Does FCPS have any requirements for instructors regarding posting grades in timely fashion

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a long-standing problem in FCPS with terrible consequences for students. But most teachers, particularly those who post here, will be incredibly defensive about it. They, quite frankly, do not seem to think that grading is important enough to prioritize over other tasks. And administrators must agree because there is never any change.

I'd lodge concerns, in writing, to the counselor and principle, but do not expect any change.

Which task should we drop so we can grade? Should I drop planning lessons? That means I won’t be ready when your child shows up in my classroom on Monday. Should I drop logging and analyzing student data? That means I’ll have no idea how well your child is doing over them. Maybe I should drop parking lot duty and cafeteria duty, even though my contract dictates that I am responsible for fulfilling them. Maybe I should drop answering the tsunami of parent and student emails I get each day, or I should refuse to go to IEP meetings.

I get less than an hour of work time each day. I usually have over 5 hours of work to do. There’s the math and that’s the reason grading takes a while.

If you want more timely feedback, then join teachers in the fight for more reasonable workloads. I’ve worked 6 hours already today, on a Saturday. I’m nowhere near done.

The teachers here who refuse to work on weekends have the right idea. They are forcing an appropriate work/life balance while I’ll burn out and quit.

Proving the OPs point. Sorry your job sucks. But that doesn’t change the fact that grading isn’t happening and childrens education is suffering because of it.

If teachers’ jobs suck, if teachers are suffering, then “children’s education suffering” does seem a likely outcome. Do you expect teachers to suffer even more for the “sake of the kids?” Oh no no. This is a job, my friend. Those of us who have been beaten down by the likes of you and yours have no incentive to try and martyr ourselves for ungrateful folks who *expect* us to do sacrifice our own personal lives as a matter of course.

+1, I’m not working more hours than I already am for “the sake of the kids.” If they are suffering that is the parents problem. I’m working 50 hours a week and that’s my limit. No it’s in the parents to find the solution or pressure FCPS to find one.

So you aren't grading work, knowing it adversely affects children, in an effort to pressure admin to do something? You are using the kids to further your efforts to enact change. How did you feel about the asylum seekers being shipped to Martha's Vineyard?

They aren’t going to give hours and hours (yes, it takes that long) of their unpaid personal time to grade “for the chiiiiiiildrrreeeeen.” Deal with it.

Teacher here. This is the answer right here. I spent years working all day every day. I missed my own children’s performances, meets, and games. I delayed doctor appointments. I missed dinners with extended family. I even cancelled a family trip once. I lost ten years because I prioritized my job over my life.

I’m not doing it anymore. The choice is between demanding a work/life balance and quitting. Papers will be returned eventually.

Why not choose to not do other parts of your job, ones that don't affect the kids? Refuse the stupid admin meeting. Refuse lunch or drop off duty. Yes, that's more difficult to refuse those, but they will be more effective in getting your point across because admin will be directly impacted. Right now, the kids suffer and admin doesn't care so nothing will change and kids continue to be hurt.

That’s the problem: ALL aspects of my job affect the kids. Planning takes most of my time. If I don’t plan, your child doesn’t get an engaging, meaningful lesson. The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress.

Lunch duty is written into my contract. If I don’t go, all that will happen is I will get written up. I care about my job, so being defiant isn’t going to work for me.

There’s nothing to give up. The only thing that doesn’t have a rigid due date is my grading, so it is last priority. It has to be. I’m already working instead of eating my lunch. I’m already working instead of taking a much-needed break. (I don’t get 10 minutes at a water cooler to just chat with colleagues.) I work as I wait for meetings to start. I use my time very effectively and still can’t get my job done in the 55 hours I allow each week. I got it done when I was working 70, but that’s not happening anymore.

If there were a solution, I would have already thought of it. I’m very good at what I do. The truth is teachers are too overburdened. We need to be responsible for fewer classes during the day so we have more time. Period.

Here's your issue: "The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress."
This relentless measuring/testing focus on SOLs and all the other junk tests is a colossal waste of both teacher and student time, and as a parent I frankly want teachers to just teach instead of spending lots of time with this. If you compare now to a generation ago, this is the main time sink that creeped into classrooms, especially when combined with technological tool nonsense that gives minimal added value.

So you don't need anymore data than what you already get when you grade assignments, as that tells you who is and isn't doing well. Additionally, after your first year and assuming you're reteaching the same grade or class, lesson planning should mainly be reusing what worked well last year.

I’m assuming you are not a teacher? This post reads as if it was written by somebody who doesn’t actually understand how teaching works. I’ll start with your argument that teaching the same content every year somehow reduces planning. It doesn’t. Teachers revise lessons each year. We have to because students are huge walking variables and what worked last year may not work for the new group. Also, what we did last year may not have worked in the first place. We don’t just plan content. We plan delivery. Also, many teachers are moved around a lot. I have taught 13 different courses in my career. That’s 13 new curricula I had to make my own.

Also, yes… I do have to care about data. These tests are only “junk tests” and a “colossal waste” of time if I do what you suggest, which appears to be to ignore them. Like it or not, they are here to stay. Blowing them off is not in your child’s best interest. If I plan accordingly, though, I can find meaningful ways to work this data back into my lessons. Your student, therefore, won’t be wasting time in class because I spent sufficient time at home to make sure we don’t have to.

I spent ALL of my time in class “just teaching.” I spend MOST of my time at home planning. I spent SOME time at home grading. This is the reality of a teacher’s life. You may think there are solutions when you look in from the outside, but I promise you there is nothing you can suggest that teachers haven’t already tried.

The only solution is to reduce workload. Those of us within the profession know this.

I do teach, and what I've suggested has worked well for me. Earlier posters suggesting that teachers focus on teaching and ignore the 'fluff' stuff such as admin meetings that don't have a point are right, that's one thing you can do now if the admins refuse to reduce the load, even though it will piss them off. What you described above sounds good, but in real life is pretty useless for many kids. Anecdotally, any and all tests my kid does in school are a complete waste of time, time that could have been better used by giving them more challenging things to do/learn. I'm sure I'm far from the only one here. There is a large pool of kids who are simply bored of the whole nonsense that is called testing/tracking/measuring/endless amounts of time. You're not really helping those kids in any way and adding extra work for yourself by participating in the never ending testing/measuring nonsense. Yes it sucks that they make you do it, but teachers just have to stand up and pick their fight together against the massive admin bureaucracy. The real issue is that teachers are unable to effectively band with parents and together commit to simply teaching kids and ignoring all of the extra crap that they make you do that is not related to teaching. Also, what you've described above is not necessary, because if indeed you spend ALL 100% of the time teaching as you said, you should already know how each kid is doing over the course of each week.

You do not need to spend incredible amounts of time replanning your lessons, in the same subject. Let's say you taught geometry one year, you have almost everything you need the second time around, you only need to redo stuff that didn't work well. Geometry doesn't change and kids entering your classroom on average don't change year over year.

Hear, hear. But the bolded portion will never happen because teachers want parents to advocate for them while they are actively not teaching kids (grading is part of teaching). Why would I band together with teachers who have decided educating my kids is less important than admin fluff? That gives me zero assurance that they'll actually start grading if the admin fluff is reduced.

Agreed, but that's why parents and teachers have to start trusting each other. To do that they need to first and foremost agree on what they believe sets up kids most for success, i.e maximizing teaching time. With that, they can start to support one another whenever things get in the way of teaching, of which these days there are MANY. Teachers should let parents know when admins are overburdening them with things not related to teaching and parents should together push back against those things so that teachers can have back their classroom! Similarly, parents should try to support and encourage their kid at home to be curious and interested in learning, and when they notice learning issues/gaps, should nicely report that to their teachers. If it's something that the teacher has also noticed, they can try their best to help when they have a chance, which ideally they will have more time to teach and work with kids. Currently this is not happening, mainly because there is no mechanism for teachers and parents to work together; teachers are simply too overburdened with fluff (myriad # of software and technology that is minimally helpful to helping kids truly learn, tons of testing and even more coming out of the state just this year, ridiculous admin asks and wasted time where teacher has to do admin type of work or really stupid trainings, and also yeah.. probably too many classes/kids assigned to teachers, especially after elementary school). Once parents are on board that these types of things literally waste very valuable teaching time, they can act to support the teachers and free them up to teach and have back their classroom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a long-standing problem in FCPS with terrible consequences for students. But most teachers, particularly those who post here, will be incredibly defensive about it. They, quite frankly, do not seem to think that grading is important enough to prioritize over other tasks. And administrators must agree because there is never any change.

