The prospect of kids not going back to school until 2021

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys saying the kids will go back when there is a vaccine are really crazy.

That could be 6 months or it could be 5 years. Are you honestly ok with kids not going back to school for 5 years?

I'm honestly not ok with a mediocre education 1 hour a day for the next 5 years. They are going to be the lost generation.

Yes. And lack of education is a public health outcome.

[Anonymous]

Just watch, by Mid-August, every other county in Maryland will have announced that they will be open in the fall but MoCo will not have made an announcement. Residents will be enraged, Elrich will be shamed, and schools will open. Mark my words. Our leadership is a joke.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
This. I really hope public pressure is going to become so intense that the safetyists won't be able to implement their indefinite school reduction plan for more than a few months.

I've been fully compliant will stay-at-home orders, I diligently wear a mask when I go among people and I think everyone should (except young kids), but keeping kids in very part-time school for the foreseeable future is a crazy plan and really discredits the whole lockdown approach, to goal of which was ostensibly to flatten the curve and prevent hospitals from getting overwhelmed. Covid will be with us for a while and life has never been risk-free. We have to weigh costs and benefits, as we do in all areas of life. It's not like Covid is such an outsized threat compared to all the other things one could die of on any given day that we should just completely stop forever living normal lives with reasonable precautions. I hardly ever agree with Republicans on anything, but on this matter, they have a point.

I know everyone is counting on a vaccine within the next year but that is far from certain.

You're being way too reasonable for this crowd.

+100. First it was to flatten the curve, then it just continued. And now it seems like the new goal is 0% risk. 0% risk is not logical or attainable. Yet, here we are with no end date. I mean, we can't just keep the school situation all messed up for an undisclosed period of time. It's ridiculous.

Schools are the only consistent forum in this country where hundreds to thousands of people crowd together in small boxes, thin hallways, and tight stairwells. You're practically begging the infection rates to skyrocket by opening them up again.

Governments have to think of the well-being of the community. Not just the desires of fed-up parents.

Except that data from countries that never locked down their schools don't show them to be the cause of skyrocketing infection rates. How does that information fit into your worldview?

We've all seen the articles and the pictures of schools around the world opening up. None of them are crowded-there are a few masked kids sitting well-spaced out in a classroom, kids sitting in a marked off circle in the grass, kids lining up for temperature checks and tests. We can't even afford to supply our classrooms with pencils with our current budgets. Parents demand their kids back full time, so there's no way to reduce crowding.
How do YOU not understand the difference?

I said COUNTRIES THAT NEVER LOCKED DOWN THEIR SCHOOLS. Sweden, for instance, never shut down elementary schools, recognizing that DL was not feasible at that age. They kept operating at full capacity. Learn to read and check the facts.

Sweden didn't lockdown and they're suffering for it. I don't think this is the evidence you think it is.

They just became the country with the second-highest infection rate per capita in the WORLD and if you don't understand that children are carriers who took the virus to their family and friends....I don't know how else to explain that to you.

Sweden, Where No Lockdown Was Ordered, Becomes Second Most-Infected Country

https://www.newsweek.com/sweden-where-no-lockdown-was-ordered-becomes-second-most-infected-country-1511885

https://www.wsj.com/articles/coronavirus-is-taking-a-high-toll-on-swedens-elderly-families-blame-the-government-11592479430

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/17/swedens-exclusion-from-nordic-travel-area-swedens-foreign-minister.html

You could explain it to me if you were actually able to show me data that demonstrates that the schools were the cause of their infection rate, instead of just asserting your belief that kids are germy and therefore spread Covid like adults. Whenever they have done extensive contact tracing, kids have never been shown to be vectors.

Kids are always vectors. There's a reason parents and teachers have 6 instances of the flu, pink-eye, and the common cold in the winter and fall when people who don't interact with kids are perfectly fine.

There's also the fact that you seem to want to assert that somehow kids aren't carriers of a contagious aerosolized virus that last I checked affected the entire species.

You are making my point - you think that kids are always germy and therefore transmit Covid like adults. But listen to the experts:

“Initially, there was a lot of thought that this virus could be spread by children in congregate settings, which is common for other respiratory viruses like influenza. What we’re seeing more and more from the data that comes out is that child-to-child or child-to-adult spread is actually not common,”

- Jennifer Schuster, a pediatric infectious disease physician at Children’s Mercy Hospital in Kansas City.

https://www.the-scientist.com/news-opinion/covid-19-is-very-different-in-young-kids-versus-adults-67637

Now that doesn't mean it is proven that there is never going to be a case where a kid does spread the virus, but so far the data we have shows that it is uncommon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
This. I really hope public pressure is going to become so intense that the safetyists won't be able to implement their indefinite school reduction plan for more than a few months.

