residency fraud? (!)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I drive a company car with MD plates every single day to drop my kids off and pick them up. Sometimes, I drive a rental when my company car is being serviced. I get so sick of this conversation. If you really feel something is going on, report it. Stop posting your paranoid delusions to garner responses.

Sure, but I don't think the explanation for most cars with MD plates is that they're driving "company cars." I've been directly asked by more than one Silver Spring parent how to go about enrolling their kids in our IB. I think people have been doing it for so long that it isn't considered a big deal for some.

Sure you have

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just reported someone thru the website. The student lives in PG with both parents, but her mother works in DC and wanted a free longer school day, plus didn’t want to pay for private anymore. She has her documents pretty well covered though. She registered her car in DC and used a relative’s address. I’m not sure what OSSE can do, really.

Check her state taxes and see if she is paying in DC or MD.

I reported someone like this and unfortunately they were cleared. They had a letter, dated a few years back (purportedly), stating that the child needed to stay with a relative in DC due to financial issues. There were no financial issues whatsoever.

And why would thiese people share their financial issues with you?

I owned a business and the person in was my employee. Making a very good salary.

That only means you know her salary income. That does not explain how you know their financial issues. The two are not the same.

Well I’ve actually been to their house and know the kids live there. This was a solidly middle class family.

Can we talk for a second a about how you ratted out ***your own employee?***

If it were my employee they would be fired for committing fraud!

Yes exactly. The person in question was actually no longer an employee when the reporting occurred, but committing fraud is certainly against the company code of ethics. It was blatant and frankly, bragged about by the person in question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I drive a company car with MD plates every single day to drop my kids off and pick them up. Sometimes, I drive a rental when my company car is being serviced. I get so sick of this conversation. If you really feel something is going on, report it. Stop posting your paranoid delusions to garner responses.

Sure, but I don't think the explanation for most cars with MD plates is that they're driving "company cars." I've been directly asked by more than one Silver Spring parent how to go about enrolling their kids in our IB. I think people have been doing it for so long that it isn't considered a big deal for some.

Sure you have

PP here. I definitely have--one woman on the playground remarked that her cousin was a teacher's aide at our school. She said she lived right on the other side of Eastern, and wanted to know how to enroll her child at our school. I said that unfortunately the school is for DC residents only, and she just said "oh" and didn't say much else.

When I was a parent rep for our school, I recall that at least one parent emailed me and said she lived in Silver Spring and would like to enroll her child. I mentioned the same thing re: DC residency and didn't hear back.

Our neighborhood borders MD, and our school is one of those that had several cases of confirmed residency fraud reported recently.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I drive a company car with MD plates every single day to drop my kids off and pick them up. Sometimes, I drive a rental when my company car is being serviced. I get so sick of this conversation. If you really feel something is going on, report it. Stop posting your paranoid delusions to garner responses.

Sure, but I don't think the explanation for most cars with MD plates is that they're driving "company cars." I've been directly asked by more than one Silver Spring parent how to go about enrolling their kids in our IB. I think people have been doing it for so long that it isn't considered a big deal for some.

Sure you have

PP here. I definitely have--one woman on the playground remarked that her cousin was a teacher's aide at our school. She said she lived right on the other side of Eastern, and wanted to know how to enroll her child at our school. I said that unfortunately the school is for DC residents only, and she just said "oh" and didn't say much else.

When I was a parent rep for our school, I recall that at least one parent emailed me and said she lived in Silver Spring and would like to enroll her child. I mentioned the same thing re: DC residency and didn't hear back.

Our neighborhood borders MD, and our school is one of those that had several cases of confirmed residency fraud reported recently.

P.S. I won't name the school, but it's pretty common knowledge that it happens here. A few years ago, the PTA president even joked about all the MD plates at the end of the year during a PTA meeting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I drive a company car with MD plates every single day to drop my kids off and pick them up. Sometimes, I drive a rental when my company car is being serviced. I get so sick of this conversation. If you really feel something is going on, report it. Stop posting your paranoid delusions to garner responses.

Sure, but I don't think the explanation for most cars with MD plates is that they're driving "company cars." I've been directly asked by more than one Silver Spring parent how to go about enrolling their kids in our IB. I think people have been doing it for so long that it isn't considered a big deal for some.

