APS Closing Nottingham

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First they overcrowded Glebe
And I did not speak out
Because I didn't have kids there and so eff that.
Then they repurposed McKinley
And I did not speak out
and in fact was a little grateful over it because better them than us.
Then they came for Nottingham
And there was no one left
To speak out for me
and in fact for some reason people don't seem to like me that much and they're starting to get on my nerves

It's funny because if Nottingham hadn't been so vocal about turning away kids from other schools before because they were oh so crowded, they might not be underenrolled now. But noooooo, like always the Nottingham moms and dads were all: FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT!!

Everyone else is really done with Nottingham's Thunderdome antics. Reading some of the terrible "I'm a lawyer but have no experience with this kind of law" takes posted here is hysterical -- you guys are too much. Look at this this way, Nottingham: This is actually an opportunity for you, since your school isn't being scrapped, it's being given an extension. If enrollment numbers in your area go back up after covid, like you have been saying they will when folks return from private, then Nottingham will turn back into a local elementary in several years after the renovations. If not, and if you've been wrong about the numbers, then let's see what this experiment shows re whether the school is really needed as a local elementary.

Nottingham was overcrowded. Significantly so, and for some time. So overcrowded that we spent hundreds of millions of dollars on new elementary schools nearby. Now, less than a decade later, we are shutting down Nottingham because oops, we didn’t need that space after all.

Tell me- did the school board screw up then, or is it screwing up now? Because no rational district spends hundreds of millions of dollars to create new schools that aren’t needed. Have things changed so permanently and remarkably after COVID that we need to completely change course? If so, why aren’t we looking at that?

I don’t trust their projection data. Their confidence in it, despite being repeatedly wrong and it having the same sort of limitations that caused them to be caught flat footed in the 2010s, is very concerning.

I can see few people share this concern when it comes to sticking it to the Nottingham community. I don’t like being surrounded by idiots, and for that reason I’m looking toward the exits. Enjoy the bond service on those hundred million dollar schools.

You had ONLY 50 kids enrolled in kindergarten this year! Ashlawn had 100. Cardinal had over 120. Glebe had 80. Even Taylor had 75. Abington had 120! How is that fair to other schools who are actually pulling their weight? Then you complain whenever the board attempts to redistrict more kids to Nottingham. Something is ALWAYS wrong with the plan, something is always "very concerning," ha. As a group, you are exhausting. I don't feel community with Nottingham because they have thrown other kids under the bus multiple times over the last several years. I wouldn't push for something to happen to their school, but if APS puts them on the chopping block, I'm not going out of my way to make arguments for you. Reap what you've sown -- if you look at it, you've brought this on yourselves by all your past actions.

You don’t know me sweetheart. I’m not even in Nottingham yet. I didn’t do anything to you, short of pay the bills for your kids to have brand new LEED Gold facilities that apparently were not needed. I’m not allowed to question massive expenses that were not prudently incurred?

I can see why my neighbors who can have already bailed. People don’t talk about anything intelligently in this district - everyone is a hysterical culture warrior. Sadly I can’t bail. We’re not all rich bastards up here.

You don't know me either, honey, and my kids certainly don't have brand new LEED Gold facilities. You certainly seem like you'll fit in with the other Nottingham parents, though.

Cool. And you sound like the type of person that votes for incompetence if they check your woke equity warrior boxes. Never ask questions.

Oh, dear. Your dumb is showing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Isn't the main problem with dwindling numbers at Nottingham due to many Nottingham families going private? I think it was just under capacity before covid about 4 years ago. It's shrunk to under 400 kids because so many took their kids out for private, I thought? Not sure if I can find the 2017 numbers.

Here: In 2017, APS was projecting that Nottingham would have 535 kids attending in 2018, which for Nottingham is about 100% capacity (I think without trailers their capacity is 530). So in just 5 years they've lost more than 140 kids and their school now has under 400 kids. You're seeing that shrinkage more in the way way North where parents wend private due to school closures and less in the south where minority families who were actually more likely to be negatively affected by covid healthwise were often okay with the closures. But you can't have your cake and eat it too -- have kids leave the system in your northern elementary schools and think that's "fair" -- the reality is you're spending more on your school to staff and operate it when you've only got 400 kids compared to a school that's closer to full capacity.

