Asian American student with 1590 SAT score blames affirmative action for rejections from 6 colleges

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:China and India alone have almost 3 billion citizens.

Chinese immigrants number about 2 million a year to the US. Immigrants from India have about the same numbers.

These immigrants come here for education and better quality of life. They are a tiny percentage of Asians but they are the most likely to be hardest working with some money and family connections.

I have a friend who came here from China as a child. We have children in the same grade and are close. The rest of her extended family will not allow their children to be friends with American children. They see Americans as lazy and a distraction.

It’s a different culture and with that amount of people the Asian population could easily fill MIT, Harvard, etc a thousand times over. What are they supposed to do, especially if most of them go back to their country of origin?

I don’t understand the question…what are they supposed to do about what?

Why should we be sympathetic to the families that won’t assimilate?

What are you talking about
They are the ones who assimilate to the American way and American dream - hardworking and competition

No, the American way (which is what has made this country historically such a great place)…is that you are proud of your heritage but you are now an American and you want to embrace the country in its entirety (foibles and all). If America evolved with just a bunch of ethnic cliques keeping to themselves, the country would have a much lower GDP and overall quality of life.

Help us really understand why you are immigrating here. Someone posted a list of top engineering schools and 13/20 were in Asia, so no need to go to college in the US (in fact why would you?). If you apparently hate the people and the system…help us understand.

What are you talking about
Working hard and fair competition is not just the American way, it should be applied to everywhere
Since you asked, personally I followed my parents when I was a minor, and my kids were born here like you I guess.
I don't hate anything. I just found that the college admission system has a lot of flaws and room for improvements.
It seems that the US Supreme Court would agree with me on some of them, and we'll see progress.
Systems evolve.

You are looking for a dictatorship. It is not here.

But go on with your tutoring.

It seems that you don't understand the meaning of the word, dictatorship.
The colleges are acting like dictators when they are receiving all sorts of government aid and support.

It is the colleges who get to decide who THEY want at THEIR school. NOT the pushy parents.

colleges shouldn't decide based on race, that's the point. It's illegal to base anything on race, a protected class.

You are correct, it should not be. Most people (except Asians) believe it currently is not, except for URMs - please look up the meaning of URM.

Point being, if all of one kind come to the U.S. at once, and most expect to be admitted, it is not going to happen. It has been this way for generations. You were given bad information, and now you want that information to be true, when it is not.

No one is "expecting" to be admitted to an elite college. People are "expecting" to not be discriminated against their race. I think black people would agree that no one should be discriminated against because of their race.

Black people wish you would be just as vocal when it comes to pay disparity........right crickets....

Paying someone less because of their race is illegal, as it should be. I'm glad you agree that they're both equally immoral.

AND YET IT STILL HAPPENS THERE IS DATA SHOWING IT AND I DONT HEAR ASIAN AMERICANS TAKING UP THE BANNER FOR OTHERS. So excuse me, while I make sure that my black son takes your kids' seat.

you don't have to take up the banner for Asian Americans. The lawsuit it doing that.

The NAACP rarely takes up the banner for other minorities other than black, other than platitudes.

You didn't get the pointed jab about how black kids are taking AA seats because that's what this comes down to. AA act like the seats in institutions are already theirs. And they are overrepresented as it were. So just look at it this way, your Asian kid will go to a T25-50 and can still make more than a black kid Ivy grad.
Thanks for playing!

don't know anyone who " act like the seats in institutions are already theirs.". These kids study hard, work hard. They don't "act like the seat is already theirs".

The point is not about whether they will be ok. The point is that they are discriminated against based on their race, just like how those colleges discriminated against Jews. Wrong then; wrong now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:China and India alone have almost 3 billion citizens.

Chinese immigrants number about 2 million a year to the US. Immigrants from India have about the same numbers.

These immigrants come here for education and better quality of life. They are a tiny percentage of Asians but they are the most likely to be hardest working with some money and family connections.

I have a friend who came here from China as a child. We have children in the same grade and are close. The rest of her extended family will not allow their children to be friends with American children. They see Americans as lazy and a distraction.

It’s a different culture and with that amount of people the Asian population could easily fill MIT, Harvard, etc a thousand times over. What are they supposed to do, especially if most of them go back to their country of origin?

I don’t understand the question…what are they supposed to do about what?

Why should we be sympathetic to the families that won’t assimilate?

What are you talking about
They are the ones who assimilate to the American way and American dream - hardworking and competition

No, the American way (which is what has made this country historically such a great place)…is that you are proud of your heritage but you are now an American and you want to embrace the country in its entirety (foibles and all). If America evolved with just a bunch of ethnic cliques keeping to themselves, the country would have a much lower GDP and overall quality of life.

