Family of Four on 90k - An Upper Middle Class Existence

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yup, you read it right.

I'm SICK of reading the "500k, woe is me threads". I'm also sick of seeing the bashing going on towards the single woman in the other thread.

We make 90k pretax. DH is civil service. I stay home with both kids, 3 and 8 months.

We have two cars, max out TSP and each of our Roth IRAs. I was a music teacher in a previous life, and volunteer lessons weekly. Considering charging for my services in the near future, but I enjoy the set up. We own (and are paying mortgage on) a 3 bedroom home in a nice, safe neighborhood. We will likely homeschool our kids because public school isn't in line with our worldview.

Husband gets every other Friday off. We eat healthy food, and take yearly vacations to california to see my family. We have an active, healthy family - physically and socially.

Enough of the poor mouthing on dcum - you folks are pathetic.

Why I don't see why folks got so rude to OP, she started off on such a civil and courteous tone.

I was looking forward to the story of how DH bought a TH at 22, has to be either family money or No money down mortgage. Exemplary financial prudence, that is.

When I bought my house (a DC rowhouse) at 30 in 2003, I put down $10k, which I had saved during the 3 years previously. I was also self employed at the time and easily got a no doc loan. Many people were buying homes with no money down mortgages then.

Yes, and the was a very financially imprudent thing to do. It only worked out in DC b/c bubble never popped here. But OP claims they Are responsible with money; no money down mortgages are not responsible. And at 22, even 10k in cash for closing is HUGE.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We make 500k HHI, two kids, living in a newer home in McLean. public school for the kids, and we have no superstition/religious affiliation. We eat out once a week, but the bill for six of us (grand parents ) rarely goes above 100. Vacation about two to three times a year. Sometimes a cruise, some times a vacation spot like Cancun, but usually between 5 to 10 k for a 3 to 7 day trip. We have a 5 year old SUV, 3 year old C class, and a 2 year old 3 series. Of Course our savings, retirement, kids college and etc are all well funded. Our life style is not all that different from a middle class one, just a bit nicer but a lot of cushion for future expenses. You really can't live like money is no object on a 500k income.

$15,000 to $30,000 a year on vacations strikes me as very different than middle class, actually. As does having a Mercedes and a BMW as two of one's three cars. But okay. I know how NOVA and DC warp one's perception of middle class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yup, you read it right.

I'm SICK of reading the "500k, woe is me threads". I'm also sick of seeing the bashing going on towards the single woman in the other thread.

We make 90k pretax. DH is civil service. I stay home with both kids, 3 and 8 months.

We have two cars, max out TSP and each of our Roth IRAs. I was a music teacher in a previous life, and volunteer lessons weekly. Considering charging for my services in the near future, but I enjoy the set up. We own (and are paying mortgage on) a 3 bedroom home in a nice, safe neighborhood. We will likely homeschool our kids because public school isn't in line with our worldview.

Husband gets every other Friday off. We eat healthy food, and take yearly vacations to california to see my family. We have an active, healthy family - physically and socially.

Enough of the poor mouthing on dcum - you folks are pathetic.

Meh, I think your pathetic for being so smug and failing to realize that there is so much more time for life to happen and that your current plan may not be your future plan.

You don't know if you are homeschool. Right now, your kids are too young to be in school so you have no idea if homeschooling will work out. And please, spare me the "I am homeschool my preschooler so I know" bit.

You don't know if either child will have learning issues that require specialized instruction. You don't even know if you will enjoy homeschooling or be any good at it.

Your spouse could have a medical issue and not be able to work for a while. I was once out of work for a month due to something minor that turned into something major. No way to predict this.

Your employer may increase your costs - health insurance, life insurance, retirement contributions, etc.

Be happy where you are right now and don't worry about others. Realize that any plans you have for your kids long term will change as they become older.

[Anonymous]

We do too (well income is 150 plus bonuses) BUT we were able to buy our house because DH's parents gave him the DP to buy a condo in NYC in the early 2000s, which he sold for a pretty big profit. And then we rolled all of that into our present house in NoVa.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have neighbors who make 300K and they are living with no savings, huge mortgage (1 mil home), private school, 5 K for college, very little for retirement.

They spend like crazy on leasing expensive cars, numerous vacations, eating out, maid service, spas and massages. They are the richest among all their relatives (in their HHI). They did not come from a lot of money and they feel that these luxuries are part and parcel of earning 300K. They are always bemoaning the fact that they are broke (they are usually a few hundred short each month) and do not know how to live on less. They are a mess.

