Loaded question: MERLD and autism

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:ABA principles are applicable to children who are having issues with behavior as well as

"...used around the world to help all kinds of people overcome all kinds of social and behavioral problems such as quitting smoking, addressing personality disorders, relationship counseling, obsessive compulsive disorders, and many other common issues. Behavioral principles only began being used for children with autism in the late 1960’s and 1970’s. Studies are available that support the use of ABA programming with children affected by any number of different disabilities including Downs Syndrome, CP, Emotional Disorders, General Developmental Delay, etc."
http://www.prioritiesaba.com/resources-links/myths-and-misconceptions-about-aba

Or read about how a SLP uses ABA.
http://www.speakforyourself.org/uncategorized/accept-behavior-towards-non-autistic-child/

The same goes for things like the Kazdin Method (developed with kids with ODD) or Social Thinking Curriculum was developed with kids who fall under, "Diagnostic Label
Attention Issues (ADD/ADHD), Anxiety, Asperger's Syndrome, Autism Spectrum Disorders, Language or Learning Disability, Nonverbal Learning Disability, Social Communication Disorder, Traumatic Brain Injury, No Diagnosis, Other..."

I guess people who are using definitions that were made nearly 20 years ago, may not understand what type of therapies are used today.

Children with language issues often struggle with behavior, it's true. But that's because of their LANGUAGE issues. So if you get them into a good speech therapy setting, many of those issues go away.

The problem of pushing ABA is its massive expense which typically is not covered unless you have an autism diagnosis. It's also a huge time sink, and you're treating the symptom instead of the real issue.

We are one of the families who saw the Camaratas. They were able to give us many tips that solved most of our at-home behavior issues. At school, they recommended bringing in a board-certified behaviorist to do a support plan, and that worked right away. But that's different than ABA, which is discrete trial training.

[Anonymous]

ABA is not always recommended for ASD either. For DS with Asperger's (no language delays) and ADHD, no one ever suggested ABA per se.

The school used a functional behavioral assessment (FBA)and a behavioral intervention plan (BIP) for ~6 months when he was having behavioral issues in 2nd grade prior to his ADHD, combined, diagnosis. Never had behavioral issues at home.

My understanding is that a FBA IS a type of ABA. At our school, you need an IEP to get a FBA and BIP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ABA principles are applicable to children who are having issues with behavior as well as

"...used around the world to help all kinds of people overcome all kinds of social and behavioral problems such as quitting smoking, addressing personality disorders, relationship counseling, obsessive compulsive disorders, and many other common issues. Behavioral principles only began being used for children with autism in the late 1960’s and 1970’s. Studies are available that support the use of ABA programming with children affected by any number of different disabilities including Downs Syndrome, CP, Emotional Disorders, General Developmental Delay, etc."
http://www.prioritiesaba.com/resources-links/myths-and-misconceptions-about-aba

Or read about how a SLP uses ABA.
http://www.speakforyourself.org/uncategorized/accept-behavior-towards-non-autistic-child/

The same goes for things like the Kazdin Method (developed with kids with ODD) or Social Thinking Curriculum was developed with kids who fall under, "Diagnostic Label
Attention Issues (ADD/ADHD), Anxiety, Asperger's Syndrome, Autism Spectrum Disorders, Language or Learning Disability, Nonverbal Learning Disability, Social Communication Disorder, Traumatic Brain Injury, No Diagnosis, Other..."

I guess people who are using definitions that were made nearly 20 years ago, may not understand what type of therapies are used today.

Children with language issues often struggle with behavior, it's true. But that's because of their LANGUAGE issues. So if you get them into a good speech therapy setting, many of those issues go away.

The problem of pushing ABA is its massive expense which typically is not covered unless you have an autism diagnosis. It's also a huge time sink, and you're treating the symptom instead of the real issue.

We are one of the families who saw the Camaratas. They were able to give us many tips that solved most of our at-home behavior issues. At school, they recommended bringing in a board-certified behaviorist to do a support plan, and that worked right away. But that's different than ABA, which is discrete trial training.

Again, I'm not pushing ABA or any other behavioral intervention. I don't understand why there is such defensiveness on this board. My child diagnosed with MERLD didn't need behavioral supports or behavioral interventions in preschool, his teachers were aware of his diagnosis, and it didn't keep coming up over and over. Mainly b/c his behavior was appropriate despite his delays.

