Any Parents Privately Disappointed with College Placement?
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Anonymous
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Blair has two test-in programs: the math/science magnet, and the communication arts program. Most of the NMSSFs come from the math science magnet, to be sure. But some come from the CAP program, and a handful come from the regular programs. The math/science magnet selects about 1 in 7 applicants. The CAP program selects about 1 in 5 applicants. So both are elite groups of public school kids.
Both math/science and CAP have their own courses, about 4 out of the 8 classes that Blair kids take in a semester. For the other courses, these kids generally take honors and AP. So the math/science kids take 3-4 special science courses that are designed just for them, and then honors English classes and honors/AP government classes. Ditto for the CAP kids, who take 3/4 CAP classes and then honors math and science courses. (I've got a kid in one of these programs....) |
SAM2
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Just to follow up, the false argument that riled me up was the claim that " there just aren't that many super-high achievers academically-speaking" is private schools. That's just wrong -- there are lots of them.
The discussion seems to be shifting now to a "which is better?" argument between private schools and magnet publics. I think there's lots of fodder for argument on both sides, but it's not really a fight that interests me personally. Ultimately, I think each family should focus on which situation is best for its own individual children, and not on some artificial contest between the two. But like I said, if people want to argue about it, it's very debatable. There are lots of statistics that could point either direction. Have fun. |
Anonymous
No, it's not wrong. Arguably it's a matter of opinion or interpretation (e.g what's super-high achievement, what's many), but *most* local private schools don't have more than one or two such kids per year (if that) and even in their best years, I don't think any of the "Big 3" ever get out of the teens (except maybe combining NCS/StA) based on a measurement like NMSF. That's a handful of kids. And even when a local private has a "high" percentage of super-high achievers, that percentage is still a small percentage of the class (e.g. 15 vs. 85). Sure, super-high achievers, by definition, are a small group. But the discourse here suggests that they're all at privates and privates are full of them. Not so. Only a small percentage of the kids in privates are knocking the ball out of the park on standardized tests. And if you're looking for a concentration of such kids locally, your best hope is TJ or maybe Blair. This is simple sociology/demography -- the overlap of two tails of different bell curves (extreme wealth and extreme intelligence) is typically going to be miniscule (unless you imagine a society where wealth is based on IQ and is not inheritable). None of it is about which school (or type of school) is the best. Super-high achieving kids are outliers -- so, if the percentiles tell you anything, they're more likely to tell you which schools attract (rather than produce) them. And that's not what makes a school great. In general, I'm skeptical of the whole "best" school notion -- it's a "for whom?" decision (and the answers can vary dramatically because of that) and it's a realm-of-the-possible decision. But if you could somehow eliminate those issues, what I'd want to compare is the difference betwween what kids come in with and what they go out with. Not sure how you measure that. But I know it wouldn't be a matter of counting how many kids at each school got top standardized test scores. |
Anonymous
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ITA that the decision to go public or private is a personal one, with no one-size-fits-all choice.
My reading of this conversation is that it went in the public vs. private direction because one poster was claiming that public school kids just aren't all that bright. Specifically, the poster who claimed the average private school kid could jump over to public and be at the top of the class. Then, she kept trying to defend this. So the public school families came in to contest this, with some justice, IMHO. Now that we seem to be done with that sub-argument, I'd be happy to get back to a discussion of college placement outcomes. I haven't actually noticed much about that on this thread.... |
Anonymous
| If you talk to parents of Sidwell's Class of 2010, you will find a lot of upset. There were lots of kids who through GPA, SATs were Ivy contenders who didn't get in. The application process is so arbitrary that it's hard to say if it was just bad luck. Some say it was a weak class, others fault the school for failing to support the students apps. |
Anonymous
What, in particular, are parents saying the school should have done, but failed to do? |
Anonymous
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The thing is, having really high SATs and straight As just doesn't guarantee an Ivy any more. You also have to bring peace to the middle east, or diversity, or be a legacy, or have been Hermione in the HP movies. It's not like when we were applying.
Did any of the disappointed kids have these attributes? If not, it probably wouldn't be fair to say they were weak academically or intellectually, just that they weren't "special" in one or more of these other ways. |
Anonymous
Agreed. Sidwell had plenty of Ivy (or equivalent) admits this year, but not every great student can/should go to an Ivy League school. Having great grades and national merit on SATs does not guarantee a slot. Interestingly enough, many of the kids who did get into Ivies did not have perfect grades, but rather showed real passion for something or showed personal growth. Ivies do not necessarily want a whole class of robotic straight-A kids who are afraid to take chances in life. I recently heard a StA parent complaining that an "average" kid was chosen for Princeton over her own son. |
Anonymous
| There was a fair amount of upset at the Cathedral Schools too. I think parents who pay so much for school believe they're paying for an Ivy acceptance. |
Anonymous
| To 15:22, do you have any idea what the "average" kid who got into Princeton had going for him? Was it a "passion"? |
Anonymous
| I'm not 15:22 but my kid got into Princeton...athletic recruiting. The minimum SAT score they'll take for an athletic in my DC's sport is 2100 + top 10%. Princeton is relatively small compared to the other Ivies -- so they need "two-fers" ...students with great grades/SATs ... but someone also who excels as the best in at least one particular area. |
Anonymous
Of course it is horseshit. |
Anonymous
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Oh no, here we go again. 17:05, I hope by now you've read the posts that followed the ones you quoted.
Now can we get back to the thread topic? Kids from privates getting into Princeton, or not. |
Anonymous
I'm not sure its about the money. Parents and kids think if they have straight A's and stunning SATs' they are a shoo in. It's just not true. I realized it was an arbitrary process 30 years ago when I applied. It worked for me. I got in to a school that my college counselor said was out of my league. I told him that I didn't want his help in no uncertain terms. He thought I was impudent but the fact is that I didn't want his input on the application. My teachers were much, much more supportive. I made an effort, showed the school i wanted to go. I was different, had passions. It worked out. i'm not sure I wouldn't get in today even though my GPA and SAT's were slightly about average. |
Anonymous
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Here's my question. What if your kid is not in the top 10% at these top private schools? My daughter is a terrific student, but there are at least 10-20 equally smart strivers in her class at a Big 3.
Also what about the passion issue? What if a kid hasn't found his/her passion by 11th grade? What if a kid is just really smart and good in a lot of different things. Is he/she just out of luck in the admissions game? It seems sad because how can you control when you find your passion in life. |