Help us really understand why you are immigrating here. Someone posted a list of top engineering schools and 13/20 were in Asia, so no need to go to college in the US (in fact why would you?). If you apparently hate the people and the system…help us understand.

What are you talking about
Working hard and fair competition is not just the American way, it should be applied to everywhere
Since you asked, personally I followed my parents when I was a minor, and my kids were born here like you I guess.
I don't hate anything. I just found that the college admission system has a lot of flaws and room for improvements.
It seems that the US Supreme Court would agree with me on some of them, and we'll see progress.
Systems evolve.

You are looking for a dictatorship. It is not here.

But go on with your tutoring.

It seems that you don't understand the meaning of the word, dictatorship.
The colleges are acting like dictators when they are receiving all sorts of government aid and support.

It is the colleges who get to decide who THEY want at THEIR school. NOT the pushy parents.

colleges shouldn't decide based on race, that's the point. It's illegal to base anything on race, a protected class.

You are correct, it should not be. Most people (except Asians) believe it currently is not, except for URMs - please look up the meaning of URM.

Point being, if all of one kind come to the U.S. at once, and most expect to be admitted, it is not going to happen. It has been this way for generations. You were given bad information, and now you want that information to be true, when it is not.

No one is "expecting" to be admitted to an elite college. People are "expecting" to not be discriminated against their race. I think black people would agree that no one should be discriminated against because of their race.

Again, apples and oranges. Why do you think you have it so hard? Because you and most other people can not be admitted to your school of choice? Cry me a river.

how is that apples and oranges?


When an AO marks the Asian American student as "not likeable" even though they never met the person and the Interviewer marked them as "likeable", that smacks of discrimination.

Imagine applying for a job, and the hiring team marks your application as "not likeable" solely based on paper and your name.

While they have not "met" them, there may have been interviews, there are Essays and Teacher recommendations. Those all go a long way to providing insight into the character and personality of the candidate. the AO does not like how a teacher characterizes you or how you discussed a topic in an essay, so they mark you down for it. They are allowed to do that---they are attempting to find a way to distinguish 62K applicants and select 1.5-2K for admission offers. Most are highly qualified so it will be "little things" that make a difference.

Quite honestly, it's not shocking that those that are screaming racism are not "likable". These schools are looking for go getters, problems solvers, people who will change the world (Be it in stem research or teach for America or in between)---that does not include entitled students who whine if they don't get what they think they are entitled to because they have worked hard.

Looks like you are new to this. Welcome!.
Yes exactly, there are other factors like interviews, essays, ECs, leadership, etc.

Guess What?
Asians as a whole are better at those than other races as well as revealed in Harvard secret data!!

Of course. GPA and Tests are the hard parts.
What makes you think that they wouldn't be prepared for those extra stuff?
They know what it takes and are prepared.

That's why Harvard had to come up with the courage/likability/kindness BS score to artificially limit Asian numbers.
They came up with the holistic BS exactly the same reason to limit Jews back then.

Bad argument because Jews were not allowed and had to start their own colleges.

At least know what you are talking about.

LOL history is repeating.
Exact same thing is happening.

https://blog.kiratalent.com/a-brief-history-of-holistic-admissions/

Wake the F up

They had 'assessments of “manliness” back then.
Sounds exactly like 'assessments of "courage/kindness/likability" now.

LMFAO

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:China and India alone have almost 3 billion citizens.

Chinese immigrants number about 2 million a year to the US. Immigrants from India have about the same numbers.

These immigrants come here for education and better quality of life. They are a tiny percentage of Asians but they are the most likely to be hardest working with some money and family connections.

I have a friend who came here from China as a child. We have children in the same grade and are close. The rest of her extended family will not allow their children to be friends with American children. They see Americans as lazy and a distraction.

It’s a different culture and with that amount of people the Asian population could easily fill MIT, Harvard, etc a thousand times over. What are they supposed to do, especially if most of them go back to their country of origin?

I don’t understand the question…what are they supposed to do about what?

Why should we be sympathetic to the families that won’t assimilate?

What are you talking about
They are the ones who assimilate to the American way and American dream - hardworking and competition

No, the American way (which is what has made this country historically such a great place)…is that you are proud of your heritage but you are now an American and you want to embrace the country in its entirety (foibles and all). If America evolved with just a bunch of ethnic cliques keeping to themselves, the country would have a much lower GDP and overall quality of life.

Help us really understand why you are immigrating here. Someone posted a list of top engineering schools and 13/20 were in Asia, so no need to go to college in the US (in fact why would you?). If you apparently hate the people and the system…help us understand.

What are you talking about
Working hard and fair competition is not just the American way, it should be applied to everywhere
Since you asked, personally I followed my parents when I was a minor, and my kids were born here like you I guess.
I don't hate anything. I just found that the college admission system has a lot of flaws and room for improvements.
It seems that the US Supreme Court would agree with me on some of them, and we'll see progress.
Systems evolve.

