Supplementing math is becoming the norm now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Asians rule

Between the math competitions, spelling bees, and computer science competitions- Asians are definitely the majority of representation. Not all wealthy either-putting education as a high priority is cultural. Wish more families did

BUT, we don’t need everyone excelling in math and high tech work. Most careers don’t involved very advanced math. But students aiming for a STEM career need to prioritize it.

Elementary students and most middle school students have not settled on a career yet. The future career is an unknown. (Sure, a tiny number of very very rare exceptions to this might exist.) Yet those are the exact ages where a strong math foundation needs to be established yo even have the option for a STEM degree in college or future STEM career.

Having a solid math foundation is about not closing doors prematurely for students in elementary and middle schools.

There are plenty of students who know that they have zero interest in STEM careers, or finance or economics or anything close to that. By middle school they have a good idea of what classes they enjoy and which classes are miserable grinds.

Every student needs to have a solid math foundation. Not every student needs to accelerate math or be in advanced classes. I would hope that the kids who spent their free time at a math school and math summer programs use these skills in a career they enjoy.

Every student doesn’t need discrete math and MVC in high school. But students with normal IQ and cognitive ability that are college bound should absolutely have calculus by 12th. In most districts, the normal pathway is Alg I in 9th, which isn’t enough IMO. The most typical advanced path puts students at Alg I in 8th, which isn’t crazy advanced at all, but students might not get enough math in K-5 to get there without supplemental math. It isn’t that they are dumb- it’s that school literally isn’t preparing them. It isn’t just about math, it’s about higher level thinking

Posters here seem to only think about the same colleges with the big names and the Ivy Leagues. There are about 3,000 four year colleges in the US. Less than half require 4 years of math. The only ones that need calculus are students going into STEM or the top colleges and a few scattered reasons.

Math is not the only subject that strengthens higher level thinking. All subjects do. The problem with students who spend all of their free hours on math tend to be weak in creative thinking, creative writing, they can be weak in the humanities where everything is not black and white like math. They may be weak in memorizing historical events and timelines because they don’t typically have to memorize. Students weak in math have an easier time because they can almost avoid it with taking the minimum requirements.

A large majority of kids are average and they will have no problem finding a college that fits them. Average kids who do the work will get good grades in all of the basic maths. Most kids have a subject they like and are good at, maybe history or English. That will help them find their way into a major they will enjoy and do well in.

Taking Alg 1 in 8th is not some huge acceleration. That should be average but our schools are so bad that it isn’t. Kids wanting to go into STEM at a
Top 20 school are doing more acceleration than that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Asians rule

Between the math competitions, spelling bees, and computer science competitions- Asians are definitely the majority of representation. Not all wealthy either-putting education as a high priority is cultural. Wish more families did

BUT, we don’t need everyone excelling in math and high tech work. Most careers don’t involved very advanced math. But students aiming for a STEM career need to prioritize it.

Elementary students and most middle school students have not settled on a career yet. The future career is an unknown. (Sure, a tiny number of very very rare exceptions to this might exist.) Yet those are the exact ages where a strong math foundation needs to be established yo even have the option for a STEM degree in college or future STEM career.

Having a solid math foundation is about not closing doors prematurely for students in elementary and middle schools.

There are plenty of students who know that they have zero interest in STEM careers, or finance or economics or anything close to that. By middle school they have a good idea of what classes they enjoy and which classes are miserable grinds.

Every student needs to have a solid math foundation. Not every student needs to accelerate math or be in advanced classes. I would hope that the kids who spent their free time at a math school and math summer programs use these skills in a career they enjoy.

Every student doesn’t need discrete math and MVC in high school. But students with normal IQ and cognitive ability that are college bound should absolutely have calculus by 12th. In most districts, the normal pathway is Alg I in 9th, which isn’t enough IMO. The most typical advanced path puts students at Alg I in 8th, which isn’t crazy advanced at all, but students might not get enough math in K-5 to get there without supplemental math. It isn’t that they are dumb- it’s that school literally isn’t preparing them. It isn’t just about math, it’s about higher level thinking

Posters here seem to only think about the same colleges with the big names and the Ivy Leagues. There are about 3,000 four year colleges in the US. Less than half require 4 years of math. The only ones that need calculus are students going into STEM or the top colleges and a few scattered reasons.

Math is not the only subject that strengthens higher level thinking. All subjects do. The problem with students who spend all of their free hours on math tend to be weak in creative thinking, creative writing, they can be weak in the humanities where everything is not black and white like math. They may be weak in memorizing historical events and timelines because they don’t typically have to memorize. Students weak in math have an easier time because they can almost avoid it with taking the minimum requirements.

