S/O High SES students will perform well no matter their peer group

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem is that it’s the high SES families that are expected to accept risk without any concessions or guarantees. If DCPS were to remove, say, Lafayette from Deal they better darn well guarantee in an EOTP school there will be tracking, zero tolerance for disruptive students and those with poor attendance, crack down on residency fraud, etc. But DCPS will never do that. So instead they try to sell some immeasurable benefit like our kids will be “able to work well diverse groups in the future.” That’s just not enough.

100% correct. And "your kid will be fine because they are high SES" is also missing the mark. "Fine" is not -- nor will it ever be -- enough for this cohort of WOTP families.

Great, then enjoy your over-crowded HS and MS and stfu.

So that's the answer: We won't help you because you want your kids to do too well. Gotcha.

You know, in many cities, they actually want their students to be high achieving?

Nope. It's that if you refuse a pro-social, community-minded solution to allocating scarce resources, then the system is not going to go out of its way to help you. You've made clear that you believe you are your own little special island in DCPS, so that's what you'll get.

No, we're asking for a solution that allows for equal to the achievement potential they already have if they attend Wilson. So, for instance, if you want to rezone some schools, can you show that accelerated classes are offered with a track record of success?

That's absurd. Show up, take the classes. It will be fine. If you don't, then again, have fun at Wilson.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah there definitely seems to be a vibe here like, “we won the meritocracy, you must bow to us now.” Not sure that is an actual requirement of social policy. I at least am more interested in seeing if I can make something good for as many people as possible before looking at extracting the best for me.

In theory that's fine. But when you are dealing with your child's own education, the risks are too high. There's no bowing - there's an ask that DCPS provide a vehicle for kids who excel to be supported in doing so. Wilson and test ins are the current options. If DCPS wants me to send my kid somewhere else, they need to show me that it can work there as well.

Ok fine - again - have fun with the overcrowding at Wilson. If you refuse a common-sense solution and make prima donna demands, then nobody is going to work with you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah there definitely seems to be a vibe here like, “we won the meritocracy, you must bow to us now.” Not sure that is an actual requirement of social policy. I at least am more interested in seeing if I can make something good for as many people as possible before looking at extracting the best for me.

In theory that's fine. But when you are dealing with your child's own education, the risks are too high. There's no bowing - there's an ask that DCPS provide a vehicle for kids who excel to be supported in doing so. Wilson and test ins are the current options. If DCPS wants me to send my kid somewhere else, they need to show me that it can work there as well.

Ok fine - again - have fun with the overcrowding at Wilson. If you refuse a common-sense solution and make prima donna demands, then nobody is going to work with you.

What's a common sense solution? Rezoning kids who are high performing to a low perfoming school with no record of academic success and saying "good luck"?

[Anonymous]

Notice how you describe the child as high performing and the school as low performing? Yeah, that's the crux of it.

The high performing kids will still be high performing at another school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem is that it’s the high SES families that are expected to accept risk without any concessions or guarantees. If DCPS were to remove, say, Lafayette from Deal they better darn well guarantee in an EOTP school there will be tracking, zero tolerance for disruptive students and those with poor attendance, crack down on residency fraud, etc. But DCPS will never do that. So instead they try to sell some immeasurable benefit like our kids will be “able to work well diverse groups in the future.” That’s just not enough.

100% correct. And "your kid will be fine because they are high SES" is also missing the mark. "Fine" is not -- nor will it ever be -- enough for this cohort of WOTP families.

Great, then enjoy your over-crowded HS and MS and stfu.

So that's the answer: We won't help you because you want your kids to do too well. Gotcha.

You know, in many cities, they actually want their students to be high achieving?

Nope. It's that if you refuse a pro-social, community-minded solution to allocating scarce resources, then the system is not going to go out of its way to help you. You've made clear that you believe you are your own little special island in DCPS, so that's what you'll get.

No, we're asking for a solution that allows for equal to the achievement potential they already have if they attend Wilson. So, for instance, if you want to rezone some schools, can you show that accelerated classes are offered with a track record of success?

That's absurd. Show up, take the classes. It will be fine. If you don't, then again, have fun at Wilson.

So kids who have already completed algebra in middle school should sit through it again because, "it will be fine"?

[Anonymous]

I look at my own stalled career, and it has nothing to do with the second-tier high school and second-tier state colleges I went to. I actually landed a really good job because I'm smart and had good mentors (better mentors than I would have had at an ivy school because state school professors have way more invested in their grad students), but then I stagnated. I could be at the top of my field if I had worked harder once my career began after grad school. The difference between "fine" and "amazing" schools is NOT going to make or break your kids' careers and life. It is a drive inside of them that will make the difference. And that you can't give them. It is there or it isn't.

My life is "fine" and would be fine even if I went to a W school and Yale. I'd probably feel worse about my career if I had gone to better schools. I'd likely have more interesting friends doing more interesting things. But I'd still be exactly where I am.