You are looking for a dictatorship. It is not here.

But go on with your tutoring.

It seems that you don't understand the meaning of the word, dictatorship.
The colleges are acting like dictators when they are receiving all sorts of government aid and support.

It is the colleges who get to decide who THEY want at THEIR school. NOT the pushy parents.

colleges shouldn't decide based on race, that's the point. It's illegal to base anything on race, a protected class.

You are correct, it should not be. Most people (except Asians) believe it currently is not, except for URMs - please look up the meaning of URM.

Point being, if all of one kind come to the U.S. at once, and most expect to be admitted, it is not going to happen. It has been this way for generations. You were given bad information, and now you want that information to be true, when it is not.

No one is "expecting" to be admitted to an elite college. People are "expecting" to not be discriminated against their race. I think black people would agree that no one should be discriminated against because of their race.

Black people wish you would be just as vocal when it comes to pay disparity........right crickets....

Paying someone less because of their race is illegal, as it should be. I'm glad you agree that they're both equally immoral.

AND YET IT STILL HAPPENS THERE IS DATA SHOWING IT AND I DONT HEAR ASIAN AMERICANS TAKING UP THE BANNER FOR OTHERS. So excuse me, while I make sure that my black son takes your kids' seat.

you don't have to take up the banner for Asian Americans. The lawsuit it doing that.

The NAACP rarely takes up the banner for other minorities other than black, other than platitudes.

You didn't get the pointed jab about how black kids are taking AA seats because that's what this comes down to. AA act like the seats in institutions are already theirs. And they are overrepresented as it were. So just look at it this way, your Asian kid will go to a T25-50 and can still make more than a black kid Ivy grad.
Thanks for playing!

So you are for racial quotas. I totally support racial quotas in NBA and NFL.

also in the movies, and we need more Asian rappers

Are you an athlete or a rapper?

No, just racist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:China and India alone have almost 3 billion citizens.

Chinese immigrants number about 2 million a year to the US. Immigrants from India have about the same numbers.

These immigrants come here for education and better quality of life. They are a tiny percentage of Asians but they are the most likely to be hardest working with some money and family connections.

I have a friend who came here from China as a child. We have children in the same grade and are close. The rest of her extended family will not allow their children to be friends with American children. They see Americans as lazy and a distraction.

It’s a different culture and with that amount of people the Asian population could easily fill MIT, Harvard, etc a thousand times over. What are they supposed to do, especially if most of them go back to their country of origin?

I don’t understand the question…what are they supposed to do about what?

Why should we be sympathetic to the families that won’t assimilate?

What are you talking about
They are the ones who assimilate to the American way and American dream - hardworking and competition

No, the American way (which is what has made this country historically such a great place)…is that you are proud of your heritage but you are now an American and you want to embrace the country in its entirety (foibles and all). If America evolved with just a bunch of ethnic cliques keeping to themselves, the country would have a much lower GDP and overall quality of life.

Help us really understand why you are immigrating here. Someone posted a list of top engineering schools and 13/20 were in Asia, so no need to go to college in the US (in fact why would you?). If you apparently hate the people and the system…help us understand.

But the kids we are talking about are Asian AMERICAN. Their parents emigrated; they had no choice but to grow up here, become American and exist in this system. They are US citizens and can't just move back to a home country that they will never fit into.

All these hardworking, extremely intelligent asian Americans are supposed to be good soldiers and "take the hit" for American values -- they lose on both on Affirmative Action (wrong race) and on legacy admits( immigrant parents) to these elite schools. So many of these kids are the brightest ones in their high school, and they have to watch as other classmates are accepted while they are not. Of course they are going to get upset.

Well, honestly, if it were me, and I had the option to go to school in another country, I absolutely would. I think some of the posters are cutting off their nose to spite their own face.

But do they have the option of going to school in another country?

These kids are no dual citizens -- they are US citizens. They live here. Their parents live here. Often their aunts and uncles and cousins do too, and maybe their grandparents are still in Asia, but they have passed away by college, so they don't have a real extended family in Asia.

They are American. They are not conditional citizens. They can't just "go back." They have to exist within this system and yes, it's a lottery to get into these school, but kids of other races have "ins", like, again affirmative action and legacy admits, that Asian Americans don't have access to.

Funny how some become racial justice warriors only when their kid gets rejected.

It really boils down to " my Asian American kid doesn't have a hook to get into Harvard like the URMs and ALDCs - unfair! Bwwahhh!"

It's not about being a "racial justice warrior." The question of whether or not Asian Americans are being discriminated against in college admissions is such a legitimate question that it has gone to the Supreme Court. And when Asian Americans who bring it up here, they are being, honestly, gaslighted and made to feel that they are crazy when we can see that it may actually be happening.