You should thank them for keeping the economy a float and keeping people employed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We do too (well income is 150 plus bonuses) BUT we were able to buy our house because DH's parents gave him the DP to buy a condo in NYC in the early 2000s, which he sold for a pretty big profit. And then we rolled all of that into our present house in NoVa.

So anyone who stays home on under 100k who didn't buy before bubble or get family help? Very curious how you make that work. The ones i know live in west prince William county And DH commutes 2 hrs each way.

[Anonymous]

I call bull shit on buying a 800k row house on a 90k salary

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Some of it is that we have a low mortgage payment ($1600). We also paid cash for our car (and don't use it a lot because we live downtown) so no car payment (it's 4 years old now, but was new when we bought it from savings). We use frequent flyer miles for flights (or some of them), which are accrued primarily though putting all expenditure on credit cards (which are then paid off each month). We stay with family when we travel overseas (I realize this isn't an option for everyone) and get great deals on Priceline for local trips (e.g. 4 star hotels for $50-70 a night and we only stay one night) or use Airbnb if longer so that we can have a separate bedroom for the kids and a kitchen so that we don't have to eat out every night.

When we eat out we eat at lower cost places and pay $40-50 for the family. We use Groupons or other coupons where possible and we just eat out a handful of times a month. Our grocery and eating out budget combined is about $8-900 a month. When I cut back on eating out our grocery bills just go up, so it tends to be similar regardless. (We eat vegetarian and I cook everything from scratch at home) My husband and I almost never buy clothes for ourselves. Or shoes. The kids clothes ALL come from Value Village (we also donate a lot of clothes and toys to goodwill), though I buy their clothes new. We don't have cable and have a low phone plan. We don't ever pay for childcare (we do babysitting exchanges with friends and neighbors - no local family). I pack lunches for myself and my kindergartener.

We put $15k a year into my 401k. We already have a robust emergency fund so I tend to put at least $100 into savings per pay period and then use that to fund bigger expenses like car insurance payment (every six months) or a vacation. Despite occasional use of savings our net worth is growing steadily.

How is your mortgage so low for a rowhouse?

I bought my house when I was single and earning about $70k in 2004. It was a foreclosure in a part of town that you couldn't get cab drivers to take you to and where you couldn't get pizza delivered. People were dealing drugs in front of my house and we heard gunshots every weekend. The house was a state -- the kitchen and bathroom were barely functioning, the roof leaked etc-- but it cost less than $300k. At first I had no idea what I was doing and was in way over my head, but I've learned. Since then we've refinanced several times and fully renovated (bit by bit). We have probably spent another $150k all told, but it's been 10 years now and we've paid off the HELOC and a substantial sum of the mortgage. Now owe about $180k.

And before you slam me because this isn't helpful for you because you don't have a time machine. IT IS. You can STILL buy rowhouses (or even SFH) in the DC area, in close in locations for less than $300k. If you buy wisely you will even see similarly huge increases in your investments. You need to earn that sweat equity. (I'd recommend: Hyattsville or Mount Rainier -- you can even get a SFH)

My house now has more than $500k in equity. It's a beautiful house with lots of original Victorian features. And the neighborhood is now extremely hot. When I moved here we had no amenities beyond fast food and check cashing. Now we have restaurants and bars and artist studios, coffee shops and yoga.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I call bull shit on buying a 800k row house on a 90k salary

Call BS all you like, but I bought my $800k row house on a lower salary than that. Of course it wasn't worth $800k then, but you understood that, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Some of it is that we have a low mortgage payment ($1600). We also paid cash for our car (and don't use it a lot because we live downtown) so no car payment (it's 4 years old now, but was new when we bought it from savings). We use frequent flyer miles for flights (or some of them), which are accrued primarily though putting all expenditure on credit cards (which are then paid off each month). We stay with family when we travel overseas (I realize this isn't an option for everyone) and get great deals on Priceline for local trips (e.g. 4 star hotels for $50-70 a night and we only stay one night) or use Airbnb if longer so that we can have a separate bedroom for the kids and a kitchen so that we don't have to eat out every night.

When we eat out we eat at lower cost places and pay $40-50 for the family. We use Groupons or other coupons where possible and we just eat out a handful of times a month. Our grocery and eating out budget combined is about $8-900 a month. When I cut back on eating out our grocery bills just go up, so it tends to be similar regardless. (We eat vegetarian and I cook everything from scratch at home) My husband and I almost never buy clothes for ourselves. Or shoes. The kids clothes ALL come from Value Village (we also donate a lot of clothes and toys to goodwill), though I buy their clothes new. We don't have cable and have a low phone plan. We don't ever pay for childcare (we do babysitting exchanges with friends and neighbors - no local family). I pack lunches for myself and my kindergartener.

