New bike lane on Old Georgetown Rd in Bethesda

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’ve seen HS kids we know riding (we assume) to WJ in the morning. I feel safer knowing they are in the bike lane.

Maybe they are riding their bikes now because thanks to these bike lanes their school bus is stuck in traffic and they don’t want to be late for school.

Yes, bikes can be a great, speedy, and efficient transportation option. Active transportation in the morning before school also helps with learning. I'm really glad the WJ kids have a safe option for biking along Old Georgetown to school now. Plenty of WJ kids bike to school and from school, and I know of several who have been hit in the past. The bike lanes and safe sidewalks will also be great when the Woodward building is done and the Northwood kids come for 2 years, and then later when Woodward itself opens, of course.

This sounds absolutely crazy.

[Anonymous]

Just wait until these Bethesda blowhards figure out that Northwood kids will be in their enclave for two years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I could be wrong, but the last 10 - 15 pages of this has one incredibly triggered NIMBY just screaming into a void. And tbh, I'm kinda here for it.

The bike lanes are great for the NIMBYs. They reduce the capacity of the road and make it more likely that proposals to increase density along OGR will fail the infrastructure test. For those that do pass the test, the longer commute times from the northern part of OGR to the beltway and downtown Bethesda will reduce demand and therefore revenue potential, so fewer projects will pencil out and fewer new people will move in. At the same time, the people in the neighborhoods along OGR got a great new (basically private) amenity that connects them to a library, a school, and a shopping center. The amenity won’t bring a lot of people from outside the neighborhood because it fails to connect housing centers and job centers or transit. All in all, it’s a great win for residents who were able to get the state to act even though there are other roads that have had even more pedestrian fatalities and haven’t had adequate safety improvements. There was a day when the widening of OGR was controversial in these neighborhoods and now they’ve finally prevailed over the third lanes. Well played, Bethesda. You really are winners at life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I could be wrong, but the last 10 - 15 pages of this has one incredibly triggered NIMBY just screaming into a void. And tbh, I'm kinda here for it.

The bike lanes are great for the NIMBYs. They reduce the capacity of the road and make it more likely that proposals to increase density along OGR will fail the infrastructure test. For those that do pass the test, the longer commute times from the northern part of OGR to the beltway and downtown Bethesda will reduce demand and therefore revenue potential, so fewer projects will pencil out and fewer new people will move in. At the same time, the people in the neighborhoods along OGR got a great new (basically private) amenity that connects them to a library, a school, and a shopping center. The amenity won’t bring a lot of people from outside the neighborhood because it fails to connect housing centers and job centers or transit. All in all, it’s a great win for residents who were able to get the state to act even though there are other roads that have had even more pedestrian fatalities and haven’t had adequate safety improvements. There was a day when the widening of OGR was controversial in these neighborhoods and now they’ve finally prevailed over the third lanes. Well played, Bethesda. You really are winners at life.

I sincerely look forward to more Bethesda residents figuring out how much they benefit from the Old Georgetown Road bike lanes and other safety improvements. This will also help move safety improvement projects forward on other state roads that are dangerous, like New Hampshire Avenue or Georgia Avenue or Norbeck Road. Maybe the state will even restore and extend the bike lanes on University Boulevard, which were removed in response to complaints from a few residents, even though they met or even exceeded all of the state's measures of success. That would be outstanding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I could be wrong, but the last 10 - 15 pages of this has one incredibly triggered NIMBY just screaming into a void. And tbh, I'm kinda here for it.

The bike lanes are great for the NIMBYs. They reduce the capacity of the road and make it more likely that proposals to increase density along OGR will fail the infrastructure test. For those that do pass the test, the longer commute times from the northern part of OGR to the beltway and downtown Bethesda will reduce demand and therefore revenue potential, so fewer projects will pencil out and fewer new people will move in. At the same time, the people in the neighborhoods along OGR got a great new (basically private) amenity that connects them to a library, a school, and a shopping center. The amenity won’t bring a lot of people from outside the neighborhood because it fails to connect housing centers and job centers or transit. All in all, it’s a great win for residents who were able to get the state to act even though there are other roads that have had even more pedestrian fatalities and haven’t had adequate safety improvements. There was a day when the widening of OGR was controversial in these neighborhoods and now they’ve finally prevailed over the third lanes. Well played, Bethesda. You really are winners at life.

