Markets to Tea Party: You Suck!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Thank you Tea Party. Your actions have created a 15% decline in the market. In case you think it is anything else, let's review the timeline:


July 21: Dow is at 12,724
July 22: Boehner walks out of big Debt Talks with 3-4T reduction coal.
July 25: Boehner says he wants a short-term only deal
July 29: Dow is at 12,100
Aug 1: House passes short term GOP led debt deal
Aug 2: Dow closes at 11866
August 3: Senate passes short term debt deal
August 4: Dow is at 11,383
August 5: S&P downgrades us
August 8: Dow is at 10,809


Total loss: 1,915 (15%)

WAY TO GO!

To be fair, equities are hitting the shitter because everyone thinks Obama and Congress are going to be pursuing more recovery-killing austerity measures, not because of the S&P downgrade, which most investors realize is a load of horseshit.

Carnage in stock markets as I write — and all of the headlines I see attribute it to S&P’s downgrade.

They really are trying to make my head explode, aren’t they?

Once again: S&P declared that US debt is no longer a safe investment; yet investors are piling into US debt, not out of it, driving the 10-year interest rate below 2.4%. This amounts to a massive market rejection of S&P’s concerns.

The “signature” of debt concerns should be stock and bond prices both falling; what we actually see is those prices moving in opposite directions. And that’s normally the signature of concerns about a weak economy and deflation risk (see Japan, decline of).

What triggered economy fears? To some extent I think this is a Wile E. Coyote moment, with investors suddenly noticing just how weak the fundamentals are. Also, the mess in Europe.

And maybe, maybe there is an S&P story — but not the one you think. Arguably, that downgrade will bully policy makers into even more deflationary, contractionary policies than they would have undertaken otherwise, which has the perverse effect of making US debt more attractive, since the alternatives are worse.

But all the Very Serious People, having totally misdiagnosed our problems so far, will probably double down on that wrong diagnosis as markets fall.

Via Dr Kassandra

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thank you Tea Party. Your actions have created a 15% decline in the market. In case you think it is anything else, let's review the timeline:


July 21: Dow is at 12,724
July 22: Boehner walks out of big Debt Talks with 3-4T reduction coal.
July 25: Boehner says he wants a short-term only deal
July 29: Dow is at 12,100
Aug 1: House passes short term GOP led debt deal
Aug 2: Dow closes at 11866
August 3: Senate passes short term debt deal
August 4: Dow is at 11,383
August 5: S&P downgrades us
August 8: Dow is at 10,809


Total loss: 1,915 (15%)

WAY TO GO!

To be fair, equities are hitting the shitter because everyone thinks Obama and Congress are going to be pursuing more recovery-killing austerity measures, not because of the S&P downgrade, which most investors realize is a load of horseshit.

Carnage in stock markets as I write — and all of the headlines I see attribute it to S&P’s downgrade.

They really are trying to make my head explode, aren’t they?

Once again: S&P declared that US debt is no longer a safe investment; yet investors are piling into US debt, not out of it, driving the 10-year interest rate below 2.4%. This amounts to a massive market rejection of S&P’s concerns.

The “signature” of debt concerns should be stock and bond prices both falling; what we actually see is those prices moving in opposite directions. And that’s normally the signature of concerns about a weak economy and deflation risk (see Japan, decline of).

What triggered economy fears? To some extent I think this is a Wile E. Coyote moment, with investors suddenly noticing just how weak the fundamentals are. Also, the mess in Europe.

And maybe, maybe there is an S&P story — but not the one you think. Arguably, that downgrade will bully policy makers into even more deflationary, contractionary policies than they would have undertaken otherwise, which has the perverse effect of making US debt more attractive, since the alternatives are worse.

But all the Very Serious People, having totally misdiagnosed our problems so far, will probably double down on that wrong diagnosis as markets fall.

Via Dr Kassandra

That logic is completely flawed. The entire market is getting hammered, and AA debt is less risky than a spiraling Dow. That by no means indicates that we won't be paying a high price for our future debt.

Make no mistake about this. Our debt ceiling debacle caused this. Our debt today is not meaningfully different from the same time last month. What changed is that the world is no longer certain that we have the political will to honor our debts.

[Anonymous]

Dow dropped 350 points after Obama speech. As the pet detective says " LOOOOOOOOO OOOO oooo OOO OOOO 000000 OOOOoooooOOOOOoooooooooOOOOooOOoOo SER!!!!!

[Anonymous]

When Obama called a balanced budget a "default" even though there is plenty of tax revenue to pay our interest, the bond market remembered what Obama did to them with GM and rightfully lowered the ratings. Bond holders are last in line with this moron.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Dow dropped 350 points after Obama speech. As the pet detective says " LOOOOOOOOO OOOO oooo OOO OOOO 000000 OOOOoooooOOOOOoooooooooOOOOooOOoOo SER!!!!!

