Parents only offering low rates?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The going rate for an experienced caregiver is $30 hourly plus 2 week vacation paid and most holidays paid as well. We give stipend towards health insurance. Cost of living is high in the DMV, so I don’t see how a person can live on a $20 hourly.

Roughly $62,000 a year costing a family $78,000 in childcare costs. Just putting it into annual costs at 40 hours a week.
$20/hour is $42,000/year. Costing a family $52,000 a year in childcare costs.

I have no opinion on whether a family or a person can live on $42,000 a year but I can imagine it would be very difficult for a middle class family to afford 78k in childcare costs.

Middle class families are not entitled to private nannies. That’s what on-site group care is for.

Middle class families generally have a SAHP as it does pay to work. Middle class parent is making $42-80K a year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It never occured to me that a "middle class family" would have a nanny. I always thought nannies were for very high income folks.

I think the real issue is that when you're saying a family would spend $78K for 40 hours of care per week (so no overtime), that's surpassing one parent's take-home salary once you factor in yearly raises, bonuses, and health insurance, you're thinking the lower paid spouse brings home around $200K. If you're thinking both parents are making $250K+, then the costs increase exponentially because you need at least 50 hours of childcare and neither of you are spending much time with your kids. If you're limiting to 40 hours of childcare, one parent is already working a flex schedule/not making more than $200K.

I think many families are misclassifying their actual social class levels. If you have even just 1 parent earning $200K+, then you are actually well beyond the middle class range. I'd hesitate to say $250K is still upper-middle class still. If you have 2 adults each earning $200K+, then you are fully upper class. You might not be high net worth, but you definitely cannot say you are anywhere near middle class. Middle class for Virginia and Maryland is from ~$33K/39K up to $156K/178K. DC being a higher COL, I'd say $45K-200K would be a fair estimate.

If you are earning under $200K for your HHI, then a nanny is not meant to be a reasonable childcare option for you unless you choose to do a share or plan on tightening your budget in other areas to give the extra money to childcare. There are definitely some families that do so, they see it as investing in their children and want the best for them.

Also, 40hr/wk is extremely easy to do these days since many parents are WFH and don't need to pad the schedule for a commute. Or they have jobs that can easily be staggered, or both. It's also ridiculous that anyone assumes that having a nanny for 50 hrs/wk means that they don't spend much time with their children. That's just straight up shaming anyone who works hours that are generally necessary. You can also easily spend 4+ hours per week day with your kids while they are awake, depending on their ages. Plus quality of time wins over quantity of time every single time.

PP here.

First, I apologize if I came across as shaming parents who have a nanny for 50 hrs/week - my husband and I do, and I definitely think quality over quantity is true. That being said, at least for us, I am so exhausted after managing the nanny for 50 hours and then working like a crazy person on top of that, that I feel the time I do spend with my kids is lacking due to sheer exhaustion; however, that's totally on me.

What my point is really is that expecting to be paid $30/hour has diminishing returns for parents and it makes more sense in a lot of cases for one parent to leave the workforce, specifically in the DMV. I think you're off on your social class numbers, too - $400K HHI in the DMV is middle class, it's expensive out here and taxes are high (I'm pretty sure for a family of 5, $31K is legitimately the poverty level, and the ranges you're sharing for middle class are extremely varied) - high six figures doesn't even make you upper class. Therefore, there won't be many people willing to pay $30/hour as opposed to just having a SAHP. Let's say, my husband makes 7 figures and I make $250K. After taxes, that leaves me with $125K. Assuming a 2 week bonus annually (and other random gifts/meals during the week), overtime, car stipend, and health insurance + employer taxes, I'm paying my nanny about $115K post-tax money a year.

Why would I work a stressful demanding job just to pay a nanny all but $10K of my salary, unless I REALLY loved my job and was anticipating a lot of upward mobility eventually (which is unlikely because as the lower paid spouse, I'm still doing a crapton of household management including handling nanny call-offs and other issues - I'm not exactly a comparatively stellar employee to those with a SAHP)? It just makes no financial sense. And that's my point - there aren't any good answers, really, because I'm not going to tell someone what they are worth, but you are going to need to be a real value add to a family to demand $30/hour.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Genuinely asking---what is a competitive rate for 25 hours / week for afternoon pick up and evening care of a lower elementary kid?

How many days? Can the nanny work another part time job? I'd say $25 and hour.

[Anonymous]

A lot of daycare centers are closing down and/or don’t have spots due to being low staffed (because they’re offering incredibly low wages).

So you have desperate parents who have no business being a nanny attempt to find private childcare for daycare prices.

The key is to simply not take these jobs. There are people who can afford you and who are willing to pay you adequately. You just have to wake through the bullshit.

It’s tough. I feel for parents desperate for childcare but I’m not charity. The key is to vote for a candidate that’s going to support quality, affordable childcare. Not to bitch online that people won’t watch your kids for $250 a week.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A lot of daycare centers are closing down and/or don’t have spots due to being low staffed (because they’re offering incredibly low wages).