I sincerely look forward to more Bethesda residents figuring out how much they benefit from the Old Georgetown Road bike lanes and other safety improvements. This will also help move safety improvement projects forward on other state roads that are dangerous, like New Hampshire Avenue or Georgia Avenue or Norbeck Road. Maybe the state will even restore and extend the bike lanes on University Boulevard, which were removed in response to complaints from a few residents, even though they met or even exceeded all of the state's measures of success. That would be outstanding.

Yeah no. The end result of this is a few people are happy, a lot of people are screwed and the rallying cry for opposition to all future such proposals is say look at that disaster on Old Georgetown Road, we don’t want that here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I could be wrong, but the last 10 - 15 pages of this has one incredibly triggered NIMBY just screaming into a void. And tbh, I'm kinda here for it.

The bike lanes are great for the NIMBYs. They reduce the capacity of the road and make it more likely that proposals to increase density along OGR will fail the infrastructure test. For those that do pass the test, the longer commute times from the northern part of OGR to the beltway and downtown Bethesda will reduce demand and therefore revenue potential, so fewer projects will pencil out and fewer new people will move in. At the same time, the people in the neighborhoods along OGR got a great new (basically private) amenity that connects them to a library, a school, and a shopping center. The amenity won’t bring a lot of people from outside the neighborhood because it fails to connect housing centers and job centers or transit. All in all, it’s a great win for residents who were able to get the state to act even though there are other roads that have had even more pedestrian fatalities and haven’t had adequate safety improvements. There was a day when the widening of OGR was controversial in these neighborhoods and now they’ve finally prevailed over the third lanes. Well played, Bethesda. You really are winners at life.

Yes and no. Old Georgetown Road was not identified as a “growth corridor” in Thrive so increased density was always going to be unlikely. In addition, the planned housing development at Montgomery Mall should not be affected by traffic tests because it’s far enough away and has direct freeway access. There is the new condo building going up at Rugby Ave but that’s outside the bike lane zone and was approved years ago. After that, there is not a lot of opportunity for increased density on Old Georgetown Rd. No way they tear down Wildwood for housing and the Giant does too much business which keeps that shopping center alive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I could be wrong, but the last 10 - 15 pages of this has one incredibly triggered NIMBY just screaming into a void. And tbh, I'm kinda here for it.

The bike lanes are great for the NIMBYs. They reduce the capacity of the road and make it more likely that proposals to increase density along OGR will fail the infrastructure test. For those that do pass the test, the longer commute times from the northern part of OGR to the beltway and downtown Bethesda will reduce demand and therefore revenue potential, so fewer projects will pencil out and fewer new people will move in. At the same time, the people in the neighborhoods along OGR got a great new (basically private) amenity that connects them to a library, a school, and a shopping center. The amenity won’t bring a lot of people from outside the neighborhood because it fails to connect housing centers and job centers or transit. All in all, it’s a great win for residents who were able to get the state to act even though there are other roads that have had even more pedestrian fatalities and haven’t had adequate safety improvements. There was a day when the widening of OGR was controversial in these neighborhoods and now they’ve finally prevailed over the third lanes. Well played, Bethesda. You really are winners at life.

Yes and no. Old Georgetown Road was not identified as a “growth corridor” in Thrive so increased density was always going to be unlikely. In addition, the planned housing development at Montgomery Mall should not be affected by traffic tests because it’s far enough away and has direct freeway access. There is the new condo building going up at Rugby Ave but that’s outside the bike lane zone and was approved years ago. After that, there is not a lot of opportunity for increased density on Old Georgetown Rd. No way they tear down Wildwood for housing and the Giant does too much business which keeps that shopping center alive.

There is a lot of development proposed around pike and rose, including missing middle housing where the old office parks are. The general plan is meaningless and they will approve everything a developer proposes regardless of what the plans say.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I could be wrong, but the last 10 - 15 pages of this has one incredibly triggered NIMBY just screaming into a void. And tbh, I'm kinda here for it.

The bike lanes are great for the NIMBYs. They reduce the capacity of the road and make it more likely that proposals to increase density along OGR will fail the infrastructure test. For those that do pass the test, the longer commute times from the northern part of OGR to the beltway and downtown Bethesda will reduce demand and therefore revenue potential, so fewer projects will pencil out and fewer new people will move in. At the same time, the people in the neighborhoods along OGR got a great new (basically private) amenity that connects them to a library, a school, and a shopping center. The amenity won’t bring a lot of people from outside the neighborhood because it fails to connect housing centers and job centers or transit. All in all, it’s a great win for residents who were able to get the state to act even though there are other roads that have had even more pedestrian fatalities and haven’t had adequate safety improvements. There was a day when the widening of OGR was controversial in these neighborhoods and now they’ve finally prevailed over the third lanes. Well played, Bethesda. You really are winners at life.