The OP didn't mention trouble at home and assume that the OP's kid is already doing ST. Maybe there is and she didn't mention it. And really ABA or behavioral therapy requires a lot of time, and it depends on what your insurance coverage is if you feel you need to pursue that route. Kids don't need to be on the spectrum to do ABA; likewise kids with autism can do behavioral therapy. The approaches are very similar.

My point (again) is that if the teachers are continuing to bring up autism, there probably is a reason, and it's probably behavior related. They either don't want him at the school, or they don't understand how to deal with him. Either way, it's an obtuse way of going about it. If I were the OP, I would ask for clarification from the teachers and/or have an observation/FBA done to help this kid in his current school. And maybe give some thought as to whether it is the right school fit. Regardless of the cause (whether it's language, communication disorder, ADHD to name only a few), behavioral interventions can help.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:ABA is not always recommended for ASD either. For DS with Asperger's (no language delays) and ADHD, no one ever suggested ABA per se.

The school used a functional behavioral assessment (FBA)and a behavioral intervention plan (BIP) for ~6 months when he was having behavioral issues in 2nd grade prior to his ADHD, combined, diagnosis. Never had behavioral issues at home.

My understanding is that a FBA IS a type of ABA. At our school, you need an IEP to get a FBA and BIP.

FBAs are a component of ABA. It's a look at which functions, or consequences, are influencing a person’s behavior so interventions can be tailored to those needs.


But when people talk about ABA, they are typically talking about the therapy sessions, which are discrete trial training to distinguish or train certain behaviors. Very expensive, very time consuming, very unnecessary for most language kids.

FBAs can be executed quickly and a support plan put in place immediately (my child's was stars earned on a piece of paper). ABA is long and drawn out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ABA principles are applicable to children who are having issues with behavior as well as

"...used around the world to help all kinds of people overcome all kinds of social and behavioral problems such as quitting smoking, addressing personality disorders, relationship counseling, obsessive compulsive disorders, and many other common issues. Behavioral principles only began being used for children with autism in the late 1960’s and 1970’s. Studies are available that support the use of ABA programming with children affected by any number of different disabilities including Downs Syndrome, CP, Emotional Disorders, General Developmental Delay, etc."
http://www.prioritiesaba.com/resources-links/myths-and-misconceptions-about-aba

Or read about how a SLP uses ABA.
http://www.speakforyourself.org/uncategorized/accept-behavior-towards-non-autistic-child/

The same goes for things like the Kazdin Method (developed with kids with ODD) or Social Thinking Curriculum was developed with kids who fall under, "Diagnostic Label
Attention Issues (ADD/ADHD), Anxiety, Asperger's Syndrome, Autism Spectrum Disorders, Language or Learning Disability, Nonverbal Learning Disability, Social Communication Disorder, Traumatic Brain Injury, No Diagnosis, Other..."

I guess people who are using definitions that were made nearly 20 years ago, may not understand what type of therapies are used today.

Children with language issues often struggle with behavior, it's true. But that's because of their LANGUAGE issues. So if you get them into a good speech therapy setting, many of those issues go away.

The problem of pushing ABA is its massive expense which typically is not covered unless you have an autism diagnosis. It's also a huge time sink, and you're treating the symptom instead of the real issue.

We are one of the families who saw the Camaratas. They were able to give us many tips that solved most of our at-home behavior issues. At school, they recommended bringing in a board-certified behaviorist to do a support plan, and that worked right away. But that's different than ABA, which is discrete trial training.

Again, I'm not pushing ABA or any other behavioral intervention. I don't understand why there is such defensiveness on this board. My child diagnosed with MERLD didn't need behavioral supports or behavioral interventions in preschool, his teachers were aware of his diagnosis, and it didn't keep coming up over and over. Mainly b/c his behavior was appropriate despite his delays.

The OP didn't mention trouble at home and assume that the OP's kid is already doing ST. Maybe there is and she didn't mention it. And really ABA or behavioral therapy requires a lot of time, and it depends on what your insurance coverage is if you feel you need to pursue that route. Kids don't need to be on the spectrum to do ABA; likewise kids with autism can do behavioral therapy. The approaches are very similar.