I'd lodge concerns, in writing, to the counselor and principle, but do not expect any change.

Which task should we drop so we can grade? Should I drop planning lessons? That means I won’t be ready when your child shows up in my classroom on Monday. Should I drop logging and analyzing student data? That means I’ll have no idea how well your child is doing over them. Maybe I should drop parking lot duty and cafeteria duty, even though my contract dictates that I am responsible for fulfilling them. Maybe I should drop answering the tsunami of parent and student emails I get each day, or I should refuse to go to IEP meetings.

I get less than an hour of work time each day. I usually have over 5 hours of work to do. There’s the math and that’s the reason grading takes a while.

If you want more timely feedback, then join teachers in the fight for more reasonable workloads. I’ve worked 6 hours already today, on a Saturday. I’m nowhere near done.

The teachers here who refuse to work on weekends have the right idea. They are forcing an appropriate work/life balance while I’ll burn out and quit.

Proving the OPs point. Sorry your job sucks. But that doesn’t change the fact that grading isn’t happening and childrens education is suffering because of it.

If teachers’ jobs suck, if teachers are suffering, then “children’s education suffering” does seem a likely outcome. Do you expect teachers to suffer even more for the “sake of the kids?” Oh no no. This is a job, my friend. Those of us who have been beaten down by the likes of you and yours have no incentive to try and martyr ourselves for ungrateful folks who *expect* us to do sacrifice our own personal lives as a matter of course.

+1, I’m not working more hours than I already am for “the sake of the kids.” If they are suffering that is the parents problem. I’m working 50 hours a week and that’s my limit. No it’s in the parents to find the solution or pressure FCPS to find one.

So you aren't grading work, knowing it adversely affects children, in an effort to pressure admin to do something? You are using the kids to further your efforts to enact change. How did you feel about the asylum seekers being shipped to Martha's Vineyard?

They aren’t going to give hours and hours (yes, it takes that long) of their unpaid personal time to grade “for the chiiiiiiildrrreeeeen.” Deal with it.

Teacher here. This is the answer right here. I spent years working all day every day. I missed my own children’s performances, meets, and games. I delayed doctor appointments. I missed dinners with extended family. I even cancelled a family trip once. I lost ten years because I prioritized my job over my life.

I’m not doing it anymore. The choice is between demanding a work/life balance and quitting. Papers will be returned eventually.

Why not choose to not do other parts of your job, ones that don't affect the kids? Refuse the stupid admin meeting. Refuse lunch or drop off duty. Yes, that's more difficult to refuse those, but they will be more effective in getting your point across because admin will be directly impacted. Right now, the kids suffer and admin doesn't care so nothing will change and kids continue to be hurt.

That’s the problem: ALL aspects of my job affect the kids. Planning takes most of my time. If I don’t plan, your child doesn’t get an engaging, meaningful lesson. The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress.

Lunch duty is written into my contract. If I don’t go, all that will happen is I will get written up. I care about my job, so being defiant isn’t going to work for me.

There’s nothing to give up. The only thing that doesn’t have a rigid due date is my grading, so it is last priority. It has to be. I’m already working instead of eating my lunch. I’m already working instead of taking a much-needed break. (I don’t get 10 minutes at a water cooler to just chat with colleagues.) I work as I wait for meetings to start. I use my time very effectively and still can’t get my job done in the 55 hours I allow each week. I got it done when I was working 70, but that’s not happening anymore.

If there were a solution, I would have already thought of it. I’m very good at what I do. The truth is teachers are too overburdened. We need to be responsible for fewer classes during the day so we have more time. Period.

Here's your issue: "The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress."
This relentless measuring/testing focus on SOLs and all the other junk tests is a colossal waste of both teacher and student time, and as a parent I frankly want teachers to just teach instead of spending lots of time with this. If you compare now to a generation ago, this is the main time sink that creeped into classrooms, especially when combined with technological tool nonsense that gives minimal added value.

So you don't need anymore data than what you already get when you grade assignments, as that tells you who is and isn't doing well. Additionally, after your first year and assuming you're reteaching the same grade or class, lesson planning should mainly be reusing what worked well last year.

You need to realize who is in a power position and who is not. The people who evaluate me and renew my contract have the ability to make my life very difficult. Teachers “standing up to administrators” doesn’t always work the way you think it does.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a long-standing problem in FCPS with terrible consequences for students. But most teachers, particularly those who post here, will be incredibly defensive about it. They, quite frankly, do not seem to think that grading is important enough to prioritize over other tasks. And administrators must agree because there is never any change.

I'd lodge concerns, in writing, to the counselor and principle, but do not expect any change.

Which task should we drop so we can grade? Should I drop planning lessons? That means I won’t be ready when your child shows up in my classroom on Monday. Should I drop logging and analyzing student data? That means I’ll have no idea how well your child is doing over them. Maybe I should drop parking lot duty and cafeteria duty, even though my contract dictates that I am responsible for fulfilling them. Maybe I should drop answering the tsunami of parent and student emails I get each day, or I should refuse to go to IEP meetings.

I get less than an hour of work time each day. I usually have over 5 hours of work to do. There’s the math and that’s the reason grading takes a while.

If you want more timely feedback, then join teachers in the fight for more reasonable workloads. I’ve worked 6 hours already today, on a Saturday. I’m nowhere near done.

The teachers here who refuse to work on weekends have the right idea. They are forcing an appropriate work/life balance while I’ll burn out and quit.

Proving the OPs point. Sorry your job sucks. But that doesn’t change the fact that grading isn’t happening and childrens education is suffering because of it.

If teachers’ jobs suck, if teachers are suffering, then “children’s education suffering” does seem a likely outcome. Do you expect teachers to suffer even more for the “sake of the kids?” Oh no no. This is a job, my friend. Those of us who have been beaten down by the likes of you and yours have no incentive to try and martyr ourselves for ungrateful folks who *expect* us to do sacrifice our own personal lives as a matter of course.

+1, I’m not working more hours than I already am for “the sake of the kids.” If they are suffering that is the parents problem. I’m working 50 hours a week and that’s my limit. No it’s in the parents to find the solution or pressure FCPS to find one.

So you aren't grading work, knowing it adversely affects children, in an effort to pressure admin to do something? You are using the kids to further your efforts to enact change. How did you feel about the asylum seekers being shipped to Martha's Vineyard?

They aren’t going to give hours and hours (yes, it takes that long) of their unpaid personal time to grade “for the chiiiiiiildrrreeeeen.” Deal with it.

Teacher here. This is the answer right here. I spent years working all day every day. I missed my own children’s performances, meets, and games. I delayed doctor appointments. I missed dinners with extended family. I even cancelled a family trip once. I lost ten years because I prioritized my job over my life.

I’m not doing it anymore. The choice is between demanding a work/life balance and quitting. Papers will be returned eventually.

Why not choose to not do other parts of your job, ones that don't affect the kids? Refuse the stupid admin meeting. Refuse lunch or drop off duty. Yes, that's more difficult to refuse those, but they will be more effective in getting your point across because admin will be directly impacted. Right now, the kids suffer and admin doesn't care so nothing will change and kids continue to be hurt.

That’s the problem: ALL aspects of my job affect the kids. Planning takes most of my time. If I don’t plan, your child doesn’t get an engaging, meaningful lesson. The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress.

Lunch duty is written into my contract. If I don’t go, all that will happen is I will get written up. I care about my job, so being defiant isn’t going to work for me.

