I don't believe in the right to kill babies

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe government forcing women to have babies.

i don't either, but i also wish that we could get to a place in our culture so that women who are accidentally pregnant are encouraged to have the baby and place it for adoption. it seems to me that now there is more stigma attached to carrying a child to term than having an abortion (seriously, there are women on here who talk proudly about how many abortions they have had). there are women who are cavalier about pregnancy and i find that sickening. I realize this is my world view and I'm not trying to impose it on anyone else.

Are you saying adoption as a contraceptive method? No worry about a 'surprise' because you can leave it in the hospital?
Can we not just increase womens rights, so surprise pregnancies actually mean that the man is on the hook for child support, and that the mother gets paid maternity leave, and can get child care subsidies and wic if she needs?

Baby scoop era is over and you cannot treat women like that anymore

Maybe, and i know i won't articulate this well, but i sometimes think that women have dug a pretty deep hole regarding holding men responsible by making abortion a women's only issue and decision. if the putative father doesn't have a right to a say in whether the woman has an abortion, how can we then say he HAS to be responsible if she decides to go on with the pregnancy. i promise i'm not being glib -- i really do wrestle with this issue because i think fathers SHOULD be required to be responsible.

as to the leaving babies in the hospital, i'm not advocating that women MUST continue with a pregnancy and place the baby for adoption, but rather that more of the 3/4 of the 1.3 million women i 2008 who had abortions in whole or in part because having a child would interfere with life, for example, would opt to continue with the pregnancy and place the child for adoption. that we could get over the notion that an unexpected pregnancy is a death sentence and a life ender and that more women would become accident surrogates, in an odd way, rather than choose abortion. may sound backwards and heinous, but that's how i feel.

[Anonymous]

There is an entire forum on this site dedicated to expectant mothers. The single most important outcome determinant for almost every aspect of a child's life, experts studies etc. agree, is its in uteruo environment. Women agonize over whether to dye their hair or paint their toes or to eat lettuce or lunch meat or soy. They lament having had drinks before getting the positive test. Yet women come on these threads constantly advocating aggressively for adoption as a Panacea. It is such hypocritical crap. Not my baby, but hey! As long as its someone else's!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe government forcing women to have babies.

i don't either, but i also wish that we could get to a place in our culture so that women who are accidentally pregnant are encouraged to have the baby and place it for adoption. it seems to me that now there is more stigma attached to carrying a child to term than having an abortion (seriously, there are women on here who talk proudly about how many abortions they have had). there are women who are cavalier about pregnancy and i find that sickening. I realize this is my world view and I'm not trying to impose it on anyone else.

Are you saying adoption as a contraceptive method? No worry about a 'surprise' because you can leave it in the hospital?
Can we not just increase womens rights, so surprise pregnancies actually mean that the man is on the hook for child support, and that the mother gets paid maternity leave, and can get child care subsidies and wic if she needs?

Baby scoop era is over and you cannot treat women like that anymore

Maybe, and i know i won't articulate this well, but i sometimes think that women have dug a pretty deep hole regarding holding men responsible by making abortion a women's only issue and decision. if the putative father doesn't have a right to a say in whether the woman has an abortion, how can we then say he HAS to be responsible if she decides to go on with the pregnancy. i promise i'm not being glib -- i really do wrestle with this issue because i think fathers SHOULD be required to be responsible.

as to the leaving babies in the hospital, i'm not advocating that women MUST continue with a pregnancy and place the baby for adoption, but rather that more of the 3/4 of the 1.3 million women i 2008 who had abortions in whole or in part because having a child would interfere with life, for example, would opt to continue with the pregnancy and place the child for adoption. that we could get over the notion that an unexpected pregnancy is a death sentence and a life ender and that more women would become accident surrogates, in an odd way, rather than choose abortion. may sound backwards and heinous, but that's how i feel.

Absurd. The men do get a choice. They choose whether to have sex, whether to use birth control. They may not have the identical choices that women do or as many choices, but they get a choice. It's ot like "Gattica" - I'm not vaccuuming your keyboard too obtain your dna. You choose whether or not to leave it in a place that causes babies. Might as well complain that it's unfair the earth is round or only women can breastfeed. Or maybewomen should complain that it's really not fair that men get the same parental rights as women, after all the woman does alk the work to create the life. But that's just the way it is. It's not fair, to either gender grankly. It's biology.

Additionally it is not in the greater interest of society to allow males to opt out of responsibility for children they have sired, wanted or not.