Sure you have

PP here. I definitely have--one woman on the playground remarked that her cousin was a teacher's aide at our school. She said she lived right on the other side of Eastern, and wanted to know how to enroll her child at our school. I said that unfortunately the school is for DC residents only, and she just said "oh" and didn't say much else.

When I was a parent rep for our school, I recall that at least one parent emailed me and said she lived in Silver Spring and would like to enroll her child. I mentioned the same thing re: DC residency and didn't hear back.

Our neighborhood borders MD, and our school is one of those that had several cases of confirmed residency fraud reported recently.

I live on Capitol Hill and had a similar experience where a woman on the playground asked about the nearby ES, was it good and how hard was it to enroll there. She said she lived in MD and I mentioned DC residency was required to attend DC schools. She seemed more ignorant than scheming but it was a weird conversation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OMG, there was a car with Maryland plates in front of me during drop-off at my Arlington elementary this morning, totally must have been residency fraud and not a caregiver, divorced parent (with other parent living in Arlington) or servicemember who retained their Maryland residency when they moved to DC (which they’re allowed to do)!!!!!

Apples and oranges. Maybe you don't know since you live in VA, but indications suggest that residency fraud is not uncommon in DCPS.

I am aware. Maybe you don’t know since you live in DC, but there are increasing concerns about residency fraud in Arlington now that almost every avenue to transfer in from OOC had been cut off, and APS is cracking down hard on residency enforcement because of how overcrowded the schools are.

But I’m still not going to assume this kid lives OOC when there are so many legitimate possible explanations.

This is a DC forum. I don't even know what APS is.

You mean to tell me that you can't infer the meaning of APS from PP's post? Wow....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As usual, the truth of the matter is in the middle.

- Yes there are people with MD tags dropping off their kids at school that they attend legally.
- Yes there are people who attend DC school illegally and in more than "just a few cases."

People shouldn't be attacked for reporting people who might be committing fraud. At the same time, you should not follow people home.

But make no mistake, this is not a victim-less crime. Extra students help prop up what would be failing charters, they take OOB spots in good schools from those looking to get out from failing neighborhood schools.

The truth of the matter is that it's currently far too easy to cheat on residency in both DCPS and DCPC, both from out of state and in-boundary where DCPS goes. OSSE's rules on residency aren't well written, clear, or tough. Enforcement has been lax across the board. Tighten up the residency verification regime, including by upping document requirements, and enforcement and the appeal of playing CGI, and preachy posts like this, will taper off soon enough.

You assume that OSSE WANTS to catch people who are cheating the system.

I do not think they do and I think the City Council and the mayor don't either. OSSE wants to make it easy for people to enroll -- because they really do want everyone who should be in school to be in school. The regs are written for the corner cases to comply with; to ensure there isn't a barrier for the most transient person in a challenging situation to be able to enroll. If some savvy people use the lax rules to cheat, that's an ok price to pay for that at-risk kid to get in.

How many times have DCPS / charters / the mayor / Office of Planning used increasing enrollment in schools as evidence of the city thriving / coming back? They make a show of enforcing some rules to keep the kinds of people who read DCUM mollified, but no one really wants to know what would happen if we had tight rules for school enrollment and residency.

OSSE does want to catch cheaters, because they're under increasing political pressure to do so. They just don't want to catch them as much as the "kinds of people who read DCUM" generally want. I don't read a lot of posts by PPs who were investigated by the residency fraud office. We were investigated, and promptly cleared, two years ago, and the process was no walk in the park. We had several days to produce three years of certified tax returns to help the investigator verify our residence. among other documents. We also had to appear in person at the residency fraud investigation office to make our case for legit residency, and to consent to a home visit (which never went forward). Speaking from personal experience, a rigorous process worked very well.

Jealousy drives some of the complaints pure and simple, particularly on Cap Hill (where only around half the parents have access to a highly desirably by-right school. If others have a better in-boundary options than you do--Brent, Maury, Ludlow etc.--some of them must be address cheaters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our children are picked up from school daily by a car with MD plates. Not many young nannies can afford to live in DC these days. (And we happen to live 2 miles from Silver Spring.) I understand this was fun for you as a new preK3 mom but stop. Really, stop.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OMG, there was a car with Maryland plates in front of me during drop-off at my Arlington elementary this morning, totally must have been residency fraud and not a caregiver, divorced parent (with other parent living in Arlington) or servicemember who retained their Maryland residency when they moved to DC (which they’re allowed to do)!!!!!

