Humanize Palestine

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[Post New]07/28/2014 13:18
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Muslima
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Anonymous wrote:
Muslima wrote:
Anonymous wrote:This is a Hamas program for children:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ORAM-usqhQ


And there are same hate videos on youtube about Israeli kids wanting to kill Arabs, so what's your point?


These are sponsored by the Hamas authorities. Israel banned the racist anti-Arab party. Israel the arrested the Jewish criminals who murdered an Arab teen in revenge. In Palestine, most people celebrate those who murder Jewish civilians. They dance in the streets when child-killers are released by the ISraeli government. If you want to "humanize" then be honest about who is really doing what.


Uhm.... wow, okay. I had no idea
[Post New]07/28/2014 13:21
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Muslima
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Anonymous wrote:
Muslima wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Muslima wrote:

This is Chavka Fulman-Raban, one of the last survivors of the Warsaw Ghetto, she calls for a rebellion against the Israeili occupation:


Rebel against the Occupation. No–it is forbidden for us to rule over another people, to oppress another [people]. The most important thing is to achieve peace and an end to the cycle of blood[letting]. My generation dreamed of peace. I so want to achieve it. You have the power to help. All my hopes are with you. If only [you could]. - Chavka Fulman-Raban, arrested and imprisoned at Auschwitz, two of her family members died as resistance fighters.

http://kafila.org/2014/07/21/last-of-warsaw-ghetto-survivors-calls-for-rebellion-against-israeli-occupation/


This was from 2013

http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/347682


So? It's still relevant


Do you really not understand how disingenuous it is to post this as if this person is commenting on what is going on today, when she is not?


No, it is not. This article resurfaced at the beginning of this conflict. I clearly posted the link and source of the article. We have been discussing things that have been happening for the past 60+years in case you didn't know. This is not a conflict that started yesterday but over 60 years ago. So yea, an article from 2013 is clearly relevant
[Post New]07/28/2014 15:30
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Anonymous
Muslima, you really need a job. Or a hobby. Or both.
[Post New]07/28/2014 15:37
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Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:Muslima, you really need a job. Or a hobby. Or both.


Seems like she has a hobby.
[Post New]07/28/2014 16:07
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Muslima
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I actually have both

What's it like being Muslim? Well, it's hard to find a decent halal pizza place and occasionally there is a hashtag calling for your genocide...
[Post New]07/28/2014 17:05
quote
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Muslima wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:For all the posters advocating peaceful means, when will you begin boycotting companies that do business with Israel? When will you begin demanding the US stop supporting Israel. This and only this is what broke the South Africa Apartheid. Money.


Exactly. It was the boycotting of South Africa, the embargo and complete withdrawal of financial dealings that did them in. NOT blowing people up.

Now that we know it's possible, how can we support people who engage in violence to make these kinds of changes?


Who was blown up in the past 19 days? Do I need to remind you the facts?

About 5,870 Palestinians have been wounded with 1000+ dead, over 80% civilians

Israeli deaths are 40 soldiers and two civilians.


Who is engaging in Violence?


Please, just discuss the reality of the situation instead of pretending. What's going on now is a result of the Palestinians repeatedly attacking the Israelis. The Israelis are fight back -- and they're winning because they are much bigger and more powerful.


It's not a fair fight and you know. The Israelis took an Uzi to a kitchen knife fight. If the US would give the Palestinians the same arms they provide to Israel, then we can begin to talk about a fair fight. In regards to Palestinians repeatedly attacking the Israelis, I guess you only believe what you want to believe and not facts. There have been former and current IDF soldiers who say otherwise in regards to who is initiating many of these attacks, but you choose to ignore them.


NP. Yes, you are correct. It is not a fair fight.

When you attack another country, you don't get to then complain it's not a "fair fight" because the country you attacked is stronger than you are, and hits back harder than you hit them.


You keep spouting this line, but the real narrative is that Israel is isolating itself in the process of destroying Gaza. It is the Palestinians who have been humanized because we all live in a world full of suffering, and the Israelis who are viewed as bestial, detached and debauched. I had no idea Israeli Jews were capable of inflicting so much damage on others or on themselves.


