AEM Facebook - “Everyone thinks they’re an expert”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the “you should apply to be a teacher” responses. No one here avoids becoming a teacher because it’s intellectually difficult. We don’t want to do it because it’s a crappy job with crappy pay.

I’m a teacher. It’s not “intellectually difficult”? That’s so insulting.

In Finland, the cream of the crop become teachers. Their salaries are high and education schools are very selective. Not the case in the US. Sure many smart ppl go to education school but most of them are mediocre.

Lol I’m a teacher. There are subreddits called Teachers and Teaching. Both are always getting posts from people who want to teach instead of going things like med school, law school, and engineering. Many were lawyers or engineers first. A lot of smart people do go into teaching and they’re capable of doing more for better money, but they like the idea of things like less time in school, more time off (even if it’s unpaid in summer), working with kids, and feeling like they’re making a difference. Many accountants on those subReddits looking to switch too because they hate being chained to a desk.

So yes, a lot of teachers are intelligent enough to pursue other careers but they choose teaching instead. Some end up regretting it because people treat them like idiots based on their job and they remember how they used to get more respect when they were in med school or law school, or when they worked as an accountant or engineer.

A lot of teachers also leave teaching to pursue careers like engineering, accounting, law, and healthcare jobs like nursing. Most careers have some idiots. I know people who did very poorly in high school who are somehow nurses and that really frightens me because I don’t know that they’re smart enough to have my life in their hands, but they must be! If you got mostly C’s in high school I really don’t want to know that you’re a nurse though! But it happens all the time. They just get better grades in college.

Anyway, done ranting.

Love,
A Teacher (so I must be an idiot)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Everyone thinks they’re an expert on schools because they were once a student. But thinking you know how to teach kindergarten because you were once a kindergartener is like thinking you could direct a movie because you once watched Star Wars. Teaching is an art and a science. It requires specialized education and years of practice. Listen to teachers.”

Can someone explain the state of education in the US then? So many kids are failing.

And while you’re at it, explain how there are many homeschool success stories. We know many families nationwide that chose to homeschool during the pandemic rather than suffer through virtual school. Kids that were behind in math and reading were able to catch up (and some were able to progress beyond grade level) when they were given one-on-one attention and met where they were at.

SJH kills me. “SAY IT LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK!” She’s unhinged! 🤣

I’m not on AEM and have no idea who you are talking about but oh my god- don’t compare homeschooling to public school. Homeschooling is literally one on one instruction all day long, and usually at the cost of one parent’s income since they are home. People that aren’t teachers should be involved in decisions about how schools are run but that doesn’t mean there aren’t non-teachers out there that could be teachers if they wanted to.

Pointing out that teaching does NOT require specialized education. Teaching 30 first graders? Yes. Teaching grammar and spelling? No.

Then what is pedagogy?

Just theory to make teachers feel better about themselves. Too bad many children achieve better outcomes outside of traditional school settings.

I mean, take a look at effing Lucy Calkins. All of you “experts” followed her like sheep!

Lol teachers can literally lose their job for not following the curriculum their district chooses. I had someone in the position of Teaching and Learning Director let me go from a position that was supposed to be one year long all because I questioned Calkins and was teaching my students parts of speech and some spelling patterns. They were fourth graders in a decently wealthy MA suburb and their writing seemed more like that of first graders. People in the district feared this director and told me someone yelled “Lucy Calkins sucks” during a meeting once and then the director went to their room to be sure it was all they were using during ELA for about two weeks. A few teachers tried to supplement but they had tenure so eyes weren’t on them as much. The special ed teacher I co-taught with for three months there wrote me a nice letter of recommendation so I could get a six month long term sub position elsewhere. She couldn’t stand the woman who fired me either. She was literally awful in many ways and I just wasn’t afraid to question her. I tried teaching the students things I felt they should know by fourth grade and I also wasted time with the dumb Calkins lessons that often just confused the kids. The teacher I was co-teaching with let me know that the parents were upset I was let go and she showed me screenshots from a fb group where they said I was engaging. The woman who fired me actually told me the kids were “just eating (me) up” after she stopped in my class one time. So I think I was a pretty good teacher but yeah, even in a state with strong unions you can’t just teach however you want. That risks your job and income and benefits...