The actual numbers prove otherwise. There is no shortage of Asian representation at any highly regarded university in this country. To be honest, their over representation feels more like gaslighting.

+1

Well stated. Wonder if the Supreme Court will notice this, and act accordingly?

Every individual should be viewed and treated as an individual not as a part of a group.

That makes sense. Thank you.

It might make sense but does not necessarily carry the day.


It has NEVER been the case that even elite colleges only wanted high GPA + test scores. They want a range of students, academically, socioeconomically, ethnically, geographically, and with different talents and skills.

But colleges have never just gone down the list of GPA and test scores to build the most academically accomplished class it can. That’s a very narrow idea of what a university is about and what it does. Grades, and to an even greater extent, test scores, measure only a fraction of a person’s abilities. That’s why I really don’t mind holistic admissions. The fact that someone has lower grades and test scores doesn’t equate to that person contributing less to the university than someone with higher ones.

Not true.

Prior to changing the admissions criteria to keep the number of Jews from exploding in Harvard, they didn't look at "holistic" admissions. The only brought in holistic admissions because the number of Jews were getting 'uncomfortable" at Harvard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:China and India alone have almost 3 billion citizens.

Chinese immigrants number about 2 million a year to the US. Immigrants from India have about the same numbers.

These immigrants come here for education and better quality of life. They are a tiny percentage of Asians but they are the most likely to be hardest working with some money and family connections.

I have a friend who came here from China as a child. We have children in the same grade and are close. The rest of her extended family will not allow their children to be friends with American children. They see Americans as lazy and a distraction.

It’s a different culture and with that amount of people the Asian population could easily fill MIT, Harvard, etc a thousand times over. What are they supposed to do, especially if most of them go back to their country of origin?

I don’t understand the question…what are they supposed to do about what?

Why should we be sympathetic to the families that won’t assimilate?

What are you talking about
They are the ones who assimilate to the American way and American dream - hardworking and competition

No, the American way (which is what has made this country historically such a great place)…is that you are proud of your heritage but you are now an American and you want to embrace the country in its entirety (foibles and all). If America evolved with just a bunch of ethnic cliques keeping to themselves, the country would have a much lower GDP and overall quality of life.

Help us really understand why you are immigrating here. Someone posted a list of top engineering schools and 13/20 were in Asia, so no need to go to college in the US (in fact why would you?). If you apparently hate the people and the system…help us understand.

But the kids we are talking about are Asian AMERICAN. Their parents emigrated; they had no choice but to grow up here, become American and exist in this system. They are US citizens and can't just move back to a home country that they will never fit into.

All these hardworking, extremely intelligent asian Americans are supposed to be good soldiers and "take the hit" for American values -- they lose on both on Affirmative Action (wrong race) and on legacy admits( immigrant parents) to these elite schools. So many of these kids are the brightest ones in their high school, and they have to watch as other classmates are accepted while they are not. Of course they are going to get upset.

Well, honestly, if it were me, and I had the option to go to school in another country, I absolutely would. I think some of the posters are cutting off their nose to spite their own face.

But do they have the option of going to school in another country?

These kids are no dual citizens -- they are US citizens. They live here. Their parents live here. Often their aunts and uncles and cousins do too, and maybe their grandparents are still in Asia, but they have passed away by college, so they don't have a real extended family in Asia.

They are American. They are not conditional citizens. They can't just "go back." They have to exist within this system and yes, it's a lottery to get into these school, but kids of other races have "ins", like, again affirmative action and legacy admits, that Asian Americans don't have access to.

Funny how some become racial justice warriors only when their kid gets rejected.

It really boils down to " my Asian American kid doesn't have a hook to get into Harvard like the URMs and ALDCs - unfair! Bwwahhh!"

It's not about being a "racial justice warrior." The question of whether or not Asian Americans are being discriminated against in college admissions is such a legitimate question that it has gone to the Supreme Court. And when Asian Americans who bring it up here, they are being, honestly, gaslighted and made to feel that they are crazy when we can see that it may actually be happening.

The actual numbers prove otherwise. There is no shortage of Asian representation at any highly regarded university in this country. To be honest, their over representation feels more like gaslighting.

+1

Well stated. Wonder if the Supreme Court will notice this, and act accordingly?

Every individual should be viewed and treated as an individual not as a part of a group.

That makes sense. Thank you.

It might make sense but does not necessarily carry the day.


It has NEVER been the case that even elite colleges only wanted high GPA + test scores. They want a range of students, academically, socioeconomically, ethnically, geographically, and with different talents and skills.

But colleges have never just gone down the list of GPA and test scores to build the most academically accomplished class it can. That’s a very narrow idea of what a university is about and what it does. Grades, and to an even greater extent, test scores, measure only a fraction of a person’s abilities. That’s why I really don’t mind holistic admissions. The fact that someone has lower grades and test scores doesn’t equate to that person contributing less to the university than someone with higher ones.

