Enough is enough with the redshirting!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

Only false birth certificates is wrong. So what if a quarterback jumps around to get more play time? I know a kid who did just that and is now recruited to a top football school. He and his family knew what they were doing. How is this different than people lying about their address to attend a school they aren’t zoned for? There’s a lot more of that going on and little appetite to fix it.

Uh lying about your address to attend a school you aren't zoned for is also wrong. I don't know anyone who thinks that's fine.

Also a football player moving schools to get more playing time is fine -- that's up to his family if they want to jump through the hoops to make that happen. I'm talking about families that move schools to redshirt their kids multiple times. So moving to a new school so their kid can repeat 6th and then moving again to repeat 9th, so that he can be a senior at 20 and boost odds of recruitment. The reason they are moving schools is because the old school won't allow them to repeat the grade.

Though fortunately that's largely an issue with privates, as public schools have rules that prevent that kind of thing (as well as rules to prevent people over 18 from competing in football). It's not that hard to avoid the kind of private school that allows that sort of behavior. This is one reason why I don't send my kids to sports-obsessed schools -- it leads to all kinds of bad behavior among parents, administrators, and sometimes kids. No thank you.

I don’t know where you live but this isn’t allowed in my state. You are disqualified from school sports for a year if you are an athlete in one area and then transfer. All sports, not just that one. I think that’s fairly standard.

I hadn’t checked this thread for a bit and I see we have now reached the stage where the anti-redshirters are freaking out about imaginary football players. Cool, cool. These are definitely the people we want influencing education policy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

Only false birth certificates is wrong. So what if a quarterback jumps around to get more play time? I know a kid who did just that and is now recruited to a top football school. He and his family knew what they were doing. How is this different than people lying about their address to attend a school they aren’t zoned for? There’s a lot more of that going on and little appetite to fix it.

+1 if your kid stands a chance at playing at a big football college and maybe even being drafted into the NFL, you will move heaven and earth for that kid. It comes across as weird or “why would you do that” for a non-football kid, but it’s pretty routine for that sport.

And the vast majority will fall spectacularly short.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

I think limiting the options of people to make good academic choices for their four year olds in order to take care of 16-17 year old high school boys who play football reflects different priorities than the ones our public school systems are supposed to support.

You could solve your problem by advocating for rules about who can play football, and leave the kids who need more time before kindergarten alone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

Only false birth certificates is wrong. So what if a quarterback jumps around to get more play time? I know a kid who did just that and is now recruited to a top football school. He and his family knew what they were doing. How is this different than people lying about their address to attend a school they aren’t zoned for? There’s a lot more of that going on and little appetite to fix it.

Uh lying about your address to attend a school you aren't zoned for is also wrong. I don't know anyone who thinks that's fine.

Also a football player moving schools to get more playing time is fine -- that's up to his family if they want to jump through the hoops to make that happen. I'm talking about families that move schools to redshirt their kids multiple times. So moving to a new school so their kid can repeat 6th and then moving again to repeat 9th, so that he can be a senior at 20 and boost odds of recruitment. The reason they are moving schools is because the old school won't allow them to repeat the grade.

Though fortunately that's largely an issue with privates, as public schools have rules that prevent that kind of thing (as well as rules to prevent people over 18 from competing in football). It's not that hard to avoid the kind of private school that allows that sort of behavior. This is one reason why I don't send my kids to sports-obsessed schools -- it leads to all kinds of bad behavior among parents, administrators, and sometimes kids. No thank you.

I don’t know where you live but this isn’t allowed in my state. You are disqualified from school sports for a year if you are an athlete in one area and then transfer. All sports, not just that one. I think that’s fairly standard.

I don't think that's standard at all. Maybe if you transfer within the same district? But obviously sometimes families move or kids transfer for other reasons -- they can't ban students who transfer from all sports without unfairly punishing students who aren't doing anything shady.

And anyway, among the private high schools (especially in the south) that are known proving grounds for future college stars and NFL players, they make their own rules and it accepted that they will move heaven and earth to get star players to the school and accommodate them (including allowing redshirt years) to boost their chances of recruitment and success. It's viewed as a mutually beneficial system as these schools thrive on being able to brag about how many of their players go onto major college programs or play professionally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

I think limiting the options of people to make good academic choices for their four year olds in order to take care of 16-17 year old high school boys who play football reflects different priorities than the ones our public school systems are supposed to support.

You could solve your problem by advocating for rules about who can play football, and leave the kids who need more time before kindergarten alone.

