For high stats applying to yield-protecting schools, go TO or submit lower single sitting?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’re applying this strategy for VA Tech year. Definitely going TO. Love this thread.

My kid wanted to do that out of Langley and the CC told them that VTech expects to see scores from the strong NoVa publics.

That is completely contrary to what our experience has been. We already have had two waitlisted with gpa AND test scores at or above top 75%. Yes we have done the tours and demonstrated interest. Acceptance to UF, Ga Tech and others with lower acceptance rates. Va tech is the goldilocks of admission these days. Your application needs to be just right. Not too high, not too low.

No. You need the stats and a thoughtful application.

Exactly. There seems to be a disconnect among some of these parents. Just having the high stats doesn’t entitle one to admittance - anywhere. My high stats kid got into VT but it was also his first choice school and he showed it - everything from applying ED to writing his essays about subjects relevant to VT. It was clear he wasn’t using them as a throwaway application, as some of these kids clearly are.

Did you read all those applications cover to cover?

+1 It's sad. Time for them to land the conspiracy theory helicopter.

I don’t have any kids who have applied yet. But it’s very clear from Scattergrams that some schools yield protect the very top applicants. It’s time for you to look at the data. That doesn’t mean all schools do yield protect (many do not) or that all parents are correct when they believe their child was yield protected. But some do and some are. I suspect it’s just one or two posters trying to gaslight people on here that it doesn’t exist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’re applying this strategy for VA Tech year. Definitely going TO. Love this thread.

My kid wanted to do that out of Langley and the CC told them that VTech expects to see scores from the strong NoVa publics.

That is completely contrary to what our experience has been. We already have had two waitlisted with gpa AND test scores at or above top 75%. Yes we have done the tours and demonstrated interest. Acceptance to UF, Ga Tech and others with lower acceptance rates. Va tech is the goldilocks of admission these days. Your application needs to be just right. Not too high, not too low.

No. You need the stats and a thoughtful application.

Exactly. There seems to be a disconnect among some of these parents. Just having the high stats doesn’t entitle one to admittance - anywhere. My high stats kid got into VT but it was also his first choice school and he showed it - everything from applying ED to writing his essays about subjects relevant to VT. It was clear he wasn’t using them as a throwaway application, as some of these kids clearly are.

+1 It's sad. Time for them to land the conspiracy theory helicopter.

I don’t have any kids who have applied yet. But it’s very clear from Scattergrams that some schools yield protect the very top applicants. It’s time for you to look at the data. That doesn’t mean all schools do yield protect (many do not) or that all parents are correct when they believe their child was yield protected. But some do and some are. I suspect it’s just one or two posters trying to gaslight people on here that it doesn’t exist.

Did you read all those applications cover to cover?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’re applying this strategy for VA Tech year. Definitely going TO. Love this thread.

My kid wanted to do that out of Langley and the CC told them that VTech expects to see scores from the strong NoVa publics.

That is completely contrary to what our experience has been. We already have had two waitlisted with gpa AND test scores at or above top 75%. Yes we have done the tours and demonstrated interest. Acceptance to UF, Ga Tech and others with lower acceptance rates. Va tech is the goldilocks of admission these days. Your application needs to be just right. Not too high, not too low.

No. You need the stats and a thoughtful application.

Exactly. There seems to be a disconnect among some of these parents. Just having the high stats doesn’t entitle one to admittance - anywhere. My high stats kid got into VT but it was also his first choice school and he showed it - everything from applying ED to writing his essays about subjects relevant to VT. It was clear he wasn’t using them as a throwaway application, as some of these kids clearly are.

+1 It's sad. Time for them to land the conspiracy theory helicopter.

I don’t have any kids who have applied yet. But it’s very clear from Scattergrams that some schools yield protect the very top applicants. It’s time for you to look at the data. That doesn’t mean all schools do yield protect (many do not) or that all parents are correct when they believe their child was yield protected. But some do and some are. I suspect it’s just one or two posters trying to gaslight people on here that it doesn’t exist.

Did you read all those applications cover to cover?

There are about 3,000 kids at my kid’s school. You’re saying ALL of the dozens of top kids in the five years of data who appear yield protected had poor applications? You’re ridiculous.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP you are overthinking this. I also think “yield protection” is largely a DCUM thing. Posters here can’t fathom the idea that their kids aren’t good enough, so they blame rejections and waitlists on yield protection.

Good heavens you need to read more. Google yield protect and the schools you are interested in. Start reading books on college admissions. Go read on same on College Confidential and Reddit and other sources.

What books and peer-reviewed articles is this mentioned in?

Selingo book discusses LTE. Likelihood to Enroll that colleges factor in in determining whether to admit an applicant. He discusses the importance of yields to colleges at length.

