The only way to have equity is to drag down the top performers

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why are you all saying gifted kids will figure it out for themselves and don’t need help/resources/harder classes? Gifted doesn’t necessarily mean hard working. A lot of these kids burn out and also need direction.

I personally would like harder classes for all. One of my kids is not gifted and she’s definitely been left behind. Her classes are insanely easy, there’s no good classroom debate on any subjects, and the teachers spends all of her time focuses on kids who can still barely read. My daughter is so curious about everything and loves math but there’s nothing for her.

I’m not saying harder classes shouldn’t be available, but they are available. Maybe that collection of classes doesn’t meet your child’s needs because they are so uniquely gifted, but it still doesn’t make sense for the school to develop a whole new curriculum pathways for a single child when other options are available. Particularly if that comes at the expense of larger swaths of kids that are struggling academically.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Truly AI learning will take over. Every child will be taught according to their pace, style and ability. There's no other way to handle it

There’s a social need for every student, including high performers. But I do agree for the future generation, education is likely going to take a new format.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you all saying gifted kids will figure it out for themselves and don’t need help/resources/harder classes? Gifted doesn’t necessarily mean hard working. A lot of these kids burn out and also need direction.

I personally would like harder classes for all. One of my kids is not gifted and she’s definitely been left behind. Her classes are insanely easy, there’s no good classroom debate on any subjects, and the teachers spends all of her time focuses on kids who can still barely read. My daughter is so curious about everything and loves math but there’s nothing for her.

I’m not saying harder classes shouldn’t be available, but they are available. Maybe that collection of classes doesn’t meet your child’s needs because they are so uniquely gifted, but it still doesn’t make sense for the school to develop a whole new curriculum pathways for a single child when other options are available. Particularly if that comes at the expense of larger swaths of kids that are struggling academically.

but they aren't. those classes are too easy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you all saying gifted kids will figure it out for themselves and don’t need help/resources/harder classes? Gifted doesn’t necessarily mean hard working. A lot of these kids burn out and also need direction.

I personally would like harder classes for all. One of my kids is not gifted and she’s definitely been left behind. Her classes are insanely easy, there’s no good classroom debate on any subjects, and the teachers spends all of her time focuses on kids who can still barely read. My daughter is so curious about everything and loves math but there’s nothing for her.

I’m not saying harder classes shouldn’t be available, but they are available. Maybe that collection of classes doesn’t meet your child’s needs because they are so uniquely gifted, but it still doesn’t make sense for the school to develop a whole new curriculum pathways for a single child when other options are available. Particularly if that comes at the expense of larger swaths of kids that are struggling academically.

but they aren't. those classes are too easy.

And what is available is getting dumbed down in the name of equity — that’s the entire point of this thread. See: “honors for all”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you all saying gifted kids will figure it out for themselves and don’t need help/resources/harder classes? Gifted doesn’t necessarily mean hard working. A lot of these kids burn out and also need direction.

I personally would like harder classes for all. One of my kids is not gifted and she’s definitely been left behind. Her classes are insanely easy, there’s no good classroom debate on any subjects, and the teachers spends all of her time focuses on kids who can still barely read. My daughter is so curious about everything and loves math but there’s nothing for her.

I’m not saying harder classes shouldn’t be available, but they are available. Maybe that collection of classes doesn’t meet your child’s needs because they are so uniquely gifted, but it still doesn’t make sense for the school to develop a whole new curriculum pathways for a single child when other options are available. Particularly if that comes at the expense of larger swaths of kids that are struggling academically.

but they aren't. those classes are too easy.

I truly don’t understand the logic here. The schools offer many options for kids of all intelligence and motivation levels. Our school offers MVC, Linear Algebra, AP calc, and AP Stats, in person at our HS. In addition they offer many math classes for kids that are less advanced. Those classes meet the needs of the vast majority of students.

For the let’s say top 3%, they will now offer cluster based accelerated programs. For the kids who are beyond that, let’s say the top .3%, there are other options available like DE and the like. My kid digs physics but there is only one AP physics class at the HS. So she took four semester of Physics classes and labs at the college.

If your kid is a truly unique, one of a kind genius that is curing cancer at 14, then I agree MCPS isn’t going to give them the best diversity of options for academic challenge. I also think it isn’t MCPS’s responsibility to meet every possible desire for a very single outlier kid. For virtually every other high stats/gifted kid it seems to me that there are a wide diversity of options that MCPS offers that can reasonable meet their needs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you all saying gifted kids will figure it out for themselves and don’t need help/resources/harder classes? Gifted doesn’t necessarily mean hard working. A lot of these kids burn out and also need direction.

