DH is claiming to be Jewish with no verifiable proof.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No, a person is not “Jewish” just because a maternal great-grandmother was Jewish, at least not in the eyes of most people who consider Judaism a religion, not an indelible magic stamp that persists for all time through the maternal bloodline. Yes, I know orthodox rabbis take this view. But... one of my great-grandmothers was Irish. The others were not. This does not make me “Irish,” and does not give me a deep mystical connection to Ireland, it just makes me someone who is about 1/8 Irish in terms of genealogical ancestry. It does not somehow drown out the other seven non-Irish contributors to my genetics.

Being Jewish is a choice he can make. Or not. The fact that a bunch of orthodox rabbis might want him to convert versus say he does not need to convert should not be what defines his choices.

Jewish law is what it is. When we say, "he's Jewish," we mean that so long as his maternal grandmother was Jewish, that's sufficient to establish his full-fledged Judaism under traditional Jewish law. This is different from making claims about deep mystical connections, genes, ancestry, or even identity -- and it's not a trump card.

That said, according Jewish law and tradition, there is no such thing as 1/8 Jewish any more than there is such a thing as 1/8 pregnant. Either you are or you aren't.

None of which is necessarily germane to the question of how OP and her husband choose to proceed under the circumstances.

[Anonymous]

I think that the question of whether your DH has "proof" seems to be kind of irrelevant. These are the questions?

1. Does he want to be Jewish? Have a Jewish identity? Raise the kids Jewish? Any synagogue will have an outreach person who can not only set up some visits to services but direct him towards other Jewish learning resources. He could have a formal conversion if he so chooses.

2. How do you feel about this? Do you mind him pursuing this? Are you OK with your kids developing a Jewish identity? Have you talked about religious questions previously?

What you and he want going forward are the operative questions. I don't think that challenging whether he can prove his ancestry will get you anywhere.

[Anonymous]

Interesting that some places require proof. I don't even know what I would provide if someone asked me.

Although... Would 23&Me "99% Ashkenazi Jewish" results qualify?

[Anonymous]

You can align yourself with whatever religion you want to. Believing in it is more important than proving membership.

Personally, my religion doesn’t agree with any religion. But I respect all religions. If it makes people feel better or more comfortable in their lives, that is a great thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, a person is not “Jewish” just because a maternal great-grandmother was Jewish, at least not in the eyes of most people who consider Judaism a religion, not an indelible magic stamp that persists for all time through the maternal bloodline. Yes, I know orthodox rabbis take this view. But... one of my great-grandmothers was Irish. The others were not. This does not make me “Irish,” and does not give me a deep mystical connection to Ireland, it just makes me someone who is about 1/8 Irish in terms of genealogical ancestry. It does not somehow drown out the other seven non-Irish contributors to my genetics.

Being Jewish is a choice he can make. Or not. The fact that a bunch of orthodox rabbis might want him to convert versus say he does not need to convert should not be what defines his choices.

Jewish law is what it is. When we say, "he's Jewish," we mean that so long as his maternal grandmother was Jewish, that's sufficient to establish his full-fledged Judaism under traditional Jewish law. This is different from making claims about deep mystical connections, genes, ancestry, or even identity -- and it's not a trump card.

That said, according Jewish law and tradition, there is no such thing as 1/8 Jewish any more than there is such a thing as 1/8 pregnant. Either you are or you aren't.

None of which is necessarily germane to the question of how OP and her husband choose to proceed under the circumstances.

You don't speak for all jews, FYI. My son is Jewish despite lack of matrilineal descent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Interesting that some places require proof. I don't even know what I would provide if someone asked me.

Although... Would 23&Me "99% Ashkenazi Jewish" results qualify?

Yes

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, a person is not “Jewish” just because a maternal great-grandmother was Jewish, at least not in the eyes of most people who consider Judaism a religion, not an indelible magic stamp that persists for all time through the maternal bloodline. Yes, I know orthodox rabbis take this view. But... one of my great-grandmothers was Irish. The others were not. This does not make me “Irish,” and does not give me a deep mystical connection to Ireland, it just makes me someone who is about 1/8 Irish in terms of genealogical ancestry. It does not somehow drown out the other seven non-Irish contributors to my genetics.

Being Jewish is a choice he can make. Or not. The fact that a bunch of orthodox rabbis might want him to convert versus say he does not need to convert should not be what defines his choices.

