Wall Street Journal on rampant growth in percentage of college students with “disabilities”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm a professor and a lot of what is going on is related to liability issues.

It used to be that a student would go to a professor and describe a situation and ask for an extension, etc. but now we are actually asked not to make those sorts of judgment calls, and frankly I wouldn't feel comfortable making them.

I'm not a doctor and I have no idea if your depression is debilitating enough for you to be given an extension, and it's not in my job description to make that call.

Therefore, I"m going to tell you that it has to be documented through disability services preferably before you start the course, etc. I don't want to be accused of favoritism or bias or anything else, so everything has to be a whole lot more legalistic than it used to be.

This is the nature of the litigious society that we live in.

But I do think there may also be an element of the student as consumer, I'm paying 60K so I want a boutique experience, etc. My daughter has some anxiety issues and I had no problem asking her psychologist for a note so that we could request a single rather than a room mate for her freshman year. Maybe 20 years ago people didn't do that, but today at that price, I want to give her every ability to succeed.

That said, there did seem to be a fairly large amount of upper middle class girls who gamed the system and got diagnosed with stress or depression so that they could have a cat -- at least at my son's big southern university.

Okay, that's funny. 20 years ago, I attempted suicide while in college. Depression and an eating disorder - good times. But, its not just the girls who are affected. Boys underreport these types of issues. Also, I never had a support animal - must be a millennial thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wsj.com/articles/colleges-bend-the-rules-for-more-students-give-them-extra-help-1527154200

“At Pomona, 22% of students were considered disabled this year, up from 5% in 2014. Other elite schools have also seen a startling jump in disabilities, according to data from the federal government and from the schools. At Hampshire, Amherst and Smith colleges in Massachusetts and Yeshiva University in New York, one in five students are classified as disabled. At Oberlin College in Ohio, it is one in four. At Marlboro College in Vermont, it is one in three.”

I’m sorry, but this is disgraceful. It’s one thing if you are legally blind, but anxiety or ADHD should not be grounds for giving someone twice the time to take an exam. It’s unfair to the more humble students who are less inclined to take advantage of what should be reserved for people are are truly in-need.

The amount of ignorance in PP's comment is really what is disgraceful.

? How so? The rate of increase since 2014 is staggering.

Having a disability isn't disgraceful. Having a disability and attending college isn't disgraceful. Having a disability, attending college, and having appropriate accommodations isn't disgraceful either. Also, ignorant people like OP don't get to decide what is or is not a disability.

but it's obviously gaming the system. No possible way could there be a four-fold increase in "disabilities" in just 4 years. I think the prof's posting above probably explains what's going on about right

Yes there can if people with disabilities were unlikely to be labeled as such until recently. I know plenty of people with ADHD or ASD who've graduated college without having been diagnosed. It's incredibly common in my generation to only learn of your diagnosis after the diagnosis of your child. I also know people who have very successful careers who were unable to complete college because of their disabilities.

Sure. But that's not 25% of the entire college class! Come on.

In wealthier areas schools, 11-13% of the kids receive special education services. I would guess that if a college were well known to have a superior students with disabilities office, they would receive a disproportionate percentage of applications from students with disabilities. My DS has dyslexia and ASD and you'd better believe I pay attention to conversations about where other kids with disabilities are headed to for college even though that is years off. Hell, I've mapped out which HSs offer Latin or ASL for the language requirement.

OP's use of scare quotes and "rampant" and PP's fixation on extended test time demonstrate an assumption that the vast majority of students with disabilities are cheaters who just want to game the system. That is a willfully ignorant. It's not clear at all from the numbers that there is abuse or, if there is abuse, what form it takes. We do know is that the percentage of children being diagnosed with ASD is steadily increasing. We know that somewhere around 15% of elementary students have some level of reading disability (but we refuse to screen for it, so it is vastly under-identified). We know that record number of high school students are suffering from anxiety and depression. But here you are, so concerned that there might be college students getting extra time on tests.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a professor and a lot of what is going on is related to liability issues.

It used to be that a student would go to a professor and describe a situation and ask for an extension, etc. but now we are actually asked not to make those sorts of judgment calls, and frankly I wouldn't feel comfortable making them.

I'm not a doctor and I have no idea if your depression is debilitating enough for you to be given an extension, and it's not in my job description to make that call.