My point (again) is that if the teachers are continuing to bring up autism, there probably is a reason, and it's probably behavior related. They either don't want him at the school, or they don't understand how to deal with him. Either way, it's an obtuse way of going about it. If I were the OP, I would ask for clarification from the teachers and/or have an observation/FBA done to help this kid in his current school. And maybe give some thought as to whether it is the right school fit. Regardless of the cause (whether it's language, communication disorder, ADHD to name only a few), behavioral interventions can help.

I am the poster above you whose kid with Asperger's did not do ABA and I agree with you wholeheartedly. It's not about ABA or autism vs MERLD but the fact that the school cannot meet OP's child's needs so the teachers are telling her in a rather roundabout way that they need help in figuring out what is going on and how to help her child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ABA principles are applicable to children who are having issues with behavior as well as

"...used around the world to help all kinds of people overcome all kinds of social and behavioral problems such as quitting smoking, addressing personality disorders, relationship counseling, obsessive compulsive disorders, and many other common issues. Behavioral principles only began being used for children with autism in the late 1960’s and 1970’s. Studies are available that support the use of ABA programming with children affected by any number of different disabilities including Downs Syndrome, CP, Emotional Disorders, General Developmental Delay, etc."
http://www.prioritiesaba.com/resources-links/myths-and-misconceptions-about-aba

Or read about how a SLP uses ABA.
http://www.speakforyourself.org/uncategorized/accept-behavior-towards-non-autistic-child/

The same goes for things like the Kazdin Method (developed with kids with ODD) or Social Thinking Curriculum was developed with kids who fall under, "Diagnostic Label
Attention Issues (ADD/ADHD), Anxiety, Asperger's Syndrome, Autism Spectrum Disorders, Language or Learning Disability, Nonverbal Learning Disability, Social Communication Disorder, Traumatic Brain Injury, No Diagnosis, Other..."

I guess people who are using definitions that were made nearly 20 years ago, may not understand what type of therapies are used today.

Children with language issues often struggle with behavior, it's true. But that's because of their LANGUAGE issues. So if you get them into a good speech therapy setting, many of those issues go away.

The problem of pushing ABA is its massive expense which typically is not covered unless you have an autism diagnosis. It's also a huge time sink, and you're treating the symptom instead of the real issue.

We are one of the families who saw the Camaratas. They were able to give us many tips that solved most of our at-home behavior issues. At school, they recommended bringing in a board-certified behaviorist to do a support plan, and that worked right away. But that's different than ABA, which is discrete trial training.

Again, I'm not pushing ABA or any other behavioral intervention. I don't understand why there is such defensiveness on this board. My child diagnosed with MERLD didn't need behavioral supports or behavioral interventions in preschool, his teachers were aware of his diagnosis, and it didn't keep coming up over and over. Mainly b/c his behavior was appropriate despite his delays.

The OP didn't mention trouble at home and assume that the OP's kid is already doing ST. Maybe there is and she didn't mention it. And really ABA or behavioral therapy requires a lot of time, and it depends on what your insurance coverage is if you feel you need to pursue that route. Kids don't need to be on the spectrum to do ABA; likewise kids with autism can do behavioral therapy. The approaches are very similar.

My point (again) is that if the teachers are continuing to bring up autism, there probably is a reason, and it's probably behavior related. They either don't want him at the school, or they don't understand how to deal with him. Either way, it's an obtuse way of going about it. If I were the OP, I would ask for clarification from the teachers and/or have an observation/FBA done to help this kid in his current school. And maybe give some thought as to whether it is the right school fit. Regardless of the cause (whether it's language, communication disorder, ADHD to name only a few), behavioral interventions can help.

Exactly. SOMETHING is causing the teachers and psychologist to suggest that the current diagnosis and services are not adequate. Now, that "something" may be completely off base and incorrect (and the diagnosing may well overstep boundaries). But the smart thing to do is to focus on what they are seeing and observing, and then figure out where to go from there. It may be a different diagnosis, it may be the school environment, it may be bad teachers, it may be a lot of things. But it should not be ignored.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ABA is not always recommended for ASD either. For DS with Asperger's (no language delays) and ADHD, no one ever suggested ABA per se.

The school used a functional behavioral assessment (FBA)and a behavioral intervention plan (BIP) for ~6 months when he was having behavioral issues in 2nd grade prior to his ADHD, combined, diagnosis. Never had behavioral issues at home.

