A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Part of it has been systematic disenfranchisement of African Americans. This recent Propublica/New Yorker article covers one example--black families passed down land to descendants, and the land is sometimes later taken from them by courts, developers, etc. I'm black (although 1st-gen American) and I had no idea stuff like this had occurred recently and is still ongoing.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019/07/22/kicked-off-the-land?utm_brand=tny&utm_source=facebook&utm_social-type=owned&mbid=social_facebook&utm_medium=social&fbclid=IwAR1O7GdqtpMZK7fjhGnTFgzNfrm3ShGBmRmydq0pG7c11bKpcTi0zsnNtDc

This is an interesting piece. But you should know seizing land and valuables happens in small towns too. Texas has a huge problem with this, and it’s not just against Blacks. I only skimmed the piece but it’s seems it’s a lack of education of how laws are in flux that results in land losing.

I’m Hispanic (2nd generation), I’m the pp poster with my family idea. I think Op that the ones that do this have drugs and nothing to lose. Most people are good if they aren’t on drugs. If they had a good family unit even poor, there would be something to turn to. Money does buy opportunities. But love care and togetherness is not bought with money. If they could turn to church, they could turn around. I don’t think they are past rehab. But it can’t be the government fixing this. Yes there’s millions of issues they can fix. But you can’t fix instrisic value with a law. Foster children have the same issue.

Yes, in fact love, care, and togetherness ARE bought with money, in part. I am the PP white mom with the challenging son. My money and privilege: got him an IEP; got him top-of-the line therapy; got a house zoned for a good school where they implement the IEP; got me a job with great health insurance for him; got me a house close to my work so I can spend more time at home with him; and probably most importantly -- not being in poverty greatly reduces my stress level, so I can be a good parent.

Ok this is ridiculous OP. So unless you get paid well you can’t love and care for your kids? Cook or clean at home? I’m Hispanic and my parents came here as immigrants and through their love and care a I succeeded. My mom worked as cafeteria lady, we were dirt poor. Their money did not afford me the best school, I went to a regular public school, middle school was horrible with gangs. I’m now a parent two two boys. One with autism. I dedicate time to him and he succeeds. I recognize that now I have an economic component that other kids don’t have. But it goes hand in hand. IEPs also don’t cost money, it’s a law that schools have to provide.

But As other black men said, they practice self care and do the best they can. Showing up and hard work gets you far, even when the stakes are against you. This is why immigrants come here. Granted I’m also aware blacks experience another level of racism Hispanics don’t.

OP’s examples of people who kill senselessly are not related to blacks. Any race can do that. The Hispanic man who shot that woman in San Francisco, etc. these are just people with no social network, no church, job, family (again not bought with money!), and emotional battered. Probably no role models either, mixed with the $ aspect. And drugs. It kills any sense of morality or care for humanity. OP do you think this from reading the news. The news is sensational.

Of course you can love and take care of your kids in poverty. But poverty adds stress, and reduces resources (by definition). When coupled with things like lead poisoning, bad schools, bad housing, lack of outdoor play space that already disadvantage these kids ... poverty makes it MUCH MUCH harder for parents to take care of kids and prevent behavioral issues. The parents don't actually love their kids any less -- that I am clear on -- but stress & poverty must make good parenting so much harder.

And IEPs don't cost money, are you joking? Do you know the number of hours & personal expertise & professional/personal capital I had to dedicate to get my child's IEP ... and the money it takes to enroll him in a school that will implement it well?

I get that poverty adds stress. I said that above it goes hand in hand in a way. But this is where the family structure plays a role. Having a proper family unit can insulate children from going the wrong way, or at least guide them to try. This is not a resolve of racism. It just how to get by and not get lost. If children already start off out of wedlock or no male role model and poverty, they lost the first teacher in life already.

For the IEP yes it has taken me time too, but through education I know my rights. I attended a free course at a nonprofit. i haven't paid in public school for anything. I do pay privately for services though. I don't know maybe I'm so far removed from how I grew up I don't understand anymore. But I think families need strengthening in these communities.