The system is a mess but I haven’t questioned what a school wants me to teach since that time I was fired for doing so. I’m convinced I could help the education system more once I’m done with teaching. Until then I do have to play the stupid little games if I want a job... sorry.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a teacher. I hate this thread. The breakdown between parents and teachers is what’s ruining education. We’re supposed to be partners.

I do believe teachers are experts in child development and education, and parents are the child’s first and most important teachers. Let’s not diminish one another’s authority. That sends a bad message to our kids.

I am a parent and now homeschool teacher and I hate this thread too. Teachers do an enormously difficult job.

I used to agree with you that teachers were experts in child development and education. And then I figured out my K child was dyslexic and I entered the ugly world of elementary reading instruction. I know that public schools cannot effectively support dyslexic kids (which is a different battle), but they should be able to teach non-dyslexic kids to read. That seems like a basic requirement. (Writing instruction, both handwriting and composition, has been abandoned.)

Teachers are not trained in effective reading instruction aka the science of reading. Parents have been working for years to get this situation improved and we have been insulted at every turn. Balanced literacy is a failure. Teachers will say it is admin decisions on curriculum, but admins used to be teachers and curriculum review teams are teachers. So you all really need to accept responsibility for your failed pedagogy.

We can’t trust teachers to make good decisions/ recommendations on reading instruction. You have proved this with your support for Lucy Calkins and Fountas & Pinnel and Reading Recovery (which has been abandoned in its country of origin).

You are blaming ALL teachers for the admin's choices? Mental.....

This is where the breakdown is. Most parents don’t understand the extent that teachers must follow district/admin procedures. Even if we do know a better way of doing something we are limited in our ability, both by time and resources.

Here’s the thing- teachers don’t want parents wading into curriculum decisions, school boards don’t get to make curriculum decisions. Teachers need to hold each other accountable for the mess you’ve made of reading instruction. Admins used to be teachers, so it is a teacher culture problem. The ones who know better must use their voices to drive change.

Teachers certainly can use their voices to try to drive change. But be prepared to be let go for questioning your admin aka your boss. Be prepared to be let go for not following the first jobs at your workplace aka not using the curriculum you’re told to use.

I’m a PP who was let go from a teaching job for doing that once. I don’t think I’ll try again until I’m out of the education field. Even then I’d be nervous because these days people lose jobs just for have different opinions. If I speak out against the most widely used ELA curriculum, is an office job going to fire me? Honestly, it’s a possibility if I’m then seen as controversial. I’ve only been in the education field for about six year and some of that time was as a substitute so I’m pretty sure a bunch of people would just say I’m some inexperienced idiot and they Calkins is the way.

I also lost a friend because she’s a special education teacher and I feel like sometimes IEPs are just enabling kids to be lazy. I had a student with one who had no specific learning disability and she just did not like doing work without me reading the directions and without me trying to work with her 1:1 which was usually impossible in a class of 24. This was fourth grade and I had one of the kids read directions for one of our projects. This fourth grader read them just fine. I got an email from the girl with IEP (there were 11 with IEPs in this class!! But I just didn’t understand hers) and her mother told me the directions had too many words and I should simplify them.... no other kids had a problem with one kid had a 504 for OCD so she liked detailed instructions. So how do I provide details for one kid, simply things down for another, and keep things on grade level for mostly everyone else? And my friend who teaches at the high school level with severe special needs so she teaches life skills and only has two students on her plate, called me out and told me they as a special education teacher she was offended and it wouldn’t be so hard to differentiate directions for all the students. Yeah, let me just write the directions in 3-24 different ways for everything! Psh. And the kicker was this girl who allegedly didn’t like my directions because they were too hard to follow scores as above grade level for STAR Reading (this is like I-Ready). I think her mother just enabled her to be lazy.

As a teacher it’s hard to speak out against anything you find weird about the system because you WILL offend people and have people make you feel like a heartless monster for thinking things like this cruel to have a class full of fourth graders who vary from a kindergarten to sixth grade reading level all together in one class. And I’ve heard of high school teachers with 15 kids on IEPs who get front row seats as an accommodation and they’re like “well I don’t even have 15 front row seats so I guess I get in trouble for not following every IEP this year.” Some kids truly need IEPs but at least in many wealthy towns, a lot of parents push and push to get one. Some schools make it easier then others.