My understanding is that a FBA IS a type of ABA. At our school, you need an IEP to get a FBA and BIP.

FBAs are a component of ABA. It's a look at which functions, or consequences, are influencing a person’s behavior so interventions can be tailored to those needs.


But when people talk about ABA, they are typically talking about the therapy sessions, which are discrete trial training to distinguish or train certain behaviors. Very expensive, very time consuming, very unnecessary for most language kids.

FBAs can be executed quickly and a support plan put in place immediately (my child's was stars earned on a piece of paper). ABA is long and drawn out.

Well yeah. My kid with ASD/ADHD did not need ABA or a FBA/BIP until 2nd grade and then for only 6 months. My point being that not all kids with autism need ABA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ABA principles are applicable to children who are having issues with behavior as well as

"...used around the world to help all kinds of people overcome all kinds of social and behavioral problems such as quitting smoking, addressing personality disorders, relationship counseling, obsessive compulsive disorders, and many other common issues. Behavioral principles only began being used for children with autism in the late 1960’s and 1970’s. Studies are available that support the use of ABA programming with children affected by any number of different disabilities including Downs Syndrome, CP, Emotional Disorders, General Developmental Delay, etc."
http://www.prioritiesaba.com/resources-links/myths-and-misconceptions-about-aba

Or read about how a SLP uses ABA.
http://www.speakforyourself.org/uncategorized/accept-behavior-towards-non-autistic-child/

The same goes for things like the Kazdin Method (developed with kids with ODD) or Social Thinking Curriculum was developed with kids who fall under, "Diagnostic Label
Attention Issues (ADD/ADHD), Anxiety, Asperger's Syndrome, Autism Spectrum Disorders, Language or Learning Disability, Nonverbal Learning Disability, Social Communication Disorder, Traumatic Brain Injury, No Diagnosis, Other..."

I guess people who are using definitions that were made nearly 20 years ago, may not understand what type of therapies are used today.

Children with language issues often struggle with behavior, it's true. But that's because of their LANGUAGE issues. So if you get them into a good speech therapy setting, many of those issues go away.

The problem of pushing ABA is its massive expense which typically is not covered unless you have an autism diagnosis. It's also a huge time sink, and you're treating the symptom instead of the real issue.

We are one of the families who saw the Camaratas. They were able to give us many tips that solved most of our at-home behavior issues. At school, they recommended bringing in a board-certified behaviorist to do a support plan, and that worked right away. But that's different than ABA, which is discrete trial training.

Again, I'm not pushing ABA or any other behavioral intervention. I don't understand why there is such defensiveness on this board. My child diagnosed with MERLD didn't need behavioral supports or behavioral interventions in preschool, his teachers were aware of his diagnosis, and it didn't keep coming up over and over. Mainly b/c his behavior was appropriate despite his delays.

The OP didn't mention trouble at home and assume that the OP's kid is already doing ST. Maybe there is and she didn't mention it. And really ABA or behavioral therapy requires a lot of time, and it depends on what your insurance coverage is if you feel you need to pursue that route. Kids don't need to be on the spectrum to do ABA; likewise kids with autism can do behavioral therapy. The approaches are very similar.

My point (again) is that if the teachers are continuing to bring up autism, there probably is a reason, and it's probably behavior related. They either don't want him at the school, or they don't understand how to deal with him. Either way, it's an obtuse way of going about it. If I were the OP, I would ask for clarification from the teachers and/or have an observation/FBA done to help this kid in his current school. And maybe give some thought as to whether it is the right school fit. Regardless of the cause (whether it's language, communication disorder, ADHD to name only a few), behavioral interventions can help.

I'm the PP and I agree it's likely the behavior they are seeing that makes them think autism. This is what we ran into. And we could clearly see that the school district personnel had a tunnel vision of "this is how autistic children act" vs. "this is how a child in distress acts.'

What was frustrating is we kept asking for a Functional Behavior Assessment, and they kept stalling and facilitating between "everything's going ok with inclusion" to "your child needs to be in a center based autism program!" All without ever doing the FBA.

