policies that reward the former at the expense of the latter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
No, the argument is that there's inherent value in sports, music, arts, math clubs, robotics etc. These make for a good life, good society and represent value to children and adults regardless of their effect (which is usually miniscule if at all) on college admissions. Test prep has no inherent value to life. It's just aimed at an artificial hoop--performance on a particular measure--not on a valued skill.
There is a strong resistance to test prep culture in the US and interest in figuring out how to stop putting families in a position where it feels necessary to get a good education.

You're assuming that places like Curie spend the bulk of their time teaching test prep, rather than also spending a lot of time teaching math, writing, and other academic topics.

I'd be fine with those places if they didn't do test prep. (But they always seem to do it.) I personally don't believe it's best for children's long-term learning to have extra hours of academic instruction as opposed to play/enrichment in areas of interests that varies from school (e.g., robotics, music lessons, math competitions), but I don't see need to impose that view on others. But I also don't think extra academic instruction should result in disproportionate access to educational opportunities over alternate enrichment. The immediate rewards of extra instruction might show up more on near-term assessments whereas the longer term (but likely more relevant) impact of robotics competitions and the like will make better STEM professionals. We shouldn't have admissions policies that reward the former at the expense of the latter.

Again, you're making a lot of assumptions about the way the old system worked. Kids who just had high test scores and grades but nothing else generally weren't accepted to TJ. TJ wanted to see the robotics clubs, high level music interest, math competition success, or even things like Model UN. The teachers and coaches for those clubs wrote strong recommendations. The kids themselves talked about their activities in the essays. Earning high scores on the TJ test only got you to the semifinalist level. At that point, they weeded out the kids who didn't seem to have much to offer to the school. Many of the Curie kids prepped for the TJ test, but they're also highly advanced overachievers with many awards to their names in many different academic and musical areas. Curie is most likely not tipping the balance much at all for many of these kids, but rather the demographic served by Curie (middle and upper middle class South Asians with graduate degrees in STEM) already tended toward producing kids who look like ideal STEM magnet students.

All of this seems much better than the current admissions policies, which don't even reward the alternate enrichment or any real achievements. Kids who do extensive prep, kids who excel in enrichment areas of interest, and kids who do absolutely nothing at all aside from school are all being treated the same. Heck, they aren't even rewarding 7th grade Algebra I, which is readily available to every child in FCPS through their regular school classes. Any kid who massively failed IAAT, took Algebra in 8th, did no extracurriculars of any kind, and only got straight As from watered down covid grades are just as likely to get accepted as the kids who are brilliant with many high level activities and achievements.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
No, the argument is that there's inherent value in sports, music, arts, math clubs, robotics etc. These make for a good life, good society and represent value to children and adults regardless of their effect (which is usually miniscule if at all) on college admissions. Test prep has no inherent value to life. It's just aimed at an artificial hoop--performance on a particular measure--not on a valued skill.
There is a strong resistance to test prep culture in the US and interest in figuring out how to stop putting families in a position where it feels necessary to get a good education.

You're assuming that places like Curie spend the bulk of their time teaching test prep, rather than also spending a lot of time teaching math, writing, and other academic topics.

I'd be fine with those places if they didn't do test prep. (But they always seem to do it.) I personally don't believe it's best for children's long-term learning to have extra hours of academic instruction as opposed to play/enrichment in areas of interests that varies from school (e.g., robotics, music lessons, math competitions), but I don't see need to impose that view on others. But I also don't think extra academic instruction should result in disproportionate access to educational opportunities over alternate enrichment. The immediate rewards of extra instruction might show up more on near-term assessments whereas the longer term (but likely more relevant) impact of robotics competitions and the like will make better STEM professionals. We shouldn't have admissions policies that reward the former at the expense of the latter.

Again, you're making a lot of assumptions about the way the old system worked. Kids who just had high test scores and grades but nothing else generally weren't accepted to TJ. TJ wanted to see the robotics clubs, high level music interest, math competition success, or even things like Model UN. The teachers and coaches for those clubs wrote strong recommendations. The kids themselves talked about their activities in the essays. Earning high scores on the TJ test only got you to the semifinalist level. At that point, they weeded out the kids who didn't seem to have much to offer to the school. Many of the Curie kids prepped for the TJ test, but they're also highly advanced overachievers with many awards to their names in many different academic and musical areas. Curie is most likely not tipping the balance much at all for many of these kids, but rather the demographic served by Curie (middle and upper middle class South Asians with graduate degrees in STEM) already tended toward producing kids who look like ideal STEM magnet students.