A large majority of kids are average and they will have no problem finding a college that fits them. Average kids who do the work will get good grades in all of the basic maths. Most kids have a subject they like and are good at, maybe history or English. That will help them find their way into a major they will enjoy and do well in.

I think those kids whose parents are so invested in their math are also doing other extra curricular activities that strengthen other skills. It’s not a zero sum game. But yes these kids will have less time to play. The overall sentiment in this thread is that school based education is so weak in some areas that many families feel like they need to take things in their own hands.

[Anonymous]

My kid has been doing RSM since third grade. He also does a rec sport each season and Scouts. He is in MS now and is involved in clubs at school. He has an active social life and loves math competitions. He has loved math competitions since he was introduced to them in 4th grade. He thinks math is fun.

He was one of the few kids in his public ES cohort to participate in math supplementation. Most of the kids he hangs out with in MS do some sort of math supplementation but that is because he is involved with kids in AAP and mathcounts.

There are kids who just like math.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Asians rule

Between the math competitions, spelling bees, and computer science competitions- Asians are definitely the majority of representation. Not all wealthy either-putting education as a high priority is cultural. Wish more families did

BUT, we don’t need everyone excelling in math and high tech work. Most careers don’t involved very advanced math. But students aiming for a STEM career need to prioritize it.

Elementary students and most middle school students have not settled on a career yet. The future career is an unknown. (Sure, a tiny number of very very rare exceptions to this might exist.) Yet those are the exact ages where a strong math foundation needs to be established yo even have the option for a STEM degree in college or future STEM career.

Having a solid math foundation is about not closing doors prematurely for students in elementary and middle schools.

There are plenty of students who know that they have zero interest in STEM careers, or finance or economics or anything close to that. By middle school they have a good idea of what classes they enjoy and which classes are miserable grinds.

Every student needs to have a solid math foundation. Not every student needs to accelerate math or be in advanced classes. I would hope that the kids who spent their free time at a math school and math summer programs use these skills in a career they enjoy.

Every student doesn’t need discrete math and MVC in high school. But students with normal IQ and cognitive ability that are college bound should absolutely have calculus by 12th. In most districts, the normal pathway is Alg I in 9th, which isn’t enough IMO. The most typical advanced path puts students at Alg I in 8th, which isn’t crazy advanced at all, but students might not get enough math in K-5 to get there without supplemental math. It isn’t that they are dumb- it’s that school literally isn’t preparing them. It isn’t just about math, it’s about higher level thinking

Posters here seem to only think about the same colleges with the big names and the Ivy Leagues. There are about 3,000 four year colleges in the US. Less than half require 4 years of math. The only ones that need calculus are students going into STEM or the top colleges and a few scattered reasons.

Math is not the only subject that strengthens higher level thinking. All subjects do. The problem with students who spend all of their free hours on math tend to be weak in creative thinking, creative writing, they can be weak in the humanities where everything is not black and white like math. They may be weak in memorizing historical events and timelines because they don’t typically have to memorize. Students weak in math have an easier time because they can almost avoid it with taking the minimum requirements.

A large majority of kids are average and they will have no problem finding a college that fits them. Average kids who do the work will get good grades in all of the basic maths. Most kids have a subject they like and are good at, maybe history or English. That will help them find their way into a major they will enjoy and do well in.

Taking Alg 1 in 8th is not some huge acceleration. That should be average but our schools are so bad that it isn’t. Kids wanting to go into STEM at a
Top 20 school are doing more acceleration than that.

We have the advanced kids who go to RMS close to the school in Algebra 1. Everyone else, about 80% take 8th grade math.

[Anonymous]

I never assumed the school would be enough.i went to private growing up and everyone had a tutor. We picked a good public school to allow for supplementation. My K is doing 100 lessons to learn reading with me (so I do phonics with her) and she went to Mathnesium- I wasn’t happy with that so we are doing private tutoring. I plan to ramp this up once my youngest is out of daycare. It’s on me as a parent to make sure my kids are prepped- not the school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Asians rule

Between the math competitions, spelling bees, and computer science competitions- Asians are definitely the majority of representation. Not all wealthy either-putting education as a high priority is cultural. Wish more families did

BUT, we don’t need everyone excelling in math and high tech work. Most careers don’t involved very advanced math. But students aiming for a STEM career need to prioritize it.