I don't "keep spouting" that line -- I'm a new poster on this thread.

There is no "real narrative". There are many real narratives. If you choose to see the Israelis as debauched beasts, then that is your narrative that you have built. Congratulations. Somehow I don't think your black and white thinking is drawing you closer to any truth, or peace.
[Post New]07/28/2014 19:37
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Muslima
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They are worth fighting for! Whatever the cost, we need to fight for this war to be over so that both Israeli and Palestinian kids can live a life free of missile, free of rockets and free of drones. Children shouldn't have to pay the cost of war~

What's it like being Muslim? Well, it's hard to find a decent halal pizza place and occasionally there is a hashtag calling for your genocide...
[Post New]07/28/2014 20:22
quote
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Muslima wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:For all the posters advocating peaceful means, when will you begin boycotting companies that do business with Israel? When will you begin demanding the US stop supporting Israel. This and only this is what broke the South Africa Apartheid. Money.


Exactly. It was the boycotting of South Africa, the embargo and complete withdrawal of financial dealings that did them in. NOT blowing people up.

Now that we know it's possible, how can we support people who engage in violence to make these kinds of changes?


Who was blown up in the past 19 days? Do I need to remind you the facts?

About 5,870 Palestinians have been wounded with 1000+ dead, over 80% civilians

Israeli deaths are 40 soldiers and two civilians.


Who is engaging in Violence?


Please, just discuss the reality of the situation instead of pretending. What's going on now is a result of the Palestinians repeatedly attacking the Israelis. The Israelis are fight back -- and they're winning because they are much bigger and more powerful.


It's not a fair fight and you know. The Israelis took an Uzi to a kitchen knife fight. If the US would give the Palestinians the same arms they provide to Israel, then we can begin to talk about a fair fight. In regards to Palestinians repeatedly attacking the Israelis, I guess you only believe what you want to believe and not facts. There have been former and current IDF soldiers who say otherwise in regards to who is initiating many of these attacks, but you choose to ignore them.


NP. Yes, you are correct. It is not a fair fight.

When you attack another country, you don't get to then complain it's not a "fair fight" because the country you attacked is stronger than you are, and hits back harder than you hit them.


You keep spouting this line, but the real narrative is that Israel is isolating itself in the process of destroying Gaza. It is the Palestinians who have been humanized because we all live in a world full of suffering, and the Israelis who are viewed as bestial, detached and debauched. I had no idea Israeli Jews were capable of inflicting so much damage on others or on themselves.


I don't "keep spouting" that line -- I'm a new poster on this thread.

There is no "real narrative". There are many real narratives. If you choose to see the Israelis as debauched beasts, then that is your narrative that you have built. Congratulations. Somehow I don't think your black and white thinking is drawing you closer to any truth, or peace.


No, it is the narrative that Netanyahu and his cronies have constructed, and it will hang Israel very soon. Bon voyage.
[Post New]07/28/2014 20:27
quote
Anonymous
Who would you prefer to have as a neighbor - Israel or Hamas?
Not a hard choice at all - Israel all the way.
[Post New]07/28/2014 20:46
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Muslima
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Anybody speak dutch? Would like to know what this says? Apparently the video shows live streaming of Ghaza

http://www.turks.nl/nieuws/buitenland/item/4067-live-gaza-onder-zware-luchtaanval.html#.U9bNwPl_utPHeb

What's it like being Muslim? Well, it's hard to find a decent halal pizza place and occasionally there is a hashtag calling for your genocide...
[Post New]07/28/2014 22:26
quote
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:Who would you prefer to have as a neighbor - Israel or Hamas?
Not a hard choice at all - Israel all the way.


Neither, one takes your land and blows you up, the other blows you up.
[Post New]07/28/2014 22:27
quote
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Who would you prefer to have as a neighbor - Israel or Hamas?
Not a hard choice at all - Israel all the way.


Neither, one takes your land and blows you up, the other blows you up.