All of this seems much better than the current admissions policies, which don't even reward the alternate enrichment or any real achievements. Kids who do extensive prep, kids who excel in enrichment areas of interest, and kids who do absolutely nothing at all aside from school are all being treated the same. Heck, they aren't even rewarding 7th grade Algebra I, which is readily available to every child in FCPS through their regular school classes. Any kid who massively failed IAAT, took Algebra in 8th, did no extracurriculars of any kind, and only got straight As from watered down covid grades are just as likely to get accepted as the kids who are brilliant with many high level activities and achievements.

I guess I'm perhaps bothered by the idea of a public high school as a "reward" and the pressures it imposes on the people (or parents of people) who desire it. We will see whether the new system will result in admitted TJ students "blooming where they are planted" or not. I hope we can all wish them well rather than hoping for bad outcomes. The new policy may improve the STEM offerings of all FCPS schools if the focus isn't on working towards a TJ prize and those same highly motivated parents seek opportunities for their brilliant, motivated children in their local high schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


Uncle. I've seen references to the purchase of test answers, but can someone point me to the source of this accusation? Or is it just alleged without any evidence? As a father whose daughter has take summer and weekend classes to ensure competency, I grow weary of these types of comments...

It's not quite correct to say that folks who went to Curie paid $4-5K for the answers to the old TJ exam.

What is correct is that students who took the TJ exam in the class of 2023 and 2024 reported having seen the questions that were on their TJ exam (specifically on the Quant-Q, which is supposed to be a secured exam with no prep available) during their time at Curie. Now, whether they actually did or not is another question entirely, but it's hard to imagine why a TJ student would openly admit that they had seen the questions before in a public forum if it weren't true.

More likely students saw similar questions. Curie either had previous exams, or they made up their own exams based on either previous exams they got a hold of or what students told them about the exams. It's also possible the Quant-Q people were so lazy they just reused questions verbatim.

Agree. Also, regarding the lack of available prep, please see this: https://www.amazon.com/New-TJHSST-Math-Workbook-Advanced/dp/1794340904. So it would seem that the assertion is questionable. Just a bit irritating of how preparation is somehow considered unfair. It's much easier to accuse parents of purchasing TJ admission, and totally dismissing the effort of those that do prepare. All in the past now...

I thought this was obvious and ignored as well. Preparation for math you expect to be on a test and getting the test and answers beforehand are very, very different. The wokies try to equate the two to make themselves feel better about an indefensible position on competitive admissions.

Several of the popular prep places have been accused of providing their students with the questions ahead of time, but regardless prep does confer a real advantage to those who can afford it.

Well...I am an immigrant, my family came here with nothing, I have worked since I was 14 and put myself through college and grad school. If I choose to spend my six-figure salary on test prep for my kid, whose business is it of anyone else's? Working hard to prepare for exams is just a part of getting somewhere in life and it makes no sense to me why there should be a penalty for that. FWIW, I am not Asian, so this attitude is by no means limited to this particular community.

If outside enrichment gives your kid an advantage for admission to a publicly funded program yes it is a problem but otherwise fine

White people do this all the time. Sports clubs, music enrichment , you name it. It’s all for college application. So enrichment is only okay for white people. That’s basically what liberals are saying.

No, the argument is that there's inherent value in sports, music, arts, math clubs, robotics etc. These make for a good life, good society and represent value to children and adults regardless of their effect (which is usually miniscule if at all) on college admissions. Test prep has no inherent value to life. It's just aimed at an artificial hoop--performance on a particular measure--not on a valued skill.
There is a strong resistance to test prep culture in the US and interest in figuring out how to stop putting families in a position where it feels necessary to get a good education.

Why do you always label math enrichment as test prep while white people buying extra sports classes and training as inherent value? This is all about white supremacy and it's disgusting!