Jewish law is what it is. When we say, "he's Jewish," we mean that so long as his maternal grandmother was Jewish, that's sufficient to establish his full-fledged Judaism under traditional Jewish law. This is different from making claims about deep mystical connections, genes, ancestry, or even identity -- and it's not a trump card.

That said, according Jewish law and tradition, there is no such thing as 1/8 Jewish any more than there is such a thing as 1/8 pregnant. Either you are or you aren't.

None of which is necessarily germane to the question of how OP and her husband choose to proceed under the circumstances.

You don't speak for all jews, FYI. My son is Jewish despite lack of matrilineal descent.

Sorry, I didn't mean to suggest that your son isn't 100% Jewish or speak for anyone. When I say "traditional" I mean that as a stand-in for "halacha" i.e. Jewish legal tradition, followed in different ways and to different degrees by Orthodox (and arguably Conservative) Jewish communities. On the other hand, Reform Judaism and other Liberal Jewish traditions view halacha / traditional Jewish law as more of a jumping-off point or gateway for understanding rather than a set of rules, and do not accept "Jewish law" in the prescriptive sense. Reform Judaism certainly accepts patrilineal descent.

My point is that under this -- let's call it "strict constructionist" perspective, so long as there is matrilineal descent, he is Jewish, and meeting the halachik criteria is going to be a sufficient condition for establishing Judaism in all but a few outlying scenarios. (E.g. birthright trip, applying for Israeli citizenship lol.) According to that perspective, he'd be 100% Jewish -- which doesn't mean he's not Irish or German or Korean -- but it also doesn't mean he's only partly Jewish, because traditional Judaism doesn't recognize such a thing.

This is not to say at ALL that the question of "who is a Jew" is somehow definitely answered for all of us by that one model and those particular criteria. For example, according to the Reform movement's platform adopted more than 30 yeas ago, "A child of one Jewish parent, who is raised exclusively as a Jew and whose Jewish status is "established through appropriate and timely public and formal acts of identification with the Jewish faith and people" is Jewish. These acts include entry into the covenant, acquisition of a Hebrew name, Torah study, bar/bat mitzvah, and confirmation."

[Anonymous]

Some Jews are progressive and don't buy into all that outdated stuff

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some Jews are progressive and don't buy into all that outdated stuff

lol by "outdated stuff" do you mean "religion?"

You don't have to buy into it in order to understand it or find value in it. Just sharing information here. We're not quite sure what OP's husband is looking for or trying to determine, so maybe it's valuable, and maybe it's not

Again, it would be really unlikely and rare for anyone at any synagogue or Jewish org to ask for any kind of proof of anything in order to participate in Jewish life in their community. It's just not like that, not for Orthodox Jews, either, and certainly not for Reform or other progressive Jews. Most congregations here try to be really welcoming and that includes Chabad and other v. Orthodox communities.

I mean I have a close friend who is Jewish, 1/2 ashkenazic 1/2 vietnamese . Her mom converted with an Orthodox rabbi -- but after she was born. So technically under Orthodox Jewish law she's not Jewish -- but that really has no impact on her life. She involved in her local Jewish community, keeps kosher, all the holidays, etc. The only time it has ever come up for her that I'm aware of is when she was much younger and part of a Zionist group and considered moving to Israel one day, and realized she'd have to convert.

And I also have at least two friends with one Jewish grandparent who don't consider themselves Jewish at all, it's just like a random thing they've brought up in conversation. For them it's just a footnote.

<shrug>

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t get it. Are you Jewish?

If so your kids will be Jewish and you can be reform or conservative whatever,

If not, why is he so into this exactly?

Not true both my sisters were born Jewish, married non Jews and both kids are being raised Catholic, please in light of our world today, do not over generalize..ridiculous!

There is a difference between being ethnically Jewish and religiously Jewish. Your nieces/nephews are ethnically Jewish by nature of your sisters being born Jewish. They inherit their ethnicity through the matrilineal line. That does not make them religiously Jewish. In fact they are not religiously Jewish, they are being raised Catholic and are religiously Christian.

[Anonymous]

Looks like Op’s DH has a new pet project. Hope he doesn’t slough off his other responsibilities.
Frankly this sounds like a mid life crisis.