Canceling $10k of student loan debt is stupid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:what is point of it? To look koowool? Get a high five? I'm not understanding what much a mere 10k of forgiveness would meaningfully do for anyone's day to day

It buys votes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see it as part of a larger trend toward coddling grown adults so they don't have to be responsible adults making good on their obligations. It's along the same line as people shouting "cancel rent!" I mean, come on. It's time to grow up all the way.

I mean, in the nostalgic past to which you are referring, most people did not go to college and if they did, loans were not available to them at all. You could actually work your way through a public college in 4 years with a relatively low paying job (waiting tables, retail, etc.).

I do actually think that young people today are immature and expect things to be easy. But ask yourself why that is true. Is it something inherent to this generation? No, it's how they were raised. We've created a culture where kids feel entitled to an education, but also feel pressured to get one. Where we have replaced expectations of independence (supporting yourself and your family) at a relatively young age with an amorphous expectation of "success" (impressive degrees, owning a home) at a relatively young age. The expectations for young people today are often shallow and nonsensical, but they are being pushed not by peers but by THEIR PARENTS. You think kids get expensive graduate degrees because their friends are doing it? No, they do it because their families have expectations of a certain kind of success and class status, and graduate school has been presented as a way to get there.

This is a mess of our own making. The idea that young people independently decided to start going to college and graduate school in bigger numbers, decided on their own to take out loans (which didn't used to even be available like this!), and are now struggling with the consequences of their own choices is silly -- this is a Boomer problem and it needs Boomers to help solve it. Yup, that might mean some loan forgiveness. The whole situation is dumb but it wasn't created by 18 yo kids making bad choices. It was created by their parents.

If we want social mobility, then kids should feel entitled to higher education. Independence at 18 usually means a crappy minimum wage job with no future prospects. This isn't 1960 where you can leave high school, join at local factory and have a great union job until you are ready to retire with a nice pension

I'm actually one of the people who believe community colleges should be free. However, I don't believe kids are entitled to an *expensive* education studying a subject that has limited earning potential, paid for by other people.

The maximum federal student loans you can take out for your undergraduate education is $57,500. That's under 15k year. People reach the maximum loan burden for just going to college--the average in-state tuition and fees in this country is 11000/yr and that doesn't include any room and board. And plenty of states don't have any school that inexpensive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I went to college for free. I had financial aid based on my moms very low income.

I could not afford to go away to school so went local, drove a $200 car that was falling apart on side streets to school as unsafe on a highway. I graduated debt free.

I then got a job that paid for part time MBA and did that over 4 years for free.

Same deal everyone has right now if they want.

Some of us have parents that were moderately more responsible than your mom, but not so successful to be able to drop $40k on tuition. Or $10k. Or even $5k. Also, I know a kid in your shoes who never got to live to collect that degree because she died in a car wreck with her crap car. If she had airbags in that car, she would have lived.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I went to college for free. I had financial aid based on my moms very low income.

I could not afford to go away to school so went local, drove a $200 car that was falling apart on side streets to school as unsafe on a highway. I graduated debt free.

I then got a job that paid for part time MBA and did that over 4 years for free.

Same deal everyone has right now if they want.

Some of us have parents that were moderately more responsible than your mom, but not so successful to be able to drop $40k on tuition. Or $10k. Or even $5k. Also, I know a kid in your shoes who never got to live to collect that degree because she died in a car wreck with her crap car. If she had airbags in that car, she would have lived.

low income does not equal irresponsible

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:what is point of it? To look koowool? Get a high five? I'm not understanding what much a mere 10k of forgiveness would meaningfully do for anyone's day to day

It buys votes.

Not really. The political impact is thought to be zero because it alienates some voters as well. But 10k does make a lot of difference, esp. to people in their 20s --it allows them to take more career-related risks, save up some money to move to where job opportunities are etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:what is point of it? To look koowool? Get a high five? I'm not understanding what much a mere 10k of forgiveness would meaningfully do for anyone's day to day

It buys votes.

Not really. The political impact is thought to be zero because it alienates some voters as well. But 10k does make a lot of difference, esp. to people in their 20s --it allows them to take more career-related risks, save up some money to move to where job opportunities are etc.

If they studied a marketable skill in College, there would be no career-related risks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see it as part of a larger trend toward coddling grown adults so they don't have to be responsible adults making good on their obligations. It's along the same line as people shouting "cancel rent!" I mean, come on. It's time to grow up all the way.

I mean, in the nostalgic past to which you are referring, most people did not go to college and if they did, loans were not available to them at all. You could actually work your way through a public college in 4 years with a relatively low paying job (waiting tables, retail, etc.).

I do actually think that young people today are immature and expect things to be easy. But ask yourself why that is true. Is it something inherent to this generation? No, it's how they were raised. We've created a culture where kids feel entitled to an education, but also feel pressured to get one. Where we have replaced expectations of independence (supporting yourself and your family) at a relatively young age with an amorphous expectation of "success" (impressive degrees, owning a home) at a relatively young age. The expectations for young people today are often shallow and nonsensical, but they are being pushed not by peers but by THEIR PARENTS. You think kids get expensive graduate degrees because their friends are doing it? No, they do it because their families have expectations of a certain kind of success and class status, and graduate school has been presented as a way to get there.

This is a mess of our own making. The idea that young people independently decided to start going to college and graduate school in bigger numbers, decided on their own to take out loans (which didn't used to even be available like this!), and are now struggling with the consequences of their own choices is silly -- this is a Boomer problem and it needs Boomers to help solve it. Yup, that might mean some loan forgiveness. The whole situation is dumb but it wasn't created by 18 yo kids making bad choices. It was created by their parents.