Not true.

Prior to changing the admissions criteria to keep the number of Jews from exploding in Harvard, they didn't look at "holistic" admissions. The only brought in holistic admissions because the number of Jews were getting 'uncomfortable" at Harvard.

Exactly. Pro-Affirmative Action folks are today's Nazis. Just admit it AA apologists. Hurts doesn't it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:China and India alone have almost 3 billion citizens.

Chinese immigrants number about 2 million a year to the US. Immigrants from India have about the same numbers.

These immigrants come here for education and better quality of life. They are a tiny percentage of Asians but they are the most likely to be hardest working with some money and family connections.

I have a friend who came here from China as a child. We have children in the same grade and are close. The rest of her extended family will not allow their children to be friends with American children. They see Americans as lazy and a distraction.

It’s a different culture and with that amount of people the Asian population could easily fill MIT, Harvard, etc a thousand times over. What are they supposed to do, especially if most of them go back to their country of origin?

I don’t understand the question…what are they supposed to do about what?

Why should we be sympathetic to the families that won’t assimilate?

What are you talking about
They are the ones who assimilate to the American way and American dream - hardworking and competition

No, the American way (which is what has made this country historically such a great place)…is that you are proud of your heritage but you are now an American and you want to embrace the country in its entirety (foibles and all). If America evolved with just a bunch of ethnic cliques keeping to themselves, the country would have a much lower GDP and overall quality of life.

Help us really understand why you are immigrating here. Someone posted a list of top engineering schools and 13/20 were in Asia, so no need to go to college in the US (in fact why would you?). If you apparently hate the people and the system…help us understand.

But the kids we are talking about are Asian AMERICAN. Their parents emigrated; they had no choice but to grow up here, become American and exist in this system. They are US citizens and can't just move back to a home country that they will never fit into.

All these hardworking, extremely intelligent asian Americans are supposed to be good soldiers and "take the hit" for American values -- they lose on both on Affirmative Action (wrong race) and on legacy admits( immigrant parents) to these elite schools. So many of these kids are the brightest ones in their high school, and they have to watch as other classmates are accepted while they are not. Of course they are going to get upset.

Well, honestly, if it were me, and I had the option to go to school in another country, I absolutely would. I think some of the posters are cutting off their nose to spite their own face.

But do they have the option of going to school in another country?

These kids are no dual citizens -- they are US citizens. They live here. Their parents live here. Often their aunts and uncles and cousins do too, and maybe their grandparents are still in Asia, but they have passed away by college, so they don't have a real extended family in Asia.

They are American. They are not conditional citizens. They can't just "go back." They have to exist within this system and yes, it's a lottery to get into these school, but kids of other races have "ins", like, again affirmative action and legacy admits, that Asian Americans don't have access to.

Funny how some become racial justice warriors only when their kid gets rejected.

It really boils down to " my Asian American kid doesn't have a hook to get into Harvard like the URMs and ALDCs - unfair! Bwwahhh!"

It's not about being a "racial justice warrior." The question of whether or not Asian Americans are being discriminated against in college admissions is such a legitimate question that it has gone to the Supreme Court. And when Asian Americans who bring it up here, they are being, honestly, gaslighted and made to feel that they are crazy when we can see that it may actually be happening.

The actual numbers prove otherwise. There is no shortage of Asian representation at any highly regarded university in this country. To be honest, their over representation feels more like gaslighting.

+1

Well stated. Wonder if the Supreme Court will notice this, and act accordingly?

Every individual should be viewed and treated as an individual not as a part of a group.

That makes sense. Thank you.

It might make sense but does not necessarily carry the day.


It has NEVER been the case that even elite colleges only wanted high GPA + test scores. They want a range of students, academically, socioeconomically, ethnically, geographically, and with different talents and skills.

But colleges have never just gone down the list of GPA and test scores to build the most academically accomplished class it can. That’s a very narrow idea of what a university is about and what it does. Grades, and to an even greater extent, test scores, measure only a fraction of a person’s abilities. That’s why I really don’t mind holistic admissions. The fact that someone has lower grades and test scores doesn’t equate to that person contributing less to the university than someone with higher ones.

Not true.

Prior to changing the admissions criteria to keep the number of Jews from exploding in Harvard, they didn't look at "holistic" admissions. The only brought in holistic admissions because the number of Jews were getting 'uncomfortable" at Harvard.

and Jews and Asians are perfectly fine with holistic whatever.
They get good scores on ECs, leadership, interview, sports, music, art, essay, whatever
Whatever the rule is, bring it on.

However when they do shit like 'manliness score' or 'likability score', really WTF.
What kind of sick people are rooting for this??

