$80K+ tuition

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Depends on the school and the kid but yes, can definitely be worth it. DH and I met at MIT. For two regular middle class kids, the education, network and brand of the school profoundly changed our lives. I had full ride opportunities at other good schools so it was a huge sacrifice for my parents (who have never made more than 200K HHI in a very expensive California coastal region) to pay out of pocket for at the time. But now 15 years later, we all agree it was worth it.

Why wouldn’t you just take the full ride at another good school, pocket and invest the tuition savings, and then get a Ph.D., S.M., or other graduate degree from MIT? This is what most smart people do. If you’re good enough to get accepted as an undergraduate, you should be good enough to get a fully covered graduate degree as well. Then, you have a more useful and prestigious degree from MIT as well as hundreds of thousands in tuition savings.

Anyone smart enough to get into MIT would be smart enough to perform this very straightforward analysis.

Especially since PP lived in coastal California and could have easily gone to Berkeley for a fraction of the cost of MIT. And then still gone to MIT for free as a grad student. What a dummy.

Spoken like two posters who were not smart enough to get into MIT, as undergrads or grad students.

This comment is vexing. First, the aforementioned words were written, not spoken. Second, it isn’t clear from your puerile statements whether you’re even familiar with the acronym MIT. You don’t project yourself as a Caltech prankster, after all.

[Anonymous]

I want my kid to go to Pepperdine. I know the cost and prepared to pay it. I am not worried about what they rank, just the right fit for them. Cost currently is 90k/year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not for a pre-professional program. Save the money for MCAT/LSAT training and tell your kid to stand out on campus at the state U.

What if the state U is, say, one with an 80% admission rate. So ranked not highly at all? The in between option(s) was not one that DC liked (you know, like a 30-50% admit).

Acceptance rate is just a measure of popularity. 30-50% admit rate doesn’t mean it’s a better school than one with 80% acceptance.

That's not really the comparison though, is it?

It's the 30-50% vs. the selective school as compared to 80% vs. the selective school.

Dp. I don’t understand what you're saying. Pp is correct. The acceptance rate reflects the quantity of applicants, not the quality. That’s a poor measure to use when comparing schools.

Actually, it's partly true. But most State U with a 80% acceptance rate do have a group of really smart kids (especially if it's the best State U in that state). However you will also have a significant portion of the kids who are simply on a different level. For example: this kid got into a T20ish school. So lets say 3.9+UW gpa, 1500+ SAT are likely on the resume. However most state U with an 80% acceptance rate will have a very different demographic.
Take Univ of Iowa (82% acceptance rate). For those who did NOT submit SAT?ACT 31% have a 4.0, 27% have 3.75 and 3.99. So 57% have a 3.75+ GPA.
Back in 2019 their SAT range (25-75) was 1140-1330. So yes, this kid will need to find the honors program and search for similar kids, but they will exist. Just only 20% of the school will have 1400+. However, there are 20K+ undergrads, not 5K. There will still be very driven students---it's a state school many will be there because they are smart, it's debt free for them and it's all they can afford.

Agree. My daughter goes to our very large, well-regarded instate flagship. She likes it and I actually like that she has to be proactive and not getting her hand held (because it has been the last 18 years somewhat). But in the FB and other social media sites, I see that there are kids sleeping in class right in front of the professor. On summer orientation (parents went too, had separate seminars), I saw a few kids acting like it was HS and being truly obnoxious and interrupting the speakers. Just a few , but it made me think maybe the students in her second choice college (more expensive, private, pre-professional mostly) would have been more on point. But my kid is happy, doing well, we are not going into debt and I kept those observations to myself. Another parent on orientation sitting next to me had noticed the few obnoxious kids and said they probably wouldn’t make it through the first year. Hopefully they shape up or they’re wasting precious money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not for a pre-professional program. Save the money for MCAT/LSAT training and tell your kid to stand out on campus at the state U.

This. Definitely not worth it if child is continuing beyond undergrad. I don’t know much about engineering - maybe it’s worth it for one of the top programs in that in order to work straight out of college? But I worked in T10 law school admissions for years and it made no difference in the application whether the applicant went to Princeton or UVA or VA Tech.