I have to respond to this point. Many were not ok with the closures, especially the ones that continued to work outside the home in public facing jobs and wanted their kids to get an education or at least be supervised for 6-7 hours a day. They just didn’t have the resources to flee to private school.

No, sorry. Lower income families and many of the “brown” families you all pretended to care so much about chose virtual at a higher rate than privileged white people whose SAHM-ing or sitting-on-their-behind-in-yoga-pants “working” at home white moms was being cramped by their noisy kids being at home wanting attention and endless snacks.

I didn’t realize it at the time but turns out that APE was 100% right.

I gotta love the resident APE promoter who always pretends to be non APE but oh so supportive. Makes my day every time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: "All APS schools will now teach phonics and cursive, and homework is mandatory. Grading will be on a standard 4.0 scale." Done. Time to close ATS.

yeah but then the SB would lose their woke..err...progressive points and be unable to show off to all their friends.

I’m sorry you’re not very bright.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why isn't the Madison Community Center on the list for a swing space?

Used to be a school.

Because the County owns it and doesn’t share. It’s not going to happen.

Another community center is on the list though, so they appear to have moved past that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems obvious that Nottingham should be shut down. Less than 400 kids? Give me a break. Unless there us another school with even fewer kids it just makes sense.

Fewer than 400 kids !!! I remember when the community was up in arms about leaving drew so underenrolled after MPSA left. Drew is now larger than Nottingham.

But the housing policies that filled up Drew don’t apply to Nottingham. Unless the community is asking the county to build a CAF up in that neighborhood to fill up the school. One building would do it.

I remember a few years ago Jamestown was so under enrolled that they had to fill it with pre school and sped programs. Is that still the case? Maybe Nott isn’t really the lowest enrollment if you compare the number of neighborhood kids across schools, and don’t take into account the other programs that don’t have to be in any particular place.

And why did APS fill up Jamestown with these other programs instead of closing it, but now wants to close Nott? Nott isn’t that underenrolled. APS could move some of the programs out of the overcrowded schools and get it right back up to 100.

But look at how fast a Nottingham parent is to point to Jamestown or some other elementary school as an alternative chopping block head to get them out of their problem. They do this every cycle, did it with McKinley a few times and Taylor or Tuckahoe when they didn’t want to take in excess kids and pointed them towards other schools instead. You guys are the worst.

They don't want more buses that come from being used as swing space; yet it's fine to to add buses to move the programs out of crowded schools from other parts of the county. NES folks need to come up with an agreed argument and stick to it.

You don't see the difference between adding 1-2 programs to a mostly walking school vs switching a 90% walking school to a 100% driving school?

As swing space, the 100% driving school would be mainly buses and probably not much more individual cars for pick-ups and such as you have as a neighborhood program. And probably a lot less independent drivers on those rainy or cold days when all those walkers don't actually walk. So, differences; but overall, not a tremendous increase in danger, no. As an option program, there would still be those same buses and maybe more drivers depending on the program and where most of the students come from.

Nevertheless, the other issue is the constant - or frequent - relocation of those programs. Instructional consistency is needed for special programs, too; and it isn't right to keep moving those around like second-class citizens. Sure, parents may only be involved in a preK program for a year or so; but the teachers also have to move with the program, schools have to re-arrange to accommodate, admin has to adapt, etc. personally, I think every single elementary school should have pre-K classrooms and all Montessori preK should be with Montessori (if we have to keep Montessori).

And you base this conclusion that it would be mainly buses on what? I completely disagree. With longer bus rides, more parents would likely drive and there would be a lot more individual cars in the neighborhood.

trust me, Nottingham is not convenient enough for most parents to drive their kids to and from school every day. The bus will be far more convenient.

Yes, and we had all these exact concerns and discussions within the ATS community - moved from a perfect central location to the edge of the county and into a perfectly walkable neighborhood and their school - which somehow was falling apart despite the money APS had sunk into it just a few years prior. We had 16 buses I believe. APS condensed them. Most kids take the bus. I know the immediate neighborhood doesn’t like the excess cars, but hey, they all wanted the shiny new school, which was, as it turns out, a completely unnecessary built and expenditure. No foresight, and a CB continuously working against the SB. So on brand Arlington.

