Wall Street Journal on rampant growth in percentage of college students with “disabilities”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's little debate about whether a person is deaf or blind or needs glasses.

But the same accomodations work for a person who is dyslexic as those that are for a person that is blind. Why discriminate against one disability and not the other.

The question is whether the disability REQUIRES the accommodation to access the regular curriculum. If we're trying to boost everyone onto a level playing field regardless of their intelligence and ability, then what's the point of evaluation at all? We might as well just go to ungraded colleges.

It the case of my DC, the answer is yes, it is required for him to access the curriculum. He has the intelligence, the persistence, the drive, and the ability to do the work. He goes to a fairly highly ranked college and does extremely well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have to agree that this is distasteful. These are very difficult schools to get into. They turn away many applicants who could do the work and succeed there. I see no reason why they should be accepting disproportionately wealthy students whose parents have gamed the system to get their children extra time on exams. Any of our kids could improve their scores with extra time.

Bingo! My DCs are at a very wealthy prep school where over 25% goes to ivies + S. Kids who were perfectly fine started getting accomodations in classes (to boost school gpa). One got extra time for school and SAT exams from “audio processing” meaning kid can’t process what professors in class to his/her brain. So why does this warrant extra time on tests? Tests questions are written and not read aloud. Look at collegeboard studies of the time before and after they were allowed to mark whether a kid had extra time. The % of kids who needed accommodation shot up. Let’s start leveling the playing field folks- give every kid the same amount of time. My kid could have gotten an 800 on the SAT Math II instead of 760 if they had extra t8me as their friend.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have to agree that this is distasteful. These are very difficult schools to get into. They turn away many applicants who could do the work and succeed there. I see no reason why they should be accepting disproportionately wealthy students whose parents have gamed the system to get their children extra time on exams. Any of our kids could improve their scores with extra time.

Bingo! My DCs are at a very wealthy prep school where over 25% goes to ivies + S. Kids who were perfectly fine started getting accomodations in classes (to boost school gpa). One got extra time for school and SAT exams from “audio processing” meaning kid can’t process what professors in class to his/her brain. So why does this warrant extra time on tests? Tests questions are written and not read aloud. Look at collegeboard studies of the time before and after they were allowed to mark whether a kid had extra time. The % of kids who needed accommodation shot up. Let’s start leveling the playing field folks- give every kid the same amount of time. My kid could have gotten an 800 on the SAT Math II instead of 760 if they had extra t8me as their friend.

My daughter attends a top school too and it’s crazy. I’m thinking of getting her tested because I didn’t with her older sister and regretted it when she couldn’t finish the ACT in the time allotted while her friends who went to Ivy League got double time and were allowed to use a computer to do the writing section - there is no way someone using a pencil and paper can create an essay that competes with a computer and the ability to cut/paste/rework/spell check. Made me crazy to hear it!

[Anonymous]

A couple of points: Serious mental illnesses such as bipolar disorder usually present themselves for the first time when people are 18-22. So it is possible that quite a few students who were "normal" in high school will suddenly need mental health care and accommodation in college. Secondly students who suffer from anxiety and depression can suddenly get worse when they are away from their support system. I suffered from clinical depression my freshman year, and needed more time to do my school work, but got better after I found the correct medication. So if you think mental health issues are scams to get better grades, thank your lucky stars you don't know otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What concerns me from a related article is the statement that wealthier students are more likely to receive accommodations than poor students.

What happens when these kids graduate college? Is an employer going to give a person who takes twice as long to do something the same salary as someone who meets deadlines?

The student is going to find a field appropriate to their strengths and weaknesses. Like we all do. How is this so shocking?

My dyslexic sibling takes longer to read and synthesize information than his non-dyslexic coworkers. Should he be fired? He has other strengths in his job that compensate for the time he needs to take to read information, and he deliberately chose a line of work where reading information isn't terribly time sensitive so he can spread it out and make sure he's not missing critical information.

No, he shouldn't be fired. But that's not the question here. The question is whether somehow 25% of the population suddenly has learning disabilities; whether those students benefit from accommodations; whether those accommodations are legitimate or not. Arguably, an accommodation just stops the student from learning where their proper niche is. In high school or elementary school it might be more appropriate; but college IMO is where they start needing to face their abilities and disabilities in the real world.

That is the question. Look, right up above my answer. "What happens when these kids graduate college?"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are disability accommodations as a result of mental illness (the root cause of the large percent, as highlighted in the article) a bad thing? What makes them less deserving of attention and consideration than someone who is physically disabled or blind?