Finally we switched schools in 2nd grade, they did the FBA -- and the plan worked the first day. All of a sudden, inclusion was working great! And then they really started to see the impact of his language issues on his education and his social skills. We finally started moving forward from there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ABA principles are applicable to children who are having issues with behavior as well as

"...used around the world to help all kinds of people overcome all kinds of social and behavioral problems such as quitting smoking, addressing personality disorders, relationship counseling, obsessive compulsive disorders, and many other common issues. Behavioral principles only began being used for children with autism in the late 1960’s and 1970’s. Studies are available that support the use of ABA programming with children affected by any number of different disabilities including Downs Syndrome, CP, Emotional Disorders, General Developmental Delay, etc."
http://www.prioritiesaba.com/resources-links/myths-and-misconceptions-about-aba

Or read about how a SLP uses ABA.
http://www.speakforyourself.org/uncategorized/accept-behavior-towards-non-autistic-child/

The same goes for things like the Kazdin Method (developed with kids with ODD) or Social Thinking Curriculum was developed with kids who fall under, "Diagnostic Label
Attention Issues (ADD/ADHD), Anxiety, Asperger's Syndrome, Autism Spectrum Disorders, Language or Learning Disability, Nonverbal Learning Disability, Social Communication Disorder, Traumatic Brain Injury, No Diagnosis, Other..."

I guess people who are using definitions that were made nearly 20 years ago, may not understand what type of therapies are used today.

Children with language issues often struggle with behavior, it's true. But that's because of their LANGUAGE issues. So if you get them into a good speech therapy setting, many of those issues go away.

The problem of pushing ABA is its massive expense which typically is not covered unless you have an autism diagnosis. It's also a huge time sink, and you're treating the symptom instead of the real issue.

We are one of the families who saw the Camaratas. They were able to give us many tips that solved most of our at-home behavior issues. At school, they recommended bringing in a board-certified behaviorist to do a support plan, and that worked right away. But that's different than ABA, which is discrete trial training.

Again, I'm not pushing ABA or any other behavioral intervention. I don't understand why there is such defensiveness on this board. My child diagnosed with MERLD didn't need behavioral supports or behavioral interventions in preschool, his teachers were aware of his diagnosis, and it didn't keep coming up over and over. Mainly b/c his behavior was appropriate despite his delays.

The OP didn't mention trouble at home and assume that the OP's kid is already doing ST. Maybe there is and she didn't mention it. And really ABA or behavioral therapy requires a lot of time, and it depends on what your insurance coverage is if you feel you need to pursue that route. Kids don't need to be on the spectrum to do ABA; likewise kids with autism can do behavioral therapy. The approaches are very similar.

My point (again) is that if the teachers are continuing to bring up autism, there probably is a reason, and it's probably behavior related. They either don't want him at the school, or they don't understand how to deal with him. Either way, it's an obtuse way of going about it. If I were the OP, I would ask for clarification from the teachers and/or have an observation/FBA done to help this kid in his current school. And maybe give some thought as to whether it is the right school fit. Regardless of the cause (whether it's language, communication disorder, ADHD to name only a few), behavioral interventions can help.

Exactly. SOMETHING is causing the teachers and psychologist to suggest that the current diagnosis and services are not adequate. Now, that "something" may be completely off base and incorrect (and the diagnosing may well overstep boundaries). But the smart thing to do is to focus on what they are seeing and observing, and then figure out where to go from there. It may be a different diagnosis, it may be the school environment, it may be bad teachers, it may be a lot of things. But it should not be ignored.

Here's the thing about that: Too often, the school district "fix" is just shoving a MERLD child into an autism based program. They did this with my child after Kindergarten. And, it solved NOTHING. ALL the same problems existed. Now the district was happier, but the autism program had turned into a dumping ground for children with behaviors, no matter the true diagnosis.

Again, it was getting the FBA done with the supports that made the difference.

Parents need to guard against the "school knows best" mentality. They are just doing what's convenient for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ABA principles are applicable to children who are having issues with behavior as well as

"...used around the world to help all kinds of people overcome all kinds of social and behavioral problems such as quitting smoking, addressing personality disorders, relationship counseling, obsessive compulsive disorders, and many other common issues. Behavioral principles only began being used for children with autism in the late 1960’s and 1970’s. Studies are available that support the use of ABA programming with children affected by any number of different disabilities including Downs Syndrome, CP, Emotional Disorders, General Developmental Delay, etc."
http://www.prioritiesaba.com/resources-links/myths-and-misconceptions-about-aba

Or read about how a SLP uses ABA.
http://www.speakforyourself.org/uncategorized/accept-behavior-towards-non-autistic-child/

The same goes for things like the Kazdin Method (developed with kids with ODD) or Social Thinking Curriculum was developed with kids who fall under, "Diagnostic Label
Attention Issues (ADD/ADHD), Anxiety, Asperger's Syndrome, Autism Spectrum Disorders, Language or Learning Disability, Nonverbal Learning Disability, Social Communication Disorder, Traumatic Brain Injury, No Diagnosis, Other..."