[Anonymous]

Wow, either the trolls are out in full force for this one, or just one is feeling particularly energetic the past few days. Hard to blame them given how many are falling for the bait.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wow, either the trolls are out in full force for this one, or just one is feeling particularly energetic the past few days. Hard to blame them given how many are falling for the bait.

It's just one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Let’s let the census drive the discussion. A university can have up to the maximum per category below. If they don’t get enough applicants per category then they can take the next most qualified from another category.

White - 59.3%
Hispanic - 18.9%
Black -12.6%
Asian - 5.9%
Multiracial - 2.3%
American Indian/Alaska Native - 0.7%
Native Hawaiian/Pacific Islander - 0.3%

Given that Asians are ~30% of the incoming Harvard class, I'm gonna guess they would not like this. Fact is they are not "underrepresented". And no, college should not be all asians or all white or all black or all anything, unless that is only who applies.

Fact is the Usa is a melting pot and colleges will be as well.

[Anonymous]

yea it's a done deal.
let's get over with this, move on, and focus on ALDC

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:China and India alone have almost 3 billion citizens.

Chinese immigrants number about 2 million a year to the US. Immigrants from India have about the same numbers.

These immigrants come here for education and better quality of life. They are a tiny percentage of Asians but they are the most likely to be hardest working with some money and family connections.

I have a friend who came here from China as a child. We have children in the same grade and are close. The rest of her extended family will not allow their children to be friends with American children. They see Americans as lazy and a distraction.

It’s a different culture and with that amount of people the Asian population could easily fill MIT, Harvard, etc a thousand times over. What are they supposed to do, especially if most of them go back to their country of origin?

I don’t understand the question…what are they supposed to do about what?

Why should we be sympathetic to the families that won’t assimilate?

What are you talking about
They are the ones who assimilate to the American way and American dream - hardworking and competition

No, the American way (which is what has made this country historically such a great place)…is that you are proud of your heritage but you are now an American and you want to embrace the country in its entirety (foibles and all). If America evolved with just a bunch of ethnic cliques keeping to themselves, the country would have a much lower GDP and overall quality of life.

Help us really understand why you are immigrating here. Someone posted a list of top engineering schools and 13/20 were in Asia, so no need to go to college in the US (in fact why would you?). If you apparently hate the people and the system…help us understand.

But the kids we are talking about are Asian AMERICAN. Their parents emigrated; they had no choice but to grow up here, become American and exist in this system. They are US citizens and can't just move back to a home country that they will never fit into.

All these hardworking, extremely intelligent asian Americans are supposed to be good soldiers and "take the hit" for American values -- they lose on both on Affirmative Action (wrong race) and on legacy admits( immigrant parents) to these elite schools. So many of these kids are the brightest ones in their high school, and they have to watch as other classmates are accepted while they are not. Of course they are going to get upset.

Well, honestly, if it were me, and I had the option to go to school in another country, I absolutely would. I think some of the posters are cutting off their nose to spite their own face.

But do they have the option of going to school in another country?

These kids are no dual citizens -- they are US citizens. They live here. Their parents live here. Often their aunts and uncles and cousins do too, and maybe their grandparents are still in Asia, but they have passed away by college, so they don't have a real extended family in Asia.

They are American. They are not conditional citizens. They can't just "go back." They have to exist within this system and yes, it's a lottery to get into these school, but kids of other races have "ins", like, again affirmative action and legacy admits, that Asian Americans don't have access to.

Funny how some become racial justice warriors only when their kid gets rejected.

It really boils down to " my Asian American kid doesn't have a hook to get into Harvard like the URMs and ALDCs - unfair! Bwwahhh!"

It's not about being a "racial justice warrior." The question of whether or not Asian Americans are being discriminated against in college admissions is such a legitimate question that it has gone to the Supreme Court. And when Asian Americans who bring it up here, they are being, honestly, gaslighted and made to feel that they are crazy when we can see that it may actually be happening.

The actual numbers prove otherwise. There is no shortage of Asian representation at any highly regarded university in this country. To be honest, their over representation feels more like gaslighting.

+1

Well stated. Wonder if the Supreme Court will notice this, and act accordingly?

Every individual should be viewed and treated as an individual not as a part of a group.

That makes sense. Thank you.

It might make sense but does not necessarily carry the day.


It has NEVER been the case that even elite colleges only wanted high GPA + test scores. They want a range of students, academically, socioeconomically, ethnically, geographically, and with different talents and skills.

But colleges have never just gone down the list of GPA and test scores to build the most academically accomplished class it can. That’s a very narrow idea of what a university is about and what it does. Grades, and to an even greater extent, test scores, measure only a fraction of a person’s abilities. That’s why I really don’t mind holistic admissions. The fact that someone has lower grades and test scores doesn’t equate to that person contributing less to the university than someone with higher ones.