Elementary students and most middle school students have not settled on a career yet. The future career is an unknown. (Sure, a tiny number of very very rare exceptions to this might exist.) Yet those are the exact ages where a strong math foundation needs to be established yo even have the option for a STEM degree in college or future STEM career.

Having a solid math foundation is about not closing doors prematurely for students in elementary and middle schools.

There are plenty of students who know that they have zero interest in STEM careers, or finance or economics or anything close to that. By middle school they have a good idea of what classes they enjoy and which classes are miserable grinds.

Every student needs to have a solid math foundation. Not every student needs to accelerate math or be in advanced classes. I would hope that the kids who spent their free time at a math school and math summer programs use these skills in a career they enjoy.

Every student doesn’t need discrete math and MVC in high school. But students with normal IQ and cognitive ability that are college bound should absolutely have calculus by 12th. In most districts, the normal pathway is Alg I in 9th, which isn’t enough IMO. The most typical advanced path puts students at Alg I in 8th, which isn’t crazy advanced at all, but students might not get enough math in K-5 to get there without supplemental math. It isn’t that they are dumb- it’s that school literally isn’t preparing them. It isn’t just about math, it’s about higher level thinking

Posters here seem to only think about the same colleges with the big names and the Ivy Leagues. There are about 3,000 four year colleges in the US. Less than half require 4 years of math. The only ones that need calculus are students going into STEM or the top colleges and a few scattered reasons.

Math is not the only subject that strengthens higher level thinking. All subjects do. The problem with students who spend all of their free hours on math tend to be weak in creative thinking, creative writing, they can be weak in the humanities where everything is not black and white like math. They may be weak in memorizing historical events and timelines because they don’t typically have to memorize. Students weak in math have an easier time because they can almost avoid it with taking the minimum requirements.

A large majority of kids are average and they will have no problem finding a college that fits them. Average kids who do the work will get good grades in all of the basic maths. Most kids have a subject they like and are good at, maybe history or English. That will help them find their way into a major they will enjoy and do well in.

Taking Alg 1 in 8th is not some huge acceleration. That should be average but our schools are so bad that it isn’t. Kids wanting to go into STEM at a
Top 20 school are doing more acceleration than that.

We have the advanced kids who go to RMS close to the school in Algebra 1. Everyone else, about 80% take 8th grade math.

Yeah, because school math is terrible and very slow; only about 30% of kids meet grade level expectations. If kids of normal intelligence were actually given good instruction in school, Alg I in 8th would be standard. But that isn’t reality. Math instruction in school as is subpar for normal kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I never assumed the school would be enough.i went to private growing up and everyone had a tutor. We picked a good public school to allow for supplementation. My K is doing 100 lessons to learn reading with me (so I do phonics with her) and she went to Mathnesium- I wasn’t happy with that so we are doing private tutoring. I plan to ramp this up once my youngest is out of daycare. It’s on me as a parent to make sure my kids are prepped- not the school.

I think your experience growing up is coloring your expectations, which I think are off.

My kid went to public and learned to read there. I did buy that 100 lessons book and she hated it, so I held off, and then she became a great reader in K and it didn't matter.

We supplement with resources and I pay close attention to where she is at so if I think there are deficits, I can help meet them. But we have yet to do any tutoring. I don't think they read enough full books at school and definitely not enough classic literature, so she does lots of that outside of school. I have bought Beast Academy books for math supplementing and she does an after school math club provided by the school. I see no point in doing Mathnasium or Kumon or RSM at this point.

I would get tutors if she was falling behind and I'd definitely get tutors/therapists for LDs. But my kid is learning in school. Above grade level in everything, self-motivated. After school is for playing, sports, and ballet. Balance.

If I truly thought the school wasn't teaching her, we'd put her in private or find a way to homeschool and focus "supplementing" on the social side. But it's not the case.

[Anonymous]

I do not perceive a difference between supplementing at home, filling gaps at home, taking student to a center for supplementing, and tutoring as a supplement.

The bottom line is that many schools cannot be relied upon to ensure students learn the material well. This causes many parents on DCUM supplement - either at home, online, at a center, or with a tutor.

Yes, there will be a few exceptions to _everything_ on DCUM, but the outline above seems very common here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I never assumed the school would be enough.i went to private growing up and everyone had a tutor. We picked a good public school to allow for supplementation. My K is doing 100 lessons to learn reading with me (so I do phonics with her) and she went to Mathnesium- I wasn’t happy with that so we are doing private tutoring. I plan to ramp this up once my youngest is out of daycare. It’s on me as a parent to make sure my kids are prepped- not the school.