We put $15k a year into my 401k. We already have a robust emergency fund so I tend to put at least $100 into savings per pay period and then use that to fund bigger expenses like car insurance payment (every six months) or a vacation. Despite occasional use of savings our net worth is growing steadily.

How is your mortgage so low for a rowhouse?

I bought my house when I was single and earning about $70k in 2004. It was a foreclosure in a part of town that you couldn't get cab drivers to take you to and where you couldn't get pizza delivered. People were dealing drugs in front of my house and we heard gunshots every weekend. The house was a state -- the kitchen and bathroom were barely functioning, the roof leaked etc-- but it cost less than $300k. At first I had no idea what I was doing and was in way over my head, but I've learned. Since then we've refinanced several times and fully renovated (bit by bit). We have probably spent another $150k all told, but it's been 10 years now and we've paid off the HELOC and a substantial sum of the mortgage. Now owe about $180k.

And before you slam me because this isn't helpful for you because you don't have a time machine. IT IS. You can STILL buy rowhouses (or even SFH) in the DC area, in close in locations for less than $300k. If you buy wisely you will even see similarly huge increases in your investments. You need to earn that sweat equity. (I'd recommend: Hyattsville or Mount Rainier -- you can even get a SFH)

My house now has more than $500k in equity. It's a beautiful house with lots of original Victorian features. And the neighborhood is now extremely hot. When I moved here we had no amenities beyond fast food and check cashing. Now we have restaurants and bars and artist studios, coffee shops and yoga.

That is awesome. I wish I'd done similar but didn't have the funds or the foresight in 2004.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I call bull shit on buying a 800k row house on a 90k salary

Call BS all you like, but I bought my $800k row house on a lower salary than that. Of course it wasn't worth $800k then, but you understood that, right?

Do you want a cookie? Think of how much salary you would need to buy that same home today. So the whole 90k and I am making it fine argument is BULLSHIT if you bought before the bubble. thanks and troll through you dick.

[Anonymous]

Op, I think I get you original point as it is weird to here " we have 2.4 mil in savings but I feel poor." On the other hand, your kids are LITTLE! It might seem like 90k is fine but what about when they both need 6k braces a year apart? That will 12k of your 90k. Also, have you had to buy 4 airline tickets yet? You said 3 and 8 mos but two fares will go to 4 one day.

It is so great you teach music but I don't. We have 150$ and 130$ per kid each month for different insteuments. We could say " no" but one kid is quite good and loves it and the other is ok but he loves and not much other hobbies. Also one teen does a competitive sport. Again, we can say no at any time, but none of this is extreme ( each does music and one also has a sport) as you will see that it is not so white or black as to why people feel the pinch even when both making a bit higher.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yup, you read it right.

I'm SICK of reading the "500k, woe is me threads". I'm also sick of seeing the bashing going on towards the single woman in the other thread.

We make 90k pretax. DH is civil service. I stay home with both kids, 3 and 8 months.

We have two cars, max out TSP and each of our Roth IRAs. I was a music teacher in a previous life, and volunteer lessons weekly. Considering charging for my services in the near future, but I enjoy the set up. We own (and are paying mortgage on) a 3 bedroom home in a nice, safe neighborhood. We will likely homeschool our kids because public school isn't in line with our worldview.

Husband gets every other Friday off. We eat healthy food, and take yearly vacations to california to see my family. We have an active, healthy family - physically and socially.

Enough of the poor mouthing on dcum - you folks are pathetic.

you have made no mention of what sort of help you get from family. I am guessing your parents and in laws(or a trust find?) subsidize you. No disrespect to you, but I find that to be especially common around here and it is just those people that seem to claim how "frugal" they are and how easy it is to live around here. Don't assume everyone has that same support.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I call bull shit on buying a 800k row house on a 90k salary

Call BS all you like, but I bought my $800k row house on a lower salary than that. Of course it wasn't worth $800k then, but you understood that, right?

Do you want a cookie? Think of how much salary you would need to buy that same home today. So the whole 90k and I am making it fine argument is BULLSHIT if you bought before the bubble. thanks and troll through you dick.

Yes please. Chocolate chip would be nice.

Suggest you read my post above about how I did it and how you can still do it. It doesn't happen overnight and back in 2004 I was kicking myself for not buying five years earlier.

[Anonymous]

Do your kids play sports?

I just got a registration packet for a non-profit, non-competitive, no-travel volleyball program that wants a CHECK fro $500 with registration. Check only. We're well off by many people's standards and still a $500 lump sum is going to sting. And I need to wait until payday.