failed the bar 3x...

[Anonymous]

I used "Law in a Flash" to study and passed two different exams in one year. I was the first one finished when I took my second bar exam.

I swear those little flash cards is what did it for me.

[Anonymous]

http://www.barristerbooks.com/law-in-a-flash-flashcards-multistate-bar-exam-review-set.9781565425903.01.htm?gclid=CPGy4JashcUCFc9gfgod3rcAMA#.VTUu7_nF98E

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:my niece has failed the bar 3 x... 2x in new york and 1x in massachusetts. she has been unemployed since law school graduation in 2013. any advice on what to make of this/what she should do? should she still even try to practice law? she went to a bad law school and has huge debt.

I failed 4 including the other states. It's a mind / confidence now. She knows more law now than any attorney practicing. I guarantee it!

Are you serious? Memorizing legal tests is not the same as knowing the law. And I would never hire an attorney that I knew had failed the bar multiple times. Once can be bad luck or a bad day, but it is absolutely a lack of intelligence after multiple fails.

Are you a lawyer? Do you even know what you're talking about?

Bar and cams are not that hard. I did LLM program and pass VA and NY bars just after one year studying in the law school. And my English back then was really bad. I can't understa how are native English speakers possibly can fail it?

[Anonymous]

it should be Bar exams above.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
3) It's possible to pass the bar after failing a lot, and New York is hard. MA is less difficult but the Passachusetts comments in here are unnecessarily snarky and mean. You think this poor girl isn't aware of that and using that thought to make herself feel worse? I know what it's like to fail the bar - it feels like shit. You go on Facebook and see all your friends celebrating their results, getting sworn in, starting work as real lawyers, and you just want to go away and die.

It's not the hours she puts in the studying (though at this point I'd recommend putting in the crazy 500 hours that BarBri recommends) but how much she gets out of it. Tell her to analyze her essays closely, and then go back and really kill the MBE. The MBE is the easiest place to gain points, it's very much an objective test of black letter law recollection. Memorization, understanding the application of the law, and reading comprehension high enough to notice the MBE's tricks are the only skills you need, and the MBE has the same questions no matter what state you're in.

Essay grading varies by state unfortunately, as does the law, so she really needs to read what her graders said about her essays.

And the MPT component is just a gimme - easiest place to rack up points on the bar exam, whether you're in a mega-tough state like California or in an easy state like Mississippi.

She can do this. People from third-tier law schools outside the Top 100 pass the bar; she can too. It will happen. But first she needs to get ANY job to start paying off her debt even at the most low amount possible, and network.

This PP has got it 100% right. OP, your daughter CAN pass the bar exam if she learns how to study for the exam - it sounds like she has been memorizing material but not going into the bar exam with any strategy.

I took the New York bar a decade ago and it was pretty damn tough, but once you figure out exactly what the strategy is for the bar exam, all the barriers fall away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
3) It's possible to pass the bar after failing a lot, and New York is hard. MA is less difficult but the Passachusetts comments in here are unnecessarily snarky and mean. You think this poor girl isn't aware of that and using that thought to make herself feel worse? I know what it's like to fail the bar - it feels like shit. You go on Facebook and see all your friends celebrating their results, getting sworn in, starting work as real lawyers, and you just want to go away and die.

It's not the hours she puts in the studying (though at this point I'd recommend putting in the crazy 500 hours that BarBri recommends) but how much she gets out of it. Tell her to analyze her essays closely, and then go back and really kill the MBE. The MBE is the easiest place to gain points, it's very much an objective test of black letter law recollection. Memorization, understanding the application of the law, and reading comprehension high enough to notice the MBE's tricks are the only skills you need, and the MBE has the same questions no matter what state you're in.

Essay grading varies by state unfortunately, as does the law, so she really needs to read what her graders said about her essays.

And the MPT component is just a gimme - easiest place to rack up points on the bar exam, whether you're in a mega-tough state like California or in an easy state like Mississippi.

She can do this. People from third-tier law schools outside the Top 100 pass the bar; she can too. It will happen. But first she needs to get ANY job to start paying off her debt even at the most low amount possible, and network.

This PP has got it 100% right. OP, your daughter CAN pass the bar exam if she learns how to study for the exam - it sounds like she has been memorizing material but not going into the bar exam with any strategy.

I took the New York bar a decade ago and it was pretty damn tough, but once you figure out exactly what the strategy is for the bar exam, all the barriers fall away.

*niece

[Anonymous]

I don't think the issue is whether she can pass the bar. The bigger issue is even if she passes, what kind of job is she likely to get and will she be successful.

3rd tier law school + mediocre grades + failing bar 3x = not the greatest prospects

Sorry, but this is the truth

[Anonymous]

We need to stop pretending she has even mediocre grades. C's are essentially failing, they just want to keep taking your money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:my niece has failed the bar 3 x... 2x in new york and 1x in massachusetts. she has been unemployed since law school graduation in 2013. any advice on what to make of this/what she should do? should she still even try to practice law? she went to a bad law school and has huge debt.

I failed 4 including the other states. It's a mind / confidence now. She knows more law now than any attorney practicing. I guarantee it!

Are you serious? Memorizing legal tests is not the same as knowing the law. And I would never hire an attorney that I knew had failed the bar multiple times. Once can be bad luck or a bad day, but it is absolutely a lack of intelligence after multiple fails.

Are you a lawyer? Do you even know what you're talking about?

Bar and cams are not that hard. I did LLM program and pass VA and NY bars just after one year studying in the law school. And my English back then was really bad. I can't understa how are native English speakers possibly can fail it?

Lol!!!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: In most cases it's probably due to anxiety.

No, in most cases it is because their IQ is just too low and now there are law schools any 90 IQ knuckle-dragger can get into. Since you think most people's problem with failing the BAR is "anxiety," I'd guess you're a simpleton as well.

Oh dear. I'm way above 90. And an attorney. My issue was I never bothered to actuallly participate in school. I only read my first semester and only studied that last time I took and passed the bar. Now my work is in an area never on the bar and just now being taught.
Testing anxiety is a big problem . If she's actually studied 3 times she knows more law than most lawyers. Are you a lawyer PP? When's the last time you dealt with a corporation? Or conflict? Or tort? Get it now?

[Anonymous]

Jobs to do with JD in DC area without a bar-
Compliance (Ethics and compliance, HIPPA compliance at a hospital)
EEOC investigator
Contracts Manager - government and government contracts
Paralegal in house at a corporation
Paralegal with Federal Govt


Keep her head up, she is not the first JD to not pass a bar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:my niece has failed the bar 3 x... 2x in new york and 1x in massachusetts. she has been unemployed since law school graduation in 2013. any advice on what to make of this/what she should do? should she still even try to practice law? she went to a bad law school and has huge debt.

NY, like CA, is typically one of the harder bar exams because so many people want to practice there, so I wouldn't take failing NY twice as that much of a sign. However, she went to a "bad law school" which might mean that she didn't have the grades to get into a good one. You also don't mention how she did at law school.

The real question is why she did it. Does she really want to be a lawyer? At this point she isn't going to get a BigLaw job, so she needs to be looking at alternatives, anyway.

There are lots of fields out there where the logical thought process taught in law school is useful, and a knowledge of the law would be helpful. She should consider something like that rather than pushing the law career.

Such as?