Likewise, I know so many people doing amazing things in my field who went to schools like mine. These are the literal stars in my profession.

We all want to believe that we can set our kids up for a great life. But all we can set them up for is "fine." I don't want to pretend that the US is a meritocracy because it does take a lot of parent privilege to achieve fine. But the difference between fine and amazing, no amount of parent privilege can engineer that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Notice how you describe the child as high performing and the school as low performing? Yeah, that's the crux of it.

The high performing kids will still be high performing at another school.

In general, yes, they will be. Will they be as high performing/learn as much as they would have been at Wilson/SWW/McKinley/Banneker? That's the question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem is that it’s the high SES families that are expected to accept risk without any concessions or guarantees. If DCPS were to remove, say, Lafayette from Deal they better darn well guarantee in an EOTP school there will be tracking, zero tolerance for disruptive students and those with poor attendance, crack down on residency fraud, etc. But DCPS will never do that. So instead they try to sell some immeasurable benefit like our kids will be “able to work well diverse groups in the future.” That’s just not enough.

100% correct. And "your kid will be fine because they are high SES" is also missing the mark. "Fine" is not -- nor will it ever be -- enough for this cohort of WOTP families.

Great, then enjoy your over-crowded HS and MS and stfu.

So that's the answer: We won't help you because you want your kids to do too well. Gotcha.

You know, in many cities, they actually want their students to be high achieving?

Nope. It's that if you refuse a pro-social, community-minded solution to allocating scarce resources, then the system is not going to go out of its way to help you. You've made clear that you believe you are your own little special island in DCPS, so that's what you'll get.

No, we're asking for a solution that allows for equal to the achievement potential they already have if they attend Wilson. So, for instance, if you want to rezone some schools, can you show that accelerated classes are offered with a track record of success?

That's absurd. Show up, take the classes. It will be fine. If you don't, then again, have fun at Wilson.

So kids who have already completed algebra in middle school should sit through it again because, "it will be fine"?

The whole "show us the curriculum" thing is a red herring. Do you honestly think that the other DC high schools just won't adjust their math curriculums? Sure, parents should be involved and curriculums should be discussed, but we all know this is a red herring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I look at my own stalled career, and it has nothing to do with the second-tier high school and second-tier state colleges I went to. I actually landed a really good job because I'm smart and had good mentors (better mentors than I would have had at an ivy school because state school professors have way more invested in their grad students), but then I stagnated. I could be at the top of my field if I had worked harder once my career began after grad school. The difference between "fine" and "amazing" schools is NOT going to make or break your kids' careers and life. It is a drive inside of them that will make the difference. And that you can't give them. It is there or it isn't.

My life is "fine" and would be fine even if I went to a W school and Yale. I'd probably feel worse about my career if I had gone to better schools. I'd likely have more interesting friends doing more interesting things. But I'd still be exactly where I am.

Likewise, I know so many people doing amazing things in my field who went to schools like mine. These are the literal stars in my profession.

We all want to believe that we can set our kids up for a great life. But all we can set them up for is "fine." I don't want to pretend that the US is a meritocracy because it does take a lot of parent privilege to achieve fine. But the difference between fine and amazing, no amount of parent privilege can engineer that.

The stats don't back you up. Elite colleges do make a difference.

https://www.businessinsider.com/colleges-whose-graduates-earn-the-most-2015-9#1-massachusetts-institute-of-technology-25

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem is that it’s the high SES families that are expected to accept risk without any concessions or guarantees. If DCPS were to remove, say, Lafayette from Deal they better darn well guarantee in an EOTP school there will be tracking, zero tolerance for disruptive students and those with poor attendance, crack down on residency fraud, etc. But DCPS will never do that. So instead they try to sell some immeasurable benefit like our kids will be “able to work well diverse groups in the future.” That’s just not enough.

100% correct. And "your kid will be fine because they are high SES" is also missing the mark. "Fine" is not -- nor will it ever be -- enough for this cohort of WOTP families.

Great, then enjoy your over-crowded HS and MS and stfu.

So that's the answer: We won't help you because you want your kids to do too well. Gotcha.

You know, in many cities, they actually want their students to be high achieving?

Nope. It's that if you refuse a pro-social, community-minded solution to allocating scarce resources, then the system is not going to go out of its way to help you. You've made clear that you believe you are your own little special island in DCPS, so that's what you'll get.

No, we're asking for a solution that allows for equal to the achievement potential they already have if they attend Wilson. So, for instance, if you want to rezone some schools, can you show that accelerated classes are offered with a track record of success?

That's absurd. Show up, take the classes. It will be fine. If you don't, then again, have fun at Wilson.

So kids who have already completed algebra in middle school should sit through it again because, "it will be fine"?

The whole "show us the curriculum" thing is a red herring. Do you honestly think that the other DC high schools just won't adjust their math curriculums? Sure, parents should be involved and curriculums should be discussed, but we all know this is a red herring.