I acknowledge the education system is a mess and I do think any teacher who disagrees with that is an unintelligent teacher. Luckily I think most teachers could list a few things wrong with the system. Most of us aren’t idiots. We just don’t want to be shamed or lose our jobs for questioning things we are just supposed to go along with with no questions asked.

[Anonymous]

*directions, not first jobs

I’m on a phone and I can’t see the whole box to edit. I’m sure this makes me even more of an idiot than being a teacher already does. Sorry!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Everyone thinks they’re an expert on schools because they were once a student. But thinking you know how to teach kindergarten because you were once a kindergartener is like thinking you could direct a movie because you once watched Star Wars. Teaching is an art and a science. It requires specialized education and years of practice. Listen to teachers.”

Can someone explain the state of education in the US then? So many kids are failing.

And while you’re at it, explain how there are many homeschool success stories. We know many families nationwide that chose to homeschool during the pandemic rather than suffer through virtual school. Kids that were behind in math and reading were able to catch up (and some were able to progress beyond grade level) when they were given one-on-one attention and met where they were at.

SJH kills me. “SAY IT LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK!” She’s unhinged! 🤣

I’m not on AEM and have no idea who you are talking about but oh my god- don’t compare homeschooling to public school. Homeschooling is literally one on one instruction all day long, and usually at the cost of one parent’s income since they are home. People that aren’t teachers should be involved in decisions about how schools are run but that doesn’t mean there aren’t non-teachers out there that could be teachers if they wanted to.

Pointing out that teaching does NOT require specialized education. Teaching 30 first graders? Yes. Teaching grammar and spelling? No.

Then what is pedagogy?

Just theory to make teachers feel better about themselves. Too bad many children achieve better outcomes outside of traditional school settings.

I mean, take a look at effing Lucy Calkins. All of you “experts” followed her like sheep!

Lol teachers can literally lose their job for not following the curriculum their district chooses. I had someone in the position of Teaching and Learning Director let me go from a position that was supposed to be one year long all because I questioned Calkins and was teaching my students parts of speech and some spelling patterns. They were fourth graders in a decently wealthy MA suburb and their writing seemed more like that of first graders. People in the district feared this director and told me someone yelled “Lucy Calkins sucks” during a meeting once and then the director went to their room to be sure it was all they were using during ELA for about two weeks. A few teachers tried to supplement but they had tenure so eyes weren’t on them as much. The special ed teacher I co-taught with for three months there wrote me a nice letter of recommendation so I could get a six month long term sub position elsewhere. She couldn’t stand the woman who fired me either. She was literally awful in many ways and I just wasn’t afraid to question her. I tried teaching the students things I felt they should know by fourth grade and I also wasted time with the dumb Calkins lessons that often just confused the kids. The teacher I was co-teaching with let me know that the parents were upset I was let go and she showed me screenshots from a fb group where they said I was engaging. The woman who fired me actually told me the kids were “just eating (me) up” after she stopped in my class one time. So I think I was a pretty good teacher but yeah, even in a state with strong unions you can’t just teach however you want. That risks your job and income and benefits...

The system is a mess but I haven’t questioned what a school wants me to teach since that time I was fired for doing so. I’m convinced I could help the education system more once I’m done with teaching. Until then I do have to play the stupid little games if I want a job... sorry.

This is so so so sad. Thank you for speaking up. I’m not sure I can blame parents for taking their kids out of a failing system, but I do appreciate teachers like you that at least recognize there’s a problem. Take care!! 🙂

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a teacher. I hate this thread. The breakdown between parents and teachers is what’s ruining education. We’re supposed to be partners.

I do believe teachers are experts in child development and education, and parents are the child’s first and most important teachers. Let’s not diminish one another’s authority. That sends a bad message to our kids.

I am a parent and now homeschool teacher and I hate this thread too. Teachers do an enormously difficult job.

I used to agree with you that teachers were experts in child development and education. And then I figured out my K child was dyslexic and I entered the ugly world of elementary reading instruction. I know that public schools cannot effectively support dyslexic kids (which is a different battle), but they should be able to teach non-dyslexic kids to read. That seems like a basic requirement. (Writing instruction, both handwriting and composition, has been abandoned.)

Teachers are not trained in effective reading instruction aka the science of reading. Parents have been working for years to get this situation improved and we have been insulted at every turn. Balanced literacy is a failure. Teachers will say it is admin decisions on curriculum, but admins used to be teachers and curriculum review teams are teachers. So you all really need to accept responsibility for your failed pedagogy.

