How many have a kid who turned down an Ivy or Ivies to attend another school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Turned down Cornell for Vanderbilt.

Who wouldn’t?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of DC's friends turned down athletic recruiting offers (football) from Harvard and Princeton for a free ride to a much lower ranked school. His family is not wealthy so he would have had to take out loans to pay for it.

To play football?

Folks, these football anecdotes are pretty stupid.

Also, nobody has to take out loans for Harvard or Princeton…especially Princeton…because they are no loan schools. So the family must have had more $$$s than you think.

The family is clearly too cheap to pay for Harvard or Princeton.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The football recruit for Stanford goes 100% for free even if you make millions per year…100% of all Power 4 football recruits receive 100% scholarships (and if they were poor they would also go for free because they are as generous all Ivies for need aid).

So…let’s leave Ivy and Patriot schools out of the conversation because the economics of attending college and the ability to compete at a high level at a Power 4 school in football (not to mention having sold out stadiums and national TV coverage) will outweigh everything else.

You are way overrating how many Power 4 teams sell out their stadiums, especially at those schools with the best academic reputations.
https://www.d1ticker.com/2024-fbs-attendance-trends/

NIL is also hardly a pot of gold for the vast majority of athletes, even the Power 4 football players.
https://nilassist.ncaa.org/data-dashboard/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nobody would turn down playing football at OSU or Alabama vs playing for Harvard. Nobody.

The NIL dollars plus payments direct from the school would be massive in addition to the potential to get drafted into the NFL.

Your statement may be true for the five-star recruits and/or skill position players, but a player at the bottom of Alabama's recruiting class (yes, some of them are "only" three-stars) and plays interior offensive line, kicker, or safety is way better off going to a Harvard or Stanford.

Most of the NIL dollars are going to a small subset of the roster.

But there is still good money. I know one of the kids on an SEC roster (Transfer) and he's getting about $200K as a back up.

[Anonymous]

The stats don't lie.
https://www.si.com/fannation/name-image-likeness/nil-news/college-athlete-average-nil-earnings-shockingly-low-despite-headline-deals

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The football recruit for Stanford goes 100% for free even if you make millions per year…100% of all Power 4 football recruits receive 100% scholarships (and if they were poor they would also go for free because they are as generous all Ivies for need aid).

So…let’s leave Ivy and Patriot schools out of the conversation because the economics of attending college and the ability to compete at a high level at a Power 4 school in football (not to mention having sold out stadiums and national TV coverage) will outweigh everything else.

You are way overrating how many Power 4 teams sell out their stadiums, especially at those schools with the best academic reputations.
https://www.d1ticker.com/2024-fbs-attendance-trends/

NIL is also hardly a pot of gold for the vast majority of athletes, even the Power 4 football players.
https://nilassist.ncaa.org/data-dashboard/

This is so stupid…it’s still about 50,000+ more fans than are attending any Ivy League game…and yes many games are televised on national tv.

I see you passed over how you attend a Power 4 school for free for football…no matter how much money you have.

[Anonymous]

Not all Power 4 schools are created equal. Some are worth attending for free (vs. Harvard), others not so much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not all Power 4 schools are created equal. Some are worth attending for free (vs. Harvard), others not so much.

Well…it depends on how good a football player you are because if you are NFL material then nobody gives a f**k how good the school is academically, yes?

Just so happens if you are smart enough to get recruited for football to Harvard (which can still be scores hundreds less than the average Harvard student)…and you are great at football…then guess what, you are smart enough for Duke, Stanford, Vandy, Michigan, ND, etc.

So…logic would dictate that a 5 star 1400 SAT kid might go to say Alabama because they have the potential to go Pro or pick Michigan or ND…while the 3 star 1400 SAT kid will go to Duke or Stanford…and one star 1400 kid may go to Harvard.

[Anonymous]

HYP football parent here. We choose to pay retail for four years because we ultimately concluded it was in investment in the 40 years that come after that first four. The thesis fundamentally centered around (i) the peers he would be surrounded by and (ii) the network he would be exposed to. Regarding the latter, DS had folks from the football alumni family reaching out to him with internship opportunities before he had graduated from high school. The vast majority of whatever outcome ultimately obtains will come down to how hard the kid is willing to work to pursue his dreams, but I’d like to think the set up will be there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not all Power 4 schools are created equal. Some are worth attending for free (vs. Harvard), others not so much.

Well…it depends on how good a football player you are because if you are NFL material then nobody gives a f**k how good the school is academically, yes?

Just so happens if you are smart enough to get recruited for football to Harvard (which can still be scores hundreds less than the average Harvard student)…and you are great at football…then guess what, you are smart enough for Duke, Stanford, Vandy, Michigan, ND, etc.

So…logic would dictate that a 5 star 1400 SAT kid might go to say Alabama because they have the potential to go Pro or pick Michigan or ND…while the 3 star 1400 SAT kid will go to Duke or Stanford…and one star 1400 kid may go to Harvard.

Under 10 percent of Power 4 players are NFL material. Your chances are certainly higher from Alabama/Michigan, but still the odds are heavily against it.