+1

[Post New]07/28/2014 22:29
quote
Anonymous
on the margin i would prefer hamas because i would never take their land and human rights and they would have no reason to bomb me. israel - grab and blow up in every situation
[Post New]07/28/2014 22:45
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Muslima
Member

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Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Who would you prefer to have as a neighbor - Israel or Hamas?
Not a hard choice at all - Israel all the way.


Neither, one takes your land and blows you up, the other blows you up.


+1



When Umar, the 2nd caliph of Islam conquered Jerusalem, this was his treaty detailing the rights and privileges regarding the conquered people:

In the name of God, the Merciful, the Compassionate. This is the assurance of safety which the servant of God, Umar, the Commander of the Faithful, has given to the people of Jerusalem. He has given them an assurance of safety for themselves for their property, their churches, their crosses, the sick and healthy of the city and for all the rituals which belong to their religion. Their churches will not be inhabited by Muslims and will not be destroyed. Neither they, nor the land on which they stand, nor their cross, nor their property will be damaged. They will not be forcibly converted. No Jew will live with them in Jerusalem

The people of Jerusalem must pay the taxes like the people of other cities and must expel the Byzantines and the robbers. Those of the people of Jerusalem who want to leave with the Byzantines, take their property and abandon their churches and crosses will be safe until they reach their place of refuge. The villagers may remain in the city if they wish but must pay taxes like the citizens. Those who wish may go with the Byzantines and those who wish may return to their families. Nothing is to be taken from them before their harvest is reaped.

If they pay their taxes according to their obligations, then the conditions laid out in this letter are under the covenant of God, are the responsibility of His Prophet, of the caliphs and of the faithful.

- Quoted in The Great Arab Conquests, from Tarikh Tabari



History notes that before the Muslim conquest of Jerusalem, the Jews were not allowed to live inside the city. Although Jews were eventually allowed to come to Jerusalem for worship, the Christian ruler had requested that the Jews were not to be allowed to live in Jerusalem. Under the surrender terms, Caliph Umar accepted that request. However, later the Muslims relaxed the rules and the Jews were also allowed to enter the city and settle with the rest of the population.

How did the jews get to come back to live in Jerusalem?

So every Muslim who came was in town or valley, and there came with them a group of Jews. Then he ['Umar] ordered them to sweep the holy place [the Temple site] and to cleanse it. 'Umar himself oversaw them at all times, and each time something was uncovered, he would ask the Jewish elders about the Rock, which was the Foundation Stone. Finally, one of their scholars indicated the precise boundaries of the place, as a result of which, it was uncovered. He commanded that walls be built around the holy site and that a dome be constructed over the Foundation Stone, and that it should be gilded.

After this, the Jews sent word to all the rest of the Jews in Palestine to inform them of the agreement that 'Umar had made with them. The letter was sent back to them asking what would be the number of people who would be allowed to move to Jerusalem. So they came into 'Umar's presence and asked him, "How many people from the Jewish community will the Commander of the Faithful order to move to this city?" "What will your enemies [the Christians] say?" "Speak to them, and after that, I shall have the final word that will put an end to the dispute between you."

Then the Christian Patriarch and his entourage appeared, and 'Umar said to them, "I have made an agreement with the Jews concerning all. . . . Let there come here that number which you yourselves indicate." The Patriarch responded, "Let the number of those who come with their families and their children be fifty households." The Jews replied to this, "We shall not be less than two hundred households." They kept haggling over this until 'Umar commanded that there be seventy households -- to which they agreed.

Then 'Umar said, "Where would you wish to live in the city?" "In the southern part," they replied. And that it is now the Market of the Jews. The aim of their request was to be near the Temple Mount and its gates, and likewise to be near the water of Silwan for ritual bathing. The Commander of the Faithful granted this to them.

Then seventy families moved from Tiberias and the area around it with their wives and children. They filled up the quarter with buildings the remains of which lasted for many generations.
[Post New]07/28/2014 22:56
quote
Anonymous
Why are people so upset about "monopolizing" a thread? How is this different from the AMA threads?
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