Here’s a quote:

“ In a tsunami of applicants who are qualified on the surface, what matters at this point are the elements that differentiate students, or if they are particularly good overall, the chances they will ultimately choose Davidson—what admissions officers call LTE (likelihood to enroll). It’s an acronym used frequently in discussions during regular decision. The more admissions officers dissect an applicant’s intentions now, the better they’ll fare in April when multiple schools are competing for the attention of the students they accepted. It’s another way a college’s agenda—in this case keeping its yield rate up—shapes admissions decisions.”

This quote is about marginal students getting a nudge into the admit pile if they demonstrate interest, not denying top students because they might not enroll.

There’s a bunch of other stuff written about that. DI can be a component of LTE but it doesn’t have to be. Plus consider the role of econometric modeling in determining LTE. It’s not just DI.

"Mueller says the data is used in more of an aggregate than individualized way, meaning econometric modeling is unlikely to harm strong candidates."
https://www.usnews.com/education/best-colleges/articles/how-admissions-algorithms-could-affect-your-college-acceptance

This is mainly in the financial aid context but your story goes on to say, “ "Sometimes these data points are used at the point of evaluation (when reading the application) and other times they are used at the point of shaping a class," Perez explains.”
The reality is that the companies selling it don’t choose how it’s used and the colleges aren’t going to tell us.

No, this is not used at a granular level for admissions decisions 99.9% of the time.

Cite?

Still waiting. And is it granular if they decide to waitlist any OOS applicants above a certain test score?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’re applying this strategy for VA Tech year. Definitely going TO. Love this thread.

My kid wanted to do that out of Langley and the CC told them that VTech expects to see scores from the strong NoVa publics.

That is completely contrary to what our experience has been. We already have had two waitlisted with gpa AND test scores at or above top 75%. Yes we have done the tours and demonstrated interest. Acceptance to UF, Ga Tech and others with lower acceptance rates. Va tech is the goldilocks of admission these days. Your application needs to be just right. Not too high, not too low.

No. You need the stats and a thoughtful application.

Exactly. There seems to be a disconnect among some of these parents. Just having the high stats doesn’t entitle one to admittance - anywhere. My high stats kid got into VT but it was also his first choice school and he showed it - everything from applying ED to writing his essays about subjects relevant to VT. It was clear he wasn’t using them as a throwaway application, as some of these kids clearly are.

+1 It's sad. Time for them to land the conspiracy theory helicopter.

+2

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’re applying this strategy for VA Tech year. Definitely going TO. Love this thread.

My kid wanted to do that out of Langley and the CC told them that VTech expects to see scores from the strong NoVa publics.

That is completely contrary to what our experience has been. We already have had two waitlisted with gpa AND test scores at or above top 75%. Yes we have done the tours and demonstrated interest. Acceptance to UF, Ga Tech and others with lower acceptance rates. Va tech is the goldilocks of admission these days. Your application needs to be just right. Not too high, not too low.

No. You need the stats and a thoughtful application.

Exactly. There seems to be a disconnect among some of these parents. Just having the high stats doesn’t entitle one to admittance - anywhere. My high stats kid got into VT but it was also his first choice school and he showed it - everything from applying ED to writing his essays about subjects relevant to VT. It was clear he wasn’t using them as a throwaway application, as some of these kids clearly are.

+1 It's sad. Time for them to land the conspiracy theory helicopter.

I don’t have any kids who have applied yet. But it’s very clear from Scattergrams that some schools yield protect the very top applicants. It’s time for you to look at the data. That doesn’t mean all schools do yield protect (many do not) or that all parents are correct when they believe their child was yield protected. But some do and some are. I suspect it’s just one or two posters trying to gaslight people on here that it doesn’t exist.

DP. I suspect it's just one or two posters trying to gaslight people on here that it *does* exist. Parents who simply can't believe their child was not admitted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’re applying this strategy for VA Tech year. Definitely going TO. Love this thread.

My kid wanted to do that out of Langley and the CC told them that VTech expects to see scores from the strong NoVa publics.

That is completely contrary to what our experience has been. We already have had two waitlisted with gpa AND test scores at or above top 75%. Yes we have done the tours and demonstrated interest. Acceptance to UF, Ga Tech and others with lower acceptance rates. Va tech is the goldilocks of admission these days. Your application needs to be just right. Not too high, not too low.

No. You need the stats and a thoughtful application.

Exactly. There seems to be a disconnect among some of these parents. Just having the high stats doesn’t entitle one to admittance - anywhere. My high stats kid got into VT but it was also his first choice school and he showed it - everything from applying ED to writing his essays about subjects relevant to VT. It was clear he wasn’t using them as a throwaway application, as some of these kids clearly are.

+1 It's sad. Time for them to land the conspiracy theory helicopter.