OK but the comparison in the thread is not between or among these schools but Princeton, or UVA, and schools farther down "the rankings" like Roanoke. Can you, law school admissions person, really say that makes no difference?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our 2 kids are at SLACs that are 82-84k/yr and we wouldn’t change a thing. Saved and sacrificed and funded 529s so they could have the same incredible education we had. IYKYK. If you don’t, you will surely think it’s not worth it.

You have no idea if it’s worth it if that’s all you know. But I can see why you’d need to believe it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not for a pre-professional program. Save the money for MCAT/LSAT training and tell your kid to stand out on campus at the state U.

This. Definitely not worth it if child is continuing beyond undergrad. I don’t know much about engineering - maybe it’s worth it for one of the top programs in that in order to work straight out of college? But I worked in T10 law school admissions for years and it made no difference in the application whether the applicant went to Princeton or UVA or VA Tech.

OK but the comparison in the thread is not between or among these schools but Princeton, or UVA, and schools farther down "the rankings" like Roanoke. Can you, law school admissions person, really say that makes no difference?

Roanoke is definitely NOT worth it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not for a pre-professional program. Save the money for MCAT/LSAT training and tell your kid to stand out on campus at the state U.

This. Definitely not worth it if child is continuing beyond undergrad. I don’t know much about engineering - maybe it’s worth it for one of the top programs in that in order to work straight out of college? But I worked in T10 law school admissions for years and it made no difference in the application whether the applicant went to Princeton or UVA or VA Tech.

OK but the comparison in the thread is not between or among these schools but Princeton, or UVA, and schools farther down "the rankings" like Roanoke. Can you, law school admissions person, really say that makes no difference?

Roanoke is definitely NOT worth it.

^^^^THIS is why it is not helpful to "name schools." Roanoke was to be a school at a certain level vs. a school in the top 20. People hear the name and the biases kick in and it's not helpful. Jut like this PP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not for a pre-professional program. Save the money for MCAT/LSAT training and tell your kid to stand out on campus at the state U.

This. Definitely not worth it if child is continuing beyond undergrad. I don’t know much about engineering - maybe it’s worth it for one of the top programs in that in order to work straight out of college? But I worked in T10 law school admissions for years and it made no difference in the application whether the applicant went to Princeton or UVA or VA Tech.

Yale law school used to post their undergraduate feeder institutions and like 70% came from just the top 10 schools when they last published in 2020.

The rest of the school was just one kid from like 200 different schools.

I can’t find any similar stats published by other top law schools, so can’t refute your statement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not for a pre-professional program. Save the money for MCAT/LSAT training and tell your kid to stand out on campus at the state U.

This. Definitely not worth it if child is continuing beyond undergrad. I don’t know much about engineering - maybe it’s worth it for one of the top programs in that in order to work straight out of college? But I worked in T10 law school admissions for years and it made no difference in the application whether the applicant went to Princeton or UVA or VA Tech.

Yale law school used to post their undergraduate feeder institutions and like 70% came from just the top 10 schools when they last published in 2020.

The rest of the school was just one kid from like 200 different schools.

I can’t find any similar stats published by other top law schools, so can’t refute your statement.

Maybe Yale has that luxury but we were on the other end of the top 10 and thanks to USNWR, our primary concerns were GPA and LSAT. If you were above our desired 75th percentiles, we didn’t care if you went to Hollywood Upstairs college. Maybe for the borderline admit/deny kids we parsed on college ranking? But not many. But state flagships were viewed equally to good privates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not for a pre-professional program. Save the money for MCAT/LSAT training and tell your kid to stand out on campus at the state U.

This. Definitely not worth it if child is continuing beyond undergrad. I don’t know much about engineering - maybe it’s worth it for one of the top programs in that in order to work straight out of college? But I worked in T10 law school admissions for years and it made no difference in the application whether the applicant went to Princeton or UVA or VA Tech.

OK but the comparison in the thread is not between or among these schools but Princeton, or UVA, and schools farther down "the rankings" like Roanoke. Can you, law school admissions person, really say that makes no difference?

Roanoke is definitely NOT worth it.

^^^^THIS is why it is not helpful to "name schools." Roanoke was to be a school at a certain level vs. a school in the top 20. People hear the name and the biases kick in and it's not helpful. Jut like this PP.