I think your experience growing up is coloring your expectations, which I think are off.

My kid went to public and learned to read there. I did buy that 100 lessons book and she hated it, so I held off, and then she became a great reader in K and it didn't matter.

We supplement with resources and I pay close attention to where she is at so if I think there are deficits, I can help meet them. But we have yet to do any tutoring. I don't think they read enough full books at school and definitely not enough classic literature, so she does lots of that outside of school. I have bought Beast Academy books for math supplementing and she does an after school math club provided by the school. I see no point in doing Mathnasium or Kumon or RSM at this point.

I would get tutors if she was falling behind and I'd definitely get tutors/therapists for LDs. But my kid is learning in school. Above grade level in everything, self-motivated. After school is for playing, sports, and ballet. Balance.

If I truly thought the school wasn't teaching her, we'd put her in private or find a way to homeschool and focus "supplementing" on the social side. But it's not the case.

And, apparently, supplementing with Beast Academy books and after-school math club. Wish our local school offered an after-school math club. Sounds cheaper than RSM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I do not perceive a difference between supplementing at home, filling gaps at home, taking student to a center for supplementing, and tutoring as a supplement.

The bottom line is that many schools cannot be relied upon to ensure students learn the material well. This causes many parents on DCUM supplement - either at home, online, at a center, or with a tutor.

Yes, there will be a few exceptions to _everything_ on DCUM, but the outline above seems very common here.

+1

[Anonymous]

In my area and experience, there are multiple kids doing Russian Math as early as Kindergarten. And not to catch up, but to get ahead.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I never assumed the school would be enough.i went to private growing up and everyone had a tutor. We picked a good public school to allow for supplementation. My K is doing 100 lessons to learn reading with me (so I do phonics with her) and she went to Mathnesium- I wasn’t happy with that so we are doing private tutoring. I plan to ramp this up once my youngest is out of daycare. It’s on me as a parent to make sure my kids are prepped- not the school.

I think your experience growing up is coloring your expectations, which I think are off.

My kid went to public and learned to read there. I did buy that 100 lessons book and she hated it, so I held off, and then she became a great reader in K and it didn't matter.

We supplement with resources and I pay close attention to where she is at so if I think there are deficits, I can help meet them. But we have yet to do any tutoring. I don't think they read enough full books at school and definitely not enough classic literature, so she does lots of that outside of school. I have bought Beast Academy books for math supplementing and she does an after school math club provided by the school. I see no point in doing Mathnasium or Kumon or RSM at this point.

I would get tutors if she was falling behind and I'd definitely get tutors/therapists for LDs. But my kid is learning in school. Above grade level in everything, self-motivated. After school is for playing, sports, and ballet. Balance.

If I truly thought the school wasn't teaching her, we'd put her in private or find a way to homeschool and focus "supplementing" on the social side. But it's not the case.

And, apparently, supplementing with Beast Academy books and after-school math club. Wish our local school offered an after-school math club. Sounds cheaper than RSM.

After school math club will not replace RSM. It is not long enough and would not provide the homework or support that RSM does. My kid loves his math club but it is not even close to RSM.

[Anonymous]

We're in a Catholic middle school. Math instruction varies. One teacher is pretty good, the other not as much. My younger kid is good at math and can keep up, on track to take Algebra 1 in 8th. My other doesn't like math and we've realized the instruction is inadequate, which kind of surprised me. We do get a lot of paper: worksheets, workbooks, etc so we can see where she struggles. We're not supplementing but thank goodness my husband has a degree in the sciences and can basically teach her the math instruction she's not getting. But it does beg the question--what exactly is the tuition for if the parents have to teach the math?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We're in a Catholic middle school. Math instruction varies. One teacher is pretty good, the other not as much. My younger kid is good at math and can keep up, on track to take Algebra 1 in 8th. My other doesn't like math and we've realized the instruction is inadequate, which kind of surprised me. We do get a lot of paper: worksheets, workbooks, etc so we can see where she struggles. We're not supplementing but thank goodness my husband has a degree in the sciences and can basically teach her the math instruction she's not getting. But it does beg the question--what exactly is the tuition for if the parents have to teach the math?

So your husband is supplementing with his own knowledge.

[Anonymous]

In many other developed countries, the standard math curriculum has the equivalent of Algebra 1 in the equivalent of 7th/8th grade.

That the same is not standard here speaks to our poor quality math instruction.