272 Slaves Were Sold to Save Georgetown. What Does It Owe Their Descendants?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Students or people of color is appropriate. Look it up.

CP, POC -- there is no discernable difference, except for "of." To say one is offensive and the other is "correct" is P.C. lap dancing on the head of a pin!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's an interesting interview in the NY Times today with a CEO who says that one of the qualities she lokks for in new hires is 'the lens through which they look at the world, and whether it's one of ownership or victimization." She listens carefully to whether an inteviewee's "narrative is 'Life happens to me' or 'I make this happen.'"

America is characterized too much today by claims of victimization. Through the rear view mirror of history the selling slaves isn't right. But it also happened nearly two hundred years ago, and certainly Georgetown has done much to advance the cause of humanity since. Americans would be better served to take charge of their own lives rather than nursing some grievance over what may or may have happened to some ancestor umpteen generations ago. People who feel themselves to be victims stay that way.

I think the issue the CEO is referring to is whether the individual has this approach to life. I've known plenty of middle and upper middle class whites who feel quite victimized and are their own worst enemies.

Absolutely, the victimization complex spans all races and other groupings. But talk of reparations for a legal act in which Georgetown University participated 200 years ago (and for the purpose of sustaining its mission at the time) is victimization. No one alive today can claim hard from that. Folks need to look ahead and not back.

[Anonymous]

hardship

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Again there are studies that show* that white people (doesn't matter if you are first generation, if you are poor, or if your family never owned slaves) still benefit from white supremacy and slavery. Any potential scholarships or settlement would be a drop in the bucket in the grand scheme of things.

For instance White people with HS diplomas get more callbacks for jobs then blacks with Bachelor's. You can't tell me it's because of qualifications.

*Links are in this thread above

I've seen the studies about Elizabeth vs Shaniqua. But what about Bobbie Sue vs Shaniqua? Or Buddy vs DeAndre?

I know the studies say they think racism is the sole cause, but the white names listed in the studies I've seen are all middle class sorts of names.

Are you asking a genuine question or are you using this as an argument against worrying about implicit bias against black applicants with working class names (eg Shaniqua)?

Of course, there's prejudice against white southerners. Dd chose a gmail address for her first professional email address which had both her first and middle names included - and was similar to something like [e-mail] - which made her sound like a rural southerner. We told her to change it because the urban types which control employment would automatically make prejudiced assumptions about her.

So what we should do is educate each other about prejudice and discrimination against rural southerners as well as against African-Americans. It's not a case of who is most victimized in the name game (in case you are arguing that pp, but if you're not, apologies) but increasing our awareness of how this plays out in our daily lives.

Try getting an interview in the Goldman training program, or for that matter, admission to the Cathedral schools as "Billy Bob" or "Daisy Mae."

The point is, some AA parents of a certain class in an attempt to make a point end up hurting their kids' economic chances by the names they choose.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Again there are studies that show* that white people (doesn't matter if you are first generation, if you are poor, or if your family never owned slaves) still benefit from white supremacy and slavery. Any potential scholarships or settlement would be a drop in the bucket in the grand scheme of things.

For instance White people with HS diplomas get more callbacks for jobs then blacks with Bachelor's. You can't tell me it's because of qualifications.

*Links are in this thread above

I've seen the studies about Elizabeth vs Shaniqua. But what about Bobbie Sue vs Shaniqua? Or Buddy vs DeAndre?

I know the studies say they think racism is the sole cause, but the white names listed in the studies I've seen are all middle class sorts of names.

Are you asking a genuine question or are you using this as an argument against worrying about implicit bias against black applicants with working class names (eg Shaniqua)?

Of course, there's prejudice against white southerners. Dd chose a gmail address for her first professional email address which had both her first and middle names included - and was similar to something like [e-mail] - which made her sound like a rural southerner. We told her to change it because the urban types which control employment would automatically make prejudiced assumptions about her.