There’s nothing to give up. The only thing that doesn’t have a rigid due date is my grading, so it is last priority. It has to be. I’m already working instead of eating my lunch. I’m already working instead of taking a much-needed break. (I don’t get 10 minutes at a water cooler to just chat with colleagues.) I work as I wait for meetings to start. I use my time very effectively and still can’t get my job done in the 55 hours I allow each week. I got it done when I was working 70, but that’s not happening anymore.

If there were a solution, I would have already thought of it. I’m very good at what I do. The truth is teachers are too overburdened. We need to be responsible for fewer classes during the day so we have more time. Period.

Here's your issue: "The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress."
This relentless measuring/testing focus on SOLs and all the other junk tests is a colossal waste of both teacher and student time, and as a parent I frankly want teachers to just teach instead of spending lots of time with this. If you compare now to a generation ago, this is the main time sink that creeped into classrooms, especially when combined with technological tool nonsense that gives minimal added value.

So you don't need anymore data than what you already get when you grade assignments, as that tells you who is and isn't doing well. Additionally, after your first year and assuming you're reteaching the same grade or class, lesson planning should mainly be reusing what worked well last year.

I’m assuming you are not a teacher? This post reads as if it was written by somebody who doesn’t actually understand how teaching works. I’ll start with your argument that teaching the same content every year somehow reduces planning. It doesn’t. Teachers revise lessons each year. We have to because students are huge walking variables and what worked last year may not work for the new group. Also, what we did last year may not have worked in the first place. We don’t just plan content. We plan delivery. Also, many teachers are moved around a lot. I have taught 13 different courses in my career. That’s 13 new curricula I had to make my own.

Also, yes… I do have to care about data. These tests are only “junk tests” and a “colossal waste” of time if I do what you suggest, which appears to be to ignore them. Like it or not, they are here to stay. Blowing them off is not in your child’s best interest. If I plan accordingly, though, I can find meaningful ways to work this data back into my lessons. Your student, therefore, won’t be wasting time in class because I spent sufficient time at home to make sure we don’t have to.

I spent ALL of my time in class “just teaching.” I spend MOST of my time at home planning. I spent SOME time at home grading. This is the reality of a teacher’s life. You may think there are solutions when you look in from the outside, but I promise you there is nothing you can suggest that teachers haven’t already tried.

The only solution is to reduce workload. Those of us within the profession know this.

I do teach, and what I've suggested has worked well for me. Earlier posters suggesting that teachers focus on teaching and ignore the 'fluff' stuff such as admin meetings that don't have a point are right, that's one thing you can do now if the admins refuse to reduce the load, even though it will piss them off. What you described above sounds good, but in real life is pretty useless for many kids. Anecdotally, any and all tests my kid does in school are a complete waste of time, time that could have been better used by giving them more challenging things to do/learn. I'm sure I'm far from the only one here. There is a large pool of kids who are simply bored of the whole nonsense that is called testing/tracking/measuring/endless amounts of time. You're not really helping those kids in any way and adding extra work for yourself by participating in the never ending testing/measuring nonsense. Yes it sucks that they make you do it, but teachers just have to stand up and pick their fight together against the massive admin bureaucracy. The real issue is that teachers are unable to effectively band with parents and together commit to simply teaching kids and ignoring all of the extra crap that they make you do that is not related to teaching. Also, what you've described above is not necessary, because if indeed you spend ALL 100% of the time teaching as you said, you should already know how each kid is doing over the course of each week.

You do not need to spend incredible amounts of time replanning your lessons, in the same subject. Let's say you taught geometry one year, you have almost everything you need the second time around, you only need to redo stuff that didn't work well. Geometry doesn't change and kids entering your classroom on average don't change year over year.

Hear, hear. But the bolded portion will never happen because teachers want parents to advocate for them while they are actively not teaching kids (grading is part of teaching). Why would I band together with teachers who have decided educating my kids is less important than admin fluff? That gives me zero assurance that they'll actually start grading if the admin fluff is reduced.

Literally every teacher wants less admin stuff. They also don’t want to get fired. So parents should band with teachers to reduce our workload because then your kid will benefit. I do not understand how parents do not get this. Better working conditions for teachers will benefit students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is an ongoing issue and I'm not a teacher hater, I respect teachers, but this happens consistently in my experience with high school.

Last year, my child received a poor grade for the quarter and the teacher contacted us with concerns about the student's performance -- this was once the quarter was over. I asked how does it get to this point? Shouldn't there have obvious signs the quarter wasn't going well? Teacher didn't know until after the quarter was done as the grades weren't done until the end of the quarter and she assumed everything was okay since the kid did fine the previous quarter.

Grading should happen consistently and timely throughout a quarter so that kids know where they stand, parents can check in and see what's going on, and teachers know if they need to course adjust.

I don't expect grading to happen instantaneously, but it should happen within a week of an assignment being handed in or a test being completed.

Color me surprised. You have a graduate degree? In what? From where? Who would have thought?

You all don’t realize that all teachers would like to focus on teaching. We really would. Unfortunately we are a free and easily used labor source for administration and end up as the duct tape that makes schools which don’t have enough counselors, security guards, substitute teachers, or test administrators — keep running. I have little to no time outside of class to plan and grade and I am unwilling to use my weekends or evenings to do extra work. I’m not paid near enough to be working 70 hour weeks.

In any case, you might try to suck it up and appreciate whatever feedback and attention you get, when you get it. You might feel entitled to certain “services” from your teacher but what are you going to do if you don’t get what you think you should get? If you complain to administration, you can bet that you will not be winning the affection of your kid’s teacher and you are probably hastening the teacher exodus.

I'm the person you quoted.

I don't complain, never said I complained. Your attitude stinks and if you can't understand why not grading in a timely fashion is a problem then you are in the wrong career.

The teachers on this site complain ad nauseum about how parents don't do enough, blah, blah, blah, but if work isn't graded, how am I supposed to know my student isn't doing well or how I can help? You tell us repeatedly we should not email the teachers as they don't have enough time to answer.

So tell me, exactly how do I support my student when I don't know how they are doing in class?

Teachers don't really want us to support our students. Teachers want us to support THEM, the teachers, with the vague promise that they can then help our students. It feels like a racket: "You got a nice kid here, would be shame if they didn't get properly educated..."

Sigh. Teachers don’t want you to support your students? You don’t have students. You have children. We absolutely do want you to support your children - the more support you give them, the more likely they are to realize their potential.

The emphasis on *constant* evaluation and grading of individual student work is not healthy for students and not feasible for some teachers with their class loads. I imagine math teachers churn out the grades quickly, but grading is a more time consuming and subjective process for humanities teachers whose main goal is to keep the students reading, writing, and learning.

You seem like a very young parent or a not well educated one.

I have two adult children who went through FCPS K-12. I have a graduate degree. Stop insulting parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a long-standing problem in FCPS with terrible consequences for students. But most teachers, particularly those who post here, will be incredibly defensive about it. They, quite frankly, do not seem to think that grading is important enough to prioritize over other tasks. And administrators must agree because there is never any change.

I'd lodge concerns, in writing, to the counselor and principle, but do not expect any change.

Which task should we drop so we can grade? Should I drop planning lessons? That means I won’t be ready when your child shows up in my classroom on Monday. Should I drop logging and analyzing student data? That means I’ll have no idea how well your child is doing over them. Maybe I should drop parking lot duty and cafeteria duty, even though my contract dictates that I am responsible for fulfilling them. Maybe I should drop answering the tsunami of parent and student emails I get each day, or I should refuse to go to IEP meetings.

I get less than an hour of work time each day. I usually have over 5 hours of work to do. There’s the math and that’s the reason grading takes a while.

If you want more timely feedback, then join teachers in the fight for more reasonable workloads. I’ve worked 6 hours already today, on a Saturday. I’m nowhere near done.

The teachers here who refuse to work on weekends have the right idea. They are forcing an appropriate work/life balance while I’ll burn out and quit.

Proving the OPs point. Sorry your job sucks. But that doesn’t change the fact that grading isn’t happening and childrens education is suffering because of it.