We can’t trust teachers to make good decisions/ recommendations on reading instruction. You have proved this with your support for Lucy Calkins and Fountas & Pinnel and Reading Recovery (which has been abandoned in its country of origin).

You are blaming ALL teachers for the admin's choices? Mental.....

This is where the breakdown is. Most parents don’t understand the extent that teachers must follow district/admin procedures. Even if we do know a better way of doing something we are limited in our ability, both by time and resources.

Here’s the thing- teachers don’t want parents wading into curriculum decisions, school boards don’t get to make curriculum decisions. Teachers need to hold each other accountable for the mess you’ve made of reading instruction. Admins used to be teachers, so it is a teacher culture problem. The ones who know better must use their voices to drive change.

Teachers certainly can use their voices to try to drive change. But be prepared to be let go for questioning your admin aka your boss. Be prepared to be let go for not following the first jobs at your workplace aka not using the curriculum you’re told to use.

I’m a PP who was let go from a teaching job for doing that once. I don’t think I’ll try again until I’m out of the education field. Even then I’d be nervous because these days people lose jobs just for have different opinions. If I speak out against the most widely used ELA curriculum, is an office job going to fire me? Honestly, it’s a possibility if I’m then seen as controversial. I’ve only been in the education field for about six year and some of that time was as a substitute so I’m pretty sure a bunch of people would just say I’m some inexperienced idiot and they Calkins is the way.

I also lost a friend because she’s a special education teacher and I feel like sometimes IEPs are just enabling kids to be lazy. I had a student with one who had no specific learning disability and she just did not like doing work without me reading the directions and without me trying to work with her 1:1 which was usually impossible in a class of 24. This was fourth grade and I had one of the kids read directions for one of our projects. This fourth grader read them just fine. I got an email from the girl with IEP (there were 11 with IEPs in this class!! But I just didn’t understand hers) and her mother told me the directions had too many words and I should simplify them.... no other kids had a problem with one kid had a 504 for OCD so she liked detailed instructions. So how do I provide details for one kid, simply things down for another, and keep things on grade level for mostly everyone else? And my friend who teaches at the high school level with severe special needs so she teaches life skills and only has two students on her plate, called me out and told me they as a special education teacher she was offended and it wouldn’t be so hard to differentiate directions for all the students. Yeah, let me just write the directions in 3-24 different ways for everything! Psh. And the kicker was this girl who allegedly didn’t like my directions because they were too hard to follow scores as above grade level for STAR Reading (this is like I-Ready). I think her mother just enabled her to be lazy.

As a teacher it’s hard to speak out against anything you find weird about the system because you WILL offend people and have people make you feel like a heartless monster for thinking things like this cruel to have a class full of fourth graders who vary from a kindergarten to sixth grade reading level all together in one class. And I’ve heard of high school teachers with 15 kids on IEPs who get front row seats as an accommodation and they’re like “well I don’t even have 15 front row seats so I guess I get in trouble for not following every IEP this year.” Some kids truly need IEPs but at least in many wealthy towns, a lot of parents push and push to get one. Some schools make it easier then others.

I acknowledge the education system is a mess and I do think any teacher who disagrees with that is an unintelligent teacher. Luckily I think most teachers could list a few things wrong with the system. Most of us aren’t idiots. We just don’t want to be shamed or lose our jobs for questioning things we are just supposed to go along with with no questions asked.

You certainly don’t sound like an idiot. I think that sounds like an impossible job!

We’ve pulled our kids out to homeschool. Just for the situation you’ve described. We are fortunate enough to have me stay home to give our two children the individualized attention they need.

I think that’s why the Facebook post irritates me so much — sure, you need specialized training to teach 30 squirming first graders (all at differing levels of maturity and ability), but is specialized training truly necessary to teach a child? No, it isn’t.

I can’t blame parents for trying to figure out a way to have the system work for their child. It’s just because they care. At the same time, there’s just no way any student can get the attention they need in classrooms that large. Even teachers, with their specialized training, can’t seem to figure out a way to make the current system work.

[Anonymous]

Lol, without reading much of this thread, that is the literal truth about AEM posters- everyone indeed thinks they're an expert. On everything.