Apples and oranges. Maybe you don't know since you live in VA, but indications suggest that residency fraud is not uncommon in DCPS.

I am aware. Maybe you don’t know since you live in DC, but there are increasing concerns about residency fraud in Arlington now that almost every avenue to transfer in from OOC had been cut off, and APS is cracking down hard on residency enforcement because of how overcrowded the schools are.

But I’m still not going to assume this kid lives OOC when there are so many legitimate possible explanations.

This is a DC forum. I don't even know what APS is.

You mean to tell me that you can't infer the meaning of APS from PP's post? Wow....

PP—I didn’t care enough to try to infer. I was busy wondering why someone in Arlington was even commenting here in a DC schools forum.

[Anonymous]

The DMV is very interconnected and the person from APS was sharing their perspective. Don’t be a DC snob!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As usual, the truth of the matter is in the middle.

- Yes there are people with MD tags dropping off their kids at school that they attend legally.
- Yes there are people who attend DC school illegally and in more than "just a few cases."

People shouldn't be attacked for reporting people who might be committing fraud. At the same time, you should not follow people home.

But make no mistake, this is not a victim-less crime. Extra students help prop up what would be failing charters, they take OOB spots in good schools from those looking to get out from failing neighborhood schools.

The truth of the matter is that it's currently far too easy to cheat on residency in both DCPS and DCPC, both from out of state and in-boundary where DCPS goes. OSSE's rules on residency aren't well written, clear, or tough. Enforcement has been lax across the board. Tighten up the residency verification regime, including by upping document requirements, and enforcement and the appeal of playing CGI, and preachy posts like this, will taper off soon enough.

You assume that OSSE WANTS to catch people who are cheating the system.

I do not think they do and I think the City Council and the mayor don't either. OSSE wants to make it easy for people to enroll -- because they really do want everyone who should be in school to be in school. The regs are written for the corner cases to comply with; to ensure there isn't a barrier for the most transient person in a challenging situation to be able to enroll. If some savvy people use the lax rules to cheat, that's an ok price to pay for that at-risk kid to get in.

How many times have DCPS / charters / the mayor / Office of Planning used increasing enrollment in schools as evidence of the city thriving / coming back? They make a show of enforcing some rules to keep the kinds of people who read DCUM mollified, but no one really wants to know what would happen if we had tight rules for school enrollment and residency.

OSSE does want to catch cheaters, because they're under increasing political pressure to do so. They just don't want to catch them as much as the "kinds of people who read DCUM" generally want. I don't read a lot of posts by PPs who were investigated by the residency fraud office. We were investigated, and promptly cleared, two years ago, and the process was no walk in the park. We had several days to produce three years of certified tax returns to help the investigator verify our residence. among other documents. We also had to appear in person at the residency fraud investigation office to make our case for legit residency, and to consent to a home visit (which never went forward). Speaking from personal experience, a rigorous process worked very well.

Jealousy drives some of the complaints pure and simple, particularly on Cap Hill (where only around half the parents have access to a highly desirably by-right school. If others have a better in-boundary options than you do--Brent, Maury, Ludlow etc.--some of them must be address cheaters.

Also the long lines of cars with Maryland plates.

[Anonymous]

Total BS. Where is the long line of cars with Maryland plates pulling up at Brent, Maury, SWS, Logan Montessori or even Ludlow? That, my friend, is fiction in 2018.

[Anonymous]

Residency fraud: Prevalent but overhyped on DCUM.

Lock this topic

[Anonymous]

Considering that boundary fraud has caused major controversies for both of the last two chancellors, it is clearly a relevant issue.

[Anonymous]

Boundary fraud wasn't what caused major controversies for the last two chancellors. Antwan Wilson and "friends of Kaya" weren't trying to fudge their residency per se, like your garden variety boundary cheaters. What they were doing was was making insider deals with school officials, or having their spouses do it, to enable their children to jump over long waiting lists. Cronyism was at the heart of these controversies.