Therefore, I"m going to tell you that it has to be documented through disability services preferably before you start the course, etc. I don't want to be accused of favoritism or bias or anything else, so everything has to be a whole lot more legalistic than it used to be.

This is the nature of the litigious society that we live in.

But I do think there may also be an element of the student as consumer, I'm paying 60K so I want a boutique experience, etc. My daughter has some anxiety issues and I had no problem asking her psychologist for a note so that we could request a single rather than a room mate for her freshman year. Maybe 20 years ago people didn't do that, but today at that price, I want to give her every ability to succeed.

That said, there did seem to be a fairly large amount of upper middle class girls who gamed the system and got diagnosed with stress or depression so that they could have a cat -- at least at my son's big southern university.

Okay, that's funny. 20 years ago, I attempted suicide while in college. Depression and an eating disorder - good times. But, its not just the girls who are affected. Boys underreport these types of issues. Also, I never had a support animal - must be a millennial thing.

For me it was depression leading to insomnia that destroyed my health for about a decade. But I graduated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What concerns me from a related article is the statement that wealthier students are more likely to receive accommodations than poor students.

What happens when these kids graduate college? Is an employer going to give a person who takes twice as long to do something the same salary as someone who meets deadlines?

.

My DC has dyslexia and dysgraphia - fairly profound on both counts. He get accommodations for receiving professor notes, calculator on tests, electronic reader and keyboard for tests and 50% extra time, electronic textbooks. The reason that gets extra time is because it takes longer to take a test with an electronic reader or a live reader.

When he gets into the “real world”’, he will still be able to use a calculator, laptop and taking notes isn’t really an issue like it is in college. He will also be able to use his text to speech software. IDA will also help him if he needs other types of accommodations. He will need someone to proofread letters, but then in my office everyone has that before anything goes out. He is also exceptionally smart in math and science and will likely end up in academia or research.

The types of jobs that he will be seeking are not high pressure deadline oriented jobs that require fast turnarounds. With motor integration issues, he will not be a surgeon. Part of growing up is figuring out your niche and finding jobs where your quirks and strengths are rewarded.

[Anonymous]

What if you are legally blonde?

[Anonymous]

If you're child isn't "gifted" they must be "special needs." Sometimes they are both. That's the culture right now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What concerns me from a related article is the statement that wealthier students are more likely to receive accommodations than poor students.

What happens when these kids graduate college? Is an employer going to give a person who takes twice as long to do something the same salary as someone who meets deadlines?

.

My DC has dyslexia and dysgraphia - fairly profound on both counts. He get accommodations for receiving professor notes, calculator on tests, electronic reader and keyboard for tests and 50% extra time, electronic textbooks. The reason that gets extra time is because it takes longer to take a test with an electronic reader or a live reader.

When he gets into the “real world”’, he will still be able to use a calculator, laptop and taking notes isn’t really an issue like it is in college. He will also be able to use his text to speech software. IDA will also help him if he needs other types of accommodations. He will need someone to proofread letters, but then in my office everyone has that before anything goes out. He is also exceptionally smart in math and science and will likely end up in academia or research.

The types of jobs that he will be seeking are not high pressure deadline oriented jobs that require fast turnarounds. With motor integration issues, he will not be a surgeon. Part of growing up is figuring out your niche and finding jobs where your quirks and strengths are rewarded.

Sound similar to my DS. He's in ES right now so I have a while to figure out further along, but we've already moved to his using a computer for the majority of his written work with the school's full support. He also receives accommodations for his ASD such as being allowed to wear a hat and to eat lunch in a quiet room. The educational setting is very, very artificial and accommodations that are needed in an educational setting are frequently unneeded in a work environment. Even on the testing front, it's the freaking bubbles that give DS fits half the time. When was the last time your job required a timed exercise where you were judged on how you filled a bubble sheet?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wsj.com/articles/colleges-bend-the-rules-for-more-students-give-them-extra-help-1527154200

“At Pomona, 22% of students were considered disabled this year, up from 5% in 2014. Other elite schools have also seen a startling jump in disabilities, according to data from the federal government and from the schools. At Hampshire, Amherst and Smith colleges in Massachusetts and Yeshiva University in New York, one in five students are classified as disabled. At Oberlin College in Ohio, it is one in four. At Marlboro College in Vermont, it is one in three.”

