New TA here: please don’t send your kids to high poverty schools if you can avoid it

[Anonymous]

I went to a high farms school that was also a failing school. I came from an UMC family that was wonderful and I still have trouble processing what my high school was like. Sometimes the fights replay in my mind too because they were so violent and brutal. I'm a petite female and was beat up before I learned to be a bit smarter (don't sit at this table, don't walk down this hallway, look down and don't smile, don't talk to people- there were so many rules and I was naïve). Luckily I made friends but I did spend a few months eating lunch in the bathroom crying. A group of guys from school tried to rape me and my friend, luckily we ran and ran and found a police officer who did protect us. Man when you talk about taking police out of schools, it blows my mind. I can't imagine how unsafe my school would have been.

I saw tons of fights, lots with knives, lots with fists and they didn't end well. My teacher had her arm broken. I took all AP courses to escape the hell that was the rest of the school, but when I had to retake tests in other classrooms- it was like the wild wild west there. Pretty sure there was zero learning going on.

But apart from the drugs and violence that I witnessed, there was a lot of trauma. So much sexual abuse and physical abuse that my classmates had. Teenaged pregnancies, no parents, homeless classmates. That was the part I was naive about.

I don't want my kids to grow up in a bubble, but exposing them to trauma like this? I hope they're never exposed. Diversity and low SES is good, trauma? hell no

[Anonymous]

OP, not everyone wants to be house poor. Home ownership is much more pleasant for most than being a perpetual renter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I work in a very affluent school and we have the same problem (incredibly disruptive groups of students who take up all the teachers time). The high flyers get ignored, as do those on grade level (this is most of the students in our school - IGNORED). It is the disruptive ones, and those that need tons of interventions and help that get all the attention. Their parents are a combination of entitled (not my little angel) and in complete denial (you just need to be nicer to her - she never behaves this way at home therefore it must be something you are doing to her at school) about their children's issues.

Except at the affluent schools, vast majority of students continue to meet grade level standards year after year, despite the couple disruptive students. So either they aren’t getting ignored, or parents are making up all the lack of teaching at home.

The low income schools continue to fail to meet grade level standards for majority of their students year after year. So either the teacher isn’t teaching them or they are unable to learn.

I'd argue that the teachers are the same at both schools. It's on the students and their parents to make them learn.

[Anonymous]

What qualifies as a high poverty school? My kid is at a 40 per cent farms school, and we haven’t had the level of issues discussed here. Some disruption, sure, but overall my kid is pretty happy and seems to be learning a lot. I quite like the teachers we’ve had so far and have been pretty impressed with how well they seem to know the kids and how much they care about them. We are early elementary and here in close in DMV. This thread has me worried that I’m missing something….

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What qualifies as a high poverty school? My kid is at a 40 per cent farms school, and we haven’t had the level of issues discussed here. Some disruption, sure, but overall my kid is pretty happy and seems to be learning a lot. I quite like the teachers we’ve had so far and have been pretty impressed with how well they seem to know the kids and how much they care about them. We are early elementary and here in close in DMV. This thread has me worried that I’m missing something….

NP I don't think they should let the number go above 30. And poverty rates aren't all the same and won't affect the school the same. Some kids have wonderful family support but don't speak English and the kid doesn't speak English, whereas other students could be homeless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I work in a very affluent school and we have the same problem (incredibly disruptive groups of students who take up all the teachers time). The high flyers get ignored, as do those on grade level (this is most of the students in our school - IGNORED). It is the disruptive ones, and those that need tons of interventions and help that get all the attention. Their parents are a combination of entitled (not my little angel) and in complete denial (you just need to be nicer to her - she never behaves this way at home therefore it must be something you are doing to her at school) about their children's issues.

Except at the affluent schools, vast majority of students continue to meet grade level standards year after year, despite the couple disruptive students. So either they aren’t getting ignored, or parents are making up all the lack of teaching at home.

The low income schools continue to fail to meet grade level standards for majority of their students year after year. So either the teacher isn’t teaching them or they are unable to learn.

It’s not the teachers.

It's not the teachers and it's not that the kid's can't learn. My district is 85% low income. From a young teacher friend of mine. She is the sole teacher, no aid or support person, with a class of 23
8 kids can sit still and follow directions, if given independent work they will sit mostly quietly and complete it
5 kids are newcomers to the US with basically no english, because they aren't in an EL classroom they are supposed to be getting additional language support but they aren't (district was sued about this by the DOJ)
3 kids are severely disruptive cannot sit still or follow directions, will wander out of the classroom, hit other kids, etc
5 kids can follow directions and are ready to learn when the classroom is calm but easily get off track when others are being disruptive
2 just showed up a month ago and are dealing with that disruption, new class, new curriculum, new rules and could use additional help
0-4 extra kids from other classes of any grade. Since the district doesn't have enough subs, when a teacher is out the class is broken up and sent to other classes. This is so common that in the teacher's contract they get a per diem for these extra students.