So what we should do is educate each other about prejudice and discrimination against rural southerners as well as against African-Americans. It's not a case of who is most victimized in the name game (in case you are arguing that pp, but if you're not, apologies) but increasing our awareness of how this plays out in our daily lives.

Genuine question. And not in terms of poor Southerner discrimination, more in terms of classism. From my perspective, the name problem is an intersectional problem. I'm betting names that are outgroup get discriminated against, whether the outgroup is black people, poor people, Mormons, etc.

[Anonymous]

I think the descendents are owed full cost of attending 4 years of Georgetown. Scholarships to those that want to study, but monetary restitution to those who do not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think the descendents are owed full cost of attending 4 years of Georgetown. Scholarships to those that want to study, but monetary restitution to those who do not.

Thanks, Rev. Al.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Students or people of color is appropriate. Look it up.

CP, POC -- there is no discernable difference, except for "of." To say one is offensive and the other is "correct" is P.C. lap dancing on the head of a pin!

It's called "people first language," and it's important to many communities, including people with disabilities (see how I did that? They don't like being called disabled people, they like being called people...with disabilities.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know that specific reparations for historical injustices is the best way forward. Might it not be better to ensure that every citizen is afforded a good education, access to medical care, social services, etc?

The Japanese, the Jews (of Germany), and Native Americans received reparations. It seems as if AAs have been blatantly left out of the mix when the entire world benefited from slavery. I don't think a check for every AA is even feasible but in this case scholarships from the institution that sold your ancestors to save themselves is the least they can do.

What raparations do you think native Americans have received? The US government has famously broken every single treaty. There is litigation over Indian money that Interior has been fighting for literally decades.

Holy cow you are ignorant.

Shit, Native Americans deserve hellified reparations!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How about the Union dead and wounded in the Civil War? There are your "reparations." Time to move on and stop wallowing in victimhood.

This^^

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Students or people of color is appropriate. Look it up.

CP, POC -- there is no discernable difference, except for "of." To say one is offensive and the other is "correct" is P.C. lap dancing on the head of a pin!

It's called "people first language," and it's important to many communities, including people with disabilities (see how I did that? They don't like being called disabled people, they like being called people...with disabilities.)

This terminology is not just P.C., it's a lof of B.S.!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Students or people of color is appropriate. Look it up.

CP, POC -- there is no discernable difference, except for "of." To say one is offensive and the other is "correct" is P.C. lap dancing on the head of a pin!

It's called "people first language," and it's important to many communities, including people with disabilities (see how I did that? They don't like being called disabled people, they like being called people...with disabilities.)

For example, "people with criminal records" rather than "criminals"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know that specific reparations for historical injustices is the best way forward. Might it not be better to ensure that every citizen is afforded a good education, access to medical care, social services, etc?

The Japanese, the Jews (of Germany), and Native Americans received reparations. It seems as if AAs have been blatantly left out of the mix when the entire world benefited from slavery. I don't think a check for every AA is even feasible but in this case scholarships from the institution that sold your ancestors to save themselves is the least they can do.

The check that Japanese Americans received ($20K) can't compare to the continuous reparations that Jews continue to receive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Students or people of color is appropriate. Look it up.

CP, POC -- there is no discernable difference, except for "of." To say one is offensive and the other is "correct" is P.C. lap dancing on the head of a pin!

It's called "people first language," and it's important to many communities, including people with disabilities (see how I did that? They don't like being called disabled people, they like being called people...with disabilities.)

just about the dumbest thing... that is simply stupid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know that specific reparations for historical injustices is the best way forward. Might it not be better to ensure that every citizen is afforded a good education, access to medical care, social services, etc?

The Japanese, the Jews (of Germany), and Native Americans received reparations. It seems as if AAs have been blatantly left out of the mix when the entire world benefited from slavery. I don't think a check for every AA is even feasible but in this case scholarships from the institution that sold your ancestors to save themselves is the least they can do.

The check that Japanese Americans received ($20K) can't compare to the continuous reparations that Jews continue to receive.

Ok, hater.