Majoring in English—why so much disrespect?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Chaucer, that's another one I never read. If only my parents knew, they were already not thrilled with the English degree but I didn't even read half the books. I did watch all the movies though. Somehow I got a great job working for the government.

Lazy English major?

I considered myself to be highly efficient, I graduated with virtually no effort put forth.

Great professors at GMU back then. I just started wondering if any of them might stumble upon this thread. CF was the best. I can't remember the other names. The one who taught Southern Gothic lit was great, I recommend A Feast of Snakes, that nice old lady had us read that filthy book. The guy who did Sci Fi was great too, A Gate to Women's Country was my favorite. Another shout out to the one who had us read One Hundred Years of Solitude, she promised that we'd all read it again one day, I tried to watch the Netflix show but it was terrible. So there, I read at least three books.

Sounds like the GMU program wasn't very rigorous back in your day.

You picked up on that? Was it me repeatedly declaring English to be super easy? The classmates I kept in touch with did very well for themselves though.

Yep, and I'm not even an English major! Perhaps it was what your classmates learned that made them successful

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I majored in English, work in communications, and have a six-figure salary. Because I worked for a university, I also took advantage of the tuition benefit and earned a master’s degree as well, also in English. I have an interesting, flexible job that I love. I think anyone can be successful with just about any type of degree, as long as you gain experience along the way and know how to present yourself.

This is a compelling example of someone forging a career directly in line with studying English.

I don’t get why anyone says I majored in X and then went to law school or earned an MBA in order to become Y. It’s a tacit admission that it can’t be a useful terminal degree for many.

A terminal degree in almost all fields is a doctorate

Not for almost all of engineering, business, or arts, or almost all of medicine except for MD, and only just barely for law.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know women’s studies, studio art, and political science majors from my LAC, who went to medical school.

3% of med school students were/are humanities majors

It’s safe to say nobody knows many English majors who became doctors because it’s statistically impossible.

But you may know some.

Statistically if you know 33 doctors one of them majored in humanities. To know two you need to know 67 doctors. To know “a few” or you need to know hundreds of doctors.

That’s all humanities…not just English (poli sci most popular humanities major BTW). We are talking specifically English majors which is the title of the thread.

You probably have to know 150-200 doctors to know one that was an English major.

Gracious, I was an English major and even I understand that's not how probability works. You do not "have to know 150-200 doctors" to know one who was an English major. You can know just one doctor - the one in 150 who was an English major.

And that’s why people look down on English majors. If you look at the prior post it started with the word “statistically”, meaning on average. You’re confusing a possible outcome with the probability that said outcome is realized. Where’s that sharp critical thinking that English majors supposedly develop while analyzing Shakespeare? Businesses will not pay you money for these trite arguments, you need to be productive.

I'm the PP English major. Precision matters, and you were being imprecise to serve a false argument.
The statement "Statistically if you know 33 doctors, one of them majored in humanities" is not the same as "Statistically you would need to know 33 doctors to know one who majored in humanities."
But, you (or somebody) conflated the two and then doubled down on that second formulation to suggest that it's impossible the other PP knows a few / more than a few doctors who were humanities majors. "You'd have to know x number of people ..." was offered to show that there's no way they actually know that many people in the category. But, of course, that does not follow from the statistic. It's entirely possible that PP knows a dozen humanities majors who became doctors, for all sorts of reasons - perhaps PP is a member of an alumni club with that focus. Perhaps several friends all met at a liberal arts college and then became doctors. Perhaps all of PP's family members have that educational background. When you misuse statistics, you come to false conclusions and overlook interesting possibilities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I majored in English, work in communications, and have a six-figure salary. Because I worked for a university, I also took advantage of the tuition benefit and earned a master’s degree as well, also in English. I have an interesting, flexible job that I love. I think anyone can be successful with just about any type of degree, as long as you gain experience along the way and know how to present yourself.

This is a compelling example of someone forging a career directly in line with studying English.

I don’t get why anyone says I majored in X and then went to law school or earned an MBA in order to become Y. It’s a tacit admission that it can’t be a useful terminal degree for many.

A terminal degree in almost all fields is a doctorate

Not for almost all of engineering, business, or arts, or almost all of medicine except for MD, and only just barely for law.

You're not understanding what a terminal degree means.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know women’s studies, studio art, and political science majors from my LAC, who went to medical school.

3% of med school students were/are humanities majors

It’s safe to say nobody knows many English majors who became doctors because it’s statistically impossible.