I personally would like harder classes for all. One of my kids is not gifted and she’s definitely been left behind. Her classes are insanely easy, there’s no good classroom debate on any subjects, and the teachers spends all of her time focuses on kids who can still barely read. My daughter is so curious about everything and loves math but there’s nothing for her.

I’m not saying harder classes shouldn’t be available, but they are available. Maybe that collection of classes doesn’t meet your child’s needs because they are so uniquely gifted, but it still doesn’t make sense for the school to develop a whole new curriculum pathways for a single child when other options are available. Particularly if that comes at the expense of larger swaths of kids that are struggling academically.

but they aren't. those classes are too easy.

I truly don’t understand the logic here. The schools offer many options for kids of all intelligence and motivation levels. Our school offers MVC, Linear Algebra, AP calc, and AP Stats, in person at our HS. In addition they offer many math classes for kids that are less advanced. Those classes meet the needs of the vast majority of students.

For the let’s say top 3%, they will now offer cluster based accelerated programs. For the kids who are beyond that, let’s say the top .3%, there are other options available like DE and the like. My kid digs physics but there is only one AP physics class at the HS. So she took four semester of Physics classes and labs at the college.

If your kid is a truly unique, one of a kind genius that is curing cancer at 14, then I agree MCPS isn’t going to give them the best diversity of options for academic challenge. I also think it isn’t MCPS’s responsibility to meet every possible desire for a very single outlier kid. For virtually every other high stats/gifted kid it seems to me that there are a wide diversity of options that MCPS offers that can reasonable meet their needs.

DP. Those are not offered at most schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you all saying gifted kids will figure it out for themselves and don’t need help/resources/harder classes? Gifted doesn’t necessarily mean hard working. A lot of these kids burn out and also need direction.

I personally would like harder classes for all. One of my kids is not gifted and she’s definitely been left behind. Her classes are insanely easy, there’s no good classroom debate on any subjects, and the teachers spends all of her time focuses on kids who can still barely read. My daughter is so curious about everything and loves math but there’s nothing for her.

I’m not saying harder classes shouldn’t be available, but they are available. Maybe that collection of classes doesn’t meet your child’s needs because they are so uniquely gifted, but it still doesn’t make sense for the school to develop a whole new curriculum pathways for a single child when other options are available. Particularly if that comes at the expense of larger swaths of kids that are struggling academically.

but they aren't. those classes are too easy.

I truly don’t understand the logic here. The schools offer many options for kids of all intelligence and motivation levels. Our school offers MVC, Linear Algebra, AP calc, and AP Stats, in person at our HS. In addition they offer many math classes for kids that are less advanced. Those classes meet the needs of the vast majority of students.

For the let’s say top 3%, they will now offer cluster based accelerated programs. For the kids who are beyond that, let’s say the top .3%, there are other options available like DE and the like. My kid digs physics but there is only one AP physics class at the HS. So she took four semester of Physics classes and labs at the college.

If your kid is a truly unique, one of a kind genius that is curing cancer at 14, then I agree MCPS isn’t going to give them the best diversity of options for academic challenge. I also think it isn’t MCPS’s responsibility to meet every possible desire for a very single outlier kid. For virtually every other high stats/gifted kid it seems to me that there are a wide diversity of options that MCPS offers that can reasonable meet their needs.

The problem isn’t what MCPS currently offers. In fact MCPS has historically been a great district for gifted kids. It’s what they’re taking away. No more ELC. No more magnets. It’s dumbing everything down

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you all saying gifted kids will figure it out for themselves and don’t need help/resources/harder classes? Gifted doesn’t necessarily mean hard working. A lot of these kids burn out and also need direction.

I personally would like harder classes for all. One of my kids is not gifted and she’s definitely been left behind. Her classes are insanely easy, there’s no good classroom debate on any subjects, and the teachers spends all of her time focuses on kids who can still barely read. My daughter is so curious about everything and loves math but there’s nothing for her.

I’m not saying harder classes shouldn’t be available, but they are available. Maybe that collection of classes doesn’t meet your child’s needs because they are so uniquely gifted, but it still doesn’t make sense for the school to develop a whole new curriculum pathways for a single child when other options are available. Particularly if that comes at the expense of larger swaths of kids that are struggling academically.

but they aren't. those classes are too easy.