[Anonymous]

It's their culture.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's their culture.

...and as predicted, racists on this discussion.


I was just about to say something as a black person, but will now be quiet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, as a black person, I have just accepted that racism is a real thing and that there is a huge, huge effort by many white people to deny its existence. So, I see the truth in things.

I see it. I accept that it's not a fair playing field. I accept that professionally I will struggle and have struggled in ways my white coworkers simply never will. I accept the study that demonstrates big law partners rate the writing of black attorneys more harshly than white attorneys. I accept things will never really change because most white people are fine with the ways things are. I accept that many white people refuse to admit that the past 50-75 years in this country is a minimal amount of time compared to the hundreds of years of horror black people have suffered through. I accept that wealth is probably unequal due to discriminatory hiring, lending, housing that benefited white people's grand parents and parents. I accept it all.

Then I get up, send my children to the best school we could find, go to work and do good work, go home, work with my children and drive them to classes and sports and activities. I make healthy food. I meditate. I practice self-care. I do all of the things to thrive. And I keep the rest out of my mind. Because I know it's there and I know there is no strong incentive to change things (if anything there is an incentive to deny, ignore and deflect).

I can't give it any more power or influence in my life. I can't change it. I refuse to engage it. It's not my doing or responsibility. And the premise that black people or minorities should speak to racism, own racism, fix racism is a farce. This is a white people's problem that many of them have little interest in fixing.

I choose to thrive. I choose to live.

White person here. PP, you are absolutely right. My hope is that as more and more white people realize this, we will actually stop tolerating racism overt or systemic enough to change our culture.

Another black PP but this is on point. I completely agree with the first PP.

It's crazy that you PP are one of the few white people who responded. It kind of proved her point, though. But you keep on.

[Anonymous]

18:06 When you are the poor relations and the rest of your extended family are financially stable, they can mitigate some of the stress of poverty. When your ENTIRE family and neighborhood are in generational poverty, the ability to mitigate the stress of poverty is greatly reduced or nigh impossible. Mothers in my neighborhood shared food, but there were still nights kids went to bed hungry. If our heat was shut off, we would cross the street and share a bed with our cousins. However, it might be that their water was cut off and we might all troop back across to my unheated house to wash our faces before school. There really wasn’t an escape from stress. Not a dependable one. You can’t make long term plans. You focus on a next that is the very near future. It ate away at my childhood. By 8, I could eyeball the flour canister and tell you how many crappy pancakes we were away from skipping a meal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, as a black person, I have just accepted that racism is a real thing and that there is a huge, huge effort by many white people to deny its existence. So, I see the truth in things.

I see it. I accept that it's not a fair playing field. I accept that professionally I will struggle and have struggled in ways my white coworkers simply never will. I accept the study that demonstrates big law partners rate the writing of black attorneys more harshly than white attorneys. I accept things will never really change because most white people are fine with the ways things are. I accept that many white people refuse to admit that the past 50-75 years in this country is a minimal amount of time compared to the hundreds of years of horror black people have suffered through. I accept that wealth is probably unequal due to discriminatory hiring, lending, housing that benefited white people's grand parents and parents. I accept it all.

Then I get up, send my children to the best school we could find, go to work and do good work, go home, work with my children and drive them to classes and sports and activities. I make healthy food. I meditate. I practice self-care. I do all of the things to thrive. And I keep the rest out of my mind. Because I know it's there and I know there is no strong incentive to change things (if anything there is an incentive to deny, ignore and deflect).

I can't give it any more power or influence in my life. I can't change it. I refuse to engage it. It's not my doing or responsibility. And the premise that black people or minorities should speak to racism, own racism, fix racism is a farce. This is a white people's problem that many of them have little interest in fixing.

I choose to thrive. I choose to live.