Yes. The stupid school moves turned out to be a (very) expensive boondoggle. And Planning said that they couldn't "in good conscience" leave the taxpayers with a bussing bill for the 20% of Westover neighborhood students who could now walk to school. Right.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems obvious that Nottingham should be shut down. Less than 400 kids? Give me a break. Unless there us another school with even fewer kids it just makes sense.

Fewer than 400 kids !!! I remember when the community was up in arms about leaving drew so underenrolled after MPSA left. Drew is now larger than Nottingham.

But the housing policies that filled up Drew don’t apply to Nottingham. Unless the community is asking the county to build a CAF up in that neighborhood to fill up the school. One building would do it.

I remember a few years ago Jamestown was so under enrolled that they had to fill it with pre school and sped programs. Is that still the case? Maybe Nott isn’t really the lowest enrollment if you compare the number of neighborhood kids across schools, and don’t take into account the other programs that don’t have to be in any particular place.

And why did APS fill up Jamestown with these other programs instead of closing it, but now wants to close Nott? Nott isn’t that underenrolled. APS could move some of the programs out of the overcrowded schools and get it right back up to 100.

But look at how fast a Nottingham parent is to point to Jamestown or some other elementary school as an alternative chopping block head to get them out of their problem. They do this every cycle, did it with McKinley a few times and Taylor or Tuckahoe when they didn’t want to take in excess kids and pointed them towards other schools instead. You guys are the worst.

They don't want more buses that come from being used as swing space; yet it's fine to to add buses to move the programs out of crowded schools from other parts of the county. NES folks need to come up with an agreed argument and stick to it.

You don't see the difference between adding 1-2 programs to a mostly walking school vs switching a 90% walking school to a 100% driving school?

As swing space, the 100% driving school would be mainly buses and probably not much more individual cars for pick-ups and such as you have as a neighborhood program. And probably a lot less independent drivers on those rainy or cold days when all those walkers don't actually walk. So, differences; but overall, not a tremendous increase in danger, no. As an option program, there would still be those same buses and maybe more drivers depending on the program and where most of the students come from.

Nevertheless, the other issue is the constant - or frequent - relocation of those programs. Instructional consistency is needed for special programs, too; and it isn't right to keep moving those around like second-class citizens. Sure, parents may only be involved in a preK program for a year or so; but the teachers also have to move with the program, schools have to re-arrange to accommodate, admin has to adapt, etc. personally, I think every single elementary school should have pre-K classrooms and all Montessori preK should be with Montessori (if we have to keep Montessori).

And you base this conclusion that it would be mainly buses on what? I completely disagree. With longer bus rides, more parents would likely drive and there would be a lot more individual cars in the neighborhood.

trust me, Nottingham is not convenient enough for most parents to drive their kids to and from school every day. The bus will be far more convenient.

Not for before care or extended day. Also, where are you going to park 12 busses? The school isn’t designed for this.

I wouldn't be surprised if APS provides a later bus from extended day back to the home school.
600 kids. Minimum 60 kids per bus. That's no more than 10 total buses. And you're forgetting the hundreds that won't be riding the bus because their parents will prefer to drive all the way to NES and back twice a day so their kids don't have to be on the bus for 30 minutes. So, far less than 10 buses.

umm you know all parents don't just get out of work and pick their kids up at the same time, right? That's not how it works. Parents arrive at extended day at all different times up until it closes.

And all those parents driving to NES so their kids don't have to be on the bus is precisely what the neighborhood is worried about.

And I would guess that if these unnamed and unknown schools that would use Nottingham as a swing space knew about the plan, they wouldn’t want it either. It’s too far to be practical. How do you pick up from extended day if you rely on public transportation? It could add hours to your day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First they overcrowded Glebe
And I did not speak out
Because I didn't have kids there and so eff that.
Then they repurposed McKinley
And I did not speak out
and in fact was a little grateful over it because better them than us.
Then they came for Nottingham
And there was no one left
To speak out for me
and in fact for some reason people don't seem to like me that much and they're starting to get on my nerves

When you behave like this for years and eff over other schools in the community to put your own schools’ needs as primary, you can’t reasonably claim that other parents are going to miss your upper middle class values and time and effort put into APS. Lots of other parents volunteer at APS without screwing everyone else over.