Not true.

Prior to changing the admissions criteria to keep the number of Jews from exploding in Harvard, they didn't look at "holistic" admissions. The only brought in holistic admissions because the number of Jews were getting 'uncomfortable" at Harvard.

and Jews and Asians are perfectly fine with holistic whatever.
They get good scores on ECs, leadership, interview, sports, music, art, essay, whatever
Whatever the rule is, bring it on.

However when they do shit like 'manliness score' or 'likability score', really WTF.
What kind of sick people are rooting for this??

If the Supreme Court strikes down what is going on at Harvard with a specific focus on the likability score, then affirmative action as done at most other schools will be almost completely unaffected. At most schools, that notion might be implicitly built-in to someone's subjective evaluations of the rest of the file, but it wouldn't be expressed in a separate category.

[Anonymous]

Hello?

You do realize that Jewish people started their own colleges, in response to the (very real, not imagined) discrimination?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hello?

You do realize that Jewish people started their own colleges, in response to the (very real, not imagined) discrimination?

and Stanford recently apologized.

History is repeating.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:China and India alone have almost 3 billion citizens.

Chinese immigrants number about 2 million a year to the US. Immigrants from India have about the same numbers.

These immigrants come here for education and better quality of life. They are a tiny percentage of Asians but they are the most likely to be hardest working with some money and family connections.

I have a friend who came here from China as a child. We have children in the same grade and are close. The rest of her extended family will not allow their children to be friends with American children. They see Americans as lazy and a distraction.

It’s a different culture and with that amount of people the Asian population could easily fill MIT, Harvard, etc a thousand times over. What are they supposed to do, especially if most of them go back to their country of origin?

I don’t understand the question…what are they supposed to do about what?

Why should we be sympathetic to the families that won’t assimilate?

What are you talking about
They are the ones who assimilate to the American way and American dream - hardworking and competition

No, the American way (which is what has made this country historically such a great place)…is that you are proud of your heritage but you are now an American and you want to embrace the country in its entirety (foibles and all). If America evolved with just a bunch of ethnic cliques keeping to themselves, the country would have a much lower GDP and overall quality of life.

Help us really understand why you are immigrating here. Someone posted a list of top engineering schools and 13/20 were in Asia, so no need to go to college in the US (in fact why would you?). If you apparently hate the people and the system…help us understand.

But the kids we are talking about are Asian AMERICAN. Their parents emigrated; they had no choice but to grow up here, become American and exist in this system. They are US citizens and can't just move back to a home country that they will never fit into.

All these hardworking, extremely intelligent asian Americans are supposed to be good soldiers and "take the hit" for American values -- they lose on both on Affirmative Action (wrong race) and on legacy admits( immigrant parents) to these elite schools. So many of these kids are the brightest ones in their high school, and they have to watch as other classmates are accepted while they are not. Of course they are going to get upset.

Well, honestly, if it were me, and I had the option to go to school in another country, I absolutely would. I think some of the posters are cutting off their nose to spite their own face.

But do they have the option of going to school in another country?

These kids are no dual citizens -- they are US citizens. They live here. Their parents live here. Often their aunts and uncles and cousins do too, and maybe their grandparents are still in Asia, but they have passed away by college, so they don't have a real extended family in Asia.

They are American. They are not conditional citizens. They can't just "go back." They have to exist within this system and yes, it's a lottery to get into these school, but kids of other races have "ins", like, again affirmative action and legacy admits, that Asian Americans don't have access to.

Funny how some become racial justice warriors only when their kid gets rejected.

It really boils down to " my Asian American kid doesn't have a hook to get into Harvard like the URMs and ALDCs - unfair! Bwwahhh!"

It's not about being a "racial justice warrior." The question of whether or not Asian Americans are being discriminated against in college admissions is such a legitimate question that it has gone to the Supreme Court. And when Asian Americans who bring it up here, they are being, honestly, gaslighted and made to feel that they are crazy when we can see that it may actually be happening.

The actual numbers prove otherwise. There is no shortage of Asian representation at any highly regarded university in this country. To be honest, their over representation feels more like gaslighting.

+1

Well stated. Wonder if the Supreme Court will notice this, and act accordingly?

Every individual should be viewed and treated as an individual not as a part of a group.

That makes sense. Thank you.

It might make sense but does not necessarily carry the day.


It has NEVER been the case that even elite colleges only wanted high GPA + test scores. They want a range of students, academically, socioeconomically, ethnically, geographically, and with different talents and skills.

But colleges have never just gone down the list of GPA and test scores to build the most academically accomplished class it can. That’s a very narrow idea of what a university is about and what it does. Grades, and to an even greater extent, test scores, measure only a fraction of a person’s abilities. That’s why I really don’t mind holistic admissions. The fact that someone has lower grades and test scores doesn’t equate to that person contributing less to the university than someone with higher ones.