I’m sorry, but this is disgraceful. It’s one thing if you are legally blind, but anxiety or ADHD should not be grounds for giving someone twice the time to take an exam. It’s unfair to the more humble students who are less inclined to take advantage of what should be reserved for people are are truly in-need.

Says someone who doesn't suffer from either.

I wouldn't wish even a mild anxiety attack on someone I hate.

Also, these aren't students who just show up to class and tell the professor they have a disability to get more time or other accommodations. They have documented proof. So I don't know WTF you mean by "more humble students less inclined to take advantage." It's not like it's a B1G1 deal that they're just missing out on because they don't have the initial $5 to buy-in. Geeze.

I wish I didn't have to wake every morning and take 150mg of Zoloft in order to function like a halfway 'normal' human. I wish I didn't always walk into every situation/experience and immediately look for the fastest escape routes in case I have an attack and need to flee. I wish in the back of my mind there wasn't always the looming 'oh, what if this causes a panic attack?' about every little thing I did. I also wish that back when I was diagnosed with anxiety attacks in college, there wouldn't have been so much shame attached to it so I could have sought help in my classes. I rushed through so many tests just to flee the lecture hall while having an attack.

[Anonymous]

Truly - what is the harm of accommodations? What is one single example of an accommodated kid gaining an unfair advantage? I am asking this and my kids are accommodation free. These kids may not fit into the box they are dealt with but this has nothing to do with intellect, ideas or ability to innovate. Sure - perhaps there are some careers where they may not be properly suited but that’s between them and their employer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What concerns me from a related article is the statement that wealthier students are more likely to receive accommodations than poor students.

What happens when these kids graduate college? Is an employer going to give a person who takes twice as long to do something the same salary as someone who meets deadlines?

I can completely believe it because wealthier kids get far more diagnoses than poor kids and it starts early -- like when they are toddlers. I know because my preschooler goes to a private preschool and I'd say almost half the kids there get some sort of early intervention services -- not kidding at all -- speech, OT, PT. This includes my child. The school considers part of what you're paying for is full support, and that includes teachers who see your preschooler not interacting with other children and suggesting support for social anxiety. My guess is that if the same child was in a preschool with fewer resources, he'd simply be overlooked because he's no trouble to the teachers if he's playing quietly alone.

I don't know if the wealthy kids are overdiagnosed or the less wealthy underdiagnosed, but certainly I believe that this gap starts early and continues through college.

[Anonymous]

"Sure. But that's not 25% of the entire college class! Come on."

Of course, it is 25% of the class. I went to a top 20 school. Don't you remember all the students from college who asked the professors the dumbest questions you could ever imagine?

I knew students who couldn't pay enough attention to even get the basics like if the date that was still written on the board was when the homework was due or if there was a test.

Of course, when it came time for the test instead of just studying what the professor taught or said was going to be on the test, they would kick my #@#$ because they studied every word and example in the text book and spent as much time as they could at the professor's office hours.

Now as my kids go through school, I recognize the disabilities of both the students with the dumb question and myself and my own inability to, basically ever, ask a teacher or professor a question due to shyness.

Now in the working world, both types of disabilities don't receive accommodations. People with both types of disabilities have to make up for them with their other skills, their maturity and by using the fact that no one around them is perfect and they all know it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Truly - what is the harm of accommodations? What is one single example of an accommodated kid gaining an unfair advantage? I am asking this and my kids are accommodation free. These kids may not fit into the box they are dealt with but this has nothing to do with intellect, ideas or ability to innovate. Sure - perhaps there are some careers where they may not be properly suited but that’s between them and their employer.

This starts at high school and at my private, kids come up w diagnosis near SAT time and get extra time to improve scores esp SAT subject tests. The it continues in college, to get the better grades that allow one to get scholarships and better internships etc. I think the fairest method is to give everyone extra time. Then there will be no advantage to those gaming the system and we should see a decline and to those who really need the accommodation, they get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wsj.com/articles/colleges-bend-the-rules-for-more-students-give-them-extra-help-1527154200

“At Pomona, 22% of students were considered disabled this year, up from 5% in 2014. Other elite schools have also seen a startling jump in disabilities, according to data from the federal government and from the schools. At Hampshire, Amherst and Smith colleges in Massachusetts and Yeshiva University in New York, one in five students are classified as disabled. At Oberlin College in Ohio, it is one in four. At Marlboro College in Vermont, it is one in three.”