Uh, the attacks on Nottingham families/parents and karma arguments aren’t persuasive. I’m not in Nottingham but the idea that we should screw over a while school community because you didn’t like some former PTa mom is … stupid? And it makes you sound like a petty little person.

They are getting assigned to demographically identical schools in a nearby location. They are def not getting a raw deal if this passes! Goodness.

Non sequiter?

Nope- PP said the Nottingham community was getting “screwed over.” They aren’t! They will get assigned to wonderful nearby school communities.

So just because the Nottingham kids will end up at another good school means parents shouldn’t fight to keep their current school open?

Yes? I mean, if you have to ask. They will likely be moved with a number of their friends, and many of the staff will be moved as well. It’s not like they’re sending your kids far away, or to an inferior school. So maybe just don’t go nuclear? Ask questions, raise concerns, sure. But don’t act as if this is the worst thing to ever happen, or claim that it will destroy your community, or other hyperbole. It’s just tone deaf, and won’t be effective at accomplishing much other than angering and alienating other members of the Arlington community.

Who said anything about going nuclear? Did you see the rational post above outlining the questions parents are asking? It was exactly what you are suggesting - ask questions, raise concerns. No where was there even a hint of this being the worst thing to happen to the community. Sure, not ideal, but everyone will get through it.

Anonymous wrote:
I’ve read all 57 pages of this thread and can’t find the elitist posts you are talking about. What I see is:

- parents not wanting their walkable, neighborhood school to close
- a neighborhood not wanting the large increase in traffic that would result from a walkable neighborhood school turning into a 100 pct bus/car school
- parents wanting answers about how to retain teachers and administrators in the 3 years it would take to put this plan into action, if it happens
- parents asking questions about the possibility outdated data being used to predict enrollment across the affected area
- parents asking questions about the multiple TBD line items in the plan to close Nottingham, and why budget figures keep changing
- parents asking if the schools that will use the Nottingham swing space for a year or two while their own school is under construction actually want to use it as a swing space

Found it. Nothing nuclear about asking questions and raising concerns.

These are fine questions. But you can’t recast this thread as “only” reasonable questions from Nottingham parents. Most of the Nottingham parent comments on this thread is the usual Nottingham elitism and nastiness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First they overcrowded Glebe
And I did not speak out
Because I didn't have kids there and so eff that.
Then they repurposed McKinley
And I did not speak out
and in fact was a little grateful over it because better them than us.
Then they came for Nottingham
And there was no one left
To speak out for me
and in fact for some reason people don't seem to like me that much and they're starting to get on my nerves

When you behave like this for years and eff over other schools in the community to put your own schools’ needs as primary, you can’t reasonably claim that other parents are going to miss your upper middle class values and time and effort put into APS. Lots of other parents volunteer at APS without screwing everyone else over.

Uh, the attacks on Nottingham families/parents and karma arguments aren’t persuasive. I’m not in Nottingham but the idea that we should screw over a while school community because you didn’t like some former PTa mom is … stupid? And it makes you sound like a petty little person.

They are getting assigned to demographically identical schools in a nearby location. They are def not getting a raw deal if this passes! Goodness.

Non sequiter?

Nope- PP said the Nottingham community was getting “screwed over.” They aren’t! They will get assigned to wonderful nearby school communities.

So just because the Nottingham kids will end up at another good school means parents shouldn’t fight to keep their current school open?

Yes? I mean, if you have to ask. They will likely be moved with a number of their friends, and many of the staff will be moved as well. It’s not like they’re sending your kids far away, or to an inferior school. So maybe just don’t go nuclear? Ask questions, raise concerns, sure. But don’t act as if this is the worst thing to ever happen, or claim that it will destroy your community, or other hyperbole. It’s just tone deaf, and won’t be effective at accomplishing much other than angering and alienating other members of the Arlington community.

Who said anything about going nuclear? Did you see the rational post above outlining the questions parents are asking? It was exactly what you are suggesting - ask questions, raise concerns. No where was there even a hint of this being the worst thing to happen to the community. Sure, not ideal, but everyone will get through it.

