New "Dream Schools" from Selingo's new book ...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ithaca College has a 70% acceptance rate and a four year graduation rate of about 68%.

The School of Communications is its main attraction as well as its theater program.

Recommending Ithaca College as some sort of great value school or as an undiscovered (hidden) gem is total garbage. Great place to enjoy four years of socializing and pretending that one attends nearby Ivy League Cornell University.

My kid just graduated from the music school, so first you are wrong -- graduation rate just by a quick Google search: The college's overall graduation rate stands at 77%, placing it in the top 20% of institutions.

Second, I just finished the book, and the entire premise of the list is schools with acceptance rates of places you can get into. And the average acceptance rate of any college is 65%. The Ivies are great, but they're not for everyone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ithaca College has a 70% acceptance rate and a four year graduation rate of about 68%.

The School of Communications is its main attraction as well as its theater program.

Recommending Ithaca College as some sort of great value school or as an undiscovered (hidden) gem is total garbage. Great place to enjoy four years of socializing and pretending that one attends nearby Ivy League Cornell University.

He makes the point that graduation rates are based on who the college enrolles in the first place. He cites this study, which took some digging to find, but I plan to use in my kids search of schools that have higher than expected grad rates: https://www.bain.com/insights/beating-the-odds-improving-student-outcomes-in-higher-education/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ithaca College has a 70% acceptance rate and a four year graduation rate of about 68%.

The School of Communications is its main attraction as well as its theater program.

Recommending Ithaca College as some sort of great value school or as an undiscovered (hidden) gem is total garbage. Great place to enjoy four years of socializing and pretending that one attends nearby Ivy League Cornell University.

My kid just graduated from the music school, so first you are wrong -- graduation rate just by a quick Google search: The college's overall graduation rate stands at 77%, placing it in the top 20% of institutions.

Second, I just finished the book, and the entire premise of the list is schools with acceptance rates of places you can get into. And the average acceptance rate of any college is 65%. The Ivies are great, but they're not for everyone.

No, you are incorrect. You are confusing the first year retention rate of 77% with a four year graduation rate of 68%.

A first year retention rate of 77% means that nearly a quarter (25%) of the freshman class does not return to Ithaca College for their second year. This should be a statistic which receives serious consideration by any prospective student.

Many students in the theater & communications areas report lack of equipment & outdated equipment at Ithaca College on other college forums.

Ithaca College is hardly a "dream school" due to its serious financial difficulties and low retention rate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ithaca College has a 70% acceptance rate and a four year graduation rate of about 68%.

The School of Communications is its main attraction as well as its theater program.

Recommending Ithaca College as some sort of great value school or as an undiscovered (hidden) gem is total garbage. Great place to enjoy four years of socializing and pretending that one attends nearby Ivy League Cornell University.

My kid just graduated from the music school, so first you are wrong -- graduation rate just by a quick Google search: The college's overall graduation rate stands at 77%, placing it in the top 20% of institutions.

Second, I just finished the book, and the entire premise of the list is schools with acceptance rates of places you can get into. And the average acceptance rate of any college is 65%. The Ivies are great, but they're not for everyone.

No, you are incorrect. You are confusing the first year retention rate of 77% with a four year graduation rate of 68%.

A first year retention rate of 77% means that nearly a quarter (25%) of the freshman class does not return to Ithaca College for their second year. This should be a statistic which receives serious consideration by any prospective student.

Many students in the theater & communications areas report lack of equipment & outdated equipment at Ithaca College on other college forums.

Ithaca College is hardly a "dream school" due to its serious financial difficulties and low retention rate.

Please don't school me....I work at a college in the DMV. Go to the Collegecard. U.S. Government. It says right there: 77% grad rate. And by the way, I work at a well endowed college and we're also having financial difficulties. Every college is right now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ithaca College has a 70% acceptance rate and a four year graduation rate of about 68%.

The School of Communications is its main attraction as well as its theater program.

Recommending Ithaca College as some sort of great value school or as an undiscovered (hidden) gem is total garbage. Great place to enjoy four years of socializing and pretending that one attends nearby Ivy League Cornell University.

My kid just graduated from the music school, so first you are wrong -- graduation rate just by a quick Google search: The college's overall graduation rate stands at 77%, placing it in the top 20% of institutions.

Second, I just finished the book, and the entire premise of the list is schools with acceptance rates of places you can get into. And the average acceptance rate of any college is 65%. The Ivies are great, but they're not for everyone.

Probably not the right place to ask this question, but I will anyway. Can you talk about your kid’s experience as a music major at Ithaca including their current career plans? As a Cornell grad I have a hard time considering Ithaca as an option for my kid but kid is a musician and is set on double majoring or minoring in performance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ithaca College has a 70% acceptance rate and a four year graduation rate of about 68%.