I guess people who are using definitions that were made nearly 20 years ago, may not understand what type of therapies are used today.

Children with language issues often struggle with behavior, it's true. But that's because of their LANGUAGE issues. So if you get them into a good speech therapy setting, many of those issues go away.

The problem of pushing ABA is its massive expense which typically is not covered unless you have an autism diagnosis. It's also a huge time sink, and you're treating the symptom instead of the real issue.

We are one of the families who saw the Camaratas. They were able to give us many tips that solved most of our at-home behavior issues. At school, they recommended bringing in a board-certified behaviorist to do a support plan, and that worked right away. But that's different than ABA, which is discrete trial training.

Again, I'm not pushing ABA or any other behavioral intervention. I don't understand why there is such defensiveness on this board. My child diagnosed with MERLD didn't need behavioral supports or behavioral interventions in preschool, his teachers were aware of his diagnosis, and it didn't keep coming up over and over. Mainly b/c his behavior was appropriate despite his delays.

The OP didn't mention trouble at home and assume that the OP's kid is already doing ST. Maybe there is and she didn't mention it. And really ABA or behavioral therapy requires a lot of time, and it depends on what your insurance coverage is if you feel you need to pursue that route. Kids don't need to be on the spectrum to do ABA; likewise kids with autism can do behavioral therapy. The approaches are very similar.

My point (again) is that if the teachers are continuing to bring up autism, there probably is a reason, and it's probably behavior related. They either don't want him at the school, or they don't understand how to deal with him. Either way, it's an obtuse way of going about it. If I were the OP, I would ask for clarification from the teachers and/or have an observation/FBA done to help this kid in his current school. And maybe give some thought as to whether it is the right school fit. Regardless of the cause (whether it's language, communication disorder, ADHD to name only a few), behavioral interventions can help.

I'm the PP and I agree it's likely the behavior they are seeing that makes them think autism. This is what we ran into. And we could clearly see that the school district personnel had a tunnel vision of "this is how autistic children act" vs. "this is how a child in distress acts.'

What was frustrating is we kept asking for a Functional Behavior Assessment, and they kept stalling and facilitating between "everything's going ok with inclusion" to "your child needs to be in a center based autism program!" All without ever doing the FBA.

Finally we switched schools in 2nd grade, they did the FBA -- and the plan worked the first day. All of a sudden, inclusion was working great! And then they really started to see the impact of his language issues on his education and his social skills. We finally started moving forward from there.

Our story is similar but in DS's case, he needed more than a FBA. DS had a full neuropsych eval in 2nd grade which found undiagnosed ADHD, combined type, in addition to the Asperger's diagnosis that he got in preK:

Getting treated for ADHD + FBA/BIP + additional supports/services in his IEP including support for his learning disability in written expression = happy kid who does great at school and has friends. DS also took up chess and is one of the top kids for his age in the USA.

OP needs to speak to the teachers and go back to the developmental pediatrician for further evaluations. Whatever is happening at school is not working.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ABA principles are applicable to children who are having issues with behavior as well as

"...used around the world to help all kinds of people overcome all kinds of social and behavioral problems such as quitting smoking, addressing personality disorders, relationship counseling, obsessive compulsive disorders, and many other common issues. Behavioral principles only began being used for children with autism in the late 1960’s and 1970’s. Studies are available that support the use of ABA programming with children affected by any number of different disabilities including Downs Syndrome, CP, Emotional Disorders, General Developmental Delay, etc."
http://www.prioritiesaba.com/resources-links/myths-and-misconceptions-about-aba

Or read about how a SLP uses ABA.
http://www.speakforyourself.org/uncategorized/accept-behavior-towards-non-autistic-child/

The same goes for things like the Kazdin Method (developed with kids with ODD) or Social Thinking Curriculum was developed with kids who fall under, "Diagnostic Label
Attention Issues (ADD/ADHD), Anxiety, Asperger's Syndrome, Autism Spectrum Disorders, Language or Learning Disability, Nonverbal Learning Disability, Social Communication Disorder, Traumatic Brain Injury, No Diagnosis, Other..."