If teachers’ jobs suck, if teachers are suffering, then “children’s education suffering” does seem a likely outcome. Do you expect teachers to suffer even more for the “sake of the kids?” Oh no no. This is a job, my friend. Those of us who have been beaten down by the likes of you and yours have no incentive to try and martyr ourselves for ungrateful folks who *expect* us to do sacrifice our own personal lives as a matter of course.

+1, I’m not working more hours than I already am for “the sake of the kids.” If they are suffering that is the parents problem. I’m working 50 hours a week and that’s my limit. No it’s in the parents to find the solution or pressure FCPS to find one.

So you aren't grading work, knowing it adversely affects children, in an effort to pressure admin to do something? You are using the kids to further your efforts to enact change. How did you feel about the asylum seekers being shipped to Martha's Vineyard?

They aren’t going to give hours and hours (yes, it takes that long) of their unpaid personal time to grade “for the chiiiiiiildrrreeeeen.” Deal with it.

Teacher here. This is the answer right here. I spent years working all day every day. I missed my own children’s performances, meets, and games. I delayed doctor appointments. I missed dinners with extended family. I even cancelled a family trip once. I lost ten years because I prioritized my job over my life.

I’m not doing it anymore. The choice is between demanding a work/life balance and quitting. Papers will be returned eventually.

Why not choose to not do other parts of your job, ones that don't affect the kids? Refuse the stupid admin meeting. Refuse lunch or drop off duty. Yes, that's more difficult to refuse those, but they will be more effective in getting your point across because admin will be directly impacted. Right now, the kids suffer and admin doesn't care so nothing will change and kids continue to be hurt.

That’s the problem: ALL aspects of my job affect the kids. Planning takes most of my time. If I don’t plan, your child doesn’t get an engaging, meaningful lesson. The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress.

Lunch duty is written into my contract. If I don’t go, all that will happen is I will get written up. I care about my job, so being defiant isn’t going to work for me.

There’s nothing to give up. The only thing that doesn’t have a rigid due date is my grading, so it is last priority. It has to be. I’m already working instead of eating my lunch. I’m already working instead of taking a much-needed break. (I don’t get 10 minutes at a water cooler to just chat with colleagues.) I work as I wait for meetings to start. I use my time very effectively and still can’t get my job done in the 55 hours I allow each week. I got it done when I was working 70, but that’s not happening anymore.

If there were a solution, I would have already thought of it. I’m very good at what I do. The truth is teachers are too overburdened. We need to be responsible for fewer classes during the day so we have more time. Period.

Here's your issue: "The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress."
This relentless measuring/testing focus on SOLs and all the other junk tests is a colossal waste of both teacher and student time, and as a parent I frankly want teachers to just teach instead of spending lots of time with this. If you compare now to a generation ago, this is the main time sink that creeped into classrooms, especially when combined with technological tool nonsense that gives minimal added value.

So you don't need anymore data than what you already get when you grade assignments, as that tells you who is and isn't doing well. Additionally, after your first year and assuming you're reteaching the same grade or class, lesson planning should mainly be reusing what worked well last year.

I’m assuming you are not a teacher? This post reads as if it was written by somebody who doesn’t actually understand how teaching works. I’ll start with your argument that teaching the same content every year somehow reduces planning. It doesn’t. Teachers revise lessons each year. We have to because students are huge walking variables and what worked last year may not work for the new group. Also, what we did last year may not have worked in the first place. We don’t just plan content. We plan delivery. Also, many teachers are moved around a lot. I have taught 13 different courses in my career. That’s 13 new curricula I had to make my own.

Also, yes… I do have to care about data. These tests are only “junk tests” and a “colossal waste” of time if I do what you suggest, which appears to be to ignore them. Like it or not, they are here to stay. Blowing them off is not in your child’s best interest. If I plan accordingly, though, I can find meaningful ways to work this data back into my lessons. Your student, therefore, won’t be wasting time in class because I spent sufficient time at home to make sure we don’t have to.

I spent ALL of my time in class “just teaching.” I spend MOST of my time at home planning. I spent SOME time at home grading. This is the reality of a teacher’s life. You may think there are solutions when you look in from the outside, but I promise you there is nothing you can suggest that teachers haven’t already tried.

The only solution is to reduce workload. Those of us within the profession know this.

I do teach, and what I've suggested has worked well for me. Earlier posters suggesting that teachers focus on teaching and ignore the 'fluff' stuff such as admin meetings that don't have a point are right, that's one thing you can do now if the admins refuse to reduce the load, even though it will piss them off. What you described above sounds good, but in real life is pretty useless for many kids. Anecdotally, any and all tests my kid does in school are a complete waste of time, time that could have been better used by giving them more challenging things to do/learn. I'm sure I'm far from the only one here. There is a large pool of kids who are simply bored of the whole nonsense that is called testing/tracking/measuring/endless amounts of time. You're not really helping those kids in any way and adding extra work for yourself by participating in the never ending testing/measuring nonsense. Yes it sucks that they make you do it, but teachers just have to stand up and pick their fight together against the massive admin bureaucracy. The real issue is that teachers are unable to effectively band with parents and together commit to simply teaching kids and ignoring all of the extra crap that they make you do that is not related to teaching. Also, what you've described above is not necessary, because if indeed you spend ALL 100% of the time teaching as you said, you should already know how each kid is doing over the course of each week.

You do not need to spend incredible amounts of time replanning your lessons, in the same subject. Let's say you taught geometry one year, you have almost everything you need the second time around, you only need to redo stuff that didn't work well. Geometry doesn't change and kids entering your classroom on average don't change year over year.

I’m still not convinced you are a teacher. You are oversimplifying the job in a way that no teacher would.

You hate tests. I get it. I’m not a fan of them, either, but they are a part of my job and I PAID by those who demand them. You keep writing that teachers should band together with parents. Perhaps parents should band together with teachers? I would never walk into somebody else’s job and presume I know how they can do it better. I wouldn’t even walk into a Math teacher’s room to tell them how to teach better because I know their job is different than mine, simply because we teach different disciplines. You don’t know enough of my circumstances (my curricula, my testing requirements, my classroom-based assessments, etc.) to make any statement about what I should or should not do.

Yes, I’m overwhelmed. State testing is a small, small, small part of the reason why. This thread is about why grading takes too long. You have created reasons that aren’t actually the cause. The cause is too many students, too many classes, and not enough time to plan and grade. It’s that simple. A teacher I know in Germany teaches for roughly 30% of her work week. I teach for 88%. Guess who has more time to get things done?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a long-standing problem in FCPS with terrible consequences for students. But most teachers, particularly those who post here, will be incredibly defensive about it. They, quite frankly, do not seem to think that grading is important enough to prioritize over other tasks. And administrators must agree because there is never any change.

I'd lodge concerns, in writing, to the counselor and principle, but do not expect any change.

Which task should we drop so we can grade? Should I drop planning lessons? That means I won’t be ready when your child shows up in my classroom on Monday. Should I drop logging and analyzing student data? That means I’ll have no idea how well your child is doing over them. Maybe I should drop parking lot duty and cafeteria duty, even though my contract dictates that I am responsible for fulfilling them. Maybe I should drop answering the tsunami of parent and student emails I get each day, or I should refuse to go to IEP meetings.

I get less than an hour of work time each day. I usually have over 5 hours of work to do. There’s the math and that’s the reason grading takes a while.

If you want more timely feedback, then join teachers in the fight for more reasonable workloads. I’ve worked 6 hours already today, on a Saturday. I’m nowhere near done.

The teachers here who refuse to work on weekends have the right idea. They are forcing an appropriate work/life balance while I’ll burn out and quit.

Proving the OPs point. Sorry your job sucks. But that doesn’t change the fact that grading isn’t happening and childrens education is suffering because of it.

If teachers’ jobs suck, if teachers are suffering, then “children’s education suffering” does seem a likely outcome. Do you expect teachers to suffer even more for the “sake of the kids?” Oh no no. This is a job, my friend. Those of us who have been beaten down by the likes of you and yours have no incentive to try and martyr ourselves for ungrateful folks who *expect* us to do sacrifice our own personal lives as a matter of course.