But you may know some.

Statistically if you know 33 doctors one of them majored in humanities. To know two you need to know 67 doctors. To know “a few” or you need to know hundreds of doctors.

That’s all humanities…not just English (poli sci most popular humanities major BTW). We are talking specifically English majors which is the title of the thread.

You probably have to know 150-200 doctors to know one that was an English major.

Gracious, I was an English major and even I understand that's not how probability works. You do not "have to know 150-200 doctors" to know one who was an English major. You can know just one doctor - the one in 150 who was an English major.

And that’s why people look down on English majors. If you look at the prior post it started with the word “statistically”, meaning on average. You’re confusing a possible outcome with the probability that said outcome is realized. Where’s that sharp critical thinking that English majors supposedly develop while analyzing Shakespeare? Businesses will not pay you money for these trite arguments, you need to be productive.

I'm the PP English major. Precision matters, and you were being imprecise to serve a false argument.
The statement "Statistically if you know 33 doctors, one of them majored in humanities" is not the same as "Statistically you would need to know 33 doctors to know one who majored in humanities."
But, you (or somebody) conflated the two and then doubled down on that second formulation to suggest that it's impossible the other PP knows a few / more than a few doctors who were humanities majors. "You'd have to know x number of people ..." was offered to show that there's no way they actually know that many people in the category. But, of course, that does not follow from the statistic. It's entirely possible that PP knows a dozen humanities majors who became doctors, for all sorts of reasons - perhaps PP is a member of an alumni club with that focus. Perhaps several friends all met at a liberal arts college and then became doctors. Perhaps all of PP's family members have that educational background. When you misuse statistics, you come to false conclusions and overlook interesting possibilities.

Haha, love your rebuttal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

dony898 wrote:Everyone dunks on English majors until they need help writing a single coherent sentence on LinkedIn.

I had to write a job description recently and used AI for the first to time to do it. It was pretty dam* good. I just had to tweak it a bit. I was a bit shocked.

I saw a video of a fake podcast created by Google Gemini for a technical manual. It was shockingly amazing.

I think many, if not most, people find it to be good because they can't write to save their arse so anything that's comprehensible is going to be good.

But, it was really good for a job description. It's not the Harvard Review.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

dony898 wrote:Everyone dunks on English majors until they need help writing a single coherent sentence on LinkedIn.

I had to write a job description recently and used AI for the first to time to do it. It was pretty dam* good. I just had to tweak it a bit. I was a bit shocked.

I saw a video of a fake podcast created by Google Gemini for a technical manual. It was shockingly amazing.

I think many, if not most, people find it to be good because they can't write to save their arse so anything that's comprehensible is going to be good.

But, it was really good for a job description. It's not the Harvard Review.

Well if one can barely string two sentences together, I'm sure its great.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know women’s studies, studio art, and political science majors from my LAC, who went to medical school.

3% of med school students were/are humanities majors

It’s safe to say nobody knows many English majors who became doctors because it’s statistically impossible.

But you may know some.

Statistically if you know 33 doctors one of them majored in humanities. To know two you need to know 67 doctors. To know “a few” or you need to know hundreds of doctors.

That’s all humanities…not just English (poli sci most popular humanities major BTW). We are talking specifically English majors which is the title of the thread.

You probably have to know 150-200 doctors to know one that was an English major.

Gracious, I was an English major and even I understand that's not how probability works. You do not "have to know 150-200 doctors" to know one who was an English major. You can know just one doctor - the one in 150 who was an English major.

And that’s why people look down on English majors. If you look at the prior post it started with the word “statistically”, meaning on average. You’re confusing a possible outcome with the probability that said outcome is realized. Where’s that sharp critical thinking that English majors supposedly develop while analyzing Shakespeare? Businesses will not pay you money for these trite arguments, you need to be productive.

I'm not the PP but PP was not wrong. Perhaps PP was playing on the words as an English major. While the probability of an event happening before it occurs might be less than 100%, once the event has happened, it is certain, and its probability becomes 1 (or 100%).

Another English major? The event that happened is an outcome, it’s not that it’s probability becomes 100%. Probability is number of favorable outcome divided by number of possible outcomes. If you’re still confused ask ChatGPT explain it to you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:An example of Chaucer's Canterbury Tales in Middle English. Understanding it is only the beginning.

