Long time nanny great with baby but not with 4 year old. Anyone else deal with this and have advice?

[Anonymous]

Our longtime nanny has been with us since our older child (now just turned 4) was an infant and has always been very good. She's dependable, very loving, and all around awesome for the older one. Additionally, she also has taken care of us during her free time. She does our laundry, picks up around the house during nap time, and is generally very flexible and available for us (we both have jobs that sometimes require last minute addition of hours. We've trusted her enough to even go away for a few days at a time alone and to stay with our older one. She is hardworking, loves our kids, is incredibly honest, and is a great presence in our home. Until recently.
However, things have gone downhill recently. It started gradually before the baby was born. We noticed she wasn't picking up and responding to the older child's emotional needs well (trouble with toilet training, instilling some ideas in her we didn't agree with), but since these were minor and DS was going to be in school about 20 hrs a week this year, we decided to keep her on.
Since we've had the baby, nanny has been amazing with baby. He lights up when she enters the house and she is just awesome at caring for him the way she was when our older one was little.
But things have really gone downhill with her and our older DS. She sometimes openly acts like she prefers the baby, leaving our sensitive older one to somewhat pick up on this and not want to be alone with her. DS has told us nanny gets mad at her (I think its more just raising her voice but still this isn't a perception we want our 4 yo to have of an adult consistently)! She isn't really choosing age appropriate activities for him (taking him to baby events with kids that are much younger) and generally somewhat ignoring him.
We're having such a hard time deciding what to do because she has been so great for so many years and the things with older DS are hit or miss (some days are still really good but the 5-10 bad ones in the last month or so are really upsetting us). We've talked to her a few times now about this and it just doesn't seem like its getting through- I think partly due to language but also because she just has a different philosophy about dealing with kids than we do at this older age.
So my question is, have others been through this? How did they handle it? I've started interviewing other nannies halfheartedly but I'm skeptical there is anyone out there who is really great at infant care but can also engage our older one in an appropriate way. If we had infinite resources, I would just hire a college student to pick up the older one from school in the afternoon (around 1) but we don't and frankly, we pay our nanny well- probably about 55k gross, so don't have more money to throw at this. Does anyone have a nanny who is good for both age groups? We're totally willing to part with the whole housekeeping/laundry aspect of her job too. Its really just the flexibility thats important to us.
Thanks.

[Anonymous]

Ask her if she focused only on both children and not the house, could she do a better job. Not really understanding what was said by her, or by you, in your previous talks.

Housekeeping sounds to me like it's too much.
Keep looking around.

[Anonymous]

Could you elaborate a little on the philosophy aspect? What does she think of handling older kids?
I know in some cultures it is pretty common to just kind of let older kids fend for themselves, as usually women have lots of kids close in age so concentrating on older ones isn't an option.
If she is from this kind of culture I don't think she will change. It's like an American nanny being asked to spoon feed a 4 yo- just doesn't sit well with most.

[Anonymous]

OP I strongly suggest that you find someone who has already raised children. That way, the person you hire will already have previous experience in caring for both age groups as well as multiple children at the same time.

It sounds like your nanny likes the novelty and cuteness of babies. In fact, some nannies actually prefer to work w/babies over older children. From what you stated, it doesn't sound like your nanny is suited to the job at hand anymore. She has outgrown your daughter and since you already have tried to talk to her about it w/no results, you have no other option at this point but to let her go and find another person.

It wouldn't be fair to your older child to keep this current nanny on.
No child should have to deal w/feeling like a second wheel like your child is.

Plus, you are paying this nanny well and she is just not doing an efficient job anymore.

Bottom line:
Give her notice and hire another nanny who is older, and has already raised children.

Good luck to you.

[Anonymous]

Slippery slope, OP. grass isn't always greener on the other side. I'd really try to fix what's wrong with your current nanny, let her know she needs to change or you'll replace her. I think she will change for you. I say this because you put too much detail (even though you changed a couple things) and I think I'm your nanny.

[Anonymous]

OP back. Thanks for the advice. 22:39, I don't think you're my nanny because she doesn't speak a lot of English and doesn't use a computer. But I wish you luck! It's a tough thing. I've always thought she was really great and I think she still is except that she's making our older one unhappy and despite talking to her repeatedly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP back. Thanks for the advice. 22:39, I don't think you're my nanny because she doesn't speak a lot of English and doesn't use a computer. But I wish you luck! It's a tough thing. I've always thought she was really great and I think she still is except that she's making our older one unhappy and despite talking to her repeatedly.

And she's not bright enough to ask someone to help her?

[Anonymous]

I think you should have a serious talk with her OP. Tell her you've noticed your daughter is feeling neglected and ask your nanny if she feels like she could help out with that. I'm sure if she's helped your daughter from day one that she lives her deeply and probably doesn't realize what she is doing. Give her suggestions of age appropriate activities she could do with your daughter and tell her the housework comes second to your daughter's needs. Hopefully with some direction she can get back to taking care of your daughter's needs and make her feel special again. Best of luck to you!

[Anonymous]

Some nannies are better with different ages. And as much as you would hate to lose her, if she is not meeting the needs of your older child, it is time to move on.

[Anonymous]

I'm sorry but op doesn't even know if her child is a boy or girl. In the original message she said her and him and interchanged them frequently, that isn't an autocorrect error

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm sorry but op doesn't even know if her child is a boy or girl. In the original message she said her and him and interchanged them frequently, that isn't an autocorrect error

I think it's pretty obvious she was trying to change the details and wasn't careful to double check she changed it correctly.