I truly don’t understand the logic here. The schools offer many options for kids of all intelligence and motivation levels. Our school offers MVC, Linear Algebra, AP calc, and AP Stats, in person at our HS. In addition they offer many math classes for kids that are less advanced. Those classes meet the needs of the vast majority of students.

For the let’s say top 3%, they will now offer cluster based accelerated programs. For the kids who are beyond that, let’s say the top .3%, there are other options available like DE and the like. My kid digs physics but there is only one AP physics class at the HS. So she took four semester of Physics classes and labs at the college.

If your kid is a truly unique, one of a kind genius that is curing cancer at 14, then I agree MCPS isn’t going to give them the best diversity of options for academic challenge. I also think it isn’t MCPS’s responsibility to meet every possible desire for a very single outlier kid. For virtually every other high stats/gifted kid it seems to me that there are a wide diversity of options that MCPS offers that can reasonable meet their needs.

The problem isn’t what MCPS currently offers. In fact MCPS has historically been a great district for gifted kids. It’s what they’re taking away. No more ELC. No more magnets. It’s dumbing everything down

I did describe what they are going to offer, now what they offer right now. Notice I didn’t mention magnets but instead referred to cluster based accelerated programs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you all saying gifted kids will figure it out for themselves and don’t need help/resources/harder classes? Gifted doesn’t necessarily mean hard working. A lot of these kids burn out and also need direction.

I personally would like harder classes for all. One of my kids is not gifted and she’s definitely been left behind. Her classes are insanely easy, there’s no good classroom debate on any subjects, and the teachers spends all of her time focuses on kids who can still barely read. My daughter is so curious about everything and loves math but there’s nothing for her.

I’m not saying harder classes shouldn’t be available, but they are available. Maybe that collection of classes doesn’t meet your child’s needs because they are so uniquely gifted, but it still doesn’t make sense for the school to develop a whole new curriculum pathways for a single child when other options are available. Particularly if that comes at the expense of larger swaths of kids that are struggling academically.

They can do both. You are only talking about 6-10 classes at our school. They don’t have them at our school and they don’t allow independent study. My kid doesn’t have enough classes available to graduate.

[Anonymous]

The new AP Seminar offered in English departments for 10th graders is bringing back tracking, by the way. The high achieving 10th graders now take that for English and “Honors” English 10 is by default actually on level. So- all the kids with IEPs and behavioral issues.

MCPS is so messed up. Honors for all! Then… well, except for this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you all saying gifted kids will figure it out for themselves and don’t need help/resources/harder classes? Gifted doesn’t necessarily mean hard working. A lot of these kids burn out and also need direction.

I personally would like harder classes for all. One of my kids is not gifted and she’s definitely been left behind. Her classes are insanely easy, there’s no good classroom debate on any subjects, and the teachers spends all of her time focuses on kids who can still barely read. My daughter is so curious about everything and loves math but there’s nothing for her.

I’m not saying harder classes shouldn’t be available, but they are available. Maybe that collection of classes doesn’t meet your child’s needs because they are so uniquely gifted, but it still doesn’t make sense for the school to develop a whole new curriculum pathways for a single child when other options are available. Particularly if that comes at the expense of larger swaths of kids that are struggling academically.

but they aren't. those classes are too easy.

I truly don’t understand the logic here. The schools offer many options for kids of all intelligence and motivation levels. Our school offers MVC, Linear Algebra, AP calc, and AP Stats, in person at our HS. In addition they offer many math classes for kids that are less advanced. Those classes meet the needs of the vast majority of students.

For the let’s say top 3%, they will now offer cluster based accelerated programs. For the kids who are beyond that, let’s say the top .3%, there are other options available like DE and the like. My kid digs physics but there is only one AP physics class at the HS. So she took four semester of Physics classes and labs at the college.

If your kid is a truly unique, one of a kind genius that is curing cancer at 14, then I agree MCPS isn’t going to give them the best diversity of options for academic challenge. I also think it isn’t MCPS’s responsibility to meet every possible desire for a very single outlier kid. For virtually every other high stats/gifted kid it seems to me that there are a wide diversity of options that MCPS offers that can reasonable meet their needs.

The problem isn’t what MCPS currently offers. In fact MCPS has historically been a great district for gifted kids. It’s what they’re taking away. No more ELC. No more magnets. It’s dumbing everything down

I did describe what they are going to offer, now what they offer right now. Notice I didn’t mention magnets but instead referred to cluster based accelerated programs.

What are cluster based acceleration programs?

