Lactivists are just mean girls all grown up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I see these mean girls come out every time there is a post regarding:

1) To breastfeed or not,
2) To circumcise or not,
3) To red-Shirt or not.

And you know what, I bottle-fed, circumcised and red-shirted my kid - I have logical reasons for each decision, and live my life without caring about DCUM's opinion - and I'm fairly liberal, just not progressive.

I on the other hand -
- Breastfed. Exclusively for 9 months and then for three years.
- did not circumcize. In our religion and culture we don't.
- did opposite of red-shirt, by letting them take an early admission to kindergarten. My children are year younger than most of their classmates
+ I am super educated SAHM, employ lots of help, my kids go to/went magnet schools and study STEM subjects, they do not vape, do drugs. They don't do chores at home. Their college will be paid by us. I get along with my ILs, I host a lot, I make three meals a day but I also have a person who does prep work for me.
I am a liberal as well as a fiscal conservative. I don't understand how any of my decision is a judgement on someone else? And why people care?

[Anonymous]

ONCE AGAIN FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK.

No one is judging specific choices here. We're judging people who JUDGE specific choices. If that isn't you than this thread isn't about you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone needs to stop with the "formula is 100% just as good as breast milk" stuff. It's not.

Have you ever heard of a mom anywhere in the world with a bottle of breastmilk in front of her who says, "I'm not going to give that to my baby, I'm going to go make some formula instead." ??

Have you ever heard of a mom anywhere in the world with two bottles in front of her, breastmilk and formula, and says, "I'll choose the formula today. Why not. The baby can have some variety. After all, formula is just as good as breastmilk."

Have you ever heard of a NICU or hospital anywhere in the world with a bottle of breastmilk from the baby's mom and decides not to give it because, "well the baby can just get some variety and formula is 100% just as good"???

Would any mom or medical professional ever reject the mom's breastmilk (baring some medical contraindications, obviously) in favor of formula?

Would any hospital anywhere not do whatever they knew how to do (which admittedly varies wildly) to help the mom produce milk for a new baby or especially a baby in the NICU who needs all the help they can get?

No, of course not. That's because formula is NOT as good as breastmilk. End of story.

I don't know what you're all arguing about. What are all the insults for? There's no need to make anyone feel bad for their choices. There are plenty of very "valid" reasons why breastfeeding doesn't work for a woman or a family - if she's sick, or doesn't produce enough, or is taking medications, has health issues, etc etc.

But please, let's just stop with the "formula is just as good", because it's NOT. So the PP earlier on the thread who said something like "formula isn't the best thing for the baby but if it works for their family better then I don't care" is right. Sorry if you don't like hearing it, but it's true. Let's just accept facts and move on. You can still be an amazing mom. And maybe you could even be a better mom overall than someone who breastfeeds. Especially if breastfeeding is difficult. But the best food for a baby, especially a new baby, is the mom's breastmilk.

You are a moron. Go read the actual science on breastfeeding (though I suspect you could not understand any of it) and then come back.

- Extended BFer

Actually, I'm a scientist. If you were also a scientist then you'd understand that "science" is still figuring out exactly what is even IN breastmilk, and why it's there. Feel free to read the studies, and look at the publication dates, if you can figure it out.

If you are, you are a deeply sad commentary on the state of science these days. Pathetic.

NP, and the problem--which absolutely is a problem with many scientists--is that formula vs. breast milk doesn't occur in a vacuum. It's moot if breast milk is slightly better for some babies than others if that comes along with a host of negative outcomes for the family. From a policy perspective, breast milk isn't THAT much better than formula for it to be pushed as hard as it is, especially not in a country like this one, in which there is no lengthy paid maternity leave for all women and very little support for postpartum women in general. My guess is that there's too much variability in its actual benefits to know from a pure scientific perspective, but from what we do know, and in combination with how little support women receive, insisting that "breast is best" probably does more damage than good.

Wow!! Read what you have written. Our policies around pregnancy, maternity leave, equal pay, nursing, flexible work... Is so anti-woman and so you are saying that instead of changing the policies so that women have real choices, placate the women and let them not feel bad about formula? No concern at all for long term impact on health of baby and mom - both emotional and physical?
I guess there are lactivists because the workplace is so terrible for women.