"Whan that Aprill with his shoures soote

The droghte of Marche hath perced to the roote,

And bathed every veyne in swich licour,

Of which vertu engendred is the flour."

but, why do people need to understand this? I read Shakespeare, Flaubert, etc.. but I don't see the point in needing to understand very old English. My DH is English. He doesn't even like reading those types of books

Which then begs the question, why do I need to study so many subjects that I will never use in my career? It's not necessarily the specific subject matter that's important, its the the thought processes and skills that we develop that's important.

I can understand learning history, social science, but none of those classes are taught in ye olde English. So, again, why does one need to understand Chaucer's old English?

I think it's important to read some classics, but I don't think it's important to read every classic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know women’s studies, studio art, and political science majors from my LAC, who went to medical school.

3% of med school students were/are humanities majors

It’s safe to say nobody knows many English majors who became doctors because it’s statistically impossible.

But you may know some.

Statistically if you know 33 doctors one of them majored in humanities. To know two you need to know 67 doctors. To know “a few” or you need to know hundreds of doctors.

That’s all humanities…not just English (poli sci most popular humanities major BTW). We are talking specifically English majors which is the title of the thread.

You probably have to know 150-200 doctors to know one that was an English major.

Gracious, I was an English major and even I understand that's not how probability works. You do not "have to know 150-200 doctors" to know one who was an English major. You can know just one doctor - the one in 150 who was an English major.

And that’s why people look down on English majors. If you look at the prior post it started with the word “statistically”, meaning on average. You’re confusing a possible outcome with the probability that said outcome is realized. Where’s that sharp critical thinking that English majors supposedly develop while analyzing Shakespeare? Businesses will not pay you money for these trite arguments, you need to be productive.

I'm the PP English major. Precision matters, and you were being imprecise to serve a false argument.
The statement "Statistically if you know 33 doctors, one of them majored in humanities" is not the same as "Statistically you would need to know 33 doctors to know one who majored in humanities."
But, you (or somebody) conflated the two and then doubled down on that second formulation to suggest that it's impossible the other PP knows a few / more than a few doctors who were humanities majors. "You'd have to know x number of people ..." was offered to show that there's no way they actually know that many people in the category. But, of course, that does not follow from the statistic. It's entirely possible that PP knows a dozen humanities majors who became doctors, for all sorts of reasons - perhaps PP is a member of an alumni club with that focus. Perhaps several friends all met at a liberal arts college and then became doctors. Perhaps all of PP's family members have that educational background. When you misuse statistics, you come to false conclusions and overlook interesting possibilities.

I like you.

And learning to consider interesting possibilities and think critically is one of the key skills you learn when majoring in English (or history or another humanities).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:An example of Chaucer's Canterbury Tales in Middle English. Understanding it is only the beginning.

"Whan that Aprill with his shoures soote

The droghte of Marche hath perced to the roote,

And bathed every veyne in swich licour,

Of which vertu engendred is the flour."

Oof, I remember having to recite this for class. "Shoor-us soot-eh ..."

This Chaucer lesson brings home so many important aspects of the human experience. I was an English major (double major with a social science), then went on to get a Masters, and then went to law school. Thirty years later I still remember with love and gratitude my English classes: the things we read and discussed and wrote. It made me a better reader, a better writer, and a more empathetic and nuanced human being.

Today people (including me) worry so much about what jobs their kids will get after college. I’d encourage a double major along with English. But the study of language and literature is one of the things that helps us keep our humanity. Covid showed us the importance of the arts to human survival. I’d be proud if my kids majored in English or history. But if they didn’t want to be academics or go to graduate school for something more “marketable,” I’d be nervous.

You are old. (I am too. Everyone on DCUM is.) So is that poster who works in communications.

Young people today have audio video communications. Books and school aren't how people get exposed to other cultures and new ideas.

GMU Grad back again. My kids read non stop, so there are young readers out there. My older one even mentioned majoring in English, but I replied that that was not a funny joke.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

dony898 wrote:Everyone dunks on English majors until they need help writing a single coherent sentence on LinkedIn.

I had to write a job description recently and used AI for the first to time to do it. It was pretty dam* good. I just had to tweak it a bit. I was a bit shocked.

I saw a video of a fake podcast created by Google Gemini for a technical manual. It was shockingly amazing.

I think many, if not most, people find it to be good because they can't write to save their arse so anything that's comprehensible is going to be good.

But, it was really good for a job description. It's not the Harvard Review.

Well if one can barely string two sentences together, I'm sure its great.

It was actually half a page with bullets. It was pretty good - clear and concise. If an English major wrote it would've been verbose and flowery. That doesn't fly in my industry.

