Did your kid not apply for to a college because of visit? Excellent School

Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:My DD is interested in going into a very specific major. Researching schools in advance, we both thought one particular school would be “perfect” for her. Our experience with the school including the virtual visit was so bad that she’s thinking of not applying. On paper the university sounds great and has great reviews.

I’m just trying to reconcile this in my head with I am reading with what we experienced. We tried to make an appointment to visit the University back in Jan (pre-COVID). We started off on the wrong foot because we wanted to meet with an academic advisor in the department my DD will be majoring in. I called and got a very snippy receptionist who told us who to contact. DD contacted and didn’t hear back for a week. DD sent a follow up message requesting a meeting. Person setting up meeting with academic advisor made DD feel like she was impatient. FWIW- all the other schools she set up meetings with got back with her Within 24 to 48 hours. Due to COVID visit was understandably cancelled. They offered a virtual tour. It was horrible. The AV was poor, they had technical difficulties and we were unimpressed with the admission rep. We met with the academic advisor later and she cut of off and was downright rude. My daughter was in tears after the virtual visit.

I’m sure if I posted the name of the school people here would say that’s an amazing school For the major- yet our experience was anything but. The school went from being a top choice for DD to I don’t think I should apply.

I am just wondering if others had similar experiences with colleges letting them down pre-admissions but applied anyway and went. My thought is if they can’t treat DD well when she’s a prospective student, why should I think they will treat her any differently if she were to be accepted?



This is going to sound more harsh than it is meant, but your post reeks of entitlement. Universities are not structured or staffed to respond to the whims and demands of prospective students. Advisors and professors have their hands full serving their current students. No way they can also serve tens of thousands of needy prospective students. And then to cry after a poorly executed virtual visit in the middle of a global pandemic? That's some serious snowflake behavior. I would suggest telling your DD to put on her big girl pants, and make a decision based on bigger picture factors and not whether the school catered to her scheduling wishes and had slick AV.


This. Please don't apply to my school - your family sounds needy. Some semesters I teach 100 students, many of whom require frequent meetings outside of classes. Depending on admin assignments, I may also advise undergraduates in my major - which again requires frequent meetings. I also advise several PhD students, which takes many hours of work each week. These students are my priority. Your high school student may or may not apply, and may or may not be accepted. You are asking me to donate my own private or research time to you and your family. Perhaps the other schools assign admin work to faculty specifically to deal with prospective students (perhaps because they are more in need of applicants) - in which case the faculty's schedule has specific time assigned for such tasks.


Not the PP to whom you're responding, but in all seriousness and without snark: Have you considered trying to move to a smaller college? Where you would not have 100-student classes, at least? Or is your research something that you feel only really can be done where you currently teach? Because all the undergrad and PhD advising and your very understandable protectiveness over your "private or research time" sound like things that are not contributing to making your academic career a source of fulfillment to you. Since we can't convey tone very well in posts, I'm adding that I really do not mean that as criticism. I just hear...stress.


Yes - during the academic year, life is very stressful. I may have sounded defensive, but the majority of posters here do not realize how much work research active faculty do - usually we work many more than 40 hours a week, in contact with students or colleagues or coauthors in the evenings, on weekends etc. Sometimes I am asked on a Friday night to write a report that can be circulated to the department by Monday morning. Similarly, if a student is in distress - it doesn't matter if it is 8pm at night. If I were to become deadwood (as in, no research), as some of my colleagues, then I would be able to fit all the work into a 40 hr week. The posters here who expect faculty to be in touch with prospective undergrad applicant - would they be willing to stop working on a deadline for their job, or ignore their current clients, or not put their kid to bed, for a possible client, who may or may not have the money to even purchase the company's product?
Anonymous
Maybe the people you describe as "dead wood" are working as many hours as you, but they reply to perspective students and give more attention to teaching. You are showing the bias that most research universities have: undervaluing teaching contributions and over-valuing research (which brings in grants). Just saying there is another way..and you should not be so quick to put down the other way.
Anonymous
That poster sounds like the type of "collaborator" or mentor who only helps out if he gets a paper (i.e. authorship) out of the deal. It is a very transactional approach to higher education. But again, there is a cut-throat side to academia which is rampant at Tier 1 universities.

Don't think most science superstars are not prima donnas. They are tolerated, quirks, egos and all, because they bring money and prestige to the institution.