[Anonymous]

I on the other hand -
- Breastfed. Exclusively for 9 months and then for three years.
- did not circumcize. In our religion and culture we don't.
- did opposite of red-shirt, by letting them take an early admission to kindergarten. My children are year younger than most of their classmates
+ I am super educated SAHM, employ lots of help, my kids go to/went magnet schools and study STEM subjects, they do not vape, do drugs. They don't do chores at home. Their college will be paid by us. I get along with my ILs, I host a lot, I make three meals a day but I also have a person who does prep work for me.
I am a liberal as well as a fiscal conservative. I don't understand how any of my decision is a judgement on someone else? And why people care?




I'm not 100% sure, but I don't think OP was referring to you when she said "lactivist". She wasn't talking about breastfeeding moms. She was talking about women who tell other women they are harming their child by formula feeding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:ONCE AGAIN FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK.

No one is judging specific choices here. We're judging people who JUDGE specific choices. If that isn't you than this thread isn't about you.

I feel no one judges anyone because no one has the time to judge. Op needs therapy if there are people in her life making her feel bad - knowingly or unknowingly. If op was 100% happy with her choice she could just dismiss this debate. She is feeling like shit because she is allowing herself to feel like shit. Therapy, stat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone needs to stop with the "formula is 100% just as good as breast milk" stuff. It's not.

Have you ever heard of a mom anywhere in the world with a bottle of breastmilk in front of her who says, "I'm not going to give that to my baby, I'm going to go make some formula instead." ??

Have you ever heard of a mom anywhere in the world with two bottles in front of her, breastmilk and formula, and says, "I'll choose the formula today. Why not. The baby can have some variety. After all, formula is just as good as breastmilk."

Have you ever heard of a NICU or hospital anywhere in the world with a bottle of breastmilk from the baby's mom and decides not to give it because, "well the baby can just get some variety and formula is 100% just as good"???

Would any mom or medical professional ever reject the mom's breastmilk (baring some medical contraindications, obviously) in favor of formula?

Would any hospital anywhere not do whatever they knew how to do (which admittedly varies wildly) to help the mom produce milk for a new baby or especially a baby in the NICU who needs all the help they can get?

No, of course not. That's because formula is NOT as good as breastmilk. End of story.

I don't know what you're all arguing about. What are all the insults for? There's no need to make anyone feel bad for their choices. There are plenty of very "valid" reasons why breastfeeding doesn't work for a woman or a family - if she's sick, or doesn't produce enough, or is taking medications, has health issues, etc etc.

But please, let's just stop with the "formula is just as good", because it's NOT. So the PP earlier on the thread who said something like "formula isn't the best thing for the baby but if it works for their family better then I don't care" is right. Sorry if you don't like hearing it, but it's true. Let's just accept facts and move on. You can still be an amazing mom. And maybe you could even be a better mom overall than someone who breastfeeds. Especially if breastfeeding is difficult. But the best food for a baby, especially a new baby, is the mom's breastmilk.

You are a moron. Go read the actual science on breastfeeding (though I suspect you could not understand any of it) and then come back.

- Extended BFer

Actually, I'm a scientist. If you were also a scientist then you'd understand that "science" is still figuring out exactly what is even IN breastmilk, and why it's there. Feel free to read the studies, and look at the publication dates, if you can figure it out.

If you are, you are a deeply sad commentary on the state of science these days. Pathetic.

NP, and the problem--which absolutely is a problem with many scientists--is that formula vs. breast milk doesn't occur in a vacuum. It's moot if breast milk is slightly better for some babies than others if that comes along with a host of negative outcomes for the family. From a policy perspective, breast milk isn't THAT much better than formula for it to be pushed as hard as it is, especially not in a country like this one, in which there is no lengthy paid maternity leave for all women and very little support for postpartum women in general. My guess is that there's too much variability in its actual benefits to know from a pure scientific perspective, but from what we do know, and in combination with how little support women receive, insisting that "breast is best" probably does more damage than good.

Wow!! Read what you have written. Our policies around pregnancy, maternity leave, equal pay, nursing, flexible work... Is so anti-woman and so you are saying that instead of changing the policies so that women have real choices, placate the women and let them not feel bad about formula? No concern at all for long term impact on health of baby and mom - both emotional and physical?
I guess there are lactivists because the workplace is so terrible for women.

DP. I read PP's comment as saying that we have all of these campaigns/lactivists pushing breastfeeding, but our policies around postpartum care and maternity leave make breastfeeding extremely difficult if not impossible for many women. The end result is we make it impossible for many women to breastfeed and then to add insult to injury, we tell them they are harming their child by not breastfeeding. How about we focus on supporting women in their choices instead of telling them what they should do, then making it impossible for them to do it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Projection is a hell of a drug.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone needs to stop with the "formula is 100% just as good as breast milk" stuff. It's not.