Anonymous wrote:
I’ve read all 57 pages of this thread and can’t find the elitist posts you are talking about. What I see is:

- parents not wanting their walkable, neighborhood school to close
- a neighborhood not wanting the large increase in traffic that would result from a walkable neighborhood school turning into a 100 pct bus/car school
- parents wanting answers about how to retain teachers and administrators in the 3 years it would take to put this plan into action, if it happens
- parents asking questions about the possibility outdated data being used to predict enrollment across the affected area
- parents asking questions about the multiple TBD line items in the plan to close Nottingham, and why budget figures keep changing
- parents asking if the schools that will use the Nottingham swing space for a year or two while their own school is under construction actually want to use it as a swing space

Found it. Nothing nuclear about asking questions and raising concerns.

These are fine questions. But you can’t recast this thread as “only” reasonable questions from Nottingham parents. Most of the Nottingham parent comments on this thread is the usual Nottingham elitism and nastiness.

I’ve been in touch with a great deal of Nottingham parents and the vast majority align more with these unanswered questions than whatever poster here is trying for scorched earth. We know we’ll be fine - we obviously are trying to save our school but if it doesnt work out, we’ll be ok.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First they overcrowded Glebe
And I did not speak out
Because I didn't have kids there and so eff that.
Then they repurposed McKinley
And I did not speak out
and in fact was a little grateful over it because better them than us.
Then they came for Nottingham
And there was no one left
To speak out for me
and in fact for some reason people don't seem to like me that much and they're starting to get on my nerves

When you behave like this for years and eff over other schools in the community to put your own schools’ needs as primary, you can’t reasonably claim that other parents are going to miss your upper middle class values and time and effort put into APS. Lots of other parents volunteer at APS without screwing everyone else over.

Uh, the attacks on Nottingham families/parents and karma arguments aren’t persuasive. I’m not in Nottingham but the idea that we should screw over a while school community because you didn’t like some former PTa mom is … stupid? And it makes you sound like a petty little person.

They are getting assigned to demographically identical schools in a nearby location. They are def not getting a raw deal if this passes! Goodness.

Non sequiter?

Nope- PP said the Nottingham community was getting “screwed over.” They aren’t! They will get assigned to wonderful nearby school communities.

So just because the Nottingham kids will end up at another good school means parents shouldn’t fight to keep their current school open?

Yes? I mean, if you have to ask. They will likely be moved with a number of their friends, and many of the staff will be moved as well. It’s not like they’re sending your kids far away, or to an inferior school. So maybe just don’t go nuclear? Ask questions, raise concerns, sure. But don’t act as if this is the worst thing to ever happen, or claim that it will destroy your community, or other hyperbole. It’s just tone deaf, and won’t be effective at accomplishing much other than angering and alienating other members of the Arlington community.

Who said anything about going nuclear? Did you see the rational post above outlining the questions parents are asking? It was exactly what you are suggesting - ask questions, raise concerns. No where was there even a hint of this being the worst thing to happen to the community. Sure, not ideal, but everyone will get through it.

Anonymous wrote:
I’ve read all 57 pages of this thread and can’t find the elitist posts you are talking about. What I see is:

- parents not wanting their walkable, neighborhood school to close
- a neighborhood not wanting the large increase in traffic that would result from a walkable neighborhood school turning into a 100 pct bus/car school
- parents wanting answers about how to retain teachers and administrators in the 3 years it would take to put this plan into action, if it happens
- parents asking questions about the possibility outdated data being used to predict enrollment across the affected area
- parents asking questions about the multiple TBD line items in the plan to close Nottingham, and why budget figures keep changing
- parents asking if the schools that will use the Nottingham swing space for a year or two while their own school is under construction actually want to use it as a swing space

Found it. Nothing nuclear about asking questions and raising concerns.

These are fine questions. But you can’t recast this thread as “only” reasonable questions from Nottingham parents. Most of the Nottingham parent comments on this thread is the usual Nottingham elitism and nastiness.

Well someone accused us of exploiting deaths because we’re concerned about pedestrian fatalities and want a traffic study so I beg to differ. The nastiness is 90% against Nottingham based on some weird stereotype of 22207.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First they overcrowded Glebe
And I did not speak out
Because I didn't have kids there and so eff that.
Then they repurposed McKinley
And I did not speak out
and in fact was a little grateful over it because better them than us.
Then they came for Nottingham
And there was no one left
To speak out for me
and in fact for some reason people don't seem to like me that much and they're starting to get on my nerves

When you behave like this for years and eff over other schools in the community to put your own schools’ needs as primary, you can’t reasonably claim that other parents are going to miss your upper middle class values and time and effort put into APS. Lots of other parents volunteer at APS without screwing everyone else over.