[Anonymous]

Did anyone get off the waitlist for the 2nd round?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


Uncle. I've seen references to the purchase of test answers, but can someone point me to the source of this accusation? Or is it just alleged without any evidence? As a father whose daughter has take summer and weekend classes to ensure competency, I grow weary of these types of comments...

It's not quite correct to say that folks who went to Curie paid $4-5K for the answers to the old TJ exam.

What is correct is that students who took the TJ exam in the class of 2023 and 2024 reported having seen the questions that were on their TJ exam (specifically on the Quant-Q, which is supposed to be a secured exam with no prep available) during their time at Curie. Now, whether they actually did or not is another question entirely, but it's hard to imagine why a TJ student would openly admit that they had seen the questions before in a public forum if it weren't true.

More likely students saw similar questions. Curie either had previous exams, or they made up their own exams based on either previous exams they got a hold of or what students told them about the exams. It's also possible the Quant-Q people were so lazy they just reused questions verbatim.

Agree. Also, regarding the lack of available prep, please see this: https://www.amazon.com/New-TJHSST-Math-Workbook-Advanced/dp/1794340904. So it would seem that the assertion is questionable. Just a bit irritating of how preparation is somehow considered unfair. It's much easier to accuse parents of purchasing TJ admission, and totally dismissing the effort of those that do prepare. All in the past now...

I thought this was obvious and ignored as well. Preparation for math you expect to be on a test and getting the test and answers beforehand are very, very different. The wokies try to equate the two to make themselves feel better about an indefensible position on competitive admissions.

Several of the popular prep places have been accused of providing their students with the questions ahead of time, but regardless prep does confer a real advantage to those who can afford it.

Well...I am an immigrant, my family came here with nothing, I have worked since I was 14 and put myself through college and grad school. If I choose to spend my six-figure salary on test prep for my kid, whose business is it of anyone else's? Working hard to prepare for exams is just a part of getting somewhere in life and it makes no sense to me why there should be a penalty for that. FWIW, I am not Asian, so this attitude is by no means limited to this particular community.

If outside enrichment gives your kid an advantage for admission to a publicly funded program yes it is a problem but otherwise fine

So, I guess TJ needs to stop allowing in kids from private school immediately. And maybe home school kids, too. And kids that go to good middle schools in affluent areas with well-funded PTAs since arguably all of these may give a kid an advantage gaining admission to a publicly funded program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I guess I'm perhaps bothered by the idea of a public high school as a "reward" and the pressures it imposes on the people (or parents of people) who desire it. We will see whether the new system will result in admitted TJ students "blooming where they are planted" or not. I hope we can all wish them well rather than hoping for bad outcomes. The new policy may improve the STEM offerings of all FCPS schools if the focus isn't on working towards a TJ prize and those same highly motivated parents seek opportunities for their brilliant, motivated children in their local high schools.

Admission to TJ is not a reward. The bottom half of the kids at TJ will get worse college admission offers and scholarships than they would have if they remained at their base school. The bottom half of kids often consider TJ to be "Torture Jail." The main points of TJ are that it offers some very advanced math and STEM classes that aren't available at other schools, and it has some elite academic extracurricular teams. Kids who are not advanced enough or gifted enough won't gain anything from attending TJ. Every FCPS high school offers AP Calc, one year of post-AP calc, AP Bio/Chem/Physics, AP Comp Sci, etc. If a kid is only going to meet the prerequisites to take those courses, there's no point in doing so at TJ. Likewise, TJ has phenomenal STEM competition teams, which will only benefit the kids who are good enough at those competitions to make the team.

Like it or not, the kids from Curie who were admitted to TJ because they also had the attributes that suggested admission in the old holistic process were highly successful TJ students who could take full advantage of the school and would also have been somewhat under-served at the base school. While I wish the class of 2025 well, it's likely that kids selected on just GPA and one essay with extra weight given to FARMS kids, ESOL kids, etc. are being set up to fail. It's also unlikely that they will be equipped to take advantage of any of the special TJ offerings, as they will not meet the pre-requisites.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I guess I'm perhaps bothered by the idea of a public high school as a "reward" and the pressures it imposes on the people (or parents of people) who desire it. We will see whether the new system will result in admitted TJ students "blooming where they are planted" or not. I hope we can all wish them well rather than hoping for bad outcomes. The new policy may improve the STEM offerings of all FCPS schools if the focus isn't on working towards a TJ prize and those same highly motivated parents seek opportunities for their brilliant, motivated children in their local high schools.