Aside from the fact that rezoning anyone anywhere is only a "thing" on DCUM and no one in DCPS has mentioned it, DCPS has shown time and time again it doesn't ever want to do any "honors" programs. They've been dismantling, not building up those programs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Notice how you describe the child as high performing and the school as low performing? Yeah, that's the crux of it.

The high performing kids will still be high performing at another school.

High performing on whatever the level of material they are given, that is.

[Anonymous]

I just hope whoever is mayor when we do the boundary redraw doesn’t listen to you mofos. Cut the cord to Wilson and fix the rest of DC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just hope whoever is mayor when we do the boundary redraw doesn’t listen to you mofos. Cut the cord to Wilson and fix the rest of DC.

What do you mean?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem is that it’s the high SES families that are expected to accept risk without any concessions or guarantees. If DCPS were to remove, say, Lafayette from Deal they better darn well guarantee in an EOTP school there will be tracking, zero tolerance for disruptive students and those with poor attendance, crack down on residency fraud, etc. But DCPS will never do that. So instead they try to sell some immeasurable benefit like our kids will be “able to work well diverse groups in the future.” That’s just not enough.

100% correct. And "your kid will be fine because they are high SES" is also missing the mark. "Fine" is not -- nor will it ever be -- enough for this cohort of WOTP families.

Great, then enjoy your over-crowded HS and MS and stfu.

So that's the answer: We won't help you because you want your kids to do too well. Gotcha.

You know, in many cities, they actually want their students to be high achieving?

Nope. It's that if you refuse a pro-social, community-minded solution to allocating scarce resources, then the system is not going to go out of its way to help you. You've made clear that you believe you are your own little special island in DCPS, so that's what you'll get.

No, we're asking for a solution that allows for equal to the achievement potential they already have if they attend Wilson. So, for instance, if you want to rezone some schools, can you show that accelerated classes are offered with a track record of success?

That's absurd. Show up, take the classes. It will be fine. If you don't, then again, have fun at Wilson.

So kids who have already completed algebra in middle school should sit through it again because, "it will be fine"?

The whole "show us the curriculum" thing is a red herring. Do you honestly think that the other DC high schools just won't adjust their math curriculums? Sure, parents should be involved and curriculums should be discussed, but we all know this is a red herring.

Aside from the fact that rezoning anyone anywhere is only a "thing" on DCUM and no one in DCPS has mentioned it, DCPS has shown time and time again it doesn't ever want to do any "honors" programs. They've been dismantling, not building up those programs.

DCPS isn't actually a monolithic force hell bent on ignoring the needs of advanced learners.

We struck out in the Wash Latin and BASIS lotteries this year, so sent DC to Stuart Hobson for 6th, a couple blocks from home. So far so good - he spends his entire day in class with other students who work at or above grade level in advanced classes created by the principal, now in his 3rd year. No sign of the advanced classes program being dismantled- another honors class or two has been added each year for several years. These are not high-powered GT classes of course, but they're a whole lot better than the classes packed with kids who work 2, 3 even 4 years behind grade level we could have encountered at SH just a few years back. Without the advanced classes, we'd have bailed for the burbs over the summer. With a commute of 2-minutes each way, we buy an hour or two each evening to add challenge at home, which we can handle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I look at my own stalled career, and it has nothing to do with the second-tier high school and second-tier state colleges I went to. I actually landed a really good job because I'm smart and had good mentors (better mentors than I would have had at an ivy school because state school professors have way more invested in their grad students), but then I stagnated. I could be at the top of my field if I had worked harder once my career began after grad school. The difference between "fine" and "amazing" schools is NOT going to make or break your kids' careers and life. It is a drive inside of them that will make the difference. And that you can't give them. It is there or it isn't.

My life is "fine" and would be fine even if I went to a W school and Yale. I'd probably feel worse about my career if I had gone to better schools. I'd likely have more interesting friends doing more interesting things. But I'd still be exactly where I am.

Likewise, I know so many people doing amazing things in my field who went to schools like mine. These are the literal stars in my profession.

We all want to believe that we can set our kids up for a great life. But all we can set them up for is "fine." I don't want to pretend that the US is a meritocracy because it does take a lot of parent privilege to achieve fine. But the difference between fine and amazing, no amount of parent privilege can engineer that.

The stats don't back you up. Elite colleges do make a difference.

https://www.businessinsider.com/colleges-whose-graduates-earn-the-most-2015-9#1-massachusetts-institute-of-technology-25

That doesn't mean what you think it means. It just shows that when you select for only top people you get good average results. It doesn't mean top people going elsewhere will personally have poor results. Imagine Elite Unicorn College only takes kids who get 1600 on the SAT and no one else, and it is full pay for all. Imagine Open Door To All U takes everyone who applies, and 50 brilliant kids with 1600 SATs go there because they were given a full ride. You would expect the overall post grad statistics of EUC to be much much stronger than ODTAU, and they will be. But, those 50 ODTAU kids are going to do just as well as the EUC kids.