Uh, the attacks on Nottingham families/parents and karma arguments aren’t persuasive. I’m not in Nottingham but the idea that we should screw over a while school community because you didn’t like some former PTa mom is … stupid? And it makes you sound like a petty little person.

They are getting assigned to demographically identical schools in a nearby location. They are def not getting a raw deal if this passes! Goodness.

Non sequiter?

Nope- PP said the Nottingham community was getting “screwed over.” They aren’t! They will get assigned to wonderful nearby school communities.

So just because the Nottingham kids will end up at another good school means parents shouldn’t fight to keep their current school open?

Yes? I mean, if you have to ask. They will likely be moved with a number of their friends, and many of the staff will be moved as well. It’s not like they’re sending your kids far away, or to an inferior school. So maybe just don’t go nuclear? Ask questions, raise concerns, sure. But don’t act as if this is the worst thing to ever happen, or claim that it will destroy your community, or other hyperbole. It’s just tone deaf, and won’t be effective at accomplishing much other than angering and alienating other members of the Arlington community.

Who said anything about going nuclear? Did you see the rational post above outlining the questions parents are asking? It was exactly what you are suggesting - ask questions, raise concerns. No where was there even a hint of this being the worst thing to happen to the community. Sure, not ideal, but everyone will get through it.

Anonymous wrote:
I’ve read all 57 pages of this thread and can’t find the elitist posts you are talking about. What I see is:

- parents not wanting their walkable, neighborhood school to close
- a neighborhood not wanting the large increase in traffic that would result from a walkable neighborhood school turning into a 100 pct bus/car school
- parents wanting answers about how to retain teachers and administrators in the 3 years it would take to put this plan into action, if it happens
- parents asking questions about the possibility outdated data being used to predict enrollment across the affected area
- parents asking questions about the multiple TBD line items in the plan to close Nottingham, and why budget figures keep changing
- parents asking if the schools that will use the Nottingham swing space for a year or two while their own school is under construction actually want to use it as a swing space

Found it. Nothing nuclear about asking questions and raising concerns.

These are fine questions. But you can’t recast this thread as “only” reasonable questions from Nottingham parents. Most of the Nottingham parent comments on this thread is the usual Nottingham elitism and nastiness.

The fact that you accuse Nott parents of “the usual elitism and nastiness” speaks volumes. You have a weird chip on your shoulder PP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First they overcrowded Glebe
And I did not speak out
Because I didn't have kids there and so eff that.
Then they repurposed McKinley
And I did not speak out
and in fact was a little grateful over it because better them than us.
Then they came for Nottingham
And there was no one left
To speak out for me
and in fact for some reason people don't seem to like me that much and they're starting to get on my nerves

When you behave like this for years and eff over other schools in the community to put your own schools’ needs as primary, you can’t reasonably claim that other parents are going to miss your upper middle class values and time and effort put into APS. Lots of other parents volunteer at APS without screwing everyone else over.

Uh, the attacks on Nottingham families/parents and karma arguments aren’t persuasive. I’m not in Nottingham but the idea that we should screw over a while school community because you didn’t like some former PTa mom is … stupid? And it makes you sound like a petty little person.

They are getting assigned to demographically identical schools in a nearby location. They are def not getting a raw deal if this passes! Goodness.

Non sequiter?

Nope- PP said the Nottingham community was getting “screwed over.” They aren’t! They will get assigned to wonderful nearby school communities.

So just because the Nottingham kids will end up at another good school means parents shouldn’t fight to keep their current school open?

Yes? I mean, if you have to ask. They will likely be moved with a number of their friends, and many of the staff will be moved as well. It’s not like they’re sending your kids far away, or to an inferior school. So maybe just don’t go nuclear? Ask questions, raise concerns, sure. But don’t act as if this is the worst thing to ever happen, or claim that it will destroy your community, or other hyperbole. It’s just tone deaf, and won’t be effective at accomplishing much other than angering and alienating other members of the Arlington community.

Who said anything about going nuclear? Did you see the rational post above outlining the questions parents are asking? It was exactly what you are suggesting - ask questions, raise concerns. No where was there even a hint of this being the worst thing to happen to the community. Sure, not ideal, but everyone will get through it.