I've been fully compliant will stay-at-home orders, I diligently wear a mask when I go among people and I think everyone should (except young kids), but keeping kids in very part-time school for the foreseeable future is a crazy plan and really discredits the whole lockdown approach, to goal of which was ostensibly to flatten the curve and prevent hospitals from getting overwhelmed. Covid will be with us for a while and life has never been risk-free. We have to weigh costs and benefits, as we do in all areas of life. It's not like Covid is such an outsized threat compared to all the other things one could die of on any given day that we should just completely stop forever living normal lives with reasonable precautions. I hardly ever agree with Republicans on anything, but on this matter, they have a point.

I know everyone is counting on a vaccine within the next year but that is far from certain.

You're being way too reasonable for this crowd.

+100. First it was to flatten the curve, then it just continued. And now it seems like the new goal is 0% risk. 0% risk is not logical or attainable. Yet, here we are with no end date. I mean, we can't just keep the school situation all messed up for an undisclosed period of time. It's ridiculous.

Schools are the only consistent forum in this country where hundreds to thousands of people crowd together in small boxes, thin hallways, and tight stairwells. You're practically begging the infection rates to skyrocket by opening them up again.

Governments have to think of the well-being of the community. Not just the desires of fed-up parents.

Except that data from countries that never locked down their schools don't show them to be the cause of skyrocketing infection rates. How does that information fit into your worldview?

We've all seen the articles and the pictures of schools around the world opening up. None of them are crowded-there are a few masked kids sitting well-spaced out in a classroom, kids sitting in a marked off circle in the grass, kids lining up for temperature checks and tests. We can't even afford to supply our classrooms with pencils with our current budgets. Parents demand their kids back full time, so there's no way to reduce crowding.
How do YOU not understand the difference?

I said COUNTRIES THAT NEVER LOCKED DOWN THEIR SCHOOLS. Sweden, for instance, never shut down elementary schools, recognizing that DL was not feasible at that age. They kept operating at full capacity. Learn to read and check the facts.

Sweden didn't lockdown and they're suffering for it. I don't think this is the evidence you think it is.

They just became the country with the second-highest infection rate per capita in the WORLD and if you don't understand that children are carriers who took the virus to their family and friends....I don't know how else to explain that to you.

Sweden, Where No Lockdown Was Ordered, Becomes Second Most-Infected Country

https://www.newsweek.com/sweden-where-no-lockdown-was-ordered-becomes-second-most-infected-country-1511885

https://www.wsj.com/articles/coronavirus-is-taking-a-high-toll-on-swedens-elderly-families-blame-the-government-11592479430

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/17/swedens-exclusion-from-nordic-travel-area-swedens-foreign-minister.html

You could explain it to me if you were actually able to show me data that demonstrates that the schools were the cause of their infection rate, instead of just asserting your belief that kids are germy and therefore spread Covid like adults. Whenever they have done extensive contact tracing, kids have never been shown to be vectors.

Kids are always vectors. There's a reason parents and teachers have 6 instances of the flu, pink-eye, and the common cold in the winter and fall when people who don't interact with kids are perfectly fine.

There's also the fact that you seem to want to assert that somehow kids aren't carriers of a contagious aerosolized virus that last I checked affected the entire species.

You are making my point - you think that kids are always germy and therefore transmit Covid like adults. But listen to the experts:

“Initially, there was a lot of thought that this virus could be spread by children in congregate settings, which is common for other respiratory viruses like influenza. What we’re seeing more and more from the data that comes out is that child-to-child or child-to-adult spread is actually not common,”

- Jennifer Schuster, a pediatric infectious disease physician at Children’s Mercy Hospital in Kansas City.

https://www.the-scientist.com/news-opinion/covid-19-is-very-different-in-young-kids-versus-adults-67637

Now that doesn't mean it is proven that there is never going to be a case where a kid does spread the virus, but so far the data we have shows that it is uncommon.

Great. Now show me that same study with the European Coronavirus transmission rates. The U.S. West coast was primarily infected by the Asian coronavirus. The U.S. East coast has seen higher rates of the European coronavirus.

The authors don’t mention COVID-19–related multi-system inflammatory syndrome in children that’s been identified recently, she adds. “I’ve heard of it more in Europe and the US,” she says, and it will be interesting to look into whether it’s affecting kids in Asia as well.

https://www.cato.org/blog/two-supertypes-coronavirus-east-asian-european

[Anonymous]

All things being equal kids are less infectious than adults. However, Kids are just as infectious once you factor in proximity, time, and difficulty following all the all the regulations. This is what China has learned and why they are shutting down schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
This. I really hope public pressure is going to become so intense that the safetyists won't be able to implement their indefinite school reduction plan for more than a few months.