Yes and no. Old Georgetown Road was not identified as a “growth corridor” in Thrive so increased density was always going to be unlikely. In addition, the planned housing development at Montgomery Mall should not be affected by traffic tests because it’s far enough away and has direct freeway access. There is the new condo building going up at Rugby Ave but that’s outside the bike lane zone and was approved years ago. After that, there is not a lot of opportunity for increased density on Old Georgetown Rd. No way they tear down Wildwood for housing and the Giant does too much business which keeps that shopping center alive.

There is a lot of development proposed around pike and rose, including missing middle housing where the old office parks are. The general plan is meaningless and they will approve everything a developer proposes regardless of what the plans say.

Transit Oriented Development in Montgomery County is exempt for traffic tests and transportation impact fees.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I could be wrong, but the last 10 - 15 pages of this has one incredibly triggered NIMBY just screaming into a void. And tbh, I'm kinda here for it.

The bike lanes are great for the NIMBYs. They reduce the capacity of the road and make it more likely that proposals to increase density along OGR will fail the infrastructure test. For those that do pass the test, the longer commute times from the northern part of OGR to the beltway and downtown Bethesda will reduce demand and therefore revenue potential, so fewer projects will pencil out and fewer new people will move in. At the same time, the people in the neighborhoods along OGR got a great new (basically private) amenity that connects them to a library, a school, and a shopping center. The amenity won’t bring a lot of people from outside the neighborhood because it fails to connect housing centers and job centers or transit. All in all, it’s a great win for residents who were able to get the state to act even though there are other roads that have had even more pedestrian fatalities and haven’t had adequate safety improvements. There was a day when the widening of OGR was controversial in these neighborhoods and now they’ve finally prevailed over the third lanes. Well played, Bethesda. You really are winners at life.

Yes and no. Old Georgetown Road was not identified as a “growth corridor” in Thrive so increased density was always going to be unlikely. In addition, the planned housing development at Montgomery Mall should not be affected by traffic tests because it’s far enough away and has direct freeway access. There is the new condo building going up at Rugby Ave but that’s outside the bike lane zone and was approved years ago. After that, there is not a lot of opportunity for increased density on Old Georgetown Rd. No way they tear down Wildwood for housing and the Giant does too much business which keeps that shopping center alive.

There is a lot of development proposed around pike and rose, including missing middle housing where the old office parks are. The general plan is meaningless and they will approve everything a developer proposes regardless of what the plans say.

Transit Oriented Development in Montgomery County is exempt for traffic tests and transportation impact fees.

But not from market forces and if you look at these plans they are very clearly designed for people driving to work. Some of them have even gotten approval to exceed parking maximums. The attractiveness of these properties will be sensitive to increased commuting time. Maybe they’ll still pencil out and maybe they won’t. Just because someone gets a plan approved doesn’t mean they have to build.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I could be wrong, but the last 10 - 15 pages of this has one incredibly triggered NIMBY just screaming into a void. And tbh, I'm kinda here for it.

The bike lanes are great for the NIMBYs. They reduce the capacity of the road and make it more likely that proposals to increase density along OGR will fail the infrastructure test. For those that do pass the test, the longer commute times from the northern part of OGR to the beltway and downtown Bethesda will reduce demand and therefore revenue potential, so fewer projects will pencil out and fewer new people will move in. At the same time, the people in the neighborhoods along OGR got a great new (basically private) amenity that connects them to a library, a school, and a shopping center. The amenity won’t bring a lot of people from outside the neighborhood because it fails to connect housing centers and job centers or transit. All in all, it’s a great win for residents who were able to get the state to act even though there are other roads that have had even more pedestrian fatalities and haven’t had adequate safety improvements. There was a day when the widening of OGR was controversial in these neighborhoods and now they’ve finally prevailed over the third lanes. Well played, Bethesda. You really are winners at life.

Yes and no. Old Georgetown Road was not identified as a “growth corridor” in Thrive so increased density was always going to be unlikely. In addition, the planned housing development at Montgomery Mall should not be affected by traffic tests because it’s far enough away and has direct freeway access. There is the new condo building going up at Rugby Ave but that’s outside the bike lane zone and was approved years ago. After that, there is not a lot of opportunity for increased density on Old Georgetown Rd. No way they tear down Wildwood for housing and the Giant does too much business which keeps that shopping center alive.