Anonymous wrote:
I’ve read all 57 pages of this thread and can’t find the elitist posts you are talking about. What I see is:

- parents not wanting their walkable, neighborhood school to close
- a neighborhood not wanting the large increase in traffic that would result from a walkable neighborhood school turning into a 100 pct bus/car school
- parents wanting answers about how to retain teachers and administrators in the 3 years it would take to put this plan into action, if it happens
- parents asking questions about the possibility outdated data being used to predict enrollment across the affected area
- parents asking questions about the multiple TBD line items in the plan to close Nottingham, and why budget figures keep changing
- parents asking if the schools that will use the Nottingham swing space for a year or two while their own school is under construction actually want to use it as a swing space

Found it. Nothing nuclear about asking questions and raising concerns.

These are fine questions. But you can’t recast this thread as “only” reasonable questions from Nottingham parents. Most of the Nottingham parent comments on this thread is the usual Nottingham elitism and nastiness.

I’ve been in touch with a great deal of Nottingham parents and the vast majority align more with these unanswered questions than whatever poster here is trying for scorched earth. We know we’ll be fine - we obviously are trying to save our school but if it doesnt work out, we’ll be ok.

It’s an anon message board, could be trolls from other school communities stirring things up. Because it’s obvious someone really doesn’t like Nottingham kids. Sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Y'all are all playing right into APS's hands. Fight amongst yourselves when the real issue is the bizarre decision-making.

APS is at capacity! So close down a school? For what what problem are we trying to solve? What renovations are absolutely needed that will take longer than a few months that can't be broken down into summer-long chunks? For how long? No partial school closures while renovating - it's all or nothing? These are BASIC questions that have no answers in the pre-CIP. This level of mismanagement and lack of rigor would get me fired at my job. Who cares about the N vs S nonsense.

I love it - do the work over those summer months... oh wait summer is like 6 weeks now with the new calendar. And you are dead wrong. Work at Gunston and Randolph too years with unbelievably bad conditions in the schools. You Northies are probably unaware of the mold problems from leaky roofs and faulty HVAC design. Anyone remember Gunston had to close when it got too hot because the air conditioning couldn't keep up? Those jobs were spread over multiple summers and I am really glad that APS has the room to get away from that stupic method.

Oh, and for everyone saying APS is overcrowded? at capacity? Nope, certain schools are. That's it. Look at the numbers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Y'all are all playing right into APS's hands. Fight amongst yourselves when the real issue is the bizarre decision-making.

APS is at capacity! So close down a school? For what what problem are we trying to solve? What renovations are absolutely needed that will take longer than a few months that can't be broken down into summer-long chunks? For how long? No partial school closures while renovating - it's all or nothing? These are BASIC questions that have no answers in the pre-CIP. This level of mismanagement and lack of rigor would get me fired at my job. Who cares about the N vs S nonsense.

I love it - do the work over those summer months... oh wait summer is like 6 weeks now with the new calendar. And you are dead wrong. Work at Gunston and Randolph too years with unbelievably bad conditions in the schools. You Northies are probably unaware of the mold problems from leaky roofs and faulty HVAC design. Anyone remember Gunston had to close when it got too hot because the air conditioning couldn't keep up? Those jobs were spread over multiple summers and I am really glad that APS has the room to get away from that stupic method.

Oh, and for everyone saying APS is overcrowded? at capacity? Nope, certain schools are. That's it. Look at the numbers.

Nope none of this is in the report, it is just you theorizing. It still makes no sense to close any school if you have schools that are overcrowded. That’s bad planning for current school boundaries.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Y'all are all playing right into APS's hands. Fight amongst yourselves when the real issue is the bizarre decision-making.

APS is at capacity! So close down a school? For what what problem are we trying to solve? What renovations are absolutely needed that will take longer than a few months that can't be broken down into summer-long chunks? For how long? No partial school closures while renovating - it's all or nothing? These are BASIC questions that have no answers in the pre-CIP. This level of mismanagement and lack of rigor would get me fired at my job. Who cares about the N vs S nonsense.

Ding ding ding. We have a winner. Ask the real questions. Even abingdon had a full scale rebuild and never closed. What’s the plan APS? Who’s moving here? For how long? What happens to it next?