Admission to TJ is not a reward. The bottom half of the kids at TJ will get worse college admission offers and scholarships than they would have if they remained at their base school. The bottom half of kids often consider TJ to be "Torture Jail." The main points of TJ are that it offers some very advanced math and STEM classes that aren't available at other schools, and it has some elite academic extracurricular teams. Kids who are not advanced enough or gifted enough won't gain anything from attending TJ. Every FCPS high school offers AP Calc, one year of post-AP calc, AP Bio/Chem/Physics, AP Comp Sci, etc. If a kid is only going to meet the prerequisites to take those courses, there's no point in doing so at TJ. Likewise, TJ has phenomenal STEM competition teams, which will only benefit the kids who are good enough at those competitions to make the team.

Like it or not, the kids from Curie who were admitted to TJ because they also had the attributes that suggested admission in the old holistic process were highly successful TJ students who could take full advantage of the school and would also have been somewhat under-served at the base school. While I wish the class of 2025 well, it's likely that kids selected on just GPA and one essay with extra weight given to FARMS kids, ESOL kids, etc. are being set up to fail. It's also unlikely that they will be equipped to take advantage of any of the special TJ offerings, as they will not meet the pre-requisites.

One key factor that people are not considering is that the quality of a school is dependent to a large extent on the quality/motivation levels of the student population. And not all Asian kids are the same either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


Uncle. I've seen references to the purchase of test answers, but can someone point me to the source of this accusation? Or is it just alleged without any evidence? As a father whose daughter has take summer and weekend classes to ensure competency, I grow weary of these types of comments...

It's not quite correct to say that folks who went to Curie paid $4-5K for the answers to the old TJ exam.

What is correct is that students who took the TJ exam in the class of 2023 and 2024 reported having seen the questions that were on their TJ exam (specifically on the Quant-Q, which is supposed to be a secured exam with no prep available) during their time at Curie. Now, whether they actually did or not is another question entirely, but it's hard to imagine why a TJ student would openly admit that they had seen the questions before in a public forum if it weren't true.

More likely students saw similar questions. Curie either had previous exams, or they made up their own exams based on either previous exams they got a hold of or what students told them about the exams. It's also possible the Quant-Q people were so lazy they just reused questions verbatim.

Agree. Also, regarding the lack of available prep, please see this: https://www.amazon.com/New-TJHSST-Math-Workbook-Advanced/dp/1794340904. So it would seem that the assertion is questionable. Just a bit irritating of how preparation is somehow considered unfair. It's much easier to accuse parents of purchasing TJ admission, and totally dismissing the effort of those that do prepare. All in the past now...

I thought this was obvious and ignored as well. Preparation for math you expect to be on a test and getting the test and answers beforehand are very, very different. The wokies try to equate the two to make themselves feel better about an indefensible position on competitive admissions.

Several of the popular prep places have been accused of providing their students with the questions ahead of time, but regardless prep does confer a real advantage to those who can afford it.

Well...I am an immigrant, my family came here with nothing, I have worked since I was 14 and put myself through college and grad school. If I choose to spend my six-figure salary on test prep for my kid, whose business is it of anyone else's? Working hard to prepare for exams is just a part of getting somewhere in life and it makes no sense to me why there should be a penalty for that. FWIW, I am not Asian, so this attitude is by no means limited to this particular community.

If outside enrichment gives your kid an advantage for admission to a publicly funded program yes it is a problem but otherwise fine

White people do this all the time. Sports clubs, music enrichment , you name it. It’s all for college application. So enrichment is only okay for white people. That’s basically what liberals are saying.

No, the argument is that there's inherent value in sports, music, arts, math clubs, robotics etc. These make for a good life, good society and represent value to children and adults regardless of their effect (which is usually miniscule if at all) on college admissions. Test prep has no inherent value to life. It's just aimed at an artificial hoop--performance on a particular measure--not on a valued skill.
There is a strong resistance to test prep culture in the US and interest in figuring out how to stop putting families in a position where it feels necessary to get a good education.