Have you ever heard of a mom anywhere in the world with a bottle of breastmilk in front of her who says, "I'm not going to give that to my baby, I'm going to go make some formula instead." ??

Have you ever heard of a mom anywhere in the world with two bottles in front of her, breastmilk and formula, and says, "I'll choose the formula today. Why not. The baby can have some variety. After all, formula is just as good as breastmilk."

Have you ever heard of a NICU or hospital anywhere in the world with a bottle of breastmilk from the baby's mom and decides not to give it because, "well the baby can just get some variety and formula is 100% just as good"???

Would any mom or medical professional ever reject the mom's breastmilk (baring some medical contraindications, obviously) in favor of formula?

Would any hospital anywhere not do whatever they knew how to do (which admittedly varies wildly) to help the mom produce milk for a new baby or especially a baby in the NICU who needs all the help they can get?

No, of course not. That's because formula is NOT as good as breastmilk. End of story.

I don't know what you're all arguing about. What are all the insults for? There's no need to make anyone feel bad for their choices. There are plenty of very "valid" reasons why breastfeeding doesn't work for a woman or a family - if she's sick, or doesn't produce enough, or is taking medications, has health issues, etc etc.

But please, let's just stop with the "formula is just as good", because it's NOT. So the PP earlier on the thread who said something like "formula isn't the best thing for the baby but if it works for their family better then I don't care" is right. Sorry if you don't like hearing it, but it's true. Let's just accept facts and move on. You can still be an amazing mom. And maybe you could even be a better mom overall than someone who breastfeeds. Especially if breastfeeding is difficult. But the best food for a baby, especially a new baby, is the mom's breastmilk.

You are a moron. Go read the actual science on breastfeeding (though I suspect you could not understand any of it) and then come back.

- Extended BFer

Actually, I'm a scientist. If you were also a scientist then you'd understand that "science" is still figuring out exactly what is even IN breastmilk, and why it's there. Feel free to read the studies, and look at the publication dates, if you can figure it out.

If you are, you are a deeply sad commentary on the state of science these days. Pathetic.

NP, and the problem--which absolutely is a problem with many scientists--is that formula vs. breast milk doesn't occur in a vacuum. It's moot if breast milk is slightly better for some babies than others if that comes along with a host of negative outcomes for the family. From a policy perspective, breast milk isn't THAT much better than formula for it to be pushed as hard as it is, especially not in a country like this one, in which there is no lengthy paid maternity leave for all women and very little support for postpartum women in general. My guess is that there's too much variability in its actual benefits to know from a pure scientific perspective, but from what we do know, and in combination with how little support women receive, insisting that "breast is best" probably does more damage than good.

Wow!! Read what you have written. Our policies around pregnancy, maternity leave, equal pay, nursing, flexible work... Is so anti-woman and so you are saying that instead of changing the policies so that women have real choices, placate the women and let them not feel bad about formula? No concern at all for long term impact on health of baby and mom - both emotional and physical?
I guess there are lactivists because the workplace is so terrible for women.

DP. I read PP's comment as saying that we have all of these campaigns/lactivists pushing breastfeeding, but our policies around postpartum care and maternity leave make breastfeeding extremely difficult if not impossible for many women. The end result is we make it impossible for many women to breastfeed and then to add insult to injury, we tell them they are harming their child by not breastfeeding. How about we focus on supporting women in their choices instead of telling them what they should do, then making it impossible for them to do it?

What about corporations making it easy for those WOHMs who want to nurse or pump? That is worth fighting for. After that it becomes a real choice, no? Feed them formula, rice milk or almond milk, it is your choice. What you are suggesting works for some women in the work force, but not others. And Breast Milk is the best. America needs to do better. It is a backward country where women's rights are concerned.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ONCE AGAIN FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK.

No one is judging specific choices here. We're judging people who JUDGE specific choices. If that isn't you than this thread isn't about you.

I feel no one judges anyone because no one has the time to judge. Op needs therapy if there are people in her life making her feel bad - knowingly or unknowingly. If op was 100% happy with her choice she could just dismiss this debate. She is feeling like shit because she is allowing herself to feel like shit. Therapy, stat.

This is just patently false. And you're on DCUM where judging is a pastime so you should know that.

[Anonymous]

Is BFing something that umc and rich SAHMs can do with all the support?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ONCE AGAIN FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK.

No one is judging specific choices here. We're judging people who JUDGE specific choices. If that isn't you than this thread isn't about you.