White person here. PP, you are absolutely right. My hope is that as more and more white people realize this, we will actually stop tolerating racism overt or systemic enough to change our culture.

Another black PP but this is on point. I completely agree with the first PP.

It's crazy that you PP are one of the few white people who responded. It kind of proved her point, though. But you keep on.

How do white people have any standing to tell black people what to do to change the culture of their community? Not interested in hearing some white lecture about blah, blah, blah.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, as a black person, I have just accepted that racism is a real thing and that there is a huge, huge effort by many white people to deny its existence. So, I see the truth in things.

I see it. I accept that it's not a fair playing field. I accept that professionally I will struggle and have struggled in ways my white coworkers simply never will. I accept the study that demonstrates big law partners rate the writing of black attorneys more harshly than white attorneys. I accept things will never really change because most white people are fine with the ways things are. I accept that many white people refuse to admit that the past 50-75 years in this country is a minimal amount of time compared to the hundreds of years of horror black people have suffered through. I accept that wealth is probably unequal due to discriminatory hiring, lending, housing that benefited white people's grand parents and parents. I accept it all.

Then I get up, send my children to the best school we could find, go to work and do good work, go home, work with my children and drive them to classes and sports and activities. I make healthy food. I meditate. I practice self-care. I do all of the things to thrive. And I keep the rest out of my mind. Because I know it's there and I know there is no strong incentive to change things (if anything there is an incentive to deny, ignore and deflect).

I can't give it any more power or influence in my life. I can't change it. I refuse to engage it. It's not my doing or responsibility. And the premise that black people or minorities should speak to racism, own racism, fix racism is a farce. This is a white people's problem that many of them have little interest in fixing.

I choose to thrive. I choose to live.

White person here. PP, you are absolutely right. My hope is that as more and more white people realize this, we will actually stop tolerating racism overt or systemic enough to change our culture.

Another black PP but this is on point. I completely agree with the first PP.

It's crazy that you PP are one of the few white people who responded. It kind of proved her point, though. But you keep on.

How do white people have any standing to tell black people what to do to change the culture of their community? Not interested in hearing some white lecture about blah, blah, blah.

How about when whites begin to suppress the need to dominate, kill, control, disadvantage, steal, and outcompete everyone on earth. Which is never, so.... yeah.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t feel that way at all. Maybe because I have a lot of experience working with low income boys ages 11-14 in some innovative programs and see how they aren’t that different than I was at that age as a poor black kid in Baltimore and I’m a pretty awesome human being today. And they aren’t that different from my DDs raised middle class in terms of having dreams and wanting adults to support them. So I haven’t written them off. TBH, I think any community that starts writing off its youth as unredeemable is doomed.

Are you male or female?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Upwards of 70% of Black babies are born out of wedlock. The complete breakdown of the family unit is a big piece of this puzzle, I believe.

But what can realistically be done about this? You can't force couples to stay together.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Upwards of 70% of Black babies are born out of wedlock. The complete breakdown of the family unit is a big piece of this puzzle, I believe.

But what can realistically be done about this? You can't force couples to stay together.

You certainly can. Whether you should is a different question. But maybe there's a middle ground between lots of force to stay together and lots of force not to stay together.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:White mom of privileged white sons that will never know 1% of the heartbreak and worry my friends raising black sons have. I think the premise of the question is wrong. The black youth you speculate are unredeemable are trying to exist and survive in a culture that is openly hostile to them and you ask why they aren’t thriving. What is the problem to fix? Everything. Safe, quality schools. Affordable and accessible healthcare. Affordable, safe housing and transportation. Reduced police bias and violence. Just to start. As a society we need to stop asking why people without boots can’t pull themselves up by their bootstraps.