Because it's not clear if those disabilities even require academic accommodations at all. In elementary and secondary school, having a disability alone does not qualify you to get anything. You only get accommodations and services if they're needed. Being anxious does not mean you need more time to take a test, or to have a reduced homework load. Maybe you get some specific accommodations for a panic attack during an exam. But as anyone who has actually dealt with anxiety and panic knows (raises hand!) the proper treatment for situational anxiety is not avoidance; it's learning how to cope with the situation.

Learning how to cope with the situation? Like, oh, running into a question and your mind going blank. So putting the pencil down. Closing your eyes for a minute. Taking a few deep breaths. Telling yourself you can skip this problem and move on to the next one. Opening your eyes, picking up your pencil, and moving on to the next question? That sort of coping with the situation?

That's exactly what my child with anxiety does. And sometimes, it means my child spend half an exam working through anxiety reactions. So yes, extended time on exams is a perfect accommodation because it means my child's anxiety isn't ramped up because he fears he's going to run out of time. Instead he gets to practice his coping techniques and his teachers actually get an exam that is reflective of what he knows rather than reflective of a panic attack.

I'm glad your anxiety is less intrusive or you have better developed skills. These are kids. They're still learning.

That sounds appropriate for elementary and high school, but not college, honestly. Sorry.

The comment I was responding to specifically called out elementary and secondary school and anxiety. I provided an example for how sometimes anxiety can and should be accommodated in elementary and secondary school.

And why wouldn't it be appropriate for college, if a student still has problems? There are schools that have specific programs for returning soldiers with PTSD. The school makes money, the students get an education, and hopefully over time the students become better able to cope with their disability and/or figure out a future that works with it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Truly - what is the harm of accommodations? What is one single example of an accommodated kid gaining an unfair advantage? I am asking this and my kids are accommodation free. These kids may not fit into the box they are dealt with but this has nothing to do with intellect, ideas or ability to innovate. Sure - perhaps there are some careers where they may not be properly suited but that’s between them and their employer.

This starts at high school and at my private, kids come up w diagnosis near SAT time and get extra time to improve scores esp SAT subject tests. The it continues in college, to get the better grades that allow one to get scholarships and better internships etc. I think the fairest method is to give everyone extra time. Then there will be no advantage to those gaming the system and we should see a decline and to those who really need the accommodation, they get it.

I think it starts way before HS.

My DS (currently in early elementary) has documented fine-motor delays that absolutely mean that he will be at a disadvantage in a hand-written test. However, I'm currently not planning to accept accomodations that would extend testing time. I think it's important for him to learn about his limitations, within reason. He gets a lot of support to work on his handwriting and focus; but I believe that at testing time, he should just do what everyone else does.

You may feel different when his performance actually counts for something. It would be a shame to put your own child at a disadvantage just so he can be like everyone else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A couple of points: Serious mental illnesses such as bipolar disorder usually present themselves for the first time when people are 18-22. So it is possible that quite a few students who were "normal" in high school will suddenly need mental health care and accommodation in college. Secondly students who suffer from anxiety and depression can suddenly get worse when they are away from their support system. I suffered from clinical depression my freshman year, and needed more time to do my school work, but got better after I found the correct medication. So if you think mental health issues are scams to get better grades, thank your lucky stars you don't know otherwise.

Get off your high horse. We did not say all were scamming - we are pointing out how the system can be and they are being scammed by those w means.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What concerns me from a related article is the statement that wealthier students are more likely to receive accommodations than poor students.

What happens when these kids graduate college? Is an employer going to give a person who takes twice as long to do something the same salary as someone who meets deadlines?

The student is going to find a field appropriate to their strengths and weaknesses. Like we all do. How is this so shocking?

My dyslexic sibling takes longer to read and synthesize information than his non-dyslexic coworkers. Should he be fired? He has other strengths in his job that compensate for the time he needs to take to read information, and he deliberately chose a line of work where reading information isn't terribly time sensitive so he can spread it out and make sure he's not missing critical information.

No, he shouldn't be fired. But that's not the question here. The question is whether somehow 25% of the population suddenly has learning disabilities; whether those students benefit from accommodations; whether those accommodations are legitimate or not. Arguably, an accommodation just stops the student from learning where their proper niche is. In high school or elementary school it might be more appropriate; but college IMO is where they start needing to face their abilities and disabilities in the real world.

So a blind person should not go to college because their acccommodations just stops them from learning where their niche is? What about a deaf person? We should stop people from wearing glasses too, because that gives them too much advantage. A person with an LD just needs a different way to access the material in school. It does not change the fact that they have to learn that material.

No, it's different for someone with a bona fide physical disability. And in any event - yes, they do have to find a niche as well. They're likely not going to go for a career in air traffic control.

You are saying that dyslexia is not a bone fide disability? Really? Wow

Again, did 15% of Pomona enrollees (one of the most selective SLACs) suddenly get dyslexia? I don't think so.