The more important point here is that the "5 star 1400 SAT kid" is a unicorn. There are only like 30 five-star recruits in any given year. In the past decade, I'd be surprised if more than one or two of them had a 1400 SAT score, if any.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not all Power 4 schools are created equal. Some are worth attending for free (vs. Harvard), others not so much.

Well…it depends on how good a football player you are because if you are NFL material then nobody gives a f**k how good the school is academically, yes?

Just so happens if you are smart enough to get recruited for football to Harvard (which can still be scores hundreds less than the average Harvard student)…and you are great at football…then guess what, you are smart enough for Duke, Stanford, Vandy, Michigan, ND, etc.

So…logic would dictate that a 5 star 1400 SAT kid might go to say Alabama because they have the potential to go Pro or pick Michigan or ND…while the 3 star 1400 SAT kid will go to Duke or Stanford…and one star 1400 kid may go to Harvard.

Under 10 percent of Power 4 players are NFL material. Your chances are certainly higher from Alabama/Michigan, but still the odds are heavily against it.

The more important point here is that the "5 star 1400 SAT kid" is a unicorn. There are only like 30 five-star recruits in any given year. In the past decade, I'd be surprised if more than one or two of them had a 1400 SAT score, if any.

None of which you say supports any choosing Harvard over equally elite Power 4 schools that are 100% free…hence the reference to 3 star recruits who are still much better players than the Harvard recruits who are one star at best.

Stanford, Duke, Vandy, Michigan and Notre Dame all have plenty of sub-1400 SAT players.

It’s generally absurd to even think any kid able to play at these types of schools are even considering Harvard at all

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:HYP football parent here. We choose to pay retail for four years because we ultimately concluded it was in investment in the 40 years that come after that first four. The thesis fundamentally centered around (i) the peers he would be surrounded by and (ii) the network he would be exposed to. Regarding the latter, DS had folks from the football alumni family reaching out to him with internship opportunities before he had graduated from high school. The vast majority of whatever outcome ultimately obtains will come down to how hard the kid is willing to work to pursue his dreams, but I’d like to think the set up will be there.

"It's a 40 year decision" is the exact same pitch that Stanford (and other "academic" D1 schools) have been using for years.
https://www.mic.com/articles/101630/stanford-is-recruiting-football-players-with-the-smartest-pitch-imaginable

Granted, they still very rarely get five-star recruits, but enough three and four-star players to stay competitive on the field (though the last several years have been poor for Stanford after being consistently ranked in the 2010s and even borderline contenders in 2010/2015).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lots of students turn down Ivies for MIT, Stanford, Chicago, Vanderbilt, Rice, Northwestern, CalTech, Duke, Johns Hopkins, Williams, Pomona, Amherst, Michigan, Berkeley, Texas, not to mention all the schools that offered significant merit aid. It's actually quite common to turn down paying $400,000 for Harvard or Penn and choosing the free ride at the state flagship instead. I know a couple of STEM kids at UMD that did exactly that.

It's rare to turn down Harvard.

Not for engineering or CS. There are a lot of schools that are stronger than Harvard in those majors. Plus Ivy schools don't offer merit. There are many, many UMC families who are reconsidering paying $100,000 a year at Ivy schools in favor of schools where they can get merit. At this price point, everyone is trying to decide what's worth it and what's not. And engineering at Harvard or Yale is very much not worth it.

You get admitted to Harvard college and are free to choose any major. You also have the option of taking classes at MIT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The football recruit for Stanford goes 100% for free even if you make millions per year…100% of all Power 4 football recruits receive 100% scholarships (and if they were poor they would also go for free because they are as generous all Ivies for need aid).

So…let’s leave Ivy and Patriot schools out of the conversation because the economics of attending college and the ability to compete at a high level at a Power 4 school in football (not to mention having sold out stadiums and national TV coverage) will outweigh everything else.

You are way overrating how many Power 4 teams sell out their stadiums, especially at those schools with the best academic reputations.
https://www.d1ticker.com/2024-fbs-attendance-trends/

NIL is also hardly a pot of gold for the vast majority of athletes, even the Power 4 football players.
https://nilassist.ncaa.org/data-dashboard/

Except now the Power 4 schools are just paying athletes direct in addition to NIL.

$22MM of which they say 75% will go to football, so $16.5MM spread across 105 players or $157k per player on average per year.

The QB, skill positions and starters will probably get more…but it’s still probably a minimum of $30-$40k per rostered player per year (plus free total cost to attend).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:HYP football parent here. We choose to pay retail for four years because we ultimately concluded it was in investment in the 40 years that come after that first four. The thesis fundamentally centered around (i) the peers he would be surrounded by and (ii) the network he would be exposed to. Regarding the latter, DS had folks from the football alumni family reaching out to him with internship opportunities before he had graduated from high school. The vast majority of whatever outcome ultimately obtains will come down to how hard the kid is willing to work to pursue his dreams, but I’d like to think the set up will be there.

HYP don’t have the networks or peer groups in formation they once did. Wayne Gretzky would not approve of your play.