Good alternatives to UVA/WM with merit?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks all. To clarify, I’m looking at options for students with high stats and an in-state budget who still may get rejected from W&M/UVA, but the student is not that excited about Tech/JMU as alternative schools. I understand to get merit they won’t be as highly ranked at WM/UVA. Where else should we look? Thanks to those who already answered.

OP here. Should add that we want DC to be within a 6-8 hour drive. Don’t want to deal with airfare and such. So probably places like Grinnell are out, although I’m sure it’s lovely.

Ha ha. If you’re kid doesn’t get into UVA or William and Mary in state they sure as hell aren’t getting into Grinnell either - especially with merit. Grinnell had a 10 percent acceptance rate last year. So you needn’t worry about it.

I think generally once you get below the 50s all the LACs pretty reliably give merit. So then you narrow down by location, academic interests, ECs, etc.

My DD was interested in W&M but not enough that she was willing to ED. She was waitlisted in RD. Her top interests were a strong environmental science program, reasonable drive from home, opportunities to continue music. Her list included Juniata, SMCM, Allegheny, Washington College, Dickinson, Mt Holyoke. Dickinson and Mount Holyoke were too expensive. The others came in around $30k.

My rising senior is also interested in Environmental Science and has all those schools on her list. Would you mind sharing where your DD ended up?

She's going to Juniata. Washington College was a close 2nd but she preferred the music options at Juniata. FWIW, I think Juniata's environmental science program is getting them a lot more attention. At orientation they said the incoming freshman class is the 2nd largest in their history and most of the parents I spoke to during the day had students also interested in ES.

I think the Juniata poster works for admissions lol. It comes up on this board time and time again.

Sorry, there's more than one parent on here happy with Juniata since I saw them posting during my DD's search. Don't know why that's upsetting to you.

It’s not upsetting, just amusing. Somebody is awfully proud of their kid’s school!

DP- or maybe it’s multiple posters. Just like posts about UVA are not from one person.

Um, it’s Juniata. Doubtful.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks all. To clarify, I’m looking at options for students with high stats and an in-state budget who still may get rejected from W&M/UVA, but the student is not that excited about Tech/JMU as alternative schools. I understand to get merit they won’t be as highly ranked at WM/UVA. Where else should we look? Thanks to those who already answered.

OP here. Should add that we want DC to be within a 6-8 hour drive. Don’t want to deal with airfare and such. So probably places like Grinnell are out, although I’m sure it’s lovely.

Ha ha. If you’re kid doesn’t get into UVA or William and Mary in state they sure as hell aren’t getting into Grinnell either - especially with merit. Grinnell had a 10 percent acceptance rate last year. So you needn’t worry about it.

I think generally once you get below the 50s all the LACs pretty reliably give merit. So then you narrow down by location, academic interests, ECs, etc.

My DD was interested in W&M but not enough that she was willing to ED. She was waitlisted in RD. Her top interests were a strong environmental science program, reasonable drive from home, opportunities to continue music. Her list included Juniata, SMCM, Allegheny, Washington College, Dickinson, Mt Holyoke. Dickinson and Mount Holyoke were too expensive. The others came in around $30k.

My rising senior is also interested in Environmental Science and has all those schools on her list. Would you mind sharing where your DD ended up?

She's going to Juniata. Washington College was a close 2nd but she preferred the music options at Juniata. FWIW, I think Juniata's environmental science program is getting them a lot more attention. At orientation they said the incoming freshman class is the 2nd largest in their history and most of the parents I spoke to during the day had students also interested in ES.

I think the Juniata poster works for admissions lol. It comes up on this board time and time again.

Sorry, there's more than one parent on here happy with Juniata since I saw them posting during my DD's search. Don't know why that's upsetting to you.

It’s not upsetting, just amusing. Somebody is awfully proud of their kid’s school!

DP- or maybe it’s multiple posters. Just like posts about UVA are not from one person.

Um, it’s Juniata. Doubtful.

Um, they have more than one student.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For kids that are in range for these schools, where are other places they could apply private or OOS that would give them enough merit to make the price similar to full pay UVA/WM? Or what about schools that would end up even cheaper? My parents only considered instate for us so I’m new to the world of schools ending up “cheaper” or the same with merit aid. Thanks.

If you have income under $250,000, Princeton might give you enough need-based aid to be cheaper than UVa.

The Coast Guard is not going to appeal to everyone, but you don’t need a congressional nomination to go there.