Not true.

Prior to changing the admissions criteria to keep the number of Jews from exploding in Harvard, they didn't look at "holistic" admissions. The only brought in holistic admissions because the number of Jews were getting 'uncomfortable" at Harvard.

and Jews and Asians are perfectly fine with holistic whatever.
They get good scores on ECs, leadership, interview, sports, music, art, essay, whatever
Whatever the rule is, bring it on.

However when they do shit like 'manliness score' or 'likability score', really WTF.
What kind of sick people are rooting for this??

If the Supreme Court strikes down what is going on at Harvard with a specific focus on the likability score, then affirmative action as done at most other schools will be almost completely unaffected. At most schools, that notion might be implicitly built-in to someone's subjective evaluations of the rest of the file, but it wouldn't be expressed in a separate category.

Nobody really know what has been going on with other colleges.
One thing for sure is they must be really careful not to get caught again.
When they get sued, all the data is revealed. Data doesn't lie.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:China and India alone have almost 3 billion citizens.

Chinese immigrants number about 2 million a year to the US. Immigrants from India have about the same numbers.

These immigrants come here for education and better quality of life. They are a tiny percentage of Asians but they are the most likely to be hardest working with some money and family connections.

I have a friend who came here from China as a child. We have children in the same grade and are close. The rest of her extended family will not allow their children to be friends with American children. They see Americans as lazy and a distraction.

It’s a different culture and with that amount of people the Asian population could easily fill MIT, Harvard, etc a thousand times over. What are they supposed to do, especially if most of them go back to their country of origin?

I don’t understand the question…what are they supposed to do about what?

Why should we be sympathetic to the families that won’t assimilate?

What are you talking about
They are the ones who assimilate to the American way and American dream - hardworking and competition

No, the American way (which is what has made this country historically such a great place)…is that you are proud of your heritage but you are now an American and you want to embrace the country in its entirety (foibles and all). If America evolved with just a bunch of ethnic cliques keeping to themselves, the country would have a much lower GDP and overall quality of life.

Help us really understand why you are immigrating here. Someone posted a list of top engineering schools and 13/20 were in Asia, so no need to go to college in the US (in fact why would you?). If you apparently hate the people and the system…help us understand.

But the kids we are talking about are Asian AMERICAN. Their parents emigrated; they had no choice but to grow up here, become American and exist in this system. They are US citizens and can't just move back to a home country that they will never fit into.

All these hardworking, extremely intelligent asian Americans are supposed to be good soldiers and "take the hit" for American values -- they lose on both on Affirmative Action (wrong race) and on legacy admits( immigrant parents) to these elite schools. So many of these kids are the brightest ones in their high school, and they have to watch as other classmates are accepted while they are not. Of course they are going to get upset.

Well, honestly, if it were me, and I had the option to go to school in another country, I absolutely would. I think some of the posters are cutting off their nose to spite their own face.

But do they have the option of going to school in another country?

These kids are no dual citizens -- they are US citizens. They live here. Their parents live here. Often their aunts and uncles and cousins do too, and maybe their grandparents are still in Asia, but they have passed away by college, so they don't have a real extended family in Asia.

They are American. They are not conditional citizens. They can't just "go back." They have to exist within this system and yes, it's a lottery to get into these school, but kids of other races have "ins", like, again affirmative action and legacy admits, that Asian Americans don't have access to.

I don't understand what you are talking about. Every year, thousands of American-born and bred kids go to school in Canada, UK, Europe, etc. They aren't dual citizens or have any family or friends in these countries...they just made a conscious decision to go abroad for college.

How is it any different than your kids deciding to go abroad to the many top Chinese/HK/Singapore/India colleges? How is it any different than the thousands of native Chinese, Indians, etc. who attend college in the US?

Thank you for raising this issue.

Americans go abroad for college because (wait for it)

There is no room at American colleges.

Are you beginning to understand now?

It's totally the opposite actually.
There are 4000+ colleges in the US.

The seats are much smaller in other countries.
They are more controlled.

Yup - but people want an "answer" to "how to get in" to T20, and there is no answer.

The "answer" is to let your kid shine at being themselves, not shine at how good their tutor is. But supposedly that is a rubbish, lazy, White American idea, and only certain schools will do, and only having an "answer", through tutors, etc. will do.

What they have been told all this time is not working (or the "answer"), and people are upset, and think it is some kind of "conspiracy" to keep Asians out, when it clearly is not.

And you smartly recognize that no matter how "excellent your resume is" you may still not gain admission to the school of your dreams. That is okay, it happens to most people and you will be just fine attending your next choices. You are not entitled to an elite university admissions