I feel no one judges anyone because no one has the time to judge. Op needs therapy if there are people in her life making her feel bad - knowingly or unknowingly. If op was 100% happy with her choice she could just dismiss this debate. She is feeling like shit because she is allowing herself to feel like shit. Therapy, stat.

This is just patently false. And you're on DCUM where judging is a pastime so you should know that.

And so are you...so pay calling kettle black.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone needs to stop with the "formula is 100% just as good as breast milk" stuff. It's not.

Have you ever heard of a mom anywhere in the world with a bottle of breastmilk in front of her who says, "I'm not going to give that to my baby, I'm going to go make some formula instead." ??

Have you ever heard of a mom anywhere in the world with two bottles in front of her, breastmilk and formula, and says, "I'll choose the formula today. Why not. The baby can have some variety. After all, formula is just as good as breastmilk."

Have you ever heard of a NICU or hospital anywhere in the world with a bottle of breastmilk from the baby's mom and decides not to give it because, "well the baby can just get some variety and formula is 100% just as good"???

Would any mom or medical professional ever reject the mom's breastmilk (baring some medical contraindications, obviously) in favor of formula?

Would any hospital anywhere not do whatever they knew how to do (which admittedly varies wildly) to help the mom produce milk for a new baby or especially a baby in the NICU who needs all the help they can get?

No, of course not. That's because formula is NOT as good as breastmilk. End of story.

I don't know what you're all arguing about. What are all the insults for? There's no need to make anyone feel bad for their choices. There are plenty of very "valid" reasons why breastfeeding doesn't work for a woman or a family - if she's sick, or doesn't produce enough, or is taking medications, has health issues, etc etc.

But please, let's just stop with the "formula is just as good", because it's NOT. So the PP earlier on the thread who said something like "formula isn't the best thing for the baby but if it works for their family better then I don't care" is right. Sorry if you don't like hearing it, but it's true. Let's just accept facts and move on. You can still be an amazing mom. And maybe you could even be a better mom overall than someone who breastfeeds. Especially if breastfeeding is difficult. But the best food for a baby, especially a new baby, is the mom's breastmilk.

You are a moron. Go read the actual science on breastfeeding (though I suspect you could not understand any of it) and then come back.

- Extended BFer

Actually, I'm a scientist. If you were also a scientist then you'd understand that "science" is still figuring out exactly what is even IN breastmilk, and why it's there. Feel free to read the studies, and look at the publication dates, if you can figure it out.

If you are, you are a deeply sad commentary on the state of science these days. Pathetic.

NP, and the problem--which absolutely is a problem with many scientists--is that formula vs. breast milk doesn't occur in a vacuum. It's moot if breast milk is slightly better for some babies than others if that comes along with a host of negative outcomes for the family. From a policy perspective, breast milk isn't THAT much better than formula for it to be pushed as hard as it is, especially not in a country like this one, in which there is no lengthy paid maternity leave for all women and very little support for postpartum women in general. My guess is that there's too much variability in its actual benefits to know from a pure scientific perspective, but from what we do know, and in combination with how little support women receive, insisting that "breast is best" probably does more damage than good.

Wow!! Read what you have written. Our policies around pregnancy, maternity leave, equal pay, nursing, flexible work... Is so anti-woman and so you are saying that instead of changing the policies so that women have real choices, placate the women and let them not feel bad about formula? No concern at all for long term impact on health of baby and mom - both emotional and physical?
I guess there are lactivists because the workplace is so terrible for women.

DP. I read PP's comment as saying that we have all of these campaigns/lactivists pushing breastfeeding, but our policies around postpartum care and maternity leave make breastfeeding extremely difficult if not impossible for many women. The end result is we make it impossible for many women to breastfeed and then to add insult to injury, we tell them they are harming their child by not breastfeeding. How about we focus on supporting women in their choices instead of telling them what they should do, then making it impossible for them to do it?

What about corporations making it easy for those WOHMs who want to nurse or pump? That is worth fighting for. After that it becomes a real choice, no? Feed them formula, rice milk or almond milk, it is your choice. What you are suggesting works for some women in the work force, but not others. And Breast Milk is the best. America needs to do better. It is a backward country where women's rights are concerned.

Breast milk is marginally better than formula. And sorry, why are you against better postpartum care & access to more maternity leave (really parental leave - should be for men and women)?

[Anonymous]

Everytime I nurse my baby, I feel sorry for the kids who are not so fortunate. Then I think "RIP to you, but I am different". Then I laugh maniacally!! Every. Single. Time.