A lot of state flagships in the middle of the country are in lovely, liberal or centrist towns and have merit scholarships.

If you can figure out how to get a friend or relative to rent a room to your kid, or figure out some other way to cope with the housing shortage, and your kid is a great, responsible, sober kid, you could easily hold the yearly cost for an English-language program at a Dutch university to less than $35,000, all in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For kids that are in range for these schools, where are other places they could apply private or OOS that would give them enough merit to make the price similar to full pay UVA/WM? Or what about schools that would end up even cheaper? My parents only considered instate for us so I’m new to the world of schools ending up “cheaper” or the same with merit aid. Thanks.

My Kid got into Boston University as a regular decision and got excellent aid.
I'm not sure if this is merit or need-based but I heard some of the high stat kids often got full-ride.
Indeed it was cheaper than instate school for us, and she chose BU over W&M.

[Anonymous]

Second tier SLACs have full ride scholarships to shore up their stats. Consider Rollins, Biemingham-Southern, Furman, Hendrix, Lewis and Clark, Agnes Scott. Even if you dont get the full ride, they often offer hefty discounts

Also publics: Louisville, alabama, UT-Dallas, etc

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks all. To clarify, I’m looking at options for students with high stats and an in-state budget who still may get rejected from W&M/UVA, but the student is not that excited about Tech/JMU as alternative schools. I understand to get merit they won’t be as highly ranked at WM/UVA. Where else should we look? Thanks to those who already answered.

OP here. Should add that we want DC to be within a 6-8 hour drive. Don’t want to deal with airfare and such. So probably places like Grinnell are out, although I’m sure it’s lovely.

Ha ha. If you’re kid doesn’t get into UVA or William and Mary in state they sure as hell aren’t getting into Grinnell either - especially with merit. Grinnell had a 10 percent acceptance rate last year. So you needn’t worry about it.

Ick. Drugs, isolated, freezing cold weather, lack of diverse viewpoints—- and, where the heck is the nearest emergency room?!?

Glad you love it, good for you!

Gosh. And it is a way tougher admit than in-state UVA. What must applicants be thinking?

I don’t think you know how difficult it is to get into UVA

UVA: 27% overall in-state admissions rate. “I don’t think you know how difficult it is to get into [Grinnell].”

Apples and oranges. No way anyone could think Grinnell is more competitive than UVA.

Except admissions wise it IS. Especially in state. Out of state is another story, but it’s definitely easier to get into UVA in state than Grinnell.

Wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks all. To clarify, I’m looking at options for students with high stats and an in-state budget who still may get rejected from W&M/UVA, but the student is not that excited about Tech/JMU as alternative schools. I understand to get merit they won’t be as highly ranked at WM/UVA. Where else should we look? Thanks to those who already answered.

OP here. Should add that we want DC to be within a 6-8 hour drive. Don’t want to deal with airfare and such. So probably places like Grinnell are out, although I’m sure it’s lovely.

Ha ha. If you’re kid doesn’t get into UVA or William and Mary in state they sure as hell aren’t getting into Grinnell either - especially with merit. Grinnell had a 10 percent acceptance rate last year. So you needn’t worry about it.

Ick. Drugs, isolated, freezing cold weather, lack of diverse viewpoints—- and, where the heck is the nearest emergency room?!?

Glad you love it, good for you!

Gosh. And it is a way tougher admit than in-state UVA. What must applicants be thinking?

I don’t think you know how difficult it is to get into UVA

UVA: 27% overall in-state admissions rate. “I don’t think you know how difficult it is to get into [Grinnell].”

Apples and oranges. No way anyone could think Grinnell is more competitive than UVA.

+1. The 53,000 who applied to UVA are a more self-selecting group than the few thousand who apply to Grinnell.. This is because of the availability of the SCHEV statistics, Naviance and public high school college counselors whose job it is to route the public students to the most appropriate in-state institution. No Langley counselor is going to help my B student DD get in to UVA when she is clearly GMU material (and that’s exactly what happened). So only the high fliers with a 4.53, 1520 SAT or 34 ACT apply to UVA. These are the top 5% and …. those who have taken the most rigorous courses offered at the high school. And tge counselor indicates all of this is his recommendation and in the high school profile. If a kid wants to shoot an application to Grinnell on the way, sure hope for it , the public high school doesn’t care but it does care when it’s top 5 percent if students are competing against one another for the same coveted slots at UVA. The same happens for the UCLA schools, which is why you can’t compare selectivity numbers if a top public to that if a small SLAC

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks all. To clarify, I’m looking at options for students with high stats and an in-state budget who still may get rejected from W&M/UVA, but the student is not that excited about Tech/JMU as alternative schools. I understand to get merit they won’t be as highly ranked at WM/UVA. Where else should we look? Thanks to those who already answered.