I guess people who are using definitions that were made nearly 20 years ago, may not understand what type of therapies are used today.

Children with language issues often struggle with behavior, it's true. But that's because of their LANGUAGE issues. So if you get them into a good speech therapy setting, many of those issues go away.

The problem of pushing ABA is its massive expense which typically is not covered unless you have an autism diagnosis. It's also a huge time sink, and you're treating the symptom instead of the real issue.

We are one of the families who saw the Camaratas. They were able to give us many tips that solved most of our at-home behavior issues. At school, they recommended bringing in a board-certified behaviorist to do a support plan, and that worked right away. But that's different than ABA, which is discrete trial training.

Again, I'm not pushing ABA or any other behavioral intervention. I don't understand why there is such defensiveness on this board. My child diagnosed with MERLD didn't need behavioral supports or behavioral interventions in preschool, his teachers were aware of his diagnosis, and it didn't keep coming up over and over. Mainly b/c his behavior was appropriate despite his delays.

The OP didn't mention trouble at home and assume that the OP's kid is already doing ST. Maybe there is and she didn't mention it. And really ABA or behavioral therapy requires a lot of time, and it depends on what your insurance coverage is if you feel you need to pursue that route. Kids don't need to be on the spectrum to do ABA; likewise kids with autism can do behavioral therapy. The approaches are very similar.

My point (again) is that if the teachers are continuing to bring up autism, there probably is a reason, and it's probably behavior related. They either don't want him at the school, or they don't understand how to deal with him. Either way, it's an obtuse way of going about it. If I were the OP, I would ask for clarification from the teachers and/or have an observation/FBA done to help this kid in his current school. And maybe give some thought as to whether it is the right school fit. Regardless of the cause (whether it's language, communication disorder, ADHD to name only a few), behavioral interventions can help.

Exactly. SOMETHING is causing the teachers and psychologist to suggest that the current diagnosis and services are not adequate. Now, that "something" may be completely off base and incorrect (and the diagnosing may well overstep boundaries). But the smart thing to do is to focus on what they are seeing and observing, and then figure out where to go from there. It may be a different diagnosis, it may be the school environment, it may be bad teachers, it may be a lot of things. But it should not be ignored.

Here's the thing about that: Too often, the school district "fix" is just shoving a MERLD child into an autism based program. They did this with my child after Kindergarten. And, it solved NOTHING. ALL the same problems existed. Now the district was happier, but the autism program had turned into a dumping ground for children with behaviors, no matter the true diagnosis.

Again, it was getting the FBA done with the supports that made the difference.

Parents need to guard against the "school knows best" mentality. They are just doing what's convenient for them.

I wish you knew me IRL because you'd know I am so far from thinking the school knows best I 100% agree with you on that one. My point is that something is going on -- and that something absolutely could be the school blaming their inabilty to provide a proper environment on an undiagnosed condition. BTDT!!!

[Anonymous]

12:09

In my experience, children with receptive language issues really struggle in classrooms and this is made so much worse by districts and teachers who don't want to follow the IEP. Heck, my son's K teacher admitted to me in October of that year that she hadn't even READ my child's IEP-- but that didn't stop her from mounting a campaign to have him labeled with autism and removed from her class.

In OP's case, I agree it's good to go and confront them and try to get to the bottom of what they are thinking. In those early days I tried to hide from them so they couldn't tell me it was autism; in retrospect, I should have been more pro-active and willing to state my case about my son's language issues.

In 5th grade, the social worker for both schools told me the first school had treated us terribly, and that we were right to fight for the language label and inclusion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

12:09

In my experience, children with receptive language issues really struggle in classrooms and this is made so much worse by districts and teachers who don't want to follow the IEP. Heck, my son's K teacher admitted to me in October of that year that she hadn't even READ my child's IEP-- but that didn't stop her from mounting a campaign to have him labeled with autism and removed from her class.

In OP's case, I agree it's good to go and confront them and try to get to the bottom of what they are thinking. In those early days I tried to hide from them so they couldn't tell me it was autism; in retrospect, I should have been more pro-active and willing to state my case about my son's language issues.