With that group you need extra staff and resources that do not exist in our district

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What qualifies as a high poverty school? My kid is at a 40 per cent farms school, and we haven’t had the level of issues discussed here. Some disruption, sure, but overall my kid is pretty happy and seems to be learning a lot. I quite like the teachers we’ve had so far and have been pretty impressed with how well they seem to know the kids and how much they care about them. We are early elementary and here in close in DMV. This thread has me worried that I’m missing something….

When FCPS did their study they found that 20% and 40% where the two tipping points. Of course they followed it up with zero action.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What qualifies as a high poverty school? My kid is at a 40 per cent farms school, and we haven’t had the level of issues discussed here. Some disruption, sure, but overall my kid is pretty happy and seems to be learning a lot. I quite like the teachers we’ve had so far and have been pretty impressed with how well they seem to know the kids and how much they care about them. We are early elementary and here in close in DMV. This thread has me worried that I’m missing something….

When FCPS did their study they found that 20% and 40% where the two tipping points. Of course they followed it up with zero action.

That tipping point study should have gotten a lot more attention.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What qualifies as a high poverty school? My kid is at a 40 per cent farms school, and we haven’t had the level of issues discussed here. Some disruption, sure, but overall my kid is pretty happy and seems to be learning a lot. I quite like the teachers we’ve had so far and have been pretty impressed with how well they seem to know the kids and how much they care about them. We are early elementary and here in close in DMV. This thread has me worried that I’m missing something….

When FCPS did their study they found that 20% and 40% where the two tipping points. Of course they followed it up with zero action.

The action would have been rezoning, and people fight that tooth and nail.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What qualifies as a high poverty school? My kid is at a 40 per cent farms school, and we haven’t had the level of issues discussed here. Some disruption, sure, but overall my kid is pretty happy and seems to be learning a lot. I quite like the teachers we’ve had so far and have been pretty impressed with how well they seem to know the kids and how much they care about them. We are early elementary and here in close in DMV. This thread has me worried that I’m missing something….

When FCPS did their study they found that 20% and 40% where the two tipping points. Of course they followed it up with zero action.

Tipping points for what?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What qualifies as a high poverty school? My kid is at a 40 per cent farms school, and we haven’t had the level of issues discussed here. Some disruption, sure, but overall my kid is pretty happy and seems to be learning a lot. I quite like the teachers we’ve had so far and have been pretty impressed with how well they seem to know the kids and how much they care about them. We are early elementary and here in close in DMV. This thread has me worried that I’m missing something….

When FCPS did their study they found that 20% and 40% where the two tipping points. Of course they followed it up with zero action.

Tipping points for what?

Summary Finding: The study took both a graphical and a statistical approach to answering this question using SY 2011‐12 poverty and student achievement data.1 Graphs of school‐level pass rates (i.e., the percentage of students in the school above benchmarks on the reading or mathematics SOL tests) and school poverty indicated in general that as levels of school poverty increased, schools were less likely to meet academic performance expectations (i.e., schools were more likely to have SOL pass rates falling below expected levels).
And, almost all schools with poverty levels of 45 percent or higher were unable to reach expected pass rate levels in reading or math. Follow‐up statistical analyses found statistical evidence that two tipping points exist in FCPS. The reading data provided the most consistent findings as it indicated two tipping points occurring at 20 and 40‐45 percent school‐level poverty. Thus, FCPS schools with greater than 20 percent poverty are much less likely to meet performance expectations than those with less than 20 percent poverty. And, once poverty levels at a school reach 40 percent or more, FCPS schools are unlikely to meet expectations for school performance.

https://www.boarddocs.com/vsba/fairfax/Board.nsf/files/9DG4KP71B0DB/$file/fcps_tipping-point.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What qualifies as a high poverty school? My kid is at a 40 per cent farms school, and we haven’t had the level of issues discussed here. Some disruption, sure, but overall my kid is pretty happy and seems to be learning a lot. I quite like the teachers we’ve had so far and have been pretty impressed with how well they seem to know the kids and how much they care about them. We are early elementary and here in close in DMV. This thread has me worried that I’m missing something….

When FCPS did their study they found that 20% and 40% where the two tipping points. Of course they followed it up with zero action.

The action would have been rezoning, and people fight that tooth and nail.

Rezoning in the traditional sense wouldn't work, you'd need actual busing which will never fly.

[Anonymous]

OP, please don't listen to the haters. You're providing a valuable public service.

Thanks to your post, the DCUM strivers who think $100k HHI is barely middle class, live their lives according to the Gospel of GreatSchools, and rend their garments at the inequity of their 93rd percentile child not getting into a gifted program... will start avoiding high-poverty schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The issue is we need better teachers and school staff. We go where there is affordable housing that is not a stretch...

They need better kids and parents in the schools. That’s the biggest issue. Who wants to work in a crazy school full of disruptive kids with parents that don’t care. Every good teacher wants to leave that loony town

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, not everyone wants to be house poor. Home ownership is much more pleasant for most than being a perpetual renter.

I’d rather live in a small house or commute longer than send my kid to a bad school.