OP here. Should add that we want DC to be within a 6-8 hour drive. Don’t want to deal with airfare and such. So probably places like Grinnell are out, although I’m sure it’s lovely.

Ha ha. If you’re kid doesn’t get into UVA or William and Mary in state they sure as hell aren’t getting into Grinnell either - especially with merit. Grinnell had a 10 percent acceptance rate last year. So you needn’t worry about it.

Ick. Drugs, isolated, freezing cold weather, lack of diverse viewpoints—- and, where the heck is the nearest emergency room?!?

Glad you love it, good for you!

Gosh. And it is a way tougher admit than in-state UVA. What must applicants be thinking?

I don’t think you know how difficult it is to get into UVA

UVA: 27% overall in-state admissions rate. “I don’t think you know how difficult it is to get into [Grinnell].”

Apples and oranges. No way anyone could think Grinnell is more competitive than UVA.

+1. The 53,000 who applied to UVA are a more self-selecting group than the few thousand who apply to Grinnell.. This is because of the availability of the SCHEV statistics, Naviance and public high school college counselors whose job it is to route the public students to the most appropriate in-state institution. No Langley counselor is going to help my B student DD get in to UVA when she is clearly GMU material (and that’s exactly what happened). So only the high fliers with a 4.53, 1520 SAT or 34 ACT apply to UVA. These are the top 5% and …. those who have taken the most rigorous courses offered at the high school. And tge counselor indicates all of this is his recommendation and in the high school profile. If a kid wants to shoot an application to Grinnell on the way, sure hope for it , the public high school doesn’t care but it does care when it’s top 5 percent if students are competing against one another for the same coveted slots at UVA. The same happens for the UCLA schools, which is why you can’t compare selectivity numbers if a top public to that if a small SLAC

This theory has been debunked on here time and time again

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks all. To clarify, I’m looking at options for students with high stats and an in-state budget who still may get rejected from W&M/UVA, but the student is not that excited about Tech/JMU as alternative schools. I understand to get merit they won’t be as highly ranked at WM/UVA. Where else should we look? Thanks to those who already answered.

OP here. Should add that we want DC to be within a 6-8 hour drive. Don’t want to deal with airfare and such. So probably places like Grinnell are out, although I’m sure it’s lovely.

Ha ha. If you’re kid doesn’t get into UVA or William and Mary in state they sure as hell aren’t getting into Grinnell either - especially with merit. Grinnell had a 10 percent acceptance rate last year. So you needn’t worry about it.

Ick. Drugs, isolated, freezing cold weather, lack of diverse viewpoints—- and, where the heck is the nearest emergency room?!?

Glad you love it, good for you!

Gosh. And it is a way tougher admit than in-state UVA. What must applicants be thinking?

I don’t think you know how difficult it is to get into UVA

UVA: 27% overall in-state admissions rate. “I don’t think you know how difficult it is to get into [Grinnell].”

Apples and oranges. No way anyone could think Grinnell is more competitive than UVA.

+1. The 53,000 who applied to UVA are a more self-selecting group than the few thousand who apply to Grinnell.. This is because of the availability of the SCHEV statistics, Naviance and public high school college counselors whose job it is to route the public students to the most appropriate in-state institution. No Langley counselor is going to help my B student DD get in to UVA when she is clearly GMU material (and that’s exactly what happened). So only the high fliers with a 4.53, 1520 SAT or 34 ACT apply to UVA. These are the top 5% and …. those who have taken the most rigorous courses offered at the high school. And tge counselor indicates all of this is his recommendation and in the high school profile. If a kid wants to shoot an application to Grinnell on the way, sure hope for it , the public high school doesn’t care but it does care when it’s top 5 percent if students are competing against one another for the same coveted slots at UVA. The same happens for the UCLA schools, which is why you can’t compare selectivity numbers if a top public to that if a small SLAC

Oh My Lord. It’s the crazy SCHEV poster who continues to insist that VA public high school counselors direct/force kids to go to certain schools so they can keep their jobs. This is such bullshit. VA public high school counselors are far too busy and stretched with far too many students to provide that kind of individual attention even if they wanted to. Besides, even if they were doing that they would be doing a terrible job at it, considering that only 27% of the students that they are “directing“ to UVA are actually getting in.