In 5th grade, the social worker for both schools told me the first school had treated us terribly, and that we were right to fight for the language label and inclusion.

We had no issue getting a language label and the school wrote the IEP without our input despite us trying and they still don't follow it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

12:09

In my experience, children with receptive language issues really struggle in classrooms and this is made so much worse by districts and teachers who don't want to follow the IEP. Heck, my son's K teacher admitted to me in October of that year that she hadn't even READ my child's IEP-- but that didn't stop her from mounting a campaign to have him labeled with autism and removed from her class.

In OP's case, I agree it's good to go and confront them and try to get to the bottom of what they are thinking. In those early days I tried to hide from them so they couldn't tell me it was autism; in retrospect, I should have been more pro-active and willing to state my case about my son's language issues.

In 5th grade, the social worker for both schools told me the first school had treated us terribly, and that we were right to fight for the language label and inclusion.

Our experience is teachers don't understand the receptive issues and say it is autism or attention issues, when these kids just need more support to thrive. Our child isn't coded for receptive language issues even though there is a long documented history and mild concerns.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ABA principles are applicable to children who are having issues with behavior as well as

"...used around the world to help all kinds of people overcome all kinds of social and behavioral problems such as quitting smoking, addressing personality disorders, relationship counseling, obsessive compulsive disorders, and many other common issues. Behavioral principles only began being used for children with autism in the late 1960’s and 1970’s. Studies are available that support the use of ABA programming with children affected by any number of different disabilities including Downs Syndrome, CP, Emotional Disorders, General Developmental Delay, etc."
http://www.prioritiesaba.com/resources-links/myths-and-misconceptions-about-aba

Or read about how a SLP uses ABA.
http://www.speakforyourself.org/uncategorized/accept-behavior-towards-non-autistic-child/

The same goes for things like the Kazdin Method (developed with kids with ODD) or Social Thinking Curriculum was developed with kids who fall under, "Diagnostic Label
Attention Issues (ADD/ADHD), Anxiety, Asperger's Syndrome, Autism Spectrum Disorders, Language or Learning Disability, Nonverbal Learning Disability, Social Communication Disorder, Traumatic Brain Injury, No Diagnosis, Other..."

I guess people who are using definitions that were made nearly 20 years ago, may not understand what type of therapies are used today.

Children with language issues often struggle with behavior, it's true. But that's because of their LANGUAGE issues. So if you get them into a good speech therapy setting, many of those issues go away.

The problem of pushing ABA is its massive expense which typically is not covered unless you have an autism diagnosis. It's also a huge time sink, and you're treating the symptom instead of the real issue.

We are one of the families who saw the Camaratas. They were able to give us many tips that solved most of our at-home behavior issues. At school, they recommended bringing in a board-certified behaviorist to do a support plan, and that worked right away. But that's different than ABA, which is discrete trial training.

Again, I'm not pushing ABA or any other behavioral intervention. I don't understand why there is such defensiveness on this board. My child diagnosed with MERLD didn't need behavioral supports or behavioral interventions in preschool, his teachers were aware of his diagnosis, and it didn't keep coming up over and over. Mainly b/c his behavior was appropriate despite his delays.

The OP didn't mention trouble at home and assume that the OP's kid is already doing ST. Maybe there is and she didn't mention it. And really ABA or behavioral therapy requires a lot of time, and it depends on what your insurance coverage is if you feel you need to pursue that route. Kids don't need to be on the spectrum to do ABA; likewise kids with autism can do behavioral therapy. The approaches are very similar.

My point (again) is that if the teachers are continuing to bring up autism, there probably is a reason, and it's probably behavior related. They either don't want him at the school, or they don't understand how to deal with him. Either way, it's an obtuse way of going about it. If I were the OP, I would ask for clarification from the teachers and/or have an observation/FBA done to help this kid in his current school. And maybe give some thought as to whether it is the right school fit. Regardless of the cause (whether it's language, communication disorder, ADHD to name only a few), behavioral interventions can help.

I am the poster above you whose kid with Asperger's did not do ABA and I agree with you wholeheartedly. It's not about ABA or autism vs MERLD but the fact that the school cannot meet OP's child's needs so the teachers are telling her in a rather roundabout way that they need help in figuring out what is going on and how to help her child.

I have an Aspie and we didn't do ABA, either. ABA isn't for every kid.