There is a lot of development proposed around pike and rose, including missing middle housing where the old office parks are. The general plan is meaningless and they will approve everything a developer proposes regardless of what the plans say.

Transit Oriented Development in Montgomery County is exempt for traffic tests and transportation impact fees.

But not from market forces and if you look at these plans they are very clearly designed for people driving to work. Some of them have even gotten approval to exceed parking maximums. The attractiveness of these properties will be sensitive to increased commuting time. Maybe they’ll still pencil out and maybe they won’t. Just because someone gets a plan approved doesn’t mean they have to build.

You are correct. This is very true. All of the plans have more parking than the parking minimums. White Flint Phase II is probably dead as a result and similarly Rock Springs is going to seriously suffer. Who’s going to move into the former Marriott and Choice Hotels HQs now? What potential do they have for residential conversion now? It’s all pretty dumb and that’s what happens when decision makers allow ideologues to shape and control public policy. WABA had a seat at the table throughout but there was no effort to conduct community outreach which would have led to a better result that would have more buy-in.

Less so that future development, I’m just thinking about how they think existing development can remain viable. There is a lot of vacant commercial office space in downtown Bethesda. What company in their right mind would lease it under these traffic conditions? It was always folly to go high rise in downtown Bethesda due to the lack of direct freeway access. It only and barely works if OGR and 355 are not massively congested. They are trying to turn 355 into a boulevard and now they intentionally did this to OGR. It just seems so foolish I don’t have words and this is why Montgomery County is falling behind economically.

[Anonymous]

Nope. Once the project is finished and they evaluate it, it'll fail and the paint and plastic will be removed. It's only a matter of time

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Nope. Once the project is finished and they evaluate it, it'll fail and the paint and plastic will be removed. It's only a matter of time

SHA issued a press release recently that indicates they are digging in their heels. They seem to believe that an adjustment period is needed and then very thing will be fine. My experience with SHA is that they do what they want and are reflexively defensive. For example, they refuse to release accident stats for intersections.

However, Korman is a man of his word and is quite powerful and the business community has to be up in arms. So I’m confident there will be some changes eventually. Even cyclists are saying that it’s too much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nope. Once the project is finished and they evaluate it, it'll fail and the paint and plastic will be removed. It's only a matter of time

SHA issued a press release recently that indicates they are digging in their heels. They seem to believe that an adjustment period is needed and then very thing will be fine. My experience with SHA is that they do what they want and are reflexively defensive. For example, they refuse to release accident stats for intersections.

However, Korman is a man of his word and is quite powerful and the business community has to be up in arms. So I’m confident there will be some changes eventually. Even cyclists are saying that it’s too much.

If all else fails, the developers whose properties have again been devalued by the government will throw a fit and the bike lanes will go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nope. Once the project is finished and they evaluate it, it'll fail and the paint and plastic will be removed. It's only a matter of time

SHA issued a press release recently that indicates they are digging in their heels. They seem to believe that an adjustment period is needed and then very thing will be fine. My experience with SHA is that they do what they want and are reflexively defensive. For example, they refuse to release accident stats for intersections.

However, Korman is a man of his word and is quite powerful and the business community has to be up in arms. So I’m confident there will be some changes eventually. Even cyclists are saying that it’s too much.

You don't say.

Once the project is finished and they evaluate it, this is what they'll find: fewer serious crashes, fewer injury crashes, less speeding, minimal effect on overall driving times, more people bicycling, much more comfortable walking, overall increase in safety.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nope. Once the project is finished and they evaluate it, it'll fail and the paint and plastic will be removed. It's only a matter of time

SHA issued a press release recently that indicates they are digging in their heels. They seem to believe that an adjustment period is needed and then very thing will be fine. My experience with SHA is that they do what they want and are reflexively defensive. For example, they refuse to release accident stats for intersections.

However, Korman is a man of his word and is quite powerful and the business community has to be up in arms. So I’m confident there will be some changes eventually. Even cyclists are saying that it’s too much.

You don't say.

Once the project is finished and they evaluate it, this is what they'll find: fewer serious crashes, fewer injury crashes, less speeding, minimal effect on overall driving times, more people bicycling, much more comfortable walking, overall increase in safety.

You don’t seem well versed in what is going on, which makes sense because you don’t live in the county and I don’t know why you’re so invested in what happens in other peoples communities. But if you must, go argue with WABA because they are promoting and endorsing changes. Probably because they know if there are not changes this will be the last bike lane ever installed on a major arterial in the county.