I’m sorry, but this is disgraceful. It’s one thing if you are legally blind, but anxiety or ADHD should not be grounds for giving someone twice the time to take an exam. It’s unfair to the more humble students who are less inclined to take advantage of what should be reserved for people are are truly in-need.

The amount of ignorance in PP's comment is really what is disgraceful.

? How so? The rate of increase since 2014 is staggering.

Having a disability isn't disgraceful. Having a disability and attending college isn't disgraceful. Having a disability, attending college, and having appropriate accommodations isn't disgraceful either. Also, ignorant people like OP don't get to decide what is or is not a disability.

but it's obviously gaming the system. No possible way could there be a four-fold increase in "disabilities" in just 4 years. I think the prof's posting above probably explains what's going on about right

Yes there can if people with disabilities were unlikely to be labeled as such until recently. I know plenty of people with ADHD or ASD who've graduated college without having been diagnosed. It's incredibly common in my generation to only learn of your diagnosis after the diagnosis of your child. I also know people who have very successful careers who were unable to complete college because of their disabilities.

Sure. But that's not 25% of the entire college class! Come on.

In wealthier areas schools, 11-13% of the kids receive special education services. I would guess that if a college were well known to have a superior students with disabilities office, they would receive a disproportionate percentage of applications from students with disabilities. My DS has dyslexia and ASD and you'd better believe I pay attention to conversations about where other kids with disabilities are headed to for college even though that is years off. Hell, I've mapped out which HSs offer Latin or ASL for the language requirement.

OP's use of scare quotes and "rampant" and PP's fixation on extended test time demonstrate an assumption that the vast majority of students with disabilities are cheaters who just want to game the system. That is a willfully ignorant. It's not clear at all from the numbers that there is abuse or, if there is abuse, what form it takes. We do know is that the percentage of children being diagnosed with ASD is steadily increasing. We know that somewhere around 15% of elementary students have some level of reading disability (but we refuse to screen for it, so it is vastly under-identified). We know that record number of high school students are suffering from anxiety and depression. But here you are, so concerned that there might be college students getting extra time on tests.

I find it extremely hard to believe that a quarter of students in any give college have disabilities that *require academic accommodations.* Just because a child has anxiety or depression does not mean that they need extra time on a test or special care. In fact, that kind of treatment can be counter-productive. Your child with ASD and dyslexia is a different story. Also, where do you get that 15% of kids have a reading disablity? that seems hard to believe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Truly - what is the harm of accommodations? What is one single example of an accommodated kid gaining an unfair advantage? I am asking this and my kids are accommodation free. These kids may not fit into the box they are dealt with but this has nothing to do with intellect, ideas or ability to innovate. Sure - perhaps there are some careers where they may not be properly suited but that’s between them and their employer.

Obviously, with more time they could out-perform their peers who have to stick to the time limit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"Sure. But that's not 25% of the entire college class! Come on."

Of course, it is 25% of the class. I went to a top 20 school. Don't you remember all the students from college who asked the professors the dumbest questions you could ever imagine?

I knew students who couldn't pay enough attention to even get the basics like if the date that was still written on the board was when the homework was due or if there was a test.

Of course, when it came time for the test instead of just studying what the professor taught or said was going to be on the test, they would kick my #@#$ because they studied every word and example in the text book and spent as much time as they could at the professor's office hours.

Now as my kids go through school, I recognize the disabilities of both the students with the dumb question and myself and my own inability to, basically ever, ask a teacher or professor a question due to shyness.

Now in the working world, both types of disabilities don't receive accommodations. People with both types of disabilities have to make up for them with their other skills, their maturity and by using the fact that no one around them is perfect and they all know it.

Well, that doesn't really resemble my experience at all. And perhaps the "dumb" questions you perceived were actually good questions. Nothing of what you describe sounds like a disability, but rather personality characteristics that related to different ways of learning and expressing information. Do you really think you should have gotten a disability determination due to your shyness? And then what? You should have gotten an extra 10% on your exams because you were too shy to ask questions?