+1, I’m not working more hours than I already am for “the sake of the kids.” If they are suffering that is the parents problem. I’m working 50 hours a week and that’s my limit. No it’s in the parents to find the solution or pressure FCPS to find one.

So you aren't grading work, knowing it adversely affects children, in an effort to pressure admin to do something? You are using the kids to further your efforts to enact change. How did you feel about the asylum seekers being shipped to Martha's Vineyard?

They aren’t going to give hours and hours (yes, it takes that long) of their unpaid personal time to grade “for the chiiiiiiildrrreeeeen.” Deal with it.

Teacher here. This is the answer right here. I spent years working all day every day. I missed my own children’s performances, meets, and games. I delayed doctor appointments. I missed dinners with extended family. I even cancelled a family trip once. I lost ten years because I prioritized my job over my life.

I’m not doing it anymore. The choice is between demanding a work/life balance and quitting. Papers will be returned eventually.

Why not choose to not do other parts of your job, ones that don't affect the kids? Refuse the stupid admin meeting. Refuse lunch or drop off duty. Yes, that's more difficult to refuse those, but they will be more effective in getting your point across because admin will be directly impacted. Right now, the kids suffer and admin doesn't care so nothing will change and kids continue to be hurt.

That’s the problem: ALL aspects of my job affect the kids. Planning takes most of my time. If I don’t plan, your child doesn’t get an engaging, meaningful lesson. The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress.

Lunch duty is written into my contract. If I don’t go, all that will happen is I will get written up. I care about my job, so being defiant isn’t going to work for me.

There’s nothing to give up. The only thing that doesn’t have a rigid due date is my grading, so it is last priority. It has to be. I’m already working instead of eating my lunch. I’m already working instead of taking a much-needed break. (I don’t get 10 minutes at a water cooler to just chat with colleagues.) I work as I wait for meetings to start. I use my time very effectively and still can’t get my job done in the 55 hours I allow each week. I got it done when I was working 70, but that’s not happening anymore.

If there were a solution, I would have already thought of it. I’m very good at what I do. The truth is teachers are too overburdened. We need to be responsible for fewer classes during the day so we have more time. Period.

Here's your issue: "The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress."
This relentless measuring/testing focus on SOLs and all the other junk tests is a colossal waste of both teacher and student time, and as a parent I frankly want teachers to just teach instead of spending lots of time with this. If you compare now to a generation ago, this is the main time sink that creeped into classrooms, especially when combined with technological tool nonsense that gives minimal added value.

So you don't need anymore data than what you already get when you grade assignments, as that tells you who is and isn't doing well. Additionally, after your first year and assuming you're reteaching the same grade or class, lesson planning should mainly be reusing what worked well last year.

I’m assuming you are not a teacher? This post reads as if it was written by somebody who doesn’t actually understand how teaching works. I’ll start with your argument that teaching the same content every year somehow reduces planning. It doesn’t. Teachers revise lessons each year. We have to because students are huge walking variables and what worked last year may not work for the new group. Also, what we did last year may not have worked in the first place. We don’t just plan content. We plan delivery. Also, many teachers are moved around a lot. I have taught 13 different courses in my career. That’s 13 new curricula I had to make my own.

Also, yes… I do have to care about data. These tests are only “junk tests” and a “colossal waste” of time if I do what you suggest, which appears to be to ignore them. Like it or not, they are here to stay. Blowing them off is not in your child’s best interest. If I plan accordingly, though, I can find meaningful ways to work this data back into my lessons. Your student, therefore, won’t be wasting time in class because I spent sufficient time at home to make sure we don’t have to.

I spent ALL of my time in class “just teaching.” I spend MOST of my time at home planning. I spent SOME time at home grading. This is the reality of a teacher’s life. You may think there are solutions when you look in from the outside, but I promise you there is nothing you can suggest that teachers haven’t already tried.

The only solution is to reduce workload. Those of us within the profession know this.

I do teach, and what I've suggested has worked well for me. Earlier posters suggesting that teachers focus on teaching and ignore the 'fluff' stuff such as admin meetings that don't have a point are right, that's one thing you can do now if the admins refuse to reduce the load, even though it will piss them off. What you described above sounds good, but in real life is pretty useless for many kids. Anecdotally, any and all tests my kid does in school are a complete waste of time, time that could have been better used by giving them more challenging things to do/learn. I'm sure I'm far from the only one here. There is a large pool of kids who are simply bored of the whole nonsense that is called testing/tracking/measuring/endless amounts of time. You're not really helping those kids in any way and adding extra work for yourself by participating in the never ending testing/measuring nonsense. Yes it sucks that they make you do it, but teachers just have to stand up and pick their fight together against the massive admin bureaucracy. The real issue is that teachers are unable to effectively band with parents and together commit to simply teaching kids and ignoring all of the extra crap that they make you do that is not related to teaching. Also, what you've described above is not necessary, because if indeed you spend ALL 100% of the time teaching as you said, you should already know how each kid is doing over the course of each week.

You do not need to spend incredible amounts of time replanning your lessons, in the same subject. Let's say you taught geometry one year, you have almost everything you need the second time around, you only need to redo stuff that didn't work well. Geometry doesn't change and kids entering your classroom on average don't change year over year.

Hear, hear. But the bolded portion will never happen because teachers want parents to advocate for them while they are actively not teaching kids (grading is part of teaching). Why would I band together with teachers who have decided educating my kids is less important than admin fluff? That gives me zero assurance that they'll actually start grading if the admin fluff is reduced.

Literally every teacher wants less admin stuff. They also don’t want to get fired. So parents should band with teachers to reduce our workload because then your kid will benefit. I do not understand how parents do not get this. Better working conditions for teachers will benefit students.

Different poster here.

I think the person you are responding to has a simplified view of our work day and doesn’t really understand the pressures placed on teachers. That “admin fluff” is part of our contract. We can’t throw tantrums and refuse to do it. We also know that the “admin fluff” keeps the school operating. There are only a finite amount of adults in a school building. We are all busy… all day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a long-standing problem in FCPS with terrible consequences for students. But most teachers, particularly those who post here, will be incredibly defensive about it. They, quite frankly, do not seem to think that grading is important enough to prioritize over other tasks. And administrators must agree because there is never any change.

I'd lodge concerns, in writing, to the counselor and principle, but do not expect any change.

Which task should we drop so we can grade? Should I drop planning lessons? That means I won’t be ready when your child shows up in my classroom on Monday. Should I drop logging and analyzing student data? That means I’ll have no idea how well your child is doing over them. Maybe I should drop parking lot duty and cafeteria duty, even though my contract dictates that I am responsible for fulfilling them. Maybe I should drop answering the tsunami of parent and student emails I get each day, or I should refuse to go to IEP meetings.

I get less than an hour of work time each day. I usually have over 5 hours of work to do. There’s the math and that’s the reason grading takes a while.

If you want more timely feedback, then join teachers in the fight for more reasonable workloads. I’ve worked 6 hours already today, on a Saturday. I’m nowhere near done.

The teachers here who refuse to work on weekends have the right idea. They are forcing an appropriate work/life balance while I’ll burn out and quit.

Proving the OPs point. Sorry your job sucks. But that doesn’t change the fact that grading isn’t happening and childrens education is suffering because of it.

If teachers’ jobs suck, if teachers are suffering, then “children’s education suffering” does seem a likely outcome. Do you expect teachers to suffer even more for the “sake of the kids?” Oh no no. This is a job, my friend. Those of us who have been beaten down by the likes of you and yours have no incentive to try and martyr ourselves for ungrateful folks who *expect* us to do sacrifice our own personal lives as a matter of course.

+1, I’m not working more hours than I already am for “the sake of the kids.” If they are suffering that is the parents problem. I’m working 50 hours a week and that’s my limit. No it’s in the parents to find the solution or pressure FCPS to find one.

So you aren't grading work, knowing it adversely affects children, in an effort to pressure admin to do something? You are using the kids to further your efforts to enact change. How did you feel about the asylum seekers being shipped to Martha's Vineyard?