How many kids actually go on to play football in college and beyond. That’s just one reason to hold back. Most do it as it’s trendy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

Only false birth certificates is wrong. So what if a quarterback jumps around to get more play time? I know a kid who did just that and is now recruited to a top football school. He and his family knew what they were doing. How is this different than people lying about their address to attend a school they aren’t zoned for? There’s a lot more of that going on and little appetite to fix it.

Because families that don’t manipulate the rules should be able to compete fairly for those spots at top schools. We should support people who compete fairly on the field based on skill over people who use age advantage schemes.

+1, only so many spots.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

Only false birth certificates is wrong. So what if a quarterback jumps around to get more play time? I know a kid who did just that and is now recruited to a top football school. He and his family knew what they were doing. How is this different than people lying about their address to attend a school they aren’t zoned for? There’s a lot more of that going on and little appetite to fix it.

Uh lying about your address to attend a school you aren't zoned for is also wrong. I don't know anyone who thinks that's fine.

Also a football player moving schools to get more playing time is fine -- that's up to his family if they want to jump through the hoops to make that happen. I'm talking about families that move schools to redshirt their kids multiple times. So moving to a new school so their kid can repeat 6th and then moving again to repeat 9th, so that he can be a senior at 20 and boost odds of recruitment. The reason they are moving schools is because the old school won't allow them to repeat the grade.

Though fortunately that's largely an issue with privates, as public schools have rules that prevent that kind of thing (as well as rules to prevent people over 18 from competing in football). It's not that hard to avoid the kind of private school that allows that sort of behavior. This is one reason why I don't send my kids to sports-obsessed schools -- it leads to all kinds of bad behavior among parents, administrators, and sometimes kids. No thank you.

I don’t know where you live but this isn’t allowed in my state. You are disqualified from school sports for a year if you are an athlete in one area and then transfer. All sports, not just that one. I think that’s fairly standard.

I hadn’t checked this thread for a bit and I see we have now reached the stage where the anti-redshirters are freaking out about imaginary football players. Cool, cool. These are definitely the people we want influencing education policy.

Let’s call it what it is. Holding back kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

Only false birth certificates is wrong. So what if a quarterback jumps around to get more play time? I know a kid who did just that and is now recruited to a top football school. He and his family knew what they were doing. How is this different than people lying about their address to attend a school they aren’t zoned for? There’s a lot more of that going on and little appetite to fix it.

Uh lying about your address to attend a school you aren't zoned for is also wrong. I don't know anyone who thinks that's fine.

Also a football player moving schools to get more playing time is fine -- that's up to his family if they want to jump through the hoops to make that happen. I'm talking about families that move schools to redshirt their kids multiple times. So moving to a new school so their kid can repeat 6th and then moving again to repeat 9th, so that he can be a senior at 20 and boost odds of recruitment. The reason they are moving schools is because the old school won't allow them to repeat the grade.

Though fortunately that's largely an issue with privates, as public schools have rules that prevent that kind of thing (as well as rules to prevent people over 18 from competing in football). It's not that hard to avoid the kind of private school that allows that sort of behavior. This is one reason why I don't send my kids to sports-obsessed schools -- it leads to all kinds of bad behavior among parents, administrators, and sometimes kids. No thank you.

I don’t know where you live but this isn’t allowed in my state. You are disqualified from school sports for a year if you are an athlete in one area and then transfer. All sports, not just that one. I think that’s fairly standard.

I don't think that's standard at all. Maybe if you transfer within the same district? But obviously sometimes families move or kids transfer for other reasons -- they can't ban students who transfer from all sports without unfairly punishing students who aren't doing anything shady.

And anyway, among the private high schools (especially in the south) that are known proving grounds for future college stars and NFL players, they make their own rules and it accepted that they will move heaven and earth to get star players to the school and accommodate them (including allowing redshirt years) to boost their chances of recruitment and success. It's viewed as a mutually beneficial system as these schools thrive on being able to brag about how many of their players go onto major college programs or play professionally.

Do you understand how private schools work and how you don’t have to pay tuition to those schools if you disagree with their admissions practices?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

Only false birth certificates is wrong. So what if a quarterback jumps around to get more play time? I know a kid who did just that and is now recruited to a top football school. He and his family knew what they were doing. How is this different than people lying about their address to attend a school they aren’t zoned for? There’s a lot more of that going on and little appetite to fix it.

Uh lying about your address to attend a school you aren't zoned for is also wrong. I don't know anyone who thinks that's fine.

Also a football player moving schools to get more playing time is fine -- that's up to his family if they want to jump through the hoops to make that happen. I'm talking about families that move schools to redshirt their kids multiple times. So moving to a new school so their kid can repeat 6th and then moving again to repeat 9th, so that he can be a senior at 20 and boost odds of recruitment. The reason they are moving schools is because the old school won't allow them to repeat the grade.