I've been fully compliant will stay-at-home orders, I diligently wear a mask when I go among people and I think everyone should (except young kids), but keeping kids in very part-time school for the foreseeable future is a crazy plan and really discredits the whole lockdown approach, to goal of which was ostensibly to flatten the curve and prevent hospitals from getting overwhelmed. Covid will be with us for a while and life has never been risk-free. We have to weigh costs and benefits, as we do in all areas of life. It's not like Covid is such an outsized threat compared to all the other things one could die of on any given day that we should just completely stop forever living normal lives with reasonable precautions. I hardly ever agree with Republicans on anything, but on this matter, they have a point.

I know everyone is counting on a vaccine within the next year but that is far from certain.

You're being way too reasonable for this crowd.

+100. First it was to flatten the curve, then it just continued. And now it seems like the new goal is 0% risk. 0% risk is not logical or attainable. Yet, here we are with no end date. I mean, we can't just keep the school situation all messed up for an undisclosed period of time. It's ridiculous.

Schools are the only consistent forum in this country where hundreds to thousands of people crowd together in small boxes, thin hallways, and tight stairwells. You're practically begging the infection rates to skyrocket by opening them up again.

Governments have to think of the well-being of the community. Not just the desires of fed-up parents.

Except that data from countries that never locked down their schools don't show them to be the cause of skyrocketing infection rates. How does that information fit into your worldview?

We've all seen the articles and the pictures of schools around the world opening up. None of them are crowded-there are a few masked kids sitting well-spaced out in a classroom, kids sitting in a marked off circle in the grass, kids lining up for temperature checks and tests. We can't even afford to supply our classrooms with pencils with our current budgets. Parents demand their kids back full time, so there's no way to reduce crowding.
How do YOU not understand the difference?

I said COUNTRIES THAT NEVER LOCKED DOWN THEIR SCHOOLS. Sweden, for instance, never shut down elementary schools, recognizing that DL was not feasible at that age. They kept operating at full capacity. Learn to read and check the facts.

Sweden didn't lockdown and they're suffering for it. I don't think this is the evidence you think it is.

They just became the country with the second-highest infection rate per capita in the WORLD and if you don't understand that children are carriers who took the virus to their family and friends....I don't know how else to explain that to you.

Sweden, Where No Lockdown Was Ordered, Becomes Second Most-Infected Country

https://www.newsweek.com/sweden-where-no-lockdown-was-ordered-becomes-second-most-infected-country-1511885

https://www.wsj.com/articles/coronavirus-is-taking-a-high-toll-on-swedens-elderly-families-blame-the-government-11592479430

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/17/swedens-exclusion-from-nordic-travel-area-swedens-foreign-minister.html

You could explain it to me if you were actually able to show me data that demonstrates that the schools were the cause of their infection rate, instead of just asserting your belief that kids are germy and therefore spread Covid like adults. Whenever they have done extensive contact tracing, kids have never been shown to be vectors.

Kids are always vectors. There's a reason parents and teachers have 6 instances of the flu, pink-eye, and the common cold in the winter and fall when people who don't interact with kids are perfectly fine.

There's also the fact that you seem to want to assert that somehow kids aren't carriers of a contagious aerosolized virus that last I checked affected the entire species.

You are making my point - you think that kids are always germy and therefore transmit Covid like adults. But listen to the experts:

“Initially, there was a lot of thought that this virus could be spread by children in congregate settings, which is common for other respiratory viruses like influenza. What we’re seeing more and more from the data that comes out is that child-to-child or child-to-adult spread is actually not common,”

- Jennifer Schuster, a pediatric infectious disease physician at Children’s Mercy Hospital in Kansas City.

https://www.the-scientist.com/news-opinion/covid-19-is-very-different-in-young-kids-versus-adults-67637

Now that doesn't mean it is proven that there is never going to be a case where a kid does spread the virus, but so far the data we have shows that it is uncommon.

Great. Now show me that same study with the European Coronavirus transmission rates. The U.S. West coast was primarily infected by the Asian coronavirus. The U.S. East coast has seen higher rates of the European coronavirus.