They aren’t going to give hours and hours (yes, it takes that long) of their unpaid personal time to grade “for the chiiiiiiildrrreeeeen.” Deal with it.

Teacher here. This is the answer right here. I spent years working all day every day. I missed my own children’s performances, meets, and games. I delayed doctor appointments. I missed dinners with extended family. I even cancelled a family trip once. I lost ten years because I prioritized my job over my life.

I’m not doing it anymore. The choice is between demanding a work/life balance and quitting. Papers will be returned eventually.

Why not choose to not do other parts of your job, ones that don't affect the kids? Refuse the stupid admin meeting. Refuse lunch or drop off duty. Yes, that's more difficult to refuse those, but they will be more effective in getting your point across because admin will be directly impacted. Right now, the kids suffer and admin doesn't care so nothing will change and kids continue to be hurt.

That’s the problem: ALL aspects of my job affect the kids. Planning takes most of my time. If I don’t plan, your child doesn’t get an engaging, meaningful lesson. The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress.

Lunch duty is written into my contract. If I don’t go, all that will happen is I will get written up. I care about my job, so being defiant isn’t going to work for me.

There’s nothing to give up. The only thing that doesn’t have a rigid due date is my grading, so it is last priority. It has to be. I’m already working instead of eating my lunch. I’m already working instead of taking a much-needed break. (I don’t get 10 minutes at a water cooler to just chat with colleagues.) I work as I wait for meetings to start. I use my time very effectively and still can’t get my job done in the 55 hours I allow each week. I got it done when I was working 70, but that’s not happening anymore.

If there were a solution, I would have already thought of it. I’m very good at what I do. The truth is teachers are too overburdened. We need to be responsible for fewer classes during the day so we have more time. Period.

Here's your issue: "The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress."
This relentless measuring/testing focus on SOLs and all the other junk tests is a colossal waste of both teacher and student time, and as a parent I frankly want teachers to just teach instead of spending lots of time with this. If you compare now to a generation ago, this is the main time sink that creeped into classrooms, especially when combined with technological tool nonsense that gives minimal added value.

So you don't need anymore data than what you already get when you grade assignments, as that tells you who is and isn't doing well. Additionally, after your first year and assuming you're reteaching the same grade or class, lesson planning should mainly be reusing what worked well last year.

You need to realize who is in a power position and who is not. The people who evaluate me and renew my contract have the ability to make my life very difficult. Teachers “standing up to administrators” doesn’t always work the way you think it does.

I understand this of course, you are risking getting fired. Yet anyway many, many teachers are already thinking of leaving the profession because they are no longer left alone to teach, which was the original reason they got into teaching to pursue their interest and passion! In that case, it's better to do what you believe is right and take that risk if it means a chance to change things, i.e change the current culture of disrespect toward teachers in this country. If you have to fight and get parents on your side, and if ultimately it does unfortunately result in being forced to leave, so be it. This is what I would do, certainly if I was a young teacher, frustrated with the lack of support, sometimes even inhumane treatment depending on the school, and usually low pay. The situation is already demoralizingly bad, why not leave without fighting for something good if it has to come to that?

Personally, as a parent and teacher, I think it would be very easy to change this culture (certainly at some schools where there is a lot of parent involvement). The main issue right now are:

1) Many teachers who started a long time ago when things were better now have families and are simply scared to lose their job (and for good reason!)

2) Many young, energetic, passionate teachers who would have stood up to the system wisely decided it's best to leave the profession early while they still have choices rather than choose to fight for the profession.

3) Many parents are sadly clueless to what is really going on in our schools, for various reasons: Some don't care about learning and uninvolved in their children's education, some are entitled a$$holes to all people, others are plain ignorant/gullible and believe all the corporate admin doublespeak lingo that even teachers are forced to say (for instance even at recent back to school nights ), and others know/feel that their children are barely learning much in 7 hrs but are too jaded to conceive of a less broken system so they accept it.

Admins meanwhile have the power and money to sell out the teaching profession to consultants and technology companies, i.e corporations who only care about profit, in this case significant amounts of money that could have been used on teachers . If you don't believe this, just try looking at how much time is spent talking about tools and software, more than teachers themselves. Teachers are already considered secondary to technology in the classrooms, and THAT is very scary and telling at the same time. Effectively, teachers cannot stand up for their profession. But if a significant number of parents band together and complain AND teachers are on their side, i.e agree with them on issues, the admins have very little choice; they have to listen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Stand up for the teachers. The reason they aren’t grassing work quickly is because they have to cover other teacher’s classes during their planning periods.

The ones who can't do their jobs had other excuses when they weren't covering other teachers' classes. It's really quite ridiculous and just breeds cynicism and a lack of respect on the part of students when teachers can't get their act together to post grades on a timely basis.

Is grading and posting grades more labor intensive now than they were in the 80s? Is it lack of time during the school day to grade work? Genuinely curious. We had larger classes where I went to school and teachers turn homework and tests around quicker. My MS and HS kid don’t get many assignments back u til after the unit tests or quizzes on the test topics. And much of what is returned isn’t actually checked for accuracy — just that work was done.

It is different because teachers have way more responsibilities than before. The amount of forced meetings, trainings, PD, admin tasks takes time away from grading and planning. This is a major reason why teachers are leaving. There is very little autonomy. I think if the county did the following there would be less burnout.

90 min planning blocks daily
Class Size Caps of 25
Stop CLTS and let teachers choose to meet and plan together.
Unencumbered TWD

I don’t teach high school, I teach Upper ES and can tell you I am drowning in work. I have 5 hours a week of planning and only 3 that are not in CLT meetings. 3 hours is not a lot to plan, grade, email parents, etc. I come in early every morning and do a few hours on Sunday. I have been teaching for awhile so luckily planning has become easier, but what teachers need is time.

That plan would be great. The CT meetings are terrible and such a time suck.

Also, I would specify that administrators cannot require teachers to use their planning time for non-teaching activities.

ES school teacher here..drowning as well. I barely get my planning time and so many assessments and meetings on top of parent calls and emails. Three out of my five days of planning time have CLTs at the same time. WE need time!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a long-standing problem in FCPS with terrible consequences for students. But most teachers, particularly those who post here, will be incredibly defensive about it. They, quite frankly, do not seem to think that grading is important enough to prioritize over other tasks. And administrators must agree because there is never any change.

I'd lodge concerns, in writing, to the counselor and principle, but do not expect any change.

Which task should we drop so we can grade? Should I drop planning lessons? That means I won’t be ready when your child shows up in my classroom on Monday. Should I drop logging and analyzing student data? That means I’ll have no idea how well your child is doing over them. Maybe I should drop parking lot duty and cafeteria duty, even though my contract dictates that I am responsible for fulfilling them. Maybe I should drop answering the tsunami of parent and student emails I get each day, or I should refuse to go to IEP meetings.

I get less than an hour of work time each day. I usually have over 5 hours of work to do. There’s the math and that’s the reason grading takes a while.

If you want more timely feedback, then join teachers in the fight for more reasonable workloads. I’ve worked 6 hours already today, on a Saturday. I’m nowhere near done.

The teachers here who refuse to work on weekends have the right idea. They are forcing an appropriate work/life balance while I’ll burn out and quit.

Proving the OPs point. Sorry your job sucks. But that doesn’t change the fact that grading isn’t happening and childrens education is suffering because of it.

If teachers’ jobs suck, if teachers are suffering, then “children’s education suffering” does seem a likely outcome. Do you expect teachers to suffer even more for the “sake of the kids?” Oh no no. This is a job, my friend. Those of us who have been beaten down by the likes of you and yours have no incentive to try and martyr ourselves for ungrateful folks who *expect* us to do sacrifice our own personal lives as a matter of course.

+1, I’m not working more hours than I already am for “the sake of the kids.” If they are suffering that is the parents problem. I’m working 50 hours a week and that’s my limit. No it’s in the parents to find the solution or pressure FCPS to find one.

So you aren't grading work, knowing it adversely affects children, in an effort to pressure admin to do something? You are using the kids to further your efforts to enact change. How did you feel about the asylum seekers being shipped to Martha's Vineyard?