It is not the world I aspire to working in, but many have drank the kool aid and think anything less is beneath them.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:PP 12:16 that's why I'm even posting because of COVID I realize that things are probably chaotic and some schools (every other school my DD toured virtually) seemed to have their act together. This one stuck out. We booked months in advance for a junior visit and we would have understood if they needed to reschedule. Unfortunately, it's hard whether fair or not to make a good next impression after a bad (first, second and third) one.

I appreciate the insider information from staff/students about not judging a undergraduate school based on staff. Unfortunately for us, it's something hard to overlook as we do not have any experience with the school other than what we've read.

We originally like the school because it is closer than most of the other colleges (well mom does at least) and its stellar reputation in her field of choice. However, I'm thinking it might be better to expand our search to schools further away- which I don't like particularly in this crazy COVID-19 climate. If safety is her top choice after the search- she can go there. The safety is driving distance and everyone I know who has attended loves it.


12:16 poster replying, OP:

Ok I understand how you feel, and your last paragraph answers your question/concern. The perfect major fit school and the safety honors school are both close to home (good for you, mom). Do you think your DD also wants to be closer to home? She may not tell you this, but she could be hesitant about going too far. This pandemic is affecting HS junior/seniors in different ways. Your daughter is young, she could be internalizing her nervousness.

I can say the same thing about my DS. Maybe he loves the school I mentioned above because it's close to home. The bonus is that it's really a hidden gem, but I was blinded by my "meh" arrogance. In all honesty, I secretly want him closer to home (northeast).

Neither school have to come off her list. Apply to both schools. When the virus fog lifts, she can do an in person tour, she has plenty of time. Also, PLEASE register for the virtual tour again for both of these schools. Maybe the second time around, it will be much better. Again, plenty of time. Apply to both schools that are close to home. I bet this will be comforting for her. No end game yet! Ours kids are only juniors.
Anonymous
DD was very excited about a college in CT- it was great on paper, online, had an excellent program for what she wanted to study. We were both excited to see the campus and went to an open house weekend. I thought it was great but DD didn't like the feel of the school and the fact that the medical campus was a bus ride away from the main campus. She didn't even apply. She is very happy with her choice which was a school that she applied to but hadn't toured until the accepted students tour. There is a lot to be said for an on-site tour, it's unfortunate that a lot of kids aren't able to do this right now.
Anonymous
I think it was very unrealistic to have such high hopes for an online tour and I'm not surprised that it unfortunately went south.

FWIW I think the demand for the meeting with the faculty member was extremely presumptuous, no matter how small the program. I'm surprised that the school even agreed to set it up. That just isn't the norm as far as our experiences have been and we have 4 kids either currently at or graduated from Top 10 schools.

You may have answered this … how far away is the school? Can you just hop in the car and do a car tour and self-guided walking tour of the school? That's what we would do. It isn't the same as visiting the campus when it is filled with students but it certainly is better than doing an online thing.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:DC hated everything about Middlebury from the AD to the other families on the tour to what the guide had to say. It was picture perfect campus - I thought she would love it. Oh well.


I had the same experience on my visit 15 years ago. I felt like I had walked into a North Face catalog and that I was back in middle school being ignored by the popular preppy people.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I'm a college professor. While this school may indeed be full of deeply unpleasant people, please know that universities are in a bit of a panic. They are trying to finish out the semester, but they don't have access to facilities for proctored exams. Some students want to take the exam later; others want take home exams. All of this requires meetings, rewriting exams, and paperwork.

Students have dying relatives, faculty members are ill or have tiny children at home, and every day , they have to decide what maintenance is necessary (safety checks on boilers, cuttting grass in advance of fire season), and what is not.

Prospective students haven't been forgotten, but they are not at the top of anyone's priority list.


+1000 Sorry


+1

Nailed it.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:My DD is interested in going into a very specific major. Researching schools in advance, we both thought one particular school would be “perfect” for her. Our experience with the school including the virtual visit was so bad that she’s thinking of not applying. On paper the university sounds great and has great reviews.