Though fortunately that's largely an issue with privates, as public schools have rules that prevent that kind of thing (as well as rules to prevent people over 18 from competing in football). It's not that hard to avoid the kind of private school that allows that sort of behavior. This is one reason why I don't send my kids to sports-obsessed schools -- it leads to all kinds of bad behavior among parents, administrators, and sometimes kids. No thank you.

I don’t know where you live but this isn’t allowed in my state. You are disqualified from school sports for a year if you are an athlete in one area and then transfer. All sports, not just that one. I think that’s fairly standard.

I hadn’t checked this thread for a bit and I see we have now reached the stage where the anti-redshirters are freaking out about imaginary football players. Cool, cool. These are definitely the people we want influencing education policy.

Let’s call it what it is. Holding back kids.

Okay? Will you go away and attempt to be normal if we all agree to do that? That’s fine with me. I don’t care what it’s called, but of course I don’t care if it is done at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

Only false birth certificates is wrong. So what if a quarterback jumps around to get more play time? I know a kid who did just that and is now recruited to a top football school. He and his family knew what they were doing. How is this different than people lying about their address to attend a school they aren’t zoned for? There’s a lot more of that going on and little appetite to fix it.

Uh lying about your address to attend a school you aren't zoned for is also wrong. I don't know anyone who thinks that's fine.

Also a football player moving schools to get more playing time is fine -- that's up to his family if they want to jump through the hoops to make that happen. I'm talking about families that move schools to redshirt their kids multiple times. So moving to a new school so their kid can repeat 6th and then moving again to repeat 9th, so that he can be a senior at 20 and boost odds of recruitment. The reason they are moving schools is because the old school won't allow them to repeat the grade.

Though fortunately that's largely an issue with privates, as public schools have rules that prevent that kind of thing (as well as rules to prevent people over 18 from competing in football). It's not that hard to avoid the kind of private school that allows that sort of behavior. This is one reason why I don't send my kids to sports-obsessed schools -- it leads to all kinds of bad behavior among parents, administrators, and sometimes kids. No thank you.

I don’t know where you live but this isn’t allowed in my state. You are disqualified from school sports for a year if you are an athlete in one area and then transfer. All sports, not just that one. I think that’s fairly standard.

I hadn’t checked this thread for a bit and I see we have now reached the stage where the anti-redshirters are freaking out about imaginary football players. Cool, cool. These are definitely the people we want influencing education policy.

I'm not an anti-redshirter nor am I freaking out about this, but these football players are not imaginary. You also see it in baseball in some parts of the country. Go check out the MS/HS records of NFL players -- you will discover many of them transferred schools one or more times, redshirted, etc. I think it might happen in hockey as well? Any sport where there can be a very big difference between a 17 year old and a 19 year old in terms muscle mass and strength.

That doesn't really have any bearing on a discussion of redshirting for kindergarteners -- this is a totally different issue. But it's not imaginary. This is how pro athletes are made in a very competitive environment.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

Only false birth certificates is wrong. So what if a quarterback jumps around to get more play time? I know a kid who did just that and is now recruited to a top football school. He and his family knew what they were doing. How is this different than people lying about their address to attend a school they aren’t zoned for? There’s a lot more of that going on and little appetite to fix it.

Uh lying about your address to attend a school you aren't zoned for is also wrong. I don't know anyone who thinks that's fine.

Also a football player moving schools to get more playing time is fine -- that's up to his family if they want to jump through the hoops to make that happen. I'm talking about families that move schools to redshirt their kids multiple times. So moving to a new school so their kid can repeat 6th and then moving again to repeat 9th, so that he can be a senior at 20 and boost odds of recruitment. The reason they are moving schools is because the old school won't allow them to repeat the grade.

Though fortunately that's largely an issue with privates, as public schools have rules that prevent that kind of thing (as well as rules to prevent people over 18 from competing in football). It's not that hard to avoid the kind of private school that allows that sort of behavior. This is one reason why I don't send my kids to sports-obsessed schools -- it leads to all kinds of bad behavior among parents, administrators, and sometimes kids. No thank you.

I don’t know where you live but this isn’t allowed in my state. You are disqualified from school sports for a year if you are an athlete in one area and then transfer. All sports, not just that one. I think that’s fairly standard.

I don't think that's standard at all. Maybe if you transfer within the same district? But obviously sometimes families move or kids transfer for other reasons -- they can't ban students who transfer from all sports without unfairly punishing students who aren't doing anything shady.

And anyway, among the private high schools (especially in the south) that are known proving grounds for future college stars and NFL players, they make their own rules and it accepted that they will move heaven and earth to get star players to the school and accommodate them (including allowing redshirt years) to boost their chances of recruitment and success. It's viewed as a mutually beneficial system as these schools thrive on being able to brag about how many of their players go onto major college programs or play professionally.