No.

Nobody is hurting kids on purpose to make a political point. The point is that we CAN’T prioritize reading and evaluating student work over what we are mandated to do. Teachers have to go to MANY more IEP meetings than we did 20 years ago. We spend hours more per week managing parent email correspondence. We have requirements for our own evaluations that are literally 20 times more work than they were 20 years ago. We are asked to cover classes when subs are gone, or cover things like lunch duty and bus duty, way more than we used to. Our classes sizes are significantly larger. It’s always more, more, more. Nothing is take off our plates. So, if I have to put off reading the stays for another week because I am drowning, I have to put it off to stay afloat. What I put first is lesson planning. Engaging students when I have them with me. Everything else is triage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is an ongoing issue and I'm not a teacher hater, I respect teachers, but this happens consistently in my experience with high school.

Last year, my child received a poor grade for the quarter and the teacher contacted us with concerns about the student's performance -- this was once the quarter was over. I asked how does it get to this point? Shouldn't there have obvious signs the quarter wasn't going well? Teacher didn't know until after the quarter was done as the grades weren't done until the end of the quarter and she assumed everything was okay since the kid did fine the previous quarter.

Grading should happen consistently and timely throughout a quarter so that kids know where they stand, parents can check in and see what's going on, and teachers know if they need to course adjust.

I don't expect grading to happen instantaneously, but it should happen within a week of an assignment being handed in or a test being completed.

If you expect assignments to be read and evaluated within a week, please start a group of parents to raise taxes to improve teacher salaries and employ more teachers in order to keep out class sizes lower than 125-150 for Hugh school teachers. Please so the simple math here. One minute per student? 3 minutes per student? Take a guess how long it takes to grade an essay. Now multiply that by how many students. Now so the math on time teachers have to do this…with maybe 1-2 hours of unencumbered planning time per WEEK.

I quit being a high school English teacher because I still have nightmares about ungraded stacks of essays, and my last year teaching HS was 1999. I worked at least 20 hours a week beyond contract time. It is structurally impossible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is an ongoing issue and I'm not a teacher hater, I respect teachers, but this happens consistently in my experience with high school.

Last year, my child received a poor grade for the quarter and the teacher contacted us with concerns about the student's performance -- this was once the quarter was over. I asked how does it get to this point? Shouldn't there have obvious signs the quarter wasn't going well? Teacher didn't know until after the quarter was done as the grades weren't done until the end of the quarter and she assumed everything was okay since the kid did fine the previous quarter.

Grading should happen consistently and timely throughout a quarter so that kids know where they stand, parents can check in and see what's going on, and teachers know if they need to course adjust.

I don't expect grading to happen instantaneously, but it should happen within a week of an assignment being handed in or a test being completed.

If you expect assignments to be read and evaluated within a week, please start a group of parents to raise taxes to improve teacher salaries and employ more teachers in order to keep out class sizes lower than 125-150 for Hugh school teachers. Please so the simple math here. One minute per student? 3 minutes per student? Take a guess how long it takes to grade an essay. Now multiply that by how many students. Now so the math on time teachers have to do this…with maybe 1-2 hours of unencumbered planning time per WEEK.

I quit being a high school English teacher because I still have nightmares about ungraded stacks of essays, and my last year teaching HS was 1999. I worked at least 20 hours a week beyond contract time. It is structurally impossible.

+1000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a long-standing problem in FCPS with terrible consequences for students. But most teachers, particularly those who post here, will be incredibly defensive about it. They, quite frankly, do not seem to think that grading is important enough to prioritize over other tasks. And administrators must agree because there is never any change.

I'd lodge concerns, in writing, to the counselor and principle, but do not expect any change.

Which task should we drop so we can grade? Should I drop planning lessons? That means I won’t be ready when your child shows up in my classroom on Monday. Should I drop logging and analyzing student data? That means I’ll have no idea how well your child is doing over them. Maybe I should drop parking lot duty and cafeteria duty, even though my contract dictates that I am responsible for fulfilling them. Maybe I should drop answering the tsunami of parent and student emails I get each day, or I should refuse to go to IEP meetings.

I get less than an hour of work time each day. I usually have over 5 hours of work to do. There’s the math and that’s the reason grading takes a while.

If you want more timely feedback, then join teachers in the fight for more reasonable workloads. I’ve worked 6 hours already today, on a Saturday. I’m nowhere near done.

The teachers here who refuse to work on weekends have the right idea. They are forcing an appropriate work/life balance while I’ll burn out and quit.

Proving the OPs point. Sorry your job sucks. But that doesn’t change the fact that grading isn’t happening and childrens education is suffering because of it.

If teachers’ jobs suck, if teachers are suffering, then “children’s education suffering” does seem a likely outcome. Do you expect teachers to suffer even more for the “sake of the kids?” Oh no no. This is a job, my friend. Those of us who have been beaten down by the likes of you and yours have no incentive to try and martyr ourselves for ungrateful folks who *expect* us to do sacrifice our own personal lives as a matter of course.

+1, I’m not working more hours than I already am for “the sake of the kids.” If they are suffering that is the parents problem. I’m working 50 hours a week and that’s my limit. No it’s in the parents to find the solution or pressure FCPS to find one.

So you aren't grading work, knowing it adversely affects children, in an effort to pressure admin to do something? You are using the kids to further your efforts to enact change. How did you feel about the asylum seekers being shipped to Martha's Vineyard?

They aren’t going to give hours and hours (yes, it takes that long) of their unpaid personal time to grade “for the chiiiiiiildrrreeeeen.” Deal with it.

Teacher here. This is the answer right here. I spent years working all day every day. I missed my own children’s performances, meets, and games. I delayed doctor appointments. I missed dinners with extended family. I even cancelled a family trip once. I lost ten years because I prioritized my job over my life.

I’m not doing it anymore. The choice is between demanding a work/life balance and quitting. Papers will be returned eventually.

Why not choose to not do other parts of your job, ones that don't affect the kids? Refuse the stupid admin meeting. Refuse lunch or drop off duty. Yes, that's more difficult to refuse those, but they will be more effective in getting your point across because admin will be directly impacted. Right now, the kids suffer and admin doesn't care so nothing will change and kids continue to be hurt.

“Suffer?” “Be hurt?” Lady, be grateful for your ridiculously charmed life, because you clearly have NO idea what those words mean.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a long-standing problem in FCPS with terrible consequences for students. But most teachers, particularly those who post here, will be incredibly defensive about it. They, quite frankly, do not seem to think that grading is important enough to prioritize over other tasks. And administrators must agree because there is never any change.

I'd lodge concerns, in writing, to the counselor and principle, but do not expect any change.

Which task should we drop so we can grade? Should I drop planning lessons? That means I won’t be ready when your child shows up in my classroom on Monday. Should I drop logging and analyzing student data? That means I’ll have no idea how well your child is doing over them. Maybe I should drop parking lot duty and cafeteria duty, even though my contract dictates that I am responsible for fulfilling them. Maybe I should drop answering the tsunami of parent and student emails I get each day, or I should refuse to go to IEP meetings.

I get less than an hour of work time each day. I usually have over 5 hours of work to do. There’s the math and that’s the reason grading takes a while.

If you want more timely feedback, then join teachers in the fight for more reasonable workloads. I’ve worked 6 hours already today, on a Saturday. I’m nowhere near done.

The teachers here who refuse to work on weekends have the right idea. They are forcing an appropriate work/life balance while I’ll burn out and quit.

Proving the OPs point. Sorry your job sucks. But that doesn’t change the fact that grading isn’t happening and childrens education is suffering because of it.

If teachers’ jobs suck, if teachers are suffering, then “children’s education suffering” does seem a likely outcome. Do you expect teachers to suffer even more for the “sake of the kids?” Oh no no. This is a job, my friend. Those of us who have been beaten down by the likes of you and yours have no incentive to try and martyr ourselves for ungrateful folks who *expect* us to do sacrifice our own personal lives as a matter of course.