Why do you always label math enrichment as test prep while white people buying extra sports classes and training as inherent value? This is all about white supremacy and it's disgusting!

Math enrichment for some may be helpful when the county fails to deliver. However, that shouldn't confer an advantage for admissions to TJ. Test prep like the Cuire classes that include actual test prep or coaching on writing an admission essay are deplorable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Math enrichment for some may be helpful when the county fails to deliver. However, that shouldn't confer an advantage for admissions to TJ. Test prep like the Cuire classes that include actual test prep or coaching on writing an admission essay are deplorable.

In your opinion, what should "confer an advantage for admissions to TJ?" If being better at math due to math enrichment shouldn't, what about kids who are better at math because they independently study more math? AoPS, Khan Academy, udacity, etc. have many free resources for motivated students, and there's nothing stopping anyone from self-enrichment. In your opinion, should being stronger at math count for anything in TJ admissions? Or, do you always view it as the product of parental pushing?

For what it's worth, I don't think enrollment in any specific enrichment activity should count for anything (and it doesn't. Kids don't get admitted when they say that they've taken classes at AoPS or RSM). But, being better at math should count for something, no matter how the kid got there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Look, if poor people can't do it or have it, it shouldn't exist. Simple as that.

welcome to communism!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Look, if poor people can't do it or have it, it shouldn't exist. Simple as that.

[Anonymous]

Forget TJ. We need a normal Governor's School in. Fairfax County. One that admits all the kids who qualify over a certain threshold and needs advanced classes. The rest of the state has them. Why are we stuck with TJ or nothing? Not everyone wants to go into Engineering. Even bright STEM minds. TJ's rigid engineering-centered curriculum is a poor fit for future Basic Research scientists. We don't need the hype and the marketing. Just give our advanced kids what they need

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


Uncle. I've seen references to the purchase of test answers, but can someone point me to the source of this accusation? Or is it just alleged without any evidence? As a father whose daughter has take summer and weekend classes to ensure competency, I grow weary of these types of comments...

It's not quite correct to say that folks who went to Curie paid $4-5K for the answers to the old TJ exam.

What is correct is that students who took the TJ exam in the class of 2023 and 2024 reported having seen the questions that were on their TJ exam (specifically on the Quant-Q, which is supposed to be a secured exam with no prep available) during their time at Curie. Now, whether they actually did or not is another question entirely, but it's hard to imagine why a TJ student would openly admit that they had seen the questions before in a public forum if it weren't true.

More likely students saw similar questions. Curie either had previous exams, or they made up their own exams based on either previous exams they got a hold of or what students told them about the exams. It's also possible the Quant-Q people were so lazy they just reused questions verbatim.

Agree. Also, regarding the lack of available prep, please see this: https://www.amazon.com/New-TJHSST-Math-Workbook-Advanced/dp/1794340904. So it would seem that the assertion is questionable. Just a bit irritating of how preparation is somehow considered unfair. It's much easier to accuse parents of purchasing TJ admission, and totally dismissing the effort of those that do prepare. All in the past now...

I thought this was obvious and ignored as well. Preparation for math you expect to be on a test and getting the test and answers beforehand are very, very different. The wokies try to equate the two to make themselves feel better about an indefensible position on competitive admissions.

Several of the popular prep places have been accused of providing their students with the questions ahead of time, but regardless prep does confer a real advantage to those who can afford it.

Well...I am an immigrant, my family came here with nothing, I have worked since I was 14 and put myself through college and grad school. If I choose to spend my six-figure salary on test prep for my kid, whose business is it of anyone else's? Working hard to prepare for exams is just a part of getting somewhere in life and it makes no sense to me why there should be a penalty for that. FWIW, I am not Asian, so this attitude is by no means limited to this particular community.

If outside enrichment gives your kid an advantage for admission to a publicly funded program yes it is a problem but otherwise fine

So, I guess TJ needs to stop allowing in kids from private school immediately. And maybe home school kids, too. And kids that go to good middle schools in affluent areas with well-funded PTAs since arguably all of these may give a kid an advantage gaining admission to a publicly funded program.

TJ isn’t denying admission because of extracurricular math opportunities. TJ is just not giving those prepping/gifted/self-studying/private school kids an advantage in admissions for learning content faster.