APS isn’t going to bus kids from Barcroft to Nottingham. That’s ridiculous. Is this about MPSA? because those details were a mere footnote in the career center plans. Arlington residents deserve to know what the longer term plans are and stop being expected to eat bulls*t a spoonful at a time.

MPSA was a footnote with a hug pricetag! Read the report.
Oh and I thanked my lucky stars every day my child wasn't at Abingdon. Never again should be the APS mantra on building with kids on the property. Plus it took longer (=$$$) to do it that way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems obvious that Nottingham should be shut down. Less than 400 kids? Give me a break. Unless there us another school with even fewer kids it just makes sense.

Fewer than 400 kids !!! I remember when the community was up in arms about leaving drew so underenrolled after MPSA left. Drew is now larger than Nottingham.

But the housing policies that filled up Drew don’t apply to Nottingham. Unless the community is asking the county to build a CAF up in that neighborhood to fill up the school. One building would do it.

I remember a few years ago Jamestown was so under enrolled that they had to fill it with pre school and sped programs. Is that still the case? Maybe Nott isn’t really the lowest enrollment if you compare the number of neighborhood kids across schools, and don’t take into account the other programs that don’t have to be in any particular place.

And why did APS fill up Jamestown with these other programs instead of closing it, but now wants to close Nott? Nott isn’t that underenrolled. APS could move some of the programs out of the overcrowded schools and get it right back up to 100.

But look at how fast a Nottingham parent is to point to Jamestown or some other elementary school as an alternative chopping block head to get them out of their problem. They do this every cycle, did it with McKinley a few times and Taylor or Tuckahoe when they didn’t want to take in excess kids and pointed them towards other schools instead. You guys are the worst.

They don't want more buses that come from being used as swing space; yet it's fine to to add buses to move the programs out of crowded schools from other parts of the county. NES folks need to come up with an agreed argument and stick to it.

You don't see the difference between adding 1-2 programs to a mostly walking school vs switching a 90% walking school to a 100% driving school?

As swing space, the 100% driving school would be mainly buses and probably not much more individual cars for pick-ups and such as you have as a neighborhood program. And probably a lot less independent drivers on those rainy or cold days when all those walkers don't actually walk. So, differences; but overall, not a tremendous increase in danger, no. As an option program, there would still be those same buses and maybe more drivers depending on the program and where most of the students come from.

Nevertheless, the other issue is the constant - or frequent - relocation of those programs. Instructional consistency is needed for special programs, too; and it isn't right to keep moving those around like second-class citizens. Sure, parents may only be involved in a preK program for a year or so; but the teachers also have to move with the program, schools have to re-arrange to accommodate, admin has to adapt, etc. personally, I think every single elementary school should have pre-K classrooms and all Montessori preK should be with Montessori (if we have to keep Montessori).

And you base this conclusion that it would be mainly buses on what? I completely disagree. With longer bus rides, more parents would likely drive and there would be a lot more individual cars in the neighborhood.

trust me, Nottingham is not convenient enough for most parents to drive their kids to and from school every day. The bus will be far more convenient.

Not for before care or extended day. Also, where are you going to park 12 busses? The school isn’t designed for this.

I wouldn't be surprised if APS provides a later bus from extended day back to the home school.
600 kids. Minimum 60 kids per bus. That's no more than 10 total buses. And you're forgetting the hundreds that won't be riding the bus because their parents will prefer to drive all the way to NES and back twice a day so their kids don't have to be on the bus for 30 minutes. So, far less than 10 buses.

umm you know all parents don't just get out of work and pick their kids up at the same time, right? That's not how it works. Parents arrive at extended day at all different times up until it closes.

And all those parents driving to NES so their kids don't have to be on the bus is precisely what the neighborhood is worried about.

A dozen buses is our concern!
There won't be a dozen buses.
All the cars is our concern!
Buses will be more convenient and used by the majority of the kids using it as swing space because of the location.
It's all the cars coming over a period of an hour or so to pick up their kids from extended day that's our concern.
And here's where we ask if it would be better that the hoards of parents picking up their kids from extended day did all come at once and you say no, that's our concern.

Seriously. A lighter, steady "stream" is far better than a joglam with everyone picking up at the same time. Just cut to the chase - cite the bottom line: we don't want, and won't accept any change. Period.