It's as previous poster mentioned, the issue is it sounds like not all schools offer the courses you listed. MVC, Linear Algebra, etc.

Then the other issue is, even if schools are offering the courses or other AP courses, not every school is teaching according to the same levels.

Going back to what OP is saying, is that instead of maybe trying to expand the courses to all schools. We're seeing posts on here like, "Oh no one needs those courses beyond a certain level"

And trying to take away and limit from the top end.

In some areas, these courses seem like a given. It sounds like some others want regionalized magnet programs to access these type of courses. And some others truly want access to an actual magnet program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you all saying gifted kids will figure it out for themselves and don’t need help/resources/harder classes? Gifted doesn’t necessarily mean hard working. A lot of these kids burn out and also need direction.

I personally would like harder classes for all. One of my kids is not gifted and she’s definitely been left behind. Her classes are insanely easy, there’s no good classroom debate on any subjects, and the teachers spends all of her time focuses on kids who can still barely read. My daughter is so curious about everything and loves math but there’s nothing for her.

I’m not saying harder classes shouldn’t be available, but they are available. Maybe that collection of classes doesn’t meet your child’s needs because they are so uniquely gifted, but it still doesn’t make sense for the school to develop a whole new curriculum pathways for a single child when other options are available. Particularly if that comes at the expense of larger swaths of kids that are struggling academically.

but they aren't. those classes are too easy.

I truly don’t understand the logic here. The schools offer many options for kids of all intelligence and motivation levels. Our school offers MVC, Linear Algebra, AP calc, and AP Stats, in person at our HS. In addition they offer many math classes for kids that are less advanced. Those classes meet the needs of the vast majority of students.

For the let’s say top 3%, they will now offer cluster based accelerated programs. For the kids who are beyond that, let’s say the top .3%, there are other options available like DE and the like. My kid digs physics but there is only one AP physics class at the HS. So she took four semester of Physics classes and labs at the college.

If your kid is a truly unique, one of a kind genius that is curing cancer at 14, then I agree MCPS isn’t going to give them the best diversity of options for academic challenge. I also think it isn’t MCPS’s responsibility to meet every possible desire for a very single outlier kid. For virtually every other high stats/gifted kid it seems to me that there are a wide diversity of options that MCPS offers that can reasonable meet their needs.

The problem isn’t what MCPS currently offers. In fact MCPS has historically been a great district for gifted kids. It’s what they’re taking away. No more ELC. No more magnets. It’s dumbing everything down

I did describe what they are going to offer, now what they offer right now. Notice I didn’t mention magnets but instead referred to cluster based accelerated programs.

How do you know what they are going to offer in the regional STEM program? It’s not shown anywhere on the slides. Link plz? If you are from the study team, how do MCPS make these course offerings equitable across different regions? If not enough students register, are some of the classes going to vanish over years? This has happened in the regional IB model. What metrics are MCPS going to evaluate the success and access across 6 regions? How often to evaluate and what’s the mitigation strategy if significant discrepancies are identified?

I’m not asking particularly hard questions. These are routine questions asked in any academia or industry proposals.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The new AP Seminar offered in English departments for 10th graders is bringing back tracking, by the way. The high achieving 10th graders now take that for English and “Honors” English 10 is by default actually on level. So- all the kids with IEPs and behavioral issues.

MCPS is so messed up. Honors for all! Then… well, except for this.

That's the way it has been in 11th and 12th grade English, so why not the same for 10th?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The new AP Seminar offered in English departments for 10th graders is bringing back tracking, by the way. The high achieving 10th graders now take that for English and “Honors” English 10 is by default actually on level. So- all the kids with IEPs and behavioral issues.

MCPS is so messed up. Honors for all! Then… well, except for this.

That's the way it has been in 11th and 12th grade English, so why not the same for 10th?

I think it’s kind of silly to pretend there’s a large cohort of sophomores ready for college-level English. So it’d make more sense to just have an advanced HS class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The new AP Seminar offered in English departments for 10th graders is bringing back tracking, by the way. The high achieving 10th graders now take that for English and “Honors” English 10 is by default actually on level. So- all the kids with IEPs and behavioral issues.

MCPS is so messed up. Honors for all! Then… well, except for this.

That's the way it has been in 11th and 12th grade English, so why not the same for 10th?

I think it’s kind of silly to pretend there’s a large cohort of sophomores ready for college-level English. So it’d make more sense to just have an advanced HS class.

Which is what AP Seminar English 10 is.