The market doesn't care about a speech. The market cares about dumbass tea partiers who will play as fast and loose with our national debt as they have done with their own personal debts. Your team screwed the pooch. You know it, I know it. The S&P people said it. The whole world knows it. From Christine O'Donnell (your crush from last year) and her messed up finances to the sitting tea party congressmen who don't pay their child support like Joe Walsh to the ones in over their heads with mortgage and credit card debt, the tea party is full of debt shirkers. I suppose it is no surprise that they treat our debt with the same recklessness that they use in their personal lives.

[Anonymous]

Yeah. this has nothing to do with 14 trillion in debt. 40% of every dollar spent being BORROWED or PRINTED. Baseline annual increases in Government spending guarenteed by law of 7.5%. A phantom economy with no factories and tons of lawyers/assorted parasites. Bond holders are last in line behind ss recipients, medicare, defense, government workers, federal retirees, union bosses, GM, Chrysler, Money printers, dollar devaluers....who in thier right mind would invest in a 30 year bond?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yeah. this has nothing to do with 14 trillion in debt. 40% of every dollar spent being BORROWED or PRINTED. Baseline annual increases in Government spending guarenteed by law of 7.5%. A phantom economy with no factories and tons of lawyers/assorted parasites. Bond holders are last in line behind ss recipients, medicare, defense, government workers, federal retirees, union bosses, GM, Chrysler, Money printers, dollar devaluers....who in thier right mind would invest in a 30 year bond?

Well the debt has been there for a while. So I guess it is just an incredible coincidence that this whole mess happened the week after some of our politicians threatened to stop paying back our creditors. Why on earth would a credit rating agency care about that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah. this has nothing to do with 14 trillion in debt. 40% of every dollar spent being BORROWED or PRINTED. Baseline annual increases in Government spending guarenteed by law of 7.5%. A phantom economy with no factories and tons of lawyers/assorted parasites. Bond holders are last in line behind ss recipients, medicare, defense, government workers, federal retirees, union bosses, GM, Chrysler, Money printers, dollar devaluers....who in thier right mind would invest in a 30 year bond?

Well the debt has been there for a while. So I guess it is just an incredible coincidence that this whole mess happened the week after some of our politicians threatened to stop paying back our creditors. Why on earth would a credit rating agency care about that?

Deficit spending has increased exponentially under Obama. Without a reversal ,downgrades and default through dollar devaluation is a fact of life. Timing is meaningless

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah. this has nothing to do with 14 trillion in debt. 40% of every dollar spent being BORROWED or PRINTED. Baseline annual increases in Government spending guarenteed by law of 7.5%. A phantom economy with no factories and tons of lawyers/assorted parasites. Bond holders are last in line behind ss recipients, medicare, defense, government workers, federal retirees, union bosses, GM, Chrysler, Money printers, dollar devaluers....who in thier right mind would invest in a 30 year bond?

Well the debt has been there for a while. So I guess it is just an incredible coincidence that this whole mess happened the week after some of our politicians threatened to stop paying back our creditors. Why on earth would a credit rating agency care about that?

Deficit spending has increased exponentially under Obama. Without a reversal ,downgrades and default through dollar devaluation is a fact of life. Timing is meaningless

I'll have to take John Chambers' word on why S&P downgraded us. It is the current political process that makes them unconfident. He said so in TV interviews all weekend. Do you think he is lying about his own company's decision?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah. this has nothing to do with 14 trillion in debt. 40% of every dollar spent being BORROWED or PRINTED. Baseline annual increases in Government spending guarenteed by law of 7.5%. A phantom economy with no factories and tons of lawyers/assorted parasites. Bond holders are last in line behind ss recipients, medicare, defense, government workers, federal retirees, union bosses, GM, Chrysler, Money printers, dollar devaluers....who in thier right mind would invest in a 30 year bond?

Well the debt has been there for a while. So I guess it is just an incredible coincidence that this whole mess happened the week after some of our politicians threatened to stop paying back our creditors. Why on earth would a credit rating agency care about that?

Deficit spending has increased exponentially under Obama. Without a reversal ,downgrades and default through dollar devaluation is a fact of life. Timing is meaningless

I'll have to take John Chambers' word on why S&P downgraded us. It is the current political process that makes them unconfident. He said so in TV interviews all weekend. Do you think he is lying about his own company's decision?

Read Ezra Klein's column in the Post today. He has some good insight.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah. this has nothing to do with 14 trillion in debt. 40% of every dollar spent being BORROWED or PRINTED. Baseline annual increases in Government spending guarenteed by law of 7.5%. A phantom economy with no factories and tons of lawyers/assorted parasites. Bond holders are last in line behind ss recipients, medicare, defense, government workers, federal retirees, union bosses, GM, Chrysler, Money printers, dollar devaluers....who in thier right mind would invest in a 30 year bond?

Well the debt has been there for a while. So I guess it is just an incredible coincidence that this whole mess happened the week after some of our politicians threatened to stop paying back our creditors. Why on earth would a credit rating agency care about that?

Deficit spending has increased exponentially under Obama. Without a reversal ,downgrades and default through dollar devaluation is a fact of life. Timing is meaningless

I'll have to take John Chambers' word on why S&P downgraded us. It is the current political process that makes them unconfident. He said so in TV interviews all weekend. Do you think he is lying about his own company's decision?

