William & Mary - how competitive?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish I could see stats comparisons within individual counties.

It's out there. The admissions office at UVA provides it. Sorry I'm at the office and can't search, but others here may be able to dig it up. It will show you that some 600+ kids from Fairfax county get accepted every year (including TJ), X from Arlington, X from Winchester, etc. The further west and south you go you will see that sometimes no students are accepted or just one.

Do you mean the county map? It was shared here a while back. Here it is. It shows enrolled, not applied, but you can guess that the applicant numbers were high from the big counties and low from the little ones.

http://digital.uvamagazine.org/articles/2020-insight/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You really need to look at Naviance numbers for your specific high school because colleges have different grades selection criteria for different high schools. It my kids school, the magic number for both UVa and William & Mary seems to be a 4.26 Weighted GPA. Anyone at or above that number was accepted and everyone below was rejected, over the last 5 years. Obviously, test scores matter, but with prep classes now, your kid has some control over their scores.

Off topic, but I am little flustered by the apparent grade requirement. I am struggling to figure out how my kid will get to that number despite having almost straight A's and taking a very hard class schedule because there is no added grade bump in Arlington except for AP/IB classes (no .5 bump for honors classes, like in Fairfax). In fact, A's from non-AP classes from middle school and high school bring down the GPA, and it is too late to expunge these grades once the kids starts high school. Also, most kids take a relatively small number of AP classes until 11th grade (especially kids is in Band or other performance class that takes up an elective and prevent the kids from taking an AP elective class, such as Art History. Psychology, Computer Science), and senior grades either aren't included for early applications or only the 1st semester grade are sent.

Remember those GPA's are end of Senior year weighted GPA's. By taking 3-4 AP's (Sciences are two credits) Junior and Senior year and doing well, your DC's GPA could easily end up in the 4.1 - 4.2 range. My DC has a smattering of B/B+'s in non-AP language and math courses and will still end up with a weighted 4.1.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whoever posted the Schev link. Thanks!

Looking at the salary data (median), Tech and GMU are pretty impressive. W&M is surprisingly at the bottom of the pile.

Bachelors degree -
18 months after graduation - UVA - $42K. Tech and GMU - $40/$39K.
5 years after graduation - Tech - 60K; UVA/GMU - 60K

Master's degree - GMU leads for both 18 months after and 5 years after - $58K/74K

Overall all three - GMU, UVA and Tech seem to do well in salaries. W&M is far behind on most categories. Surprised!!

Are GMU salaries for the master's programs higher because of the cohort (already employed folks supplementing their skillsets as opposed to full-time students at UVA/Tech)? Also shouldn't we be looking at mean salaries as opposed to median? Something is not right with this data.

Perhaps "something is not right with this data" because you're one of those posters who refuse to believe GMU is a good school. I think the data says otherwise.

No. My kids are years away from college and I'd love for GMU to be a top school by the time they are ready. Look at the benefits! Kids can stay at home with a 15 minute commute to school, I don't have to sit at home alone in my old age, etc. I'm just looking for validation. Analysis is only as good as the underlying data and I'm looking for inputs from area hiring managers, professors, college placement folks, etc to validate this data.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Whoever posted the Schev link. Thanks!

Another thank you from OP. I knew about Naviance, but not SHEV. This is a useful tool - thanks!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whoever posted the Schev link. Thanks!

Another thank you from OP. I knew about Naviance, but not SHEV. This is a useful tool - thanks!

*tips hat*

I post those links every couple weeks. The numbers just don't support a lot of the statements made around here. The raw numbers are even more interesting than the admit rates. If you look at some of the rural counties where the admissions rate is 50% or more, it's because 2-3 kids applied and 1-2 got in. The situation in NOVA isn't as dire as some of the fear mongers around here will have you think.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Whoever posted the Schev link. Thanks!

Looking at the salary data (median), Tech and GMU are pretty impressive. W&M is surprisingly at the bottom of the pile.

Bachelors degree -
18 months after graduation - UVA - $42K. Tech and GMU - $40/$39K.
5 years after graduation - Tech - 60K; UVA/GMU - 60K

Master's degree - GMU leads for both 18 months after and 5 years after - $58K/74K

Overall all three - GMU, UVA and Tech seem to do well in salaries. W&M is far behind on most categories. Surprised!!

There are lots of reasons not to use the data to compare school "outcomes", however tempting it might be. The income data are limited to graduates who stay and work in Virginia. So for W&M, only 18% of grads had full-time wages after 5 years. That does not mean that 82% were unemployed. It just means that they weren't working in Virginia. So a student taking a job in finance on Wall Street or a management consulting job in Boston would be counted the same as the kid who moved home and could not find a job. They tell you how much the commonwealth gets back in terms of graduate income, but not how graduates get in wages after attending the college.

[Anonymous]

Agree. The W&M and UVA grads are probably being recruited to cities all over the country while the other schools have more regional recruiting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whoever posted the Schev link. Thanks!