Frankly I think the status quo on this issue is right and reasonable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe government forcing women to have babies.

i don't either, but i also wish that we could get to a place in our culture so that women who are accidentally pregnant are encouraged to have the baby and place it for adoption. it seems to me that now there is more stigma attached to carrying a child to term than having an abortion (seriously, there are women on here who talk proudly about how many abortions they have had). there are women who are cavalier about pregnancy and i find that sickening. I realize this is my world view and I'm not trying to impose it on anyone else.

Are you saying adoption as a contraceptive method? No worry about a 'surprise' because you can leave it in the hospital?
Can we not just increase womens rights, so surprise pregnancies actually mean that the man is on the hook for child support, and that the mother gets paid maternity leave, and can get child care subsidies and wic if she needs?

Baby scoop era is over and you cannot treat women like that anymore

Maybe, and i know i won't articulate this well, but i sometimes think that women have dug a pretty deep hole regarding holding men responsible by making abortion a women's only issue and decision. if the putative father doesn't have a right to a say in whether the woman has an abortion, how can we then say he HAS to be responsible if she decides to go on with the pregnancy. i promise i'm not being glib -- i really do wrestle with this issue because i think fathers SHOULD be required to be responsible.

as to the leaving babies in the hospital, i'm not advocating that women MUST continue with a pregnancy and place the baby for adoption, but rather that more of the 3/4 of the 1.3 million women i 2008 who had abortions in whole or in part because having a child would interfere with life, for example, would opt to continue with the pregnancy and place the child for adoption. that we could get over the notion that an unexpected pregnancy is a death sentence and a lender and that more women would become accident surrogates, in an odd way, rather than choose abortion. may sound backwards and heinous, but that's how i feel.

Parental rights come from the responsibility. Men don't have a say over gestation because they can't do it and therefore they are not responsible for it. In fact they aren't even legally obligated to provide any support to the mother during the pregnancy at all!

They have parental rights after birth because they are responsible in raising the child. If they are incapable or unwilling to take responsibility, their rights can be stripped by the court.

When a fetus can be transplanted then a man could perhaps have some right to decide. But until he can assume that responsibility, the choice rests with the woman.

[Anonymous]

So, OP, I suppose that all of us who have had a miscarriage should have had a proper funeral and burial for our 'babies'?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So, OP, I suppose that all of us who have had a miscarriage should have had a proper funeral and burial for our 'babies'?

Well, sure, after the murder and manslaughter investigations have completed.

[Anonymous]

You're all set then op, because there is no right to kill babies. There is a right to privacy which envelops a right to make decisions regarding a pregnancy prior to viability by those involved in said pregnancy -- the mother and the baby. When the baby is pre viable, the governmental rights to regulate abortion and the babies' right to life are outweighed by the mother's right to privacy. After viability, the mother's right to privacy gives way to the baby's right to life.
I am sure you benefit from your right to privacy every day, in your choices you make regarding birth control, religion, education for your children. So why don't you butt the f@ck out of the lives of other women.

[Anonymous]

Subject matter beaten to death
No more posts and this thead will be aborted, fini done finished over forgettabout it

[Anonymous]

The single most important outcome determinant for almost every aspect of a child's life, experts studies etc. agree, is its in uteruo environment

Whaaaaaaat?

[Anonymous]

to the. quoted PP. WTF are you talking about?
If we're all really quiet maybe you'll nod off. We're talking abortion not uterine nurturing

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe government forcing women to have babies.

i don't either, but i also wish that we could get to a place in our culture so that women who are accidentally pregnant are encouraged to have the baby and place it for adoption. it seems to me that now there is more stigma attached to carrying a child to term than having an abortion (seriously, there are women on here who talk proudly about how many abortions they have had). there are women who are cavalier about pregnancy and i find that sickening. I realize this is my world view and I'm not trying to impose it on anyone else.

Are you saying adoption as a contraceptive method? No worry about a 'surprise' because you can leave it in the hospital?
Can we not just increase womens rights, so surprise pregnancies actually mean that the man is on the hook for child support, and that the mother gets paid maternity leave, and can get child care subsidies and wic if she needs?