UVA is not “self-selecting” in the slightest. It’s a large state school with a national reputation where many students simply throw their hats into the admissions ring to see what happens. No school with 53,000 applicants is “self selecting.”

Grinnell, on the other hand, is the very definition of “self-selecting.” Given its isolated location and quirky reputation, many excellent students don’t even consider throwing in an application. If the school were located in the Northeast, it would be on the same selectivity level as Williams or Amherst.

[Anonymous]

Pretty sure kids who know they have zero chances of getting into UVA, are forced to apply by their parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Pretty sure kids who know they have zero chances of getting into UVA, are forced to apply by their parents.

Why? To avoid paying for Grinnell?

[Anonymous]

To cut to the chase, theGrinnells of the world are socially acceptable and reasonable choices for those who don’t get into UVA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To cut to the chase, theGrinnells of the world are socially acceptable and reasonable choices for those who don’t get into UVA.

Not necessarily.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pretty sure kids who know they have zero chances of getting into UVA, are forced to apply by their parents.

Why? To avoid paying for Grinnell?

Because they want a bigger school and have to keep tuition as low as possible. If not UVA, then VT or JMU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks all. To clarify, I’m looking at options for students with high stats and an in-state budget who still may get rejected from W&M/UVA, but the student is not that excited about Tech/JMU as alternative schools. I understand to get merit they won’t be as highly ranked at WM/UVA. Where else should we look? Thanks to those who already answered.

OP here. Should add that we want DC to be within a 6-8 hour drive. Don’t want to deal with airfare and such. So probably places like Grinnell are out, although I’m sure it’s lovely.

Ha ha. If you’re kid doesn’t get into UVA or William and Mary in state they sure as hell aren’t getting into Grinnell either - especially with merit. Grinnell had a 10 percent acceptance rate last year. So you needn’t worry about it.

Ick. Drugs, isolated, freezing cold weather, lack of diverse viewpoints—- and, where the heck is the nearest emergency room?!?

Glad you love it, good for you!

Gosh. And it is a way tougher admit than in-state UVA. What must applicants be thinking?

I don’t think you know how difficult it is to get into UVA

UVA: 27% overall in-state admissions rate. “I don’t think you know how difficult it is to get into [Grinnell].”

Apples and oranges. No way anyone could think Grinnell is more competitive than UVA.

+1. The 53,000 who applied to UVA are a more self-selecting group than the few thousand who apply to Grinnell.. This is because of the availability of the SCHEV statistics, Naviance and public high school college counselors whose job it is to route the public students to the most appropriate in-state institution. No Langley counselor is going to help my B student DD get in to UVA when she is clearly GMU material (and that’s exactly what happened). So only the high fliers with a 4.53, 1520 SAT or 34 ACT apply to UVA. These are the top 5% and …. those who have taken the most rigorous courses offered at the high school. And tge counselor indicates all of this is his recommendation and in the high school profile. If a kid wants to shoot an application to Grinnell on the way, sure hope for it , the public high school doesn’t care but it does care when it’s top 5 percent if students are competing against one another for the same coveted slots at UVA. The same happens for the UCLA schools, which is why you can’t compare selectivity numbers if a top public to that if a small SLAC

Oh My Lord. It’s the crazy SCHEV poster who continues to insist that VA public high school counselors direct/force kids to go to certain schools so they can keep their jobs. This is such bullshit. VA public high school counselors are far too busy and stretched with far too many students to provide that kind of individual attention even if they wanted to. Besides, even if they were doing that they would be doing a terrible job at it, considering that only 27% of the students that they are “directing“ to UVA are actually getting in.

UVA is not “self-selecting” in the slightest. It’s a large state school with a national reputation where many students simply throw their hats into the admissions ring to see what happens. No school with 53,000 applicants is “self selecting.”

Grinnell, on the other hand, is the very definition of “self-selecting.” Given its isolated location and quirky reputation, many excellent students don’t even consider throwing in an application. If the school were located in the Northeast, it would be on the same selectivity level as Williams or Amherst.

Not with that heartbeat law passing! Good luck with your pay-per-posts for Grinnell.