The School of Communications is its main attraction as well as its theater program.

Recommending Ithaca College as some sort of great value school or as an undiscovered (hidden) gem is total garbage. Great place to enjoy four years of socializing and pretending that one attends nearby Ivy League Cornell University.

My kid just graduated from the music school, so first you are wrong -- graduation rate just by a quick Google search: The college's overall graduation rate stands at 77%, placing it in the top 20% of institutions.

Second, I just finished the book, and the entire premise of the list is schools with acceptance rates of places you can get into. And the average acceptance rate of any college is 65%. The Ivies are great, but they're not for everyone.

No, you are incorrect. You are confusing the first year retention rate of 77% with a four year graduation rate of 68%.

A first year retention rate of 77% means that nearly a quarter (25%) of the freshman class does not return to Ithaca College for their second year. This should be a statistic which receives serious consideration by any prospective student.

Many students in the theater & communications areas report lack of equipment & outdated equipment at Ithaca College on other college forums.

Ithaca College is hardly a "dream school" due to its serious financial difficulties and low retention rate.

Please don't school me....I work at a college in the DMV. Go to the Collegecard. U.S. Government. It says right there: 77% grad rate. And by the way, I work at a well endowed college and we're also having financial difficulties. Every college is right now.

Apparently, you need schooling in this area. Please post a link to your stats as my familiarity with such federal government statistics is that it focuses on those students receiving federal financial aid assistance and uses 6 year graduation rates, not 4 year graduation rates. Plus, wouldn't it be unusual for the first year retention rate of 77% being identical to a school's graduation rate ?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ithaca College has a 70% acceptance rate and a four year graduation rate of about 68%.

The School of Communications is its main attraction as well as its theater program.

Recommending Ithaca College as some sort of great value school or as an undiscovered (hidden) gem is total garbage. Great place to enjoy four years of socializing and pretending that one attends nearby Ivy League Cornell University.

My kid just graduated from the music school, so first you are wrong -- graduation rate just by a quick Google search: The college's overall graduation rate stands at 77%, placing it in the top 20% of institutions.

Second, I just finished the book, and the entire premise of the list is schools with acceptance rates of places you can get into. And the average acceptance rate of any college is 65%. The Ivies are great, but they're not for everyone.

No, you are incorrect. You are confusing the first year retention rate of 77% with a four year graduation rate of 68%.

A first year retention rate of 77% means that nearly a quarter (25%) of the freshman class does not return to Ithaca College for their second year. This should be a statistic which receives serious consideration by any prospective student.

Many students in the theater & communications areas report lack of equipment & outdated equipment at Ithaca College on other college forums.

Ithaca College is hardly a "dream school" due to its serious financial difficulties and low retention rate.

Please don't school me....I work at a college in the DMV. Go to the Collegecard. U.S. Government. It says right there: 77% grad rate. And by the way, I work at a well endowed college and we're also having financial difficulties. Every college is right now.

Apparently, you need schooling in this area. Please post a link to your stats as my familiarity with such federal government statistics is that it focuses on those students receiving federal financial aid assistance and uses 6 year graduation rates, not 4 year graduation rates. Plus, wouldn't it be unusual for the first year retention rate of 77% being identical to a school's graduation rate ?

bruh you are giving stay-at-home mom ex-lawyer or ex-nurse "karen" energy. please listen to people with more inside information than you have! be humble. the PP knows moe than you because they work inside a college in higher learning and their DC goes to dickinson. it's ok for you to be wrong or get corrected. this isn't a debate.

[Anonymous]

Just checked College Scorecard--it uses 8 year graduation rates.

A main attraction of Ithaca College is its use of heavy discounting of tuition to attract students.

To the poster with the music school graduate of Ithaca College: Schools of Music are specialty schools and are usually small. Music students have a different experience than do humanities students and there are far fewer schools of music than liberal arts schools.

Ithaca College's school of music was combined with the theater program in 202 in order to reduce costs. 116 faculty positions were to be eliminated over a 3 year period:

https://ithacajournal.com/story/news/local/2021/02/25/ithaca-college-faculty-eliminations-art-music/6814594002/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ithaca College has a 70% acceptance rate and a four year graduation rate of about 68%.

The School of Communications is its main attraction as well as its theater program.

Recommending Ithaca College as some sort of great value school or as an undiscovered (hidden) gem is total garbage. Great place to enjoy four years of socializing and pretending that one attends nearby Ivy League Cornell University.

My kid just graduated from the music school, so first you are wrong -- graduation rate just by a quick Google search: The college's overall graduation rate stands at 77%, placing it in the top 20% of institutions.

Second, I just finished the book, and the entire premise of the list is schools with acceptance rates of places you can get into. And the average acceptance rate of any college is 65%. The Ivies are great, but they're not for everyone.