Read Ezra Klein's column in the Post today. He has some good insight.

First, we didn't get downgraded on a typo.

Second, it's a bit silly calling foul on this. Nobody believes the CBO's nominal GDP growth number of 5% in the first place. Seriously, find me somebody. Nominal GDP growth is most likely closer to inflation, and that makes the calculations a wash.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah. this has nothing to do with 14 trillion in debt. 40% of every dollar spent being BORROWED or PRINTED. Baseline annual increases in Government spending guarenteed by law of 7.5%. A phantom economy with no factories and tons of lawyers/assorted parasites. Bond holders are last in line behind ss recipients, medicare, defense, government workers, federal retirees, union bosses, GM, Chrysler, Money printers, dollar devaluers....who in thier right mind would invest in a 30 year bond?

Well the debt has been there for a while. So I guess it is just an incredible coincidence that this whole mess happened the week after some of our politicians threatened to stop paying back our creditors. Why on earth would a credit rating agency care about that?

Deficit spending has increased exponentially under Obama. Without a reversal ,downgrades and default through dollar devaluation is a fact of life. Timing is meaningless

I'll have to take John Chambers' word on why S&P downgraded us. It is the current political process that makes them unconfident. He said so in TV interviews all weekend. Do you think he is lying about his own company's decision?

Read Ezra Klein's column in the Post today. He has some good insight.

First, we didn't get downgraded on a typo.

Second, it's a bit silly calling foul on this. Nobody believes the CBO's nominal GDP growth number of 5% in the first place. Seriously, find me somebody. Nominal GDP growth is most likely closer to inflation, and that makes the calculations a wash.

S&P also said no downgrade if the Ryan budget were enacted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah. this has nothing to do with 14 trillion in debt. 40% of every dollar spent being BORROWED or PRINTED. Baseline annual increases in Government spending guarenteed by law of 7.5%. A phantom economy with no factories and tons of lawyers/assorted parasites. Bond holders are last in line behind ss recipients, medicare, defense, government workers, federal retirees, union bosses, GM, Chrysler, Money printers, dollar devaluers....who in thier right mind would invest in a 30 year bond?

Well the debt has been there for a while. So I guess it is just an incredible coincidence that this whole mess happened the week after some of our politicians threatened to stop paying back our creditors. Why on earth would a credit rating agency care about that?

Deficit spending has increased exponentially under Obama. Without a reversal ,downgrades and default through dollar devaluation is a fact of life. Timing is meaningless

I'll have to take John Chambers' word on why S&P downgraded us. It is the current political process that makes them unconfident. He said so in TV interviews all weekend. Do you think he is lying about his own company's decision?

Read Ezra Klein's column in the Post today. He has some good insight.

First, we didn't get downgraded on a typo.

Second, it's a bit silly calling foul on this. Nobody believes the CBO's nominal GDP growth number of 5% in the first place. Seriously, find me somebody. Nominal GDP growth is most likely closer to inflation, and that makes the calculations a wash.

S&P also said no downgrade if the Ryan budget were enacted.

I didn't see that, but I did see how the Ryan budget couldn't get its own Republicans behind it.

[Anonymous]

If the USA has AAA bond rating then I should win the physical fitness award for the entire U.S. Spare me...NOBODY who buys a 10yr bond will be paid back the same dollars that they lent. The U.S. is on a never-ending money printing spree that is a defacto default. Thats right...the U.S. is currently defaulting on loans and stealing savings by money printing on a massive level. What is the bond rating for that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah. this has nothing to do with 14 trillion in debt. 40% of every dollar spent being BORROWED or PRINTED. Baseline annual increases in Government spending guarenteed by law of 7.5%. A phantom economy with no factories and tons of lawyers/assorted parasites. Bond holders are last in line behind ss recipients, medicare, defense, government workers, federal retirees, union bosses, GM, Chrysler, Money printers, dollar devaluers....who in thier right mind would invest in a 30 year bond?

Well the debt has been there for a while. So I guess it is just an incredible coincidence that this whole mess happened the week after some of our politicians threatened to stop paying back our creditors. Why on earth would a credit rating agency care about that?

Deficit spending has increased exponentially under Obama. Without a reversal ,downgrades and default through dollar devaluation is a fact of life. Timing is meaningless

I'll have to take John Chambers' word on why S&P downgraded us. It is the current political process that makes them unconfident. He said so in TV interviews all weekend. Do you think he is lying about his own company's decision?

Read Ezra Klein's column in the Post today. He has some good insight.

First, we didn't get downgraded on a typo.

Second, it's a bit silly calling foul on this. Nobody believes the CBO's nominal GDP growth number of 5% in the first place. Seriously, find me somebody. Nominal GDP growth is most likely closer to inflation, and that makes the calculations a wash.

S&P also said no downgrade if the Ryan budget were enacted.

I didn't see that, but I did see how the Ryan budget couldn't get its own Republicans behind it.

Ryan Budget passed the house.