Baby scoop era is over and you cannot treat women like that anymore

Maybe, and i know i won't articulate this well, but i sometimes think that women have dug a pretty deep hole regarding holding men responsible by making abortion a women's only issue and decision. if the putative father doesn't have a right to a say in whether the woman has an abortion, how can we then say he HAS to be responsible if she decides to go on with the pregnancy. i promise i'm not being glib -- i really do wrestle with this issue because i think fathers SHOULD be required to be responsible.

as to the leaving babies in the hospital, i'm not advocating that women MUST continue with a pregnancy and place the baby for adoption, but rather that more of the 3/4 of the 1.3 million women i 2008 who had abortions in whole or in part because having a child would interfere with life, for example, would opt to continue with the pregnancy and place the child for adoption. that we could get over the notion that an unexpected pregnancy is a death sentence and a life ender and that more women would become accident surrogates, in an odd way, rather than choose abortion. may sound backwards and heinous, but that's how i feel.

Absurd. The men do get a choice. They choose whether to have sex, whether to use birth control. They may not have the identical choices that women do or as many choices, but they get a choice. It's ot like "Gattica" - I'm not vaccuuming your keyboard too obtain your dna. You choose whether or not to leave it in a place that causes babies. Might as well complain that it's unfair the earth is round or only women can breastfeed. Or maybewomen should complain that it's really not fair that men get the same parental rights as women, after all the woman does alk the work to create the life. But that's just the way it is. It's not fair, to either gender grankly. It's biology.

Additionally it is not in the greater interest of society to allow males to opt out of responsibility for children they have sired, wanted or not.

Frankly I think the status quo on this issue is right and reasonable.

Same for women. They should be responsible for their choice to have unprotected sex and not use abortion as a means of birth control--which many women do (not referring to children conceived by rape or incest and not referring to situations in which the mother's or baby's life is endangered, etc)

[Anonymous]

I'm talking uterine nurturing because you're raving on about adoption, moron. Unless you also want to regulate what women do for the nine months they're pregnant. But yeah,, good distinction. Obviously the uterine environment has nothing to do with abortion. How stupid are you?

[Anonymous]

^^ that's sarcasm, btw. Good luck out there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe government forcing women to have babies.

i don't either, but i also wish that we could get to a place in our culture so that women who are accidentally pregnant are encouraged to have the baby and place it for adoption. it seems to me that now there is more stigma attached to carrying a child to term than having an abortion (seriously, there are women on here who talk proudly about how many abortions they have had). there are women who are cavalier about pregnancy and i find that sickening. I realize this is my world view and I'm not trying to impose it on anyone else.

Are you saying adoption as a contraceptive method? No worry about a 'surprise' because you can leave it in the hospital?
Can we not just increase womens rights, so surprise pregnancies actually mean that the man is on the hook for child support, and that the mother gets paid maternity leave, and can get child care subsidies and wic if she needs?

Baby scoop era is over and you cannot treat women like that anymore

Maybe, and i know i won't articulate this well, but i sometimes think that women have dug a pretty deep hole regarding holding men responsible by making abortion a women's only issue and decision. if the putative father doesn't have a right to a say in whether the woman has an abortion, how can we then say he HAS to be responsible if she decides to go on with the pregnancy. i promise i'm not being glib -- i really do wrestle with this issue because i think fathers SHOULD be required to be responsible.

as to the leaving babies in the hospital, i'm not advocating that women MUST continue with a pregnancy and place the baby for adoption, but rather that more of the 3/4 of the 1.3 million women i 2008 who had abortions in whole or in part because having a child would interfere with life, for example, would opt to continue with the pregnancy and place the child for adoption. that we could get over the notion that an unexpected pregnancy is a death sentence and a life ender and that more women would become accident surrogates, in an odd way, rather than choose abortion. may sound backwards and heinous, but that's how i feel.

Absurd. The men do get a choice. They choose whether to have sex, whether to use birth control. They may not have the identical choices that women do or as many choices, but they get a choice. It's ot like "Gattica" - I'm not vaccuuming your keyboard too obtain your dna. You choose whether or not to leave it in a place that causes babies. Might as well complain that it's unfair the earth is round or only women can breastfeed. Or maybewomen should complain that it's really not fair that men get the same parental rights as women, after all the woman does alk the work to create the life. But that's just the way it is. It's not fair, to either gender grankly. It's biology.

Additionally it is not in the greater interest of society to allow males to opt out of responsibility for children they have sired, wanted or not.

Frankly I think the status quo on this issue is right and reasonable.

Same for women. They should be responsible for their choice to have unprotected sex and not use abortion as a means of birth control--which many women do (not referring to children conceived by rape or incest and not referring to situations in which the mother's or baby's life is endangered, etc)

Having an abortion IS being responsible for their choice to have sex.

[Anonymous]

I cannot believe this has become a conversation about sex.
I do not even know if that is a choice.
By your logic being gay would be a choice because of the choice to have sex with someone of your gender.