The authors don’t mention COVID-19–related multi-system inflammatory syndrome in children that’s been identified recently, she adds. “I’ve heard of it more in Europe and the US,” she says, and it will be interesting to look into whether it’s affecting kids in Asia as well.

https://www.cato.org/blog/two-supertypes-coronavirus-east-asian-european

Not sure what your point is. That syndrome is still very rare, and it can be caused by other viruses, too. Not a reason to keep schools closed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Great. Now show me that same study with the European Coronavirus transmission rates. The U.S. West coast was primarily infected by the Asian coronavirus. The U.S. East coast has seen higher rates of the European coronavirus.

The authors don’t mention COVID-19–related multi-system inflammatory syndrome in children that’s been identified recently, she adds. “I’ve heard of it more in Europe and the US,” she says, and it will be interesting to look into whether it’s affecting kids in Asia as well.

https://www.cato.org/blog/two-supertypes-coronavirus-east-asian-european

You're quoting a piece published on May 8 on the blog of a libertarian political "think tank" organization. Why?

[Anonymous]

Why do I keep coming back and reading the additions to this thread? The same thing over and over again.

Why??? I need to stop.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just watch, by Mid-August, every other county in Maryland will have announced that they will be open in the fall but MoCo will not have made an announcement. Residents will be enraged, Elrich will be shamed, and schools will open. Mark my words. Our leadership is a joke.

This is close to my prediction too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Great. Now show me that same study with the European Coronavirus transmission rates. The U.S. West coast was primarily infected by the Asian coronavirus. The U.S. East coast has seen higher rates of the European coronavirus.

The authors don’t mention COVID-19–related multi-system inflammatory syndrome in children that’s been identified recently, she adds. “I’ve heard of it more in Europe and the US,” she says, and it will be interesting to look into whether it’s affecting kids in Asia as well.

https://www.cato.org/blog/two-supertypes-coronavirus-east-asian-european

You're quoting a piece published on May 8 on the blog of a libertarian political "think tank" organization. Why?

Would you prefer the New York Times?

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/08/science/new-york-coronavirus-cases-europe-genomes.html

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/30/science/coronavirus-mutations.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All things being equal kids are less infectious than adults. However, Kids are just as infectious once you factor in proximity, time, and difficulty following all the all the regulations. This is what China has learned and why they are shutting down schools.

- citation?

The point is that the current data show that child-to-child and child-to-adult transmission is rare. I don't think they were able to contact-trace a single case of that kind. What you are claiming implies that it has somehow been shown that kids are less infectious per se, but that in practice they do transmit the virus just as much as adults due to their behaviors and the school setting. I would like to know what that is based on besides pure conjecture. Is China shutting down schools because they have that sort of evidence, or are they shutting them down because they are panicking about a general rise in cases?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Great. Now show me that same study with the European Coronavirus transmission rates. The U.S. West coast was primarily infected by the Asian coronavirus. The U.S. East coast has seen higher rates of the European coronavirus.

The authors don’t mention COVID-19–related multi-system inflammatory syndrome in children that’s been identified recently, she adds. “I’ve heard of it more in Europe and the US,” she says, and it will be interesting to look into whether it’s affecting kids in Asia as well.

https://www.cato.org/blog/two-supertypes-coronavirus-east-asian-european

You're quoting a piece published on May 8 on the blog of a libertarian political "think tank" organization. Why?

Would you prefer the New York Times?

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/08/science/new-york-coronavirus-cases-europe-genomes.html

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/30/science/coronavirus-mutations.html

That's information from two months ago. Now, find us a source that says there's a medical, clinical difference between the variants.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why do I keep coming back and reading the additions to this thread? The same thing over and over again.

Why??? I need to stop.

me too

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just watch, by Mid-August, every other county in Maryland will have announced that they will be open in the fall but MoCo will not have made an announcement. Residents will be enraged, Elrich will be shamed, and schools will open. Mark my words. Our leadership is a joke.

I suspect you're right on this. But the big catch here is they can't decide overnight to open up schools, then have them open the next day. It would take weeks of preparations. For example, let's say they decide they should have a hand sanitizer dispenser outside each classroom. How long does it take to order 10,000 dispensers, and install them in every school? That alone is a big project.

Now, maybe MCPS is already considering this contingency, and maintenance staff is installing them right now. That would make sense, right? But based on what I've seen of MCPS upper management, they just aren't good at planning ahead like that. I bet the guys in the warehouse and maintenance are sitting on their hands right now, itching for things to do...

[Anonymous]

We never should have closed the way we did. It should have been a very targeted lockdown. And tbh everyone (not just teachers) are going to resist going back to work. We work much less on lock down.
Schools need to open. Folks who are scared to work with kids can get a one year salary to retrain themselves for a new job.