My kid was in an IB magnet, and I think it was a great program for them, made them stronger writers. But, do you know what all the kids called IB? "I Bulls*!t".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:An example of Chaucer's Canterbury Tales in Middle English. Understanding it is only the beginning.

"Whan that Aprill with his shoures soote

The droghte of Marche hath perced to the roote,

And bathed every veyne in swich licour,

Of which vertu engendred is the flour."

but, why do people need to understand this? I read Shakespeare, Flaubert, etc.. but I don't see the point in needing to understand very old English. My DH is English. He doesn't even like reading those types of books

Which then begs the question, why do I need to study so many subjects that I will never use in my career? It's not necessarily the specific subject matter that's important, its the the thought processes and skills that we develop that's important.

I can understand learning history, social science, but none of those classes are taught in ye olde English. So, again, why does one need to understand Chaucer's old English?

I think it's important to read some classics, but I don't think it's important to read every classic.

Majoring in English is not only (or primarily) about reading the classics. It's about thinking about literature and the ways that literature reflect (or doesn't reflect) society and our culture. It's about expanding our imaginations and empathy through seeing the world through others' perspectives. And it's about close reading and defending ideas with specific examples.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know women’s studies, studio art, and political science majors from my LAC, who went to medical school.

3% of med school students were/are humanities majors

It’s safe to say nobody knows many English majors who became doctors because it’s statistically impossible.

But you may know some.

Statistically if you know 33 doctors one of them majored in humanities. To know two you need to know 67 doctors. To know “a few” or you need to know hundreds of doctors.

That’s all humanities…not just English (poli sci most popular humanities major BTW). We are talking specifically English majors which is the title of the thread.

You probably have to know 150-200 doctors to know one that was an English major.

Gracious, I was an English major and even I understand that's not how probability works. You do not "have to know 150-200 doctors" to know one who was an English major. You can know just one doctor - the one in 150 who was an English major.

And that’s why people look down on English majors. If you look at the prior post it started with the word “statistically”, meaning on average. You’re confusing a possible outcome with the probability that said outcome is realized. Where’s that sharp critical thinking that English majors supposedly develop while analyzing Shakespeare? Businesses will not pay you money for these trite arguments, you need to be productive.

I'm not the PP but PP was not wrong. Perhaps PP was playing on the words as an English major. While the probability of an event happening before it occurs might be less than 100%, once the event has happened, it is certain, and its probability becomes 1 (or 100%).

Another English major? The event that happened is an outcome, it’s not that it’s probability becomes 100%. Probability is number of favorable outcome divided by number of possible outcomes. If you’re still confused ask ChatGPT explain it to you.

I took your advice and did:
You are asking if the probability of an event becomes \(100\%\) after its outcome is known.  What's given in the problem  The question implies an event with an initial probability less than \(100\%\).  Helpful information  Probability is a measure of the likelihood of an event occurring. A probability of \(1\) (or \(100\%\)) signifies certainty.  How to solve  Determine if the probability of an event changes to certainty once its outcome is observed.  Step 1 . Consider the definition of probability. Probability quantifies the chance of an event before it happens. Step 2 . Analyze the state after an outcome is known. Once an event has occurred and its outcome is observed, the outcome is no longer uncertain. The event has either happened or not happened. Step 3 . Conclude on the probability. If the event occurred, its probability of having occurred becomes \(1\) or \(100\%\). If the event did not occur, its probability of having occurred becomes \(0\) or \(0\%\). Solution  Yes, once the outcome of an event is known, the probability of that specific outcome having occurred becomes \(100\%\).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

dony898 wrote:Everyone dunks on English majors until they need help writing a single coherent sentence on LinkedIn.

I had to write a job description recently and used AI for the first to time to do it. It was pretty dam* good. I just had to tweak it a bit. I was a bit shocked.

I saw a video of a fake podcast created by Google Gemini for a technical manual. It was shockingly amazing.

I think many, if not most, people find it to be good because they can't write to save their arse so anything that's comprehensible is going to be good.

But, it was really good for a job description. It's not the Harvard Review.

Well if one can barely string two sentences together, I'm sure its great.

It was actually half a page with bullets. It was pretty good - clear and concise. If an English major wrote it would've been verbose and flowery. That doesn't fly in my industry.

My kid was in an IB magnet, and I think it was a great program for them, made them stronger writers. But, do you know what all the kids called IB? "I Bulls*!t".

I'm not an English major but I know enough that English majors are taught precisely not to be flowery and verbose!