This is stupid. Sorry, there is no other way to say it. This so-called woke and compassionate response is a big part of the problem, starting back in the 70s. It is not compassionate to people to blame their problems on society. They cannot control society. Society is not persecuting or holding them down. [b] If anything, our culture glorifies the maladaptive behavior through music, film and imitation. [b]

+1000
I do think hip hop culture plays a huge part of the blame.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:White mom of privileged white sons that will never know 1% of the heartbreak and worry my friends raising black sons have. I think the premise of the question is wrong. The black youth you speculate are unredeemable are trying to exist and survive in a culture that is openly hostile to them and you ask why they aren’t thriving. What is the problem to fix? Everything. Safe, quality schools. Affordable and accessible healthcare. Affordable, safe housing and transportation. Reduced police bias and violence. Just to start. As a society we need to stop asking why people without boots can’t pull themselves up by their bootstraps.

This is stupid. Sorry, there is no other way to say it. This so-called woke and compassionate response is a big part of the problem, starting back in the 70s. It is not compassionate to people to blame their problems on society. They cannot control society. Society is not persecuting or holding them down. [b] If anything, our culture glorifies the maladaptive behavior through music, film and imitation. [b]

+1000
I do think hip hop culture plays a huge part of the blame.

Ask yourself who promotes hip hop culture and perpetuates it because they're making BIG MONEY off it.
Consider this...U.S. listeners are spending more money on music than ever before: over $20 billion a year. Total music revenues — including from on-demand streams, CD sales, radio play, live events, advertising — have risen to about $43 billion a year. Of that, artists only take home $5 billion, or about 12 percent. So who's taking home the remaining 88 percent?

Hint:
It ain't the folks with melanin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP here and I also find you suspect OP. I can easily think of half a dozen more appropriate forums to have an honest discussion if you’re not trolling. And no I’m not mentioning those other forums here.

Really? I can think of no better place than an anonymous forum for having honest conversations that one could otherwise risk being attacked for. And why are you reluctant to list the other forums that are more appropriate for having honest conversations?'

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here and I also find you suspect OP. I can easily think of half a dozen more appropriate forums to have an honest discussion if you’re not trolling. And no I’m not mentioning those other forums here.

I'm OP and I'm not sure I can speak to what you find suspect about my post. I did give some thought to where I posted it before deciding to open it here. As you know, people post all kinds of things under Off-Topic - it's a catch-all kind of forum - so I went with it. I just figured if Mr. Steele and his colleagues saw fit for it under another forum, they would move it.

But yes, I am a being real, here - this discussion is important to me and I'm doing my best to read/respond as quickly as I can. No trolling, I promise. Thank you.

Pp is suggesting a forum other than dcum. Dcum has some serious racists and trolls. I guess everywhere does, but this sort of topic doesn’t work very well in this particular, anonymous, space.

Why? What other website would this topic work better at?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:White mom of privileged white sons that will never know 1% of the heartbreak and worry my friends raising black sons have. I think the premise of the question is wrong. The black youth you speculate are unredeemable are trying to exist and survive in a culture that is openly hostile to them and you ask why they aren’t thriving. What is the problem to fix? Everything. Safe, quality schools. Affordable and accessible healthcare. Affordable, safe housing and transportation. Reduced police bias and violence. Just to start. As a society we need to stop asking why people without boots can’t pull themselves up by their bootstraps.

This is stupid. Sorry, there is no other way to say it. This so-called woke and compassionate response is a big part of the problem, starting back in the 70s. It is not compassionate to people to blame their problems on society. They cannot control society. Society is not persecuting or holding them down. If anything, our culture glorifies the maladaptive behavior through music, film and imitation. [b]

+1000
I do think hip hop culture plays a huge part of the blame.

Ask yourself who promotes hip hop culture and perpetuates it because they're making BIG MONEY off it.
Consider this...U.S. listeners are spending more money on music than ever before: over $20 billion a year. Total music revenues — including from on-demand streams, CD sales, radio play, live events, advertising — have risen to about $43 billion a year. Of that, artists only take home $5 billion, or about 12 percent. So who's taking home the remaining 88 percent?

Hint:
[b]It ain't the folks with melanin.

Oh come on. Where did hip hop culture come from? Who created it?