Looking at the salary data (median), Tech and GMU are pretty impressive. W&M is surprisingly at the bottom of the pile.

Bachelors degree -
18 months after graduation - UVA - $42K. Tech and GMU - $40/$39K.
5 years after graduation - Tech - 60K; UVA/GMU - 60K

Master's degree - GMU leads for both 18 months after and 5 years after - $58K/74K

Overall all three - GMU, UVA and Tech seem to do well in salaries. W&M is far behind on most categories. Surprised!!

There are lots of reasons not to use the data to compare school "outcomes", however tempting it might be. The income data are limited to graduates who stay and work in Virginia. So for W&M, only 18% of grads had full-time wages after 5 years. That does not mean that 82% were unemployed. It just means that they weren't working in Virginia. So a student taking a job in finance on Wall Street or a management consulting job in Boston would be counted the same as the kid who moved home and could not find a job. They tell you how much the commonwealth gets back in terms of graduate income, but not how graduates get in wages after attending the college.

Makes more sense..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You really need to look at Naviance numbers for your specific high school because colleges have different grades selection criteria for different high schools. It my kids school, the magic number for both UVa and William & Mary seems to be a 4.26 Weighted GPA. Anyone at or above that number was accepted and everyone below was rejected, over the last 5 years...

which school?

Anonymous wrote:...In fact, A's from non-AP classes from middle school and high school bring down the GPA, and it is too late to expunge these grades once the kids starts high school...

i have an 8 grader at APS. when do we get to expunge these?

[Anonymous]

i have an 8 grader at APS. when do we get to expunge these?

Is it the first two weeks of school? It's a short period. Ask a counselor at your first interaction with the high school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whoever posted the Schev link. Thanks!

Looking at the salary data (median), Tech and GMU are pretty impressive. W&M is surprisingly at the bottom of the pile.

Bachelors degree -
18 months after graduation - UVA - $42K. Tech and GMU - $40/$39K.
5 years after graduation - Tech - 60K; UVA/GMU - 60K

Master's degree - GMU leads for both 18 months after and 5 years after - $58K/74K

Overall all three - GMU, UVA and Tech seem to do well in salaries. W&M is far behind on most categories. Surprised!!

Are GMU salaries for the master's programs higher because of the cohort (already employed folks supplementing their skillsets as opposed to full-time students at UVA/Tech)? Also shouldn't we be looking at mean salaries as opposed to median? Something is not right with this data.

Perhaps "something is not right with this data" because you're one of those posters who refuse to believe GMU is a good school. I think the data says otherwise.

No. My kids are years away from college and I'd love for GMU to be a top school by the time they are ready. Look at the benefits! Kids can stay at home with a 15 minute commute to school, I don't have to sit at home alone in my old age, etc. I'm just looking for validation. Analysis is only as good as the underlying data and I'm looking for inputs from area hiring managers, professors, college placement folks, etc to validate this data.

Freshman at GMU must live in the dorms. You can, however, apply for a waiver.

[Anonymous]

Here's the by county map for class of 2020. As you can see, the further out you get from D.C. the fewer students accepted. Some counties to the west and south send no students. http://digital.uvamagazine.org/articles/2020-insight/

[Anonymous]

^^ scroll down to the map of Virginia. Move the cursor over the various counties of VA for enrolled students for class of 2020.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whoever posted the Schev link. Thanks!

Looking at the salary data (median), Tech and GMU are pretty impressive. W&M is surprisingly at the bottom of the pile.

Bachelors degree -
18 months after graduation - UVA - $42K. Tech and GMU - $40/$39K.
5 years after graduation - Tech - 60K; UVA/GMU - 60K

Master's degree - GMU leads for both 18 months after and 5 years after - $58K/74K

Overall all three - GMU, UVA and Tech seem to do well in salaries. W&M is far behind on most categories. Surprised!!

Are GMU salaries for the master's programs higher because of the cohort (already employed folks supplementing their skillsets as opposed to full-time students at UVA/Tech)? Also shouldn't we be looking at mean salaries as opposed to median? Something is not right with this data.

Perhaps "something is not right with this data" because you're one of those posters who refuse to believe GMU is a good school. I think the data says otherwise.

No. My kids are years away from college and I'd love for GMU to be a top school by the time they are ready. Look at the benefits! Kids can stay at home with a 15 minute commute to school, I don't have to sit at home alone in my old age, etc. I'm just looking for validation. Analysis is only as good as the underlying data and I'm looking for inputs from area hiring managers, professors, college placement folks, etc to validate this data.

Freshman at GMU must live in the dorms. You can, however, apply for a waiver.

True. Assuming no waiver however, years 2-4 should result in substantial savings if kid stays at home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here's the by county map for class of 2020. As you can see, the further out you get from D.C. the fewer students accepted. Some counties to the west and south send no students. http://digital.uvamagazine.org/articles/2020-insight/

That was posted at the top of the page.

That is enrolled, not admitted data. Enrollment by county is on the SCHEV report.