Now that your worst suspicions have been proved right, what are you going to do?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Everytime I nurse my baby, I feel sorry for the kids who are not so fortunate. Then I think "RIP to you, but I am different". Then I laugh maniacally!! Every. Single. Time.

Now that your worst suspicions have been proved right, what are you going to do?

OP's post is not about you, dear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone needs to stop with the "formula is 100% just as good as breast milk" stuff. It's not.

Have you ever heard of a mom anywhere in the world with a bottle of breastmilk in front of her who says, "I'm not going to give that to my baby, I'm going to go make some formula instead." ??

Have you ever heard of a mom anywhere in the world with two bottles in front of her, breastmilk and formula, and says, "I'll choose the formula today. Why not. The baby can have some variety. After all, formula is just as good as breastmilk."

Have you ever heard of a NICU or hospital anywhere in the world with a bottle of breastmilk from the baby's mom and decides not to give it because, "well the baby can just get some variety and formula is 100% just as good"???

Would any mom or medical professional ever reject the mom's breastmilk (baring some medical contraindications, obviously) in favor of formula?

Would any hospital anywhere not do whatever they knew how to do (which admittedly varies wildly) to help the mom produce milk for a new baby or especially a baby in the NICU who needs all the help they can get?

No, of course not. That's because formula is NOT as good as breastmilk. End of story.

I don't know what you're all arguing about. What are all the insults for? There's no need to make anyone feel bad for their choices. There are plenty of very "valid" reasons why breastfeeding doesn't work for a woman or a family - if she's sick, or doesn't produce enough, or is taking medications, has health issues, etc etc.

But please, let's just stop with the "formula is just as good", because it's NOT. So the PP earlier on the thread who said something like "formula isn't the best thing for the baby but if it works for their family better then I don't care" is right. Sorry if you don't like hearing it, but it's true. Let's just accept facts and move on. You can still be an amazing mom. And maybe you could even be a better mom overall than someone who breastfeeds. Especially if breastfeeding is difficult. But the best food for a baby, especially a new baby, is the mom's breastmilk.

You are a moron. Go read the actual science on breastfeeding (though I suspect you could not understand any of it) and then come back.

- Extended BFer

Actually, I'm a scientist. If you were also a scientist then you'd understand that "science" is still figuring out exactly what is even IN breastmilk, and why it's there. Feel free to read the studies, and look at the publication dates, if you can figure it out.

If you are, you are a deeply sad commentary on the state of science these days. Pathetic.

NP, and the problem--which absolutely is a problem with many scientists--is that formula vs. breast milk doesn't occur in a vacuum. It's moot if breast milk is slightly better for some babies than others if that comes along with a host of negative outcomes for the family. From a policy perspective, breast milk isn't THAT much better than formula for it to be pushed as hard as it is, especially not in a country like this one, in which there is no lengthy paid maternity leave for all women and very little support for postpartum women in general. My guess is that there's too much variability in its actual benefits to know from a pure scientific perspective, but from what we do know, and in combination with how little support women receive, insisting that "breast is best" probably does more damage than good.

Wow!! Read what you have written. Our policies around pregnancy, maternity leave, equal pay, nursing, flexible work... Is so anti-woman and so you are saying that instead of changing the policies so that women have real choices, placate the women and let them not feel bad about formula? No concern at all for long term impact on health of baby and mom - both emotional and physical?
I guess there are lactivists because the workplace is so terrible for women.

DP. I read PP's comment as saying that we have all of these campaigns/lactivists pushing breastfeeding, but our policies around postpartum care and maternity leave make breastfeeding extremely difficult if not impossible for many women. The end result is we make it impossible for many women to breastfeed and then to add insult to injury, we tell them they are harming their child by not breastfeeding. How about we focus on supporting women in their choices instead of telling them what they should do, then making it impossible for them to do it?

What about corporations making it easy for those WOHMs who want to nurse or pump? That is worth fighting for. After that it becomes a real choice, no? Feed them formula, rice milk or almond milk, it is your choice. What you are suggesting works for some women in the work force, but not others. And Breast Milk is the best. America needs to do better. It is a backward country where women's rights are concerned.

Breast milk is marginally better than formula. And sorry, why are you against better postpartum care & access to more maternity leave (really parental leave - should be for men and women)?

Good news!! I am for all of that. Maternity leave, flex schedule and teleworking. Throw in a nurse service when your kid is sick. I am for a lot more coverage medically that insurance should cover post partum - massages, therapy, nutrition check. Also Breast Milk is best!!