S/O What should MoCo do about parking in downtown Bethesda

[Anonymous]

Starting this because it does not belong on a thread about Alexandria.

Should MoCo have parking minimums for new development? Should it have parking maximums for new development? Should it attempt to redevelop existing parking garages into new buildings with more other uses (offices, apts) and less parking? Should it allow private developers to do that with private parking garages? What should its policy be on govt owned garages?

I get the impression some people thing there is a move afoot to ban all parking, or even all cars, from downtown Bethesda. But I am pretty sure that is not on the agenda of anyone in MoCo govt. More likely they will just allow more development, with less new parking, and focus on shifting more people to other modes - but still allowing people to use cars to access downtown Bethesda. And of course discouraging its use as a place for people to park to use metro to get to downtown DC.

[Anonymous]

I'm not sure anyone thinks parking will be banned or substantially reduced. But, based on the thread you mentioned, there are at least some people who think it should be because every should/will take the bus, bike, or walk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm not sure anyone thinks parking will be banned or substantially reduced. But, based on the thread you mentioned, there are at least some people who think it should be because every should/will take the bus, bike, or walk.

That thread went down a rabbit hole because one person wanted parking FOR METRO RIDERS because of her personal issues, and someone else pushed back against autocentrism in general. I don't think either actually mentioned any particular policy proposals.

It is a fact that garage entrances across sidewalks are a deterrent to comfortable walking, and can be a real safety issue for bike lanes. Its also certain that garages will exist for visitors (again, no policy to even ban them for new buildings in Bethesda, that I am aware of, much less getting rid of existing ones except as the market redevelops them) but better if they are not used by metro commuters. Not sure the policies to achieve that - municipal garages with good short term rates but no long term parking maybe?

[Anonymous]

A person was hit by a car in downtown Bethesda this morning, while crossing Bradley Blvd at the marked crosswalk with flashing lights at Strathmore Rd near the pet store. Life-threatening injuries.

I'm posting this for the information of the drive-to-Metro PP from the off-topic thread, who stated that there aren't any big roads in downtown Bethesda and that Bethesda is safe and comfortable for walking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A person was hit by a car in downtown Bethesda this morning, while crossing Bradley Blvd at the marked crosswalk with flashing lights at Strathmore Rd near the pet store. Life-threatening injuries.

I'm posting this for the information of the drive-to-Metro PP from the off-topic thread, who stated that there aren't any big roads in downtown Bethesda and that Bethesda is safe and comfortable for walking.

Things like that have happened in the Dupont Circle area I lived in before moving to Bethesda. Accidents happen. I walk all the time in Bethesda. It's not as safe as downtown DC for walking, but it's generally fine (except for all that construction near metro now).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A person was hit by a car in downtown Bethesda this morning, while crossing Bradley Blvd at the marked crosswalk with flashing lights at Strathmore Rd near the pet store. Life-threatening injuries.

I'm posting this for the information of the drive-to-Metro PP from the off-topic thread, who stated that there aren't any big roads in downtown Bethesda and that Bethesda is safe and comfortable for walking.

Things like that have happened in the Dupont Circle area I lived in before moving to Bethesda. Accidents happen. I walk all the time in Bethesda. It's not as safe as downtown DC for walking, but it's generally fine (except for all that construction near metro now).

Yes, accidents happen. But a crash involving a pedestrian with life-threatening injuries, on a high-speed road where drivers speed, in a place where lots of people walk - that's not an accident. That's a predictable consequence of the road design. Big high-speed roads + pedestrians = injured or dead pedestrians.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not sure anyone thinks parking will be banned or substantially reduced. But, based on the thread you mentioned, there are at least some people who think it should be because every should/will take the bus, bike, or walk.

That thread went down a rabbit hole because one person wanted parking FOR METRO RIDERS because of her personal issues, and someone else pushed back against autocentrism in general. I don't think either actually mentioned any particular policy proposals.

It is a fact that garage entrances across sidewalks are a deterrent to comfortable walking, and can be a real safety issue for bike lanes. Its also certain that garages will exist for visitors (again, no policy to even ban them for new buildings in Bethesda, that I am aware of, much less getting rid of existing ones except as the market redevelops them) but better if they are not used by metro commuters. Not sure the policies to achieve that - municipal garages with good short term rates but no long term parking maybe?

I don't think anyone was advocating for parking for metro riders specifically like the wmata lots further out. Rather, she was saying there was nothing wrong with people driving into Bethesda to use the metro. As is, there are lots of private lots people use, at least in part, for those purposes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A person was hit by a car in downtown Bethesda this morning, while crossing Bradley Blvd at the marked crosswalk with flashing lights at Strathmore Rd near the pet store. Life-threatening injuries.

I'm posting this for the information of the drive-to-Metro PP from the off-topic thread, who stated that there aren't any big roads in downtown Bethesda and that Bethesda is safe and comfortable for walking.

Things like that have happened in the Dupont Circle area I lived in before moving to Bethesda. Accidents happen. I walk all the time in Bethesda. It's not as safe as downtown DC for walking, but it's generally fine (except for all that construction near metro now).