Do you understand how private schools work and how you don’t have to pay tuition to those schools if you disagree with their admissions practices?

Uh, I don't know why you are coming in all hot here -- I'm not even complaining about these practices. It's just people have expressed skepticism about them on the thread or suggested people are making this up. They aren't. This is common in certain places and at certain schools. I wouldn't send my kids to one of those schools, but I'm not trying to turn my kids into pro football players.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

I think limiting the options of people to make good academic choices for their four year olds in order to take care of 16-17 year old high school boys who play football reflects different priorities than the ones our public school systems are supposed to support.

You could solve your problem by advocating for rules about who can play football, and leave the kids who need more time before kindergarten alone.

How many kids actually go on to play football in college and beyond. That’s just one reason to hold back. Most do it as it’s trendy.

This number is vanishingly small and I think the parents who are intense about it are doomed to be disappointed in their kids sports outcomes anyway. I also don’t think we should make early education policy based on high school sports.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also unsafe for adults to be tackling kids in HS football

So you’re kicking off seniors with October birthdays even if they’re sent on time? They’re adults after all.

I love that now the people pathetically arguing about redshirting have also decided they are experts on high school football. As if they would ever let their kids play football or have ever seen a game themselves.

you’re so weird
we have season tickets to college football

Yet you think "adults" can't play in HS. Weirdo.

I think 20 is different than 18 especially for sports and coaches would agree

If you knew anything about football you would know there are already rules around this.

Most locations ban high school players from football at age 19.

Not exactly. It's like 19 or younger before the cutoff date. 19 yr olds can play.

And it’s governed by the state and there are lots of workarounds and appeals

Sounds like, again, people hate others playing by the rules. Nobody is being sneaky or underhanded.

Regarding football specifically, people are definitely being sneaky or underhanded. Kids who play football at a high level and get recruited by college teams wind up in all kinds of wild schemes to improve their chances. People have falsified birth certificates, found unscrupulous doctors to diagnose non-existent disabilities to be held back, switched schools multiple times in order to redshirt multiple years, etc. I wouldn't say this is the majority or even a substantial minority of football families but it happens and not infrequently. The looser and more flexible the rules are, the more it happens, which is an argument in favor of tightening up the rules to prevent it even if this limits the options of people who aren't being sneak or underhanded.

Only false birth certificates is wrong. So what if a quarterback jumps around to get more play time? I know a kid who did just that and is now recruited to a top football school. He and his family knew what they were doing. How is this different than people lying about their address to attend a school they aren’t zoned for? There’s a lot more of that going on and little appetite to fix it.

Uh lying about your address to attend a school you aren't zoned for is also wrong. I don't know anyone who thinks that's fine.

Also a football player moving schools to get more playing time is fine -- that's up to his family if they want to jump through the hoops to make that happen. I'm talking about families that move schools to redshirt their kids multiple times. So moving to a new school so their kid can repeat 6th and then moving again to repeat 9th, so that he can be a senior at 20 and boost odds of recruitment. The reason they are moving schools is because the old school won't allow them to repeat the grade.

Though fortunately that's largely an issue with privates, as public schools have rules that prevent that kind of thing (as well as rules to prevent people over 18 from competing in football). It's not that hard to avoid the kind of private school that allows that sort of behavior. This is one reason why I don't send my kids to sports-obsessed schools -- it leads to all kinds of bad behavior among parents, administrators, and sometimes kids. No thank you.

I don’t know where you live but this isn’t allowed in my state. You are disqualified from school sports for a year if you are an athlete in one area and then transfer. All sports, not just that one. I think that’s fairly standard.

I hadn’t checked this thread for a bit and I see we have now reached the stage where the anti-redshirters are freaking out about imaginary football players. Cool, cool. These are definitely the people we want influencing education policy.

I'm not an anti-redshirter nor am I freaking out about this, but these football players are not imaginary. You also see it in baseball in some parts of the country. Go check out the MS/HS records of NFL players -- you will discover many of them transferred schools one or more times, redshirted, etc. I think it might happen in hockey as well? Any sport where there can be a very big difference between a 17 year old and a 19 year old in terms muscle mass and strength.

That doesn't really have any bearing on a discussion of redshirting for kindergarteners -- this is a totally different issue. But it's not imaginary. This is how pro athletes are made in a very competitive environment.

Lacrosse is a common redshirt sport. I’ve heard that 75 percent of kids who play D1 have been redshirted once, often twice. It’s interesting too because it’s not even necessarily for the college scholarship and obviously you have no future going pro and making money.