No, you are incorrect. You are confusing the first year retention rate of 77% with a four year graduation rate of 68%.

A first year retention rate of 77% means that nearly a quarter (25%) of the freshman class does not return to Ithaca College for their second year. This should be a statistic which receives serious consideration by any prospective student.

Many students in the theater & communications areas report lack of equipment & outdated equipment at Ithaca College on other college forums.

Ithaca College is hardly a "dream school" due to its serious financial difficulties and low retention rate.

Please don't school me....I work at a college in the DMV. Go to the Collegecard. U.S. Government. It says right there: 77% grad rate. And by the way, I work at a well endowed college and we're also having financial difficulties. Every college is right now.

Apparently, you need schooling in this area. Please post a link to your stats as my familiarity with such federal government statistics is that it focuses on those students receiving federal financial aid assistance and uses 6 year graduation rates, not 4 year graduation rates. Plus, wouldn't it be unusual for the first year retention rate of 77% being identical to a school's graduation rate ?

bruh you are giving stay-at-home mom ex-lawyer or ex-nurse "karen" energy. please listen to people with more inside information than you have! be humble. the PP knows moe than you because they work inside a college in higher learning and their DC goes to dickinson. it's ok for you to be wrong or get corrected. this isn't a debate.

Grow up bruh. Stay away from adult conversations. The other poster employed by a college lacks knowledge in his/her own field.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is this basically a list of very solid colleges and universities that aren't super selective or very expensive?

yes. nothing impressive.

I think the point of the book is that students, and parents especially, are looking at college search the wrong way. People try to get into the "best" college they can get into, without critically assessing fit or value or colleges that can provide both but aren't even on their radar. The book starts with a profile of student who got into Columbia but was unhappy and did not find the student culture a fit at all, he ended up transferring to University of Minnesota, where he did find better fit and vibe had more content and less stressed students. Top ranked college is not equal to happiness. We all know this but he shares some powerful stories and data. He also shares that there isn't enough space in top colleges and they don't give enough aid, so many more of these other schools should be considered. Like a person who got into Bowdoin with zero aid and ended up another college with nearly full aid and lots of oter perks.

but for this guy - full pay at Columbia vs in state MN is a jump ball imo.

but some of this seemed like, saving 10k a year for a WAY lower ranked, fewer resourced college

They will all have fewer resources in T's America. Research funding is being cut left and right.

[Anonymous]

Augustana College is a great experience and students get a good education. Financial aid is very good for most students. I can't imagine it being a dream school for most students from this area, though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Augustana College is a great experience and students get a good education. Financial aid is very good for most students. I can't imagine it being a dream school for most students from this area, though.

Selingo is just trying to sell books by introducing non-discussed schools (lots of them) into a conversation that will generate nationwide publicity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Augustana College is a great experience and students get a good education. Financial aid is very good for most students. I can't imagine it being a dream school for most students from this area, though.

Selingo is just trying to sell books by introducing non-discussed schools (lots of them) into a conversation that will generate nationwide publicity.

Umm, the intro to the list says that: "If you live in California, then Montclair State—a good regional college in New Jersey that’s on this list—probably isn’t for you. But if you live in New Jersey and are thinking about Rutgers or Penn State, then Montclair State might be worth more than a passing look. Of course, the type of campus you want matters, too. Let’s say you’re especially drawn to small, top-ranked liberal arts colleges like Bowdoin and Pomona. In that case, it may make sense to include St. Olaf from this list as you expand your field of vision, but you can most likely skip big, rah-rah campuses like the University of Illinois and Clemson."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just read the list. Completely random. Save your money. Don't buy.

you can read the book for free at the library. on kindle, it only cost me $15. I just finished it and definitely got more than $15 worth of advice and insight. the list is just in the appendix and it includes a longer commentary on each selected school. but the book is really not about the dream school list alone.

+100.

What's sending me about this thread is all the people commenting on just the list who have not read the actual book. I guess this is what I should have expected because this crowd is not known for context or nuance. I wish he had never included the list in the appendix - it distracts from the broader message. The real value is not in the list but in the insights and tools he provides to help families make informed decisions. People seem to be missing the forest for the trees here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ithaca College has a 70% acceptance rate and a four year graduation rate of about 68%.

The School of Communications is its main attraction as well as its theater program.

Recommending Ithaca College as some sort of great value school or as an undiscovered (hidden) gem is total garbage. Great place to enjoy four years of socializing and pretending that one attends nearby Ivy League Cornell University.

He makes the point that graduation rates are based on who the college enrolles in the first place. He cites this study, which took some digging to find, but I plan to use in my kids search of schools that have higher than expected grad rates: https://www.bain.com/insights/beating-the-odds-improving-student-outcomes-in-higher-education/

Note: He went to Ithaca and sits on a bunch of committess/boards.