You misunderstand. Any mid to lower level private (without significant aid money) is not worth it. I’m not picking on Roanoke.

[Anonymous]

So the takeaway is if you can't get into a top 20, 30 school. Or more relevant to the topic, can't PAY for that type of school, you're basically screwed out of top grad schools and relegated to the mid-tier or low castes of society? LOL

Viva America!

[Anonymous]

All state schools are not the same, and I don’t mean admit rates or prestige. A flagship or similar will have a tier of top students, as bright as at any selective college. You just won’t have that cohort handed to you unless you are in an honors college or something like that.
State schools differ in the structure of lower lever science classes and this is the part that can make a difference. In some cases, you are largely on your own, teaching yourself. Once you get to the higher level classes you may have smaller seminars or research opportunities as an undergrad in R1 labs. Some state colleges have smaller more engaging intro level classes. Research this if it matters to you.

Both private and state schools have students wind up in med school. Check the competition level among students IF this matters to your kid. It varies significantly school to school.

Some students prefer to go and be anonymous except for what really matters to them ( specific profs they work with) some want to be seen and feel like they are seen and heard more.

Check the guidance reputation for health professional admissions .

Some “second tier” (hate these expressions) LACs are strong with this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not for a pre-professional program. Save the money for MCAT/LSAT training and tell your kid to stand out on campus at the state U.

This. Definitely not worth it if child is continuing beyond undergrad. I don’t know much about engineering - maybe it’s worth it for one of the top programs in that in order to work straight out of college? But I worked in T10 law school admissions for years and it made no difference in the application whether the applicant went to Princeton or UVA or VA Tech.

Yale law school used to post their undergraduate feeder institutions and like 70% came from just the top 10 schools when they last published in 2020.

The rest of the school was just one kid from like 200 different schools.

I can’t find any similar stats published by other top law schools, so can’t refute your statement.

Maybe Yale has that luxury but we were on the other end of the top 10 and thanks to USNWR, our primary concerns were GPA and LSAT. If you were above our desired 75th percentiles, we didn’t care if you went to Hollywood Upstairs college. Maybe for the borderline admit/deny kids we parsed on college ranking? But not many. But state flagships were viewed equally to good privates.

I will turn it around on you...what %age of your admits came from the Top 10 and Top 20 schools, and then how many schools in total were represented at the law school. That is perhaps a better measure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Worth it if you can comfortably afford it, in my opinion. I went to a top 10 school and 25 years later people still murmur with respect when I name it. So, I feel like a "name" school does enhance your profile over a lifetime. I intend to send my kids to the best schools to which they can gain admittance, regardless of cost, but we are saving a lot and have a high HHI. If it wasn't comfortably in our budget, then cost would factor more into our decision.

What?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All state schools are not the same, and I don’t mean admit rates or prestige. A flagship or similar will have a tier of top students, as bright as at any selective college. You just won’t have that cohort handed to you unless you are in an honors college or something like that.
State schools differ in the structure of lower lever science classes and this is the part that can make a difference. In some cases, you are largely on your own, teaching yourself. Once you get to the higher level classes you may have smaller seminars or research opportunities as an undergrad in R1 labs. Some state colleges have smaller more engaging intro level classes. Research this if it matters to you.

Both private and state schools have students wind up in med school. Check the competition level among students IF this matters to your kid. It varies significantly school to school.

Some students prefer to go and be anonymous except for what really matters to them ( specific profs they work with) some want to be seen and feel like they are seen and heard more.

Check the guidance reputation for health professional admissions .

Some “second tier” (hate these expressions) LACs are strong with this.

Honors Colleges at many large public institutions are not really a cohort. It is not as though there is an Engineering or CS Honors College, a Finance Honors College, etc. It is a bunch of students across 150+ majors that maybe have their own dorm. Sure, you may have a special general seminar or something, but for the most part you are taking classes where probably 95%+ of the class is not in the Honors college.

I think the Honors College gets thrown around and misunderstood to imply that all the Engineering Honors College students take their own classes, Business Honors College students take their own classes, etc. I am not aware of any that work that way.

The main advantages are usually you get Merit $$s, you get priority for selecting classes which is a big perk at large state universities, you can opt for an Honors dorm (which you may or may not want to do). Those perks are worth the Honors College.