Yes, accidents happen. But a crash involving a pedestrian with life-threatening injuries, on a high-speed road where drivers speed, in a place where lots of people walk - that's not an accident. That's a predictable consequence of the road design. Big high-speed roads + pedestrians = injured or dead pedestrians.

I live right near that corner you're mentioning, and saw no signs of an accident there as I walked to the metro this morning. No accident tape, or emergency vehicles or anything. Will wait to see the details on the news.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A person was hit by a car in downtown Bethesda this morning, while crossing Bradley Blvd at the marked crosswalk with flashing lights at Strathmore Rd near the pet store. Life-threatening injuries.

I'm posting this for the information of the drive-to-Metro PP from the off-topic thread, who stated that there aren't any big roads in downtown Bethesda and that Bethesda is safe and comfortable for walking.

Indeed this happened for those who haven't heard about it, as reported by MCFRS:
https://twitter.com/mcfrsPIO/status/1090976833632391168

These two mid-block crosswalks were installed a few years ago, and this was an accident waiting to happen. It's essentially around a blind curve.

In fact, it used to be you could park your car right up to just before the crosswalk, meaning drivers couldn't see anyone standing in the crosswalk at all. You can thank me they now have no parking signs for 2 car lengths before it -- I reported this to MD SHA and they agreed it was poor visibility.

The speed limit there is 30, and it's hardly a high-speed road due to how narrow it is. The issue is those crosswalks are on a curve and it's poor visibillity. They should move them to a straightaway, and ban parking for the entire block leading up to it so drivers can see people well in the crosswalk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A person was hit by a car in downtown Bethesda this morning, while crossing Bradley Blvd at the marked crosswalk with flashing lights at Strathmore Rd near the pet store. Life-threatening injuries.

I'm posting this for the information of the drive-to-Metro PP from the off-topic thread, who stated that there aren't any big roads in downtown Bethesda and that Bethesda is safe and comfortable for walking.

Things like that have happened in the Dupont Circle area I lived in before moving to Bethesda. Accidents happen. I walk all the time in Bethesda. It's not as safe as downtown DC for walking, but it's generally fine (except for all that construction near metro now).

Yes, accidents happen. But a crash involving a pedestrian with life-threatening injuries, on a high-speed road where drivers speed, in a place where lots of people walk - that's not an accident. That's a predictable consequence of the road design. Big high-speed roads + pedestrians = injured or dead pedestrians.

I live right near that corner you're mentioning, and saw no signs of an accident there as I walked to the metro this morning. No accident tape, or emergency vehicles or anything. Will wait to see the details on the news.

https://twitter.com/mcfrsPIO/status/1090976833632391168

[Anonymous]

Here is the crosswalk I believe:
https://goo.gl/maps/PHEKQsYXs6t

Notice that there is only about 1 car length of space in front of the crosswalk, then cars can park in front of it from 7am-7pm. The incident occurred around 8am, so my guess is a car was still parked there in front of the 7am-7pm sign. How can a driver be expected to see a pedestrian in that case? It's a really poor design.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A person was hit by a car in downtown Bethesda this morning, while crossing Bradley Blvd at the marked crosswalk with flashing lights at Strathmore Rd near the pet store. Life-threatening injuries.

I'm posting this for the information of the drive-to-Metro PP from the off-topic thread, who stated that there aren't any big roads in downtown Bethesda and that Bethesda is safe and comfortable for walking.

Indeed this happened for those who haven't heard about it, as reported by MCFRS:
https://twitter.com/mcfrsPIO/status/1090976833632391168

These two mid-block crosswalks were installed a few years ago, and this was an accident waiting to happen. It's essentially around a blind curve.

In fact, it used to be you could park your car right up to just before the crosswalk, meaning drivers couldn't see anyone standing in the crosswalk at all. You can thank me they now have no parking signs for 2 car lengths before it -- I reported this to MD SHA and they agreed it was poor visibility.

The speed limit there is 30, and it's hardly a high-speed road due to how narrow it is. The issue is those crosswalks are on a curve and it's poor visibillity. They should move them to a straightaway, and ban parking for the entire block leading up to it so drivers can see people well in the crosswalk.

The speed limit is 35 mph, and drivers already speed even with the parked cars. They would speed more if there weren't parked cars.

The crosswalk faciliies (pavement markings, flashing lights) are there because people cross there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A person was hit by a car in downtown Bethesda this morning, while crossing Bradley Blvd at the marked crosswalk with flashing lights at Strathmore Rd near the pet store. Life-threatening injuries.

I'm posting this for the information of the drive-to-Metro PP from the off-topic thread, who stated that there aren't any big roads in downtown Bethesda and that Bethesda is safe and comfortable for walking.

Indeed this happened for those who haven't heard about it, as reported by MCFRS:
https://twitter.com/mcfrsPIO/status/1090976833632391168

These two mid-block crosswalks were installed a few years ago, and this was an accident waiting to happen. It's essentially around a blind curve.