If we want social mobility, then kids should feel entitled to higher education. Independence at 18 usually means a crappy minimum wage job with no future prospects. This isn't 1960 where you can leave high school, join at local factory and have a great union job until you are ready to retire with a nice pension

I'm actually one of the people who believe community colleges should be free. However, I don't believe kids are entitled to an *expensive* education studying a subject that has limited earning potential, paid for by other people.

The maximum federal student loans you can take out for your undergraduate education is $57,500. That's under 15k year. People reach the maximum loan burden for just going to college--the average in-state tuition and fees in this country is 11000/yr and that doesn't include any room and board. And plenty of states don't have any school that inexpensive. [/quot]

You can't look at average in-state, you have to look at what in-state tuition is available. For example, VA in-state tuition for community colleges is under $4k a year. $16k total for 4 years. The median income for someone with a bachelor's degree is $54,700 a year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see it as part of a larger trend toward coddling grown adults so they don't have to be responsible adults making good on their obligations. It's along the same line as people shouting "cancel rent!" I mean, come on. It's time to grow up all the way.

I mean, in the nostalgic past to which you are referring, most people did not go to college and if they did, loans were not available to them at all. You could actually work your way through a public college in 4 years with a relatively low paying job (waiting tables, retail, etc.).

I do actually think that young people today are immature and expect things to be easy. But ask yourself why that is true. Is it something inherent to this generation? No, it's how they were raised. We've created a culture where kids feel entitled to an education, but also feel pressured to get one. Where we have replaced expectations of independence (supporting yourself and your family) at a relatively young age with an amorphous expectation of "success" (impressive degrees, owning a home) at a relatively young age. The expectations for young people today are often shallow and nonsensical, but they are being pushed not by peers but by THEIR PARENTS. You think kids get expensive graduate degrees because their friends are doing it? No, they do it because their families have expectations of a certain kind of success and class status, and graduate school has been presented as a way to get there.

This is a mess of our own making. The idea that young people independently decided to start going to college and graduate school in bigger numbers, decided on their own to take out loans (which didn't used to even be available like this!), and are now struggling with the consequences of their own choices is silly -- this is a Boomer problem and it needs Boomers to help solve it. Yup, that might mean some loan forgiveness. The whole situation is dumb but it wasn't created by 18 yo kids making bad choices. It was created by their parents.

If we want social mobility, then kids should feel entitled to higher education. Independence at 18 usually means a crappy minimum wage job with no future prospects. This isn't 1960 where you can leave high school, join at local factory and have a great union job until you are ready to retire with a nice pension

I'm actually one of the people who believe community colleges should be free. However, I don't believe kids are entitled to an *expensive* education studying a subject that has limited earning potential, paid for by other people.

The maximum federal student loans you can take out for your undergraduate education is $57,500. That's under 15k year. People reach the maximum loan burden for just going to college--the average in-state tuition and fees in this country is 11000/yr and that doesn't include any room and board. And plenty of states don't have any school that inexpensive. [/quot]

You can't look at average in-state, you have to look at what in-state tuition is available. For example, VA in-state tuition for community colleges is under $4k a year. $16k total for 4 years. The median income for someone with a bachelor's degree is $54,700 a year.

Community colleges only offer 2 year degrees. Try again.

[Anonymous]

It is absurd but Biden needs the popularity vote.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Canceling any new or old measly $10k of student loan debt is the dumbest idea. What is the payment on that, a mere $100/month?

Instead, the struggling folks need help - the ones buried under 75k, 100k, 300k of debt for over 20 years who, because it's been 20 years, obviously they can't pay it! And I mean 20 years since school completion, not 20 years of qualifying payments, huge difference.

my 2 cents

It would wipe out either all of or more than half of the loan balance for more than 50 percent of people who owe undergraduate debt, though, so it's actually a pretty helpful policy for most borrowers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:what is point of it? To look koowool? Get a high five? I'm not understanding what much a mere 10k of forgiveness would meaningfully do for anyone's day to day

It buys votes.

Disagree. It loses my vote, which has been Dem for 20 years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:what is point of it? To look koowool? Get a high five? I'm not understanding what much a mere 10k of forgiveness would meaningfully do for anyone's day to day

It buys votes.

Disagree. It loses my vote, which has been Dem for 20 years.

They don't care about you, they want the progressives, the young revolutionaries.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Canceling any new or old measly $10k of student loan debt is the dumbest idea. What is the payment on that, a mere $100/month?

Instead, the struggling folks need help - the ones buried under 75k, 100k, 300k of debt for over 20 years who, because it's been 20 years, obviously they can't pay it! And I mean 20 years since school completion, not 20 years of qualifying payments, huge difference.

my 2 cents

You chose to go that far in debt, your problem. You should be grateful for the 10k!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Canceling any new or old measly $10k of student loan debt is the dumbest idea. What is the payment on that, a mere $100/month?

Instead, the struggling folks need help - the ones buried under 75k, 100k, 300k of debt for over 20 years who, because it's been 20 years, obviously they can't pay it! And I mean 20 years since school completion, not 20 years of qualifying payments, huge difference.

my 2 cents

For me, canceling $10k of my debt would have halved my monthly payment. I’m one of the teachers who got screwed over under the last administration. I was supposed to have my debt entirely forgiven.

[Anonymous]

Ah, seven pages of striver UMC, not quite wealthy, tears about middle class benefits. Sorry you aren't a shareholder able to grift off Trump and now aren't getting anything from Biden either.