[Anonymous]

All guesses here, but I think your nanny thinks your older child is turning into a spoiled brat and her attitude toward that child is to toughen child up and teach that child that the baby's needs come first and older child should learn some patience, and to hear the word no from time to time. I think many families don't want a older child to feel less important than new baby, but your nanny may feel differently. Think if there's something your missing here, because I'm sure your nanny loves your older child very much.

[Anonymous]

A few things could be going on here:
1) Older child isn't being neglected, just isn't adjusting well to new sibling and is blaming nanny for some of these feelingS
2) Older child isn't being neglected but is somewhat spoiled by mom and dad and wants nanny to follow suit, nanny is more strict than parents
3) Nanny is neglecting older child because she is struggling with the amount of housework etc on top of new baby and is expecting older child to suddenly be more independent
4) Nanny is neglecting older child because nanny prefers babies generally and feels that older child's emotional neediness isn't age appropriate (even if it is).

I think the real problem here, OP is that your kid is going through a rough patch and you have a caregiver who can't or won't communicate with you effectively. If you can't even tell whether she understands the problem when you present it, how on earth are you ever going to resolve anything?

I would probably do 3 things:
1) Take a long, clear look at your expectations. How much housework? What is it that you want a caregiver to do for your older child? Try to be really self-aware about whether you are expecting a) a reasonable amount of work, and b) a reasonable level of catering to older DC. Do you baby him/her? If so, you may be setting DC1 up to have a combative relationship with his/her next nanny, too.
2) Come up with a list of specific things you want nanny to change. You can't just say, "You don't love my kid enough. Love her better." Say, "I want you to find at least D number of minutes daily to do something that DC enjoys. Here are some examples." Figure out what it is you want.
3) Have a last-ditch conversation with your nanny. Be as clear as possible aboutthe problem, what you want to see change and about the fact that this is a dealbreaker for you.

If you do all that and see no change, then she's no the nanny for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our longtime nanny has been with us since our older child (now just turned 4) was an infant and has always been very good. She's dependable, very loving, and all around awesome for the older one. Additionally, she also has taken care of us during her free time. She does our laundry, picks up around the house during nap time, and is generally very flexible and available for us (we both have jobs that sometimes require last minute addition of hours. We've trusted her enough to even go away for a few days at a time alone and to stay with our older one. She is hardworking, loves our kids, is incredibly honest, and is a great presence in our home. Until recently.
However, things have gone downhill recently. It started gradually before the baby was born. We noticed she wasn't picking up and responding to the older child's emotional needs well (trouble with toilet training, instilling some ideas in her we didn't agree with), but since these were minor and DS was going to be in school about 20 hrs a week this year, we decided to keep her on.
Since we've had the baby, nanny has been amazing with baby. He lights up when she enters the house and she is just awesome at caring for him the way she was when our older one was little.
But things have really gone downhill with her and our older DS. She sometimes openly acts like she prefers the baby, leaving our sensitive older one to somewhat pick up on this and not want to be alone with her. DS has told us nanny gets mad at her (I think its more just raising her voice but still this isn't a perception we want our 4 yo to have of an adult consistently)! She isn't really choosing age appropriate activities for him (taking him to baby events with kids that are much younger) and generally somewhat ignoring him.
We're having such a hard time deciding what to do because she has been so great for so many years and the things with older DS are hit or miss (some days are still really good but the 5-10 bad ones in the last month or so are really upsetting us). We've talked to her a few times now about this and it just doesn't seem like its getting through- I think partly due to language but also because she just has a different philosophy about dealing with kids than we do at this older age.
So my question is, have others been through this? How did they handle it? I've started interviewing other nannies halfheartedly but I'm skeptical there is anyone out there who is really great at infant care but can also engage our older one in an appropriate way. If we had infinite resources, I would just hire a college student to pick up the older one from school in the afternoon (around 1) but we don't and frankly, we pay our nanny well- probably about 55k gross, so don't have more money to throw at this. Does anyone have a nanny who is good for both age groups? We're totally willing to part with the whole housekeeping/laundry aspect of her job too. Its really just the flexibility thats important to us.
Thanks.

I wonder if this is actually your problem - you and nanny were on the same page when your older child was an infant (as you are for your younger child), but you have different philosophies about handling a pre-schooler. I think that's actually one of the tougher nanny problems - the nanny can be wonderful and stellar and be doing everything right but the inconsistent approaches between caregivers will be extremely frustrating for your older child, especially at a time when your child is probably feeling pretty emotionally fragile and jealous because of the new baby.

I'd sit the nanny down and have a very honest open conversation about the situation. I'd frame it in terms of what you observe your child is going through rather than what the nanny may or may not be doing. It might be worth asking her to explain what she perceives is going on emotionally with your older child and how she is trying to address it. If her approach is inconsistent with your own, be explicit about how you want her to handle it, including strategies for how she should handle bad behavior. I'd also be more explicit about how she should schedule the day in terms of activities for both children and perhaps sign them up for some age appropriate activities for the older one after school. Make very clear, if you haven't already, that you see (and hear) a lot of emotional insecurity in your older child's reports of the day and that the bottom line is that you want to address it as a team.

At the end of the day though, if things don't change, I think it's time to move on. There are plenty of great nannies out there who can handle kids of different ages, and hopefully you can help your nanny find a job that she is better suited for as well. I wouldn't let the status quo go just because she's been there a long time though - if it's taking a real emotional toll on your older child (which it sounds like it is), the best thing for your family long term will be to change the situation one way or the other.

[Anonymous]

Thank you everyone for your thoughtful advice. We had another conversation that didn't really go anywhere, perhaps because of the language barrier, or because she just didn't want to engage in the conversation. We're finding this so difficult. I know she loves our kids and is trying to do the right thing in her way, it just doesn't seem to be connecting. We've had a great working relationship with her all of these years and want to do right by everyone. Its just hard to cut the cord.