So you have desperate parents who have no business being a nanny attempt to find private childcare for daycare prices.

The key is to simply not take these jobs. There are people who can afford you and who are willing to pay you adequately. You just have to wake through the bullshit.

It’s tough. I feel for parents desperate for childcare but I’m not charity. The key is to vote for a candidate that’s going to support quality, affordable childcare. Not to bitch online that people won’t watch your kids for $250 a week.

*hiring a nanny

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Genuinely asking---what is a competitive rate for 25 hours / week for afternoon pick up and evening care of a lower elementary kid?

How many days? Can the nanny work another part time job? I'd say $25 and hour.

+1. A lot of people are looking for this right now.

[Anonymous]

The Nannies on here are insane . Paying $30/hr for a nanny plus letting a nanny use your car and getting health insurance covered is insane . None of my friends in northern Virginia pay their Nannies this much . If you’re college educated fine but everyone else , seriously ?

[Anonymous]

I was a live in Nanny for years, when I became live out I shared a townhouse with roommates. I managed just fine on $30k a year. It’s not like I was living in poverty. I even bought a a condo thru the first time home buyer program. I paid 90k, market rate was $150k. It was a 2 bedroom/ 2 bath so I got a roommate. All the people on here who say they need a liveable wage so need to make $30 an hour are crazy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

That being said, at least for us, I am so exhausted after managing the nanny for 50 hours and then working like a crazy person on top of that, that I feel the time I do spend with my kids is lacking due to sheer exhaustion; however, that's totally on me.

Woah, I'll finish reading in a minute, but you shouldn't have to manage your nanny at all much less for 50 hrs. They should be able to manage themselves. So maybe you just don't have a nanny with experience to earn rates closer to.$30/hr OR they are just not the same caliber and the quality of care is so low that they can't/shouldn't earn higher. You should just be able to hand off your child(ren) and get them back at the end of the day and know that they were in the best care possible outside of you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The Nannies on here are insane . Paying $30/hr for a nanny plus letting a nanny use your car and getting health insurance covered is insane . None of my friends in northern Virginia pay their Nannies this much . If you’re college educated fine but everyone else , seriously ?

The market in DC compared to even Arlington is much different. Minimum wage is over $15/hr which is twice what VA is. Rent even in many roommate situations and definitely for a studio apartment is at least $18,000+ per year. Letting a nanny use your car is not standard unless you have a nanny car for that purpose. Even with their own car, you still need to cover mileage. Health insurance stipends are necessary just like any other job provides some kind of health, why should this type of employee be any different? None if this should be an issue for a family that can truly afford to have a nanny. If you can't afford it, it means you can't afford luxury items and you should stick to cheaper, more affordable care options like daycare.

[Anonymous]

Definitely not off in my social class numbers. I took them straight from a financial article from a reputable financial source (wish I had kept the link, I'll look for it) that had them listed for every single state in late 2020. So not completely current but close enough.

All you need to do is Google middle class income or upper middle class and a gazillion banking and financial sites pop up with similar numbers for the US in 2021.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Let's say, my husband makes 7 figures and I make $250K. After taxes, that leaves me with $125K. Assuming a 2 week bonus annually (and other random gifts/meals during the week), overtime, car stipend, and health insurance + employer taxes, I'm paying my nanny about $115K post-tax money a year.

Why would I work a stressful demanding job just to pay a nanny all but $10K of my salary, unless I REALLY loved my job and was anticipating a lot of upward mobility eventually (which is unlikely because as the lower paid spouse, I'm still doing a crapton of household management including handling nanny call-offs and other issues - I'm not exactly a comparatively stellar employee to those with a SAHP)? It just makes no financial sense. And that's my point - there aren't any good answers, really, because I'm not going to tell someone what they are worth, but you are going to need to be a real value add to a family to demand $30/hour.

First, 45 hrs a week at $30/hr comes to under $75K including OT. Say you give 2 bonuses of 1 week, that's under $3000. Health is whatever you want to set it at, but let's say $350/mo which is $4200 and brings it to ~82K. There is no car stipend, mileage is paid as used but you'd pay that doing the driving yourself or them using your car, that doesn't count. You don't need to pay for other gifts and food etc, but let's go ahead and say 3K to hiring it up to $85K. Let's not pretend that your taxes are part of their pay. Not all of the above us taxed, so ~$6000 in employer taxes, that's ~90K annually. So you're somehow adding $25K to your numbers that is extremely unnecessary.

Also, if your husband is earning 7 figures, I think you could afford to pay your nanny this amount because your income isn't the only one and his makes up for any loss in yours.

Plus, for many people, they don't use a nanny for the life of their child. They use their services for the first couple of years with the most development and then move on to preschool etc and might utilize PT help if still needed, but not FT. Infants/toddlers are the most work and at a crucial time, so it makes sense to pay a high amount for their care knowing it will be limited in length. I also don't stick.around for years on end to get multiple raises over time, so it's baked into the hourly rate to start with something good that doesn't need to have much room for financial growth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Let's say, my husband makes 7 figures and I make $250K. After taxes, that leaves me with $125K. Assuming a 2 week bonus annually (and other random gifts/meals during the week), overtime, car stipend, and health insurance + employer taxes, I'm paying my nanny about $115K post-tax money a year.