+1, I’m not working more hours than I already am for “the sake of the kids.” If they are suffering that is the parents problem. I’m working 50 hours a week and that’s my limit. No it’s in the parents to find the solution or pressure FCPS to find one.

So you aren't grading work, knowing it adversely affects children, in an effort to pressure admin to do something? You are using the kids to further your efforts to enact change. How did you feel about the asylum seekers being shipped to Martha's Vineyard?

They aren’t going to give hours and hours (yes, it takes that long) of their unpaid personal time to grade “for the chiiiiiiildrrreeeeen.” Deal with it.

Teacher here. This is the answer right here. I spent years working all day every day. I missed my own children’s performances, meets, and games. I delayed doctor appointments. I missed dinners with extended family. I even cancelled a family trip once. I lost ten years because I prioritized my job over my life.

I’m not doing it anymore. The choice is between demanding a work/life balance and quitting. Papers will be returned eventually.

Why not choose to not do other parts of your job, ones that don't affect the kids? Refuse the stupid admin meeting. Refuse lunch or drop off duty. Yes, that's more difficult to refuse those, but they will be more effective in getting your point across because admin will be directly impacted. Right now, the kids suffer and admin doesn't care so nothing will change and kids continue to be hurt.

tell me you’ve never been in a classroom without telling me…

Exactly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just grade the freaking papers. Or don't bother giving graded assignments.

They will. You don’t set the timeline. Deal with it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a long-standing problem in FCPS with terrible consequences for students. But most teachers, particularly those who post here, will be incredibly defensive about it. They, quite frankly, do not seem to think that grading is important enough to prioritize over other tasks. And administrators must agree because there is never any change.

I'd lodge concerns, in writing, to the counselor and principle, but do not expect any change.

Which task should we drop so we can grade? Should I drop planning lessons? That means I won’t be ready when your child shows up in my classroom on Monday. Should I drop logging and analyzing student data? That means I’ll have no idea how well your child is doing over them. Maybe I should drop parking lot duty and cafeteria duty, even though my contract dictates that I am responsible for fulfilling them. Maybe I should drop answering the tsunami of parent and student emails I get each day, or I should refuse to go to IEP meetings.

I get less than an hour of work time each day. I usually have over 5 hours of work to do. There’s the math and that’s the reason grading takes a while.

If you want more timely feedback, then join teachers in the fight for more reasonable workloads. I’ve worked 6 hours already today, on a Saturday. I’m nowhere near done.

The teachers here who refuse to work on weekends have the right idea. They are forcing an appropriate work/life balance while I’ll burn out and quit.

Proving the OPs point. Sorry your job sucks. But that doesn’t change the fact that grading isn’t happening and childrens education is suffering because of it.

If teachers’ jobs suck, if teachers are suffering, then “children’s education suffering” does seem a likely outcome. Do you expect teachers to suffer even more for the “sake of the kids?” Oh no no. This is a job, my friend. Those of us who have been beaten down by the likes of you and yours have no incentive to try and martyr ourselves for ungrateful folks who *expect* us to do sacrifice our own personal lives as a matter of course.

+1, I’m not working more hours than I already am for “the sake of the kids.” If they are suffering that is the parents problem. I’m working 50 hours a week and that’s my limit. No it’s in the parents to find the solution or pressure FCPS to find one.

So you aren't grading work, knowing it adversely affects children, in an effort to pressure admin to do something? You are using the kids to further your efforts to enact change. How did you feel about the asylum seekers being shipped to Martha's Vineyard?

They aren’t going to give hours and hours (yes, it takes that long) of their unpaid personal time to grade “for the chiiiiiiildrrreeeeen.” Deal with it.

Teacher here. This is the answer right here. I spent years working all day every day. I missed my own children’s performances, meets, and games. I delayed doctor appointments. I missed dinners with extended family. I even cancelled a family trip once. I lost ten years because I prioritized my job over my life.

I’m not doing it anymore. The choice is between demanding a work/life balance and quitting. Papers will be returned eventually.

Why not choose to not do other parts of your job, ones that don't affect the kids? Refuse the stupid admin meeting. Refuse lunch or drop off duty. Yes, that's more difficult to refuse those, but they will be more effective in getting your point across because admin will be directly impacted. Right now, the kids suffer and admin doesn't care so nothing will change and kids continue to be hurt.

That’s the problem: ALL aspects of my job affect the kids. Planning takes most of my time. If I don’t plan, your child doesn’t get an engaging, meaningful lesson. The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress.

Lunch duty is written into my contract. If I don’t go, all that will happen is I will get written up. I care about my job, so being defiant isn’t going to work for me.

There’s nothing to give up. The only thing that doesn’t have a rigid due date is my grading, so it is last priority. It has to be. I’m already working instead of eating my lunch. I’m already working instead of taking a much-needed break. (I don’t get 10 minutes at a water cooler to just chat with colleagues.) I work as I wait for meetings to start. I use my time very effectively and still can’t get my job done in the 55 hours I allow each week. I got it done when I was working 70, but that’s not happening anymore.

If there were a solution, I would have already thought of it. I’m very good at what I do. The truth is teachers are too overburdened. We need to be responsible for fewer classes during the day so we have more time. Period.

Here's your issue: "The meetings are almost always about benchmarks and data, so if I don’t go I am not giving proper attention to student progress."
This relentless measuring/testing focus on SOLs and all the other junk tests is a colossal waste of both teacher and student time, and as a parent I frankly want teachers to just teach instead of spending lots of time with this. If you compare now to a generation ago, this is the main time sink that creeped into classrooms, especially when combined with technological tool nonsense that gives minimal added value.

So you don't need anymore data than what you already get when you grade assignments, as that tells you who is and isn't doing well. Additionally, after your first year and assuming you're reteaching the same grade or class, lesson planning should mainly be reusing what worked well last year.

You need to realize who is in a power position and who is not. The people who evaluate me and renew my contract have the ability to make my life very difficult. Teachers “standing up to administrators” doesn’t always work the way you think it does.

I understand this of course, you are risking getting fired. Yet anyway many, many teachers are already thinking of leaving the profession because they are no longer left alone to teach, which was the original reason they got into teaching to pursue their interest and passion! In that case, it's better to do what you believe is right and take that risk if it means a chance to change things, i.e change the current culture of disrespect toward teachers in this country. If you have to fight and get parents on your side, and if ultimately it does unfortunately result in being forced to leave, so be it. This is what I would do, certainly if I was a young teacher, frustrated with the lack of support, sometimes even inhumane treatment depending on the school, and usually low pay. The situation is already demoralizingly bad, why not leave without fighting for something good if it has to come to that?

Personally, as a parent and teacher, I think it would be very easy to change this culture (certainly at some schools where there is a lot of parent involvement). The main issue right now are:

1) Many teachers who started a long time ago when things were better now have families and are simply scared to lose their job (and for good reason!)

2) Many young, energetic, passionate teachers who would have stood up to the system wisely decided it's best to leave the profession early while they still have choices rather than choose to fight for the profession.

3) Many parents are sadly clueless to what is really going on in our schools, for various reasons: Some don't care about learning and uninvolved in their children's education, some are entitled a$$holes to all people, others are plain ignorant/gullible and believe all the corporate admin doublespeak lingo that even teachers are forced to say (for instance even at recent back to school nights ), and others know/feel that their children are barely learning much in 7 hrs but are too jaded to conceive of a less broken system so they accept it.

Admins meanwhile have the power and money to sell out the teaching profession to consultants and technology companies, i.e corporations who only care about profit, in this case significant amounts of money that could have been used on teachers . If you don't believe this, just try looking at how much time is spent talking about tools and software, more than teachers themselves. Teachers are already considered secondary to technology in the classrooms, and THAT is very scary and telling at the same time. Effectively, teachers cannot stand up for their profession. But if a significant number of parents band together and complain AND teachers are on their side, i.e agree with them on issues, the admins have very little choice; they have to listen.

God, you people make me laugh. You remind me of the umpteen parents during 2020 who endlessly bleated “yes, there is a chance teachers will get really sick and die, but that’s a risk I’m willing to take” while sitting at home in your PJs “working” on a laptop.