No, in the 70's and earlier they were told they were idiots in elementary school and either dropped out before they graduated from HS or did the VoTech track. Now we realize they have a learning disability that, with accommodations, shouldn't hold them back at all from many of their dreams.

[Anonymous]

Another reason you see this more in wealthy kids is that the testing is SO expensive. Thousands of dollars. An ethical professional won't fudge the report mind you, so I am not saying those kids don't really have disabilities. But the challenges of the poor kids are not going to get documented adequately to justify accomodations if they can't afford the testing. It is not fair...like so many part of growing up poor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What concerns me from a related article is the statement that wealthier students are more likely to receive accommodations than poor students.

What happens when these kids graduate college? Is an employer going to give a person who takes twice as long to do something the same salary as someone who meets deadlines?

This! At some point the accommodations have to end and these kid need to make it or break it in the real world. Their parents are doing them no favors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wsj.com/articles/colleges-bend-the-rules-for-more-students-give-them-extra-help-1527154200

“At Pomona, 22% of students were considered disabled this year, up from 5% in 2014. Other elite schools have also seen a startling jump in disabilities, according to data from the federal government and from the schools. At Hampshire, Amherst and Smith colleges in Massachusetts and Yeshiva University in New York, one in five students are classified as disabled. At Oberlin College in Ohio, it is one in four. At Marlboro College in Vermont, it is one in three.”

I’m sorry, but this is disgraceful. It’s one thing if you are legally blind, but anxiety or ADHD should not be grounds for giving someone twice the time to take an exam. It’s unfair to the more humble students who are less inclined to take advantage of what should be reserved for people are are truly in-need.

Well said

[Anonymous]

This is a huge problem. I worked at a university and one of my jobs was dealing with accommodation requests. We received a significant number of requests that were highly suspect. But we almost never rejected the request (assuming they had the minimal paperwork) and it was even rare for us to ask for a neutral evaluation.

It just wasn't worth it. We would incur significant expenses and hassle and invite the prospect of a lawsuit.

We all recognize the problem on a macro level that it creates a tremendous incentive to cheat and that it was unfair to others, but on a micro level we couldn't justify disputing all but the most egregious cases.

(To be clear, some of the increase is better diagnosis, but a lot of it isn't.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A couple of points: Serious mental illnesses such as bipolar disorder usually present themselves for the first time when people are 18-22. So it is possible that quite a few students who were "normal" in high school will suddenly need mental health care and accommodation in college. Secondly students who suffer from anxiety and depression can suddenly get worse when they are away from their support system. I suffered from clinical depression my freshman year, and needed more time to do my school work, but got better after I found the correct medication. So if you think mental health issues are scams to get better grades, thank your lucky stars you don't know otherwise.

Yes!
And the reason so many high school students get diagnosed with ADHD is because often kids can get by until the demands increase and then the challenges are exposed.
There are a lot of horrible people on this thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What concerns me from a related article is the statement that wealthier students are more likely to receive accommodations than poor students.

What happens when these kids graduate college? Is an employer going to give a person who takes twice as long to do something the same salary as someone who meets deadlines?

The student is going to find a field appropriate to their strengths and weaknesses. Like we all do. How is this so shocking?

My dyslexic sibling takes longer to read and synthesize information than his non-dyslexic coworkers. Should he be fired? He has other strengths in his job that compensate for the time he needs to take to read information, and he deliberately chose a line of work where reading information isn't terribly time sensitive so he can spread it out and make sure he's not missing critical information.

No, he shouldn't be fired. But that's not the question here. The question is whether somehow 25% of the population suddenly has learning disabilities; whether those students benefit from accommodations; whether those accommodations are legitimate or not. Arguably, an accommodation just stops the student from learning where their proper niche is. In high school or elementary school it might be more appropriate; but college IMO is where they start needing to face their abilities and disabilities in the real world.

So a blind person should not go to college because their acccommodations just stops them from learning where their niche is? What about a deaf person? We should stop people from wearing glasses too, because that gives them too much advantage. A person with an LD just needs a different way to access the material in school. It does not change the fact that they have to learn that material.

No, it's different for someone with a bona fide physical disability. And in any event - yes, they do have to find a niche as well. They're likely not going to go for a career in air traffic control.

You are saying that dyslexia is not a bone fide disability? Really? Wow

Again, did 15% of Pomona enrollees (one of the most selective SLACs) suddenly get dyslexia? I don't think so.

No, in the 70's and earlier they were told they were idiots in elementary school and either dropped out before they graduated from HS or did the VoTech track. Now we realize they have a learning disability that, with accommodations, shouldn't hold them back at all from many of their dreams.

Oh please.