Why would I work a stressful demanding job just to pay a nanny all but $10K of my salary, unless I REALLY loved my job and was anticipating a lot of upward mobility eventually (which is unlikely because as the lower paid spouse, I'm still doing a crapton of household management including handling nanny call-offs and other issues - I'm not exactly a comparatively stellar employee to those with a SAHP)? It just makes no financial sense. And that's my point - there aren't any good answers, really, because I'm not going to tell someone what they are worth, but you are going to need to be a real value add to a family to demand $30/hour.

First, 45 hrs a week at $30/hr comes to under $75K including OT. Say you give 2 bonuses of 1 week, that's under $3000. Health is whatever you want to set it at, but let's say $350/mo which is $4200 and brings it to ~82K. There is no car stipend, mileage is paid as used but you'd pay that doing the driving yourself or them using your car, that doesn't count. You don't need to pay for other gifts and food etc, but let's go ahead and say 3K to hiring it up to $85K. Let's not pretend that your taxes are part of their pay. Not all of the above us taxed, so ~$6000 in employer taxes, that's ~90K annually. So you're somehow adding $25K to your numbers that is extremely unnecessary.

Also, if your husband is earning 7 figures, I think you could afford to pay your nanny this amount because your income isn't the only one and his makes up for any loss in yours.

Plus, for many people, they don't use a nanny for the life of their child. They use their services for the first couple of years with the most development and then move on to preschool etc and might utilize PT help if still needed, but not FT. Infants/toddlers are the most work and at a crucial time, so it makes sense to pay a high amount for their care knowing it will be limited in length. I also don't stick.around for years on end to get multiple raises over time, so it's baked into the hourly rate to start with something good that doesn't need to have much room for financial growth.

OK, I think your math is off (you're forgetting payroll company, taxes are about 10% of nannies' salary, and we're saying for a person to make $250K, they need at least 50 hours of childcare, so 45 hours including OT is just wrong). But regardless, let's say I'm taking home $35K after taxes + nanny. The question I have is - why would I do that? I'll just SAHM, and hire an excellent grad student or college student babysitter who doesn't come with the baggage of a full-time employee. Most nannies I've interviewed can keep the kid alive, but take a look at their own kids' accomplishments and it's not exactly what people making 7 figures are hoping their kids to turn out like.

It's not that I can't afford the nanny. It's that I don't think the nanny is worth $30/hour - unless you're making my life remarkably easier, now I have to manage you AND work 50 hours/week.

My point still stands. You're getting close to pricing yourself out of the market at $30/hour, so the real question is what do you offer beyond what the similarly educated (to her 7 figure making husband) SAHM does? If you're thinking we are just surviving in the workforce for a few years, I ask you - why would we? We're already mommy-tracked because of the sheer amount of legwork it is to manage the nanny, so it's not like we've got massive room for growth. Kids still get out of school before the end of the workday. And my 7-figure making husband isn't really thrilled about the kids doing aftercare, since you know, I'm taking home $35K per year after paying for childcare expenses.

And on top of that, you're saying you're not trying to stick around for years on end. So I just have to search again in a few years? No thanks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Definitely not off in my social class numbers. I took them straight from a financial article from a reputable financial source (wish I had kept the link, I'll look for it) that had them listed for every single state in late 2020. So not completely current but close enough.

All you need to do is Google middle class income or upper middle class and a gazillion banking and financial sites pop up with similar numbers for the US in 2021.

Right, I'm only talking about DMV. So Maryland/Virginia numbers are totally skewed because of the areas outside of MoCo and NoVa. And honestly, I don't think anyone outside of DMV (except other major metropolitan areas) is paying $30/hour for a nanny.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

That being said, at least for us, I am so exhausted after managing the nanny for 50 hours and then working like a crazy person on top of that, that I feel the time I do spend with my kids is lacking due to sheer exhaustion; however, that's totally on me.

Woah, I'll finish reading in a minute, but you shouldn't have to manage your nanny at all much less for 50 hrs. They should be able to manage themselves. So maybe you just don't have a nanny with experience to earn rates closer to.$30/hr OR they are just not the same caliber and the quality of care is so low that they can't/shouldn't earn higher. You should just be able to hand off your child(ren) and get them back at the end of the day and know that they were in the best care possible outside of you.

I'm thinking we have just had bad luck finding good nannies, perhaps, but then I read the phone threads and I'm wondering if people just want to think their nannies are wonderful because they are leaving their kids in their care for so long. But I did misspeak there (exhausted, haha) - managing the nanny isn't taking 50 hours, I meant nanny is working 50 hours. But it does take up several hours per day, because I WFH. I include cleaning up kids' crap the nanny left lying around in managing the nanny + cleaning up my own messes so the nanny's workplace is as clean as she likes it, as she considers it her 'office.'