I don’t have any kids who have applied yet. But it’s very clear from Scattergrams that some schools yield protect the very top applicants. It’s time for you to look at the data. That doesn’t mean all schools do yield protect (many do not) or that all parents are correct when they believe their child was yield protected. But some do and some are. I suspect it’s just one or two posters trying to gaslight people on here that it doesn’t ex
ist.

Did you read all those applications cover to cover?

There are about 3,000 kids at my kid’s school. You’re saying ALL of the dozens of top kids in the five years of data who appear yield protected had poor applications? You’re ridiculous.

DP. Read the bolded. "Dozens of top kids" (over five years of data). That's not many. Plenty of top kids *were* admitted to these schools. Once again, they can't admit them all - nor should they.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’re applying this strategy for VA Tech year. Definitely going TO. Love this thread.

My kid wanted to do that out of Langley and the CC told them that VTech expects to see scores from the strong NoVa publics.

That is completely contrary to what our experience has been. We already have had two waitlisted with gpa AND test scores at or above top 75%. Yes we have done the tours and demonstrated interest. Acceptance to UF, Ga Tech and others with lower acceptance rates. Va tech is the goldilocks of admission these days. Your application needs to be just right. Not too high, not too low.

No. You need the stats and a thoughtful application.

Exactly. There seems to be a disconnect among some of these parents. Just having the high stats doesn’t entitle one to admittance - anywhere. My high stats kid got into VT but it was also his first choice school and he showed it - everything from applying ED to writing his essays about subjects relevant to VT. It was clear he wasn’t using them as a throwaway application, as some of these kids clearly are.

+1 It's sad. Time for them to land the conspiracy theory helicopter.

I don’t have any kids who have applied yet. But it’s very clear from Scattergrams that some schools yield protect the very top applicants. It’s time for you to look at the data. That doesn’t mean all schools do yield protect (many do not) or that all parents are correct when they believe their child was yield protected. But some do and some are. I suspect it’s just one or two posters trying to gaslight people on here that it doesn’t ex
ist.

Did you read all those applications cover to cover?

There are about 3,000 kids at my kid’s school. You’re saying ALL of the dozens of top kids in the five years of data who appear yield protected had poor applications? You’re ridiculous.

DP. Read the bolded. "Dozens of top kids" (over five years of data). That's not many. Plenty of top kids *were* admitted to these schools. Once again, they can't admit them all - nor should they.

You misunderstand or are being deliberately obtuse. Here’s an explanation from a top admissions counseling shop:

“ In some cases, Naviance scattergrams (which track the admissions results from a specific school with respect to GPA and test scores) do indicate that yield protection is occurring. Some counselors report patterns in which admit rates go up as GPA/test score stats increase up to a point – until admit rates decrease at the highest score and grade levels.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’re applying this strategy for VA Tech year. Definitely going TO. Love this thread.

My kid wanted to do that out of Langley and the CC told them that VTech expects to see scores from the strong NoVa publics.

That is completely contrary to what our experience has been. We already have had two waitlisted with gpa AND test scores at or above top 75%. Yes we have done the tours and demonstrated interest. Acceptance to UF, Ga Tech and others with lower acceptance rates. Va tech is the goldilocks of admission these days. Your application needs to be just right. Not too high, not too low.

No. You need the stats and a thoughtful application.

Exactly. There seems to be a disconnect among some of these parents. Just having the high stats doesn’t entitle one to admittance - anywhere. My high stats kid got into VT but it was also his first choice school and he showed it - everything from applying ED to writing his essays about subjects relevant to VT. It was clear he wasn’t using them as a throwaway application, as some of these kids clearly are.

+1 It's sad. Time for them to land the conspiracy theory helicopter.

I don’t have any kids who have applied yet. But it’s very clear from Scattergrams that some schools yield protect the very top applicants. It’s time for you to look at the data. That doesn’t mean all schools do yield protect (many do not) or that all parents are correct when they believe their child was yield protected. But some do and some are. I suspect it’s just one or two posters trying to gaslight people on here that it doesn’t ex
ist.

Did you read all those applications cover to cover?

There are about 3,000 kids at my kid’s school. You’re saying ALL of the dozens of top kids in the five years of data who appear yield protected had poor applications? You’re ridiculous.

DP. Read the bolded. "Dozens of top kids" (over five years of data). That's not many. Plenty of top kids *were* admitted to these schools. Once again, they can't admit them all - nor should they.

You misunderstand or are being deliberately obtuse. Here’s an explanation from a top admissions counseling shop:

“ In some cases, Naviance scattergrams (which track the admissions results from a specific school with respect to GPA and test scores) do indicate that yield protection is occurring. Some counselors report patterns in which admit rates go up as GPA/test score stats increase up to a point – until admit rates decrease at the highest score and grade levels.”

Surely people know GPA and test scores are only the tip if the iceberg.