I’m just trying to reconcile this in my head with I am reading with what we experienced. We tried to make an appointment to visit the University back in Jan (pre-COVID). We started off on the wrong foot because we wanted to meet with an academic advisor in the department my DD will be majoring in. I called and got a very snippy receptionist who told us who to contact. DD contacted and didn’t hear back for a week. DD sent a follow up message requesting a meeting. Person setting up meeting with academic advisor made DD feel like she was impatient. FWIW- all the other schools she set up meetings with got back with her Within 24 to 48 hours. Due to COVID visit was understandably cancelled. They offered a virtual tour. It was horrible. The AV was poor, they had technical difficulties and we were unimpressed with the admission rep. We met with the academic advisor later and she cut of off and was downright rude. My daughter was in tears after the virtual visit.

I’m sure if I posted the name of the school people here would say that’s an amazing school For the major- yet our experience was anything but. The school went from being a top choice for DD to I don’t think I should apply.

I am just wondering if others had similar experiences with colleges letting them down pre-admissions but applied anyway and went. My thought is if they can’t treat DD well when she’s a prospective student, why should I think they will treat her any differently if she were to be accepted?



As a tenured faculty member, I can tell you that universities are big places with lots of employees. I've barely even known the admin people who do work for ME, let alone those who do work for students. I couldn't name a single person in the academic advising office. Admissions rep? This is probably somebody who otherwise would be an insurance salesman. There can be a huge disconnect between the quality of classes and extracurricular activities that make up a "program" or "major" than two nobody administrators. Public or Private, universities are large bureaucracies. COVID aside (which might explain part of this), there are some wonderful people and there are people who should not be employed in any job. This was true even at an ivy league university I worked at. The campus experience is defined by interactions with 100 different people before your child graduates. I would be mortified to know that I put all this effort into designing courses that are excellently reviewed only to have it ruined by some incompetent advisor or admissions rep. I would just look at reviews or talk to students who went through the programs before you make any decision. That would be wayyyyyy more reliable than your brief experience with a very small sample (almost doesn't deserve to be called a sample) of low level grunt employees. Finally, don't forget that most "academic advisors" job is literally to look down a pre-printed list of courses that satisfy requirements and tell your student, "Durrrrr you can take A, B, or C." You might as well make a university decision based on how helpful the barista was at the campus starbucks.


Holy crap you come off as a huge jerk in this post, can you hear yourself?


I was just wondering if I was the only one who thought so. I've known lots of academics who are lovely people, but there is definitely a large subset that are arrogant a**holes like pp.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:<<I got my phd at Cornell >>

World of difference from being an undergrad. Tier 1 research schools exist to get grants and churn out peer-reviewed papers, that will bring honor (and more grants) to the school. Doctoral students are very much part of achieving those goals. (And this is coming from a tenured professor.)

The previous poster admitted that elite schools may well have amazing education, but they do not offer UNDERGRADUATES the individual attention that SLAC schools do. My DC is publishing her second peer-reviewed paper this summer, as a sophomore at a SLAC. At Cornell, that opportunity would probably go to a grad student.

My DC hopes to attend a Cornell-like grad school, but is VERY content with her choice for an undergrad environment. No one has to be RIGHT in this discussion...different options offer different benefits and disadvantages. Depending upon the student, they can all offer a great education.


+1,000 on all of this.
Anonymous
Occidental was disappointing to us. The videos made it look urban and exciting but it turned out to be somewhat isolated and very quiet. Students seemed bright and serious but the vibe was not what we expected. We thought it would be Macalaster without the snow. It wasn't. However, many people on the tour loved it.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:Northwestern. DD hated it from the moment we stepped on campus. No smiling students anywhere, cafeteria was too "weird" (her word not mine), and our tour guide was a disaster. Not that it would have mattered, DD knew she wouldn't apply before we took the tour.

For the record, and I shared none of this with DD until after all applications were in because, her college experience, not mine, I thought the campus lovely, the food delicious, and had I been the college student, absolutely would have applied!


Northwestern felt very space alien-y when we visited.
Anonymous
I hope the poster who complained that there were no refreshments or free parking never dares complaint about the cost of college.

All that swag doesn't materialize out of thin air. The parking office charges admissions at many schools for those spots. The dining hall charges for those refreshments. Some schools will spend their budget on that stuff and some won't. I think I'd rather they skip the bad coffee and put that money towards things the students need.
Anonymous
My kid took William and Mary off his list after the visit.

I was bummed. On paper it was perfect for him and it would have been a safety.
Anonymous
Did your son share why he took W&M off his list?
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