In fact, it used to be you could park your car right up to just before the crosswalk, meaning drivers couldn't see anyone standing in the crosswalk at all. You can thank me they now have no parking signs for 2 car lengths before it -- I reported this to MD SHA and they agreed it was poor visibility.

The speed limit there is 30, and it's hardly a high-speed road due to how narrow it is. The issue is those crosswalks are on a curve and it's poor visibillity. They should move them to a straightaway, and ban parking for the entire block leading up to it so drivers can see people well in the crosswalk.

I appreciate your work to make this road safer but the speed limit there is actually 35 which is too high - it should be 25 given the nature of the street:

https://www.google.com/maps/place/MD-191+%26+MD-355,+7,+MD+20815/@38.9780988,-77.0930197,3a,75y,302.92h,97.83t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCdgDCfaTti2-vHF2J5x3_w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!4m5!3m4!1s0x89b7c9777cadaabd:0x8e714de4e28e55c2!8m2!3d38.9771442!4d-77.0906091

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A person was hit by a car in downtown Bethesda this morning, while crossing Bradley Blvd at the marked crosswalk with flashing lights at Strathmore Rd near the pet store. Life-threatening injuries.

I'm posting this for the information of the drive-to-Metro PP from the off-topic thread, who stated that there aren't any big roads in downtown Bethesda and that Bethesda is safe and comfortable for walking.

Indeed this happened for those who haven't heard about it, as reported by MCFRS:
https://twitter.com/mcfrsPIO/status/1090976833632391168

These two mid-block crosswalks were installed a few years ago, and this was an accident waiting to happen. It's essentially around a blind curve.

In fact, it used to be you could park your car right up to just before the crosswalk, meaning drivers couldn't see anyone standing in the crosswalk at all. You can thank me they now have no parking signs for 2 car lengths before it -- I reported this to MD SHA and they agreed it was poor visibility.

The speed limit there is 30, and it's hardly a high-speed road due to how narrow it is. The issue is those crosswalks are on a curve and it's poor visibillity. They should move them to a straightaway, and ban parking for the entire block leading up to it so drivers can see people well in the crosswalk.

I appreciate your work to make this road safer but the speed limit there is actually 35 which is too high - it should be 25 given the nature of the street:

https://www.google.com/maps/place/MD-191+%26+MD-355,+7,+MD+20815/@38.9780988,-77.0930197,3a,75y,302.92h,97.83t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCdgDCfaTti2-vHF2J5x3_w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!4m5!3m4!1s0x89b7c9777cadaabd:0x8e714de4e28e55c2!8m2!3d38.9771442!4d-77.0906091

I don't think the speed limit is waht makes this dangerous -- it's the poor visibility of the crosswalk. On a curve with parked cars in front of it.

It's difficult to get up to 35 on that stretch, because it's so narrow for 2 cars to be driving beside each other.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A person was hit by a car in downtown Bethesda this morning, while crossing Bradley Blvd at the marked crosswalk with flashing lights at Strathmore Rd near the pet store. Life-threatening injuries.

I'm posting this for the information of the drive-to-Metro PP from the off-topic thread, who stated that there aren't any big roads in downtown Bethesda and that Bethesda is safe and comfortable for walking.

Indeed this happened for those who haven't heard about it, as reported by MCFRS:
https://twitter.com/mcfrsPIO/status/1090976833632391168

These two mid-block crosswalks were installed a few years ago, and this was an accident waiting to happen. It's essentially around a blind curve.

In fact, it used to be you could park your car right up to just before the crosswalk, meaning drivers couldn't see anyone standing in the crosswalk at all. You can thank me they now have no parking signs for 2 car lengths before it -- I reported this to MD SHA and they agreed it was poor visibility.

The speed limit there is 30, and it's hardly a high-speed road due to how narrow it is. The issue is those crosswalks are on a curve and it's poor visibillity. They should move them to a straightaway, and ban parking for the entire block leading up to it so drivers can see people well in the crosswalk.

I appreciate your work to make this road safer but the speed limit there is actually 35 which is too high - it should be 25 given the nature of the street:

https://www.google.com/maps/place/MD-191+%26+MD-355,+7,+MD+20815/@38.9780988,-77.0930197,3a,75y,302.92h,97.83t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCdgDCfaTti2-vHF2J5x3_w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!4m5!3m4!1s0x89b7c9777cadaabd:0x8e714de4e28e55c2!8m2!3d38.9771442!4d-77.0906091

I don't think the speed limit is waht makes this dangerous -- it's the poor visibility of the crosswalk. On a curve with parked cars in front of it.

It's difficult to get up to 35 on that stretch, because it's so narrow for 2 cars to be driving beside each other.

Maryland drivers always find a way to speed and the road isn't too narrow for two lanes of traffic it just appears that way which does at least help a bit but the center lane has no visual crowding.

If people were driving 25 instead of 35 the visibility of the crosswalks would be much less of an issue. Isn't the speed limit on River Road now 35 - does it make sense to have the same speed limit here?