Atheists at the Cathedral on Good Friday

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My God, who cares? Bizarre thing to be thinking or posting about.

.

So it seems weird to care if people in church believe in god?

Why would you care?

People go to church to praise God, right?

It’s a National Cathedral. It was specifically intended—back to L’Enfant’s original plan for the city—to draw visitors to DC closer to Christianity, and a lot of those visitors are not Christian. Atheists visiting is a feature, not a bug.

I seriously doubt that L'Enfant's plan to build a national cathedral was done in the hope that atheists and non-christians (people of other religions) would convert to Christianity. Never heard that one before. Besides, it's un-American.

I did not say that it was intended to create converts. But it was intended to showcase what was then the normative religious behavior of the American political class—which was Episcopalianism—when Congress chartered it in 1893. (It opened in my lifetime, but it took a VERY long time to build; cathedrals always do.)

So it was intended to "draw visitors to DC closer to Christianity", but not to create converts. Got it

I don’t know what you find so contradictory about this. The people who conceived of and created this cathedral thought of mainstream institutional Protestant Christianity as the national civil religion. When they thought about showing off the country to visitors, this was one of the things they wanted to show off.

OK to build a national cathedral; Not OK to imply L'Enfant wanted to draw visitors closer to Christianity.

If you have evidence to the contrary, by all means present it. In his time, that goal would have been regarded as absolutely legitimate, and L’Enfant would have had to be something of a renegade to have openly rejected it. But perhaps he was, IDK. What have you got?

If you have actual evidence that L'Enfant was trying to draw people to Christ, please present it. Otherwise, please desist.

DP. There is ample evidence. Go look in the L’Enfant papers in the historical section at the Library of Congress.

No, YOU tell us -- and with verifying links. Otherwise, it's simply not true. You're making up stuff.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My God, who cares? Bizarre thing to be thinking or posting about.

.

So it seems weird to care if people in church believe in god?

Why would you care?

People go to church to praise God, right?

It’s a National Cathedral. It was specifically intended—back to L’Enfant’s original plan for the city—to draw visitors to DC closer to Christianity, and a lot of those visitors are not Christian. Atheists visiting is a feature, not a bug.

I seriously doubt that L'Enfant's plan to build a national cathedral was done in the hope that atheists and non-christians (people of other religions) would convert to Christianity. Never heard that one before. Besides, it's un-American.

I did not say that it was intended to create converts. But it was intended to showcase what was then the normative religious behavior of the American political class—which was Episcopalianism—when Congress chartered it in 1893. (It opened in my lifetime, but it took a VERY long time to build; cathedrals always do.)

So it was intended to "draw visitors to DC closer to Christianity", but not to create converts. Got it

I don’t know what you find so contradictory about this. The people who conceived of and created this cathedral thought of mainstream institutional Protestant Christianity as the national civil religion. When they thought about showing off the country to visitors, this was one of the things they wanted to show off.

OK to build a national cathedral; Not OK to imply L'Enfant wanted to draw visitors closer to Christianity.

If you have evidence to the contrary, by all means present it. In his time, that goal would have been regarded as absolutely legitimate, and L’Enfant would have had to be something of a renegade to have openly rejected it. But perhaps he was, IDK. What have you got?

If you have actual evidence that L'Enfant was trying to draw people to Christ, please present it. Otherwise, please desist.

DP. There is ample evidence. Go look in the L’Enfant papers in the historical section at the Library of Congress.

No, YOU tell us -- and with verifying links. Otherwise, it's simply not true. You're making up stuff.

Have you heard? There is no God. You can look it up. There is ample evidence. Don't believe it? Just look in the Scam section at the Library of Congress.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My God, who cares? Bizarre thing to be thinking or posting about.

.

So it seems weird to care if people in church believe in god?

Why would you care?

People go to church to praise God, right?

It’s a National Cathedral. It was specifically intended—back to L’Enfant’s original plan for the city—to draw visitors to DC closer to Christianity, and a lot of those visitors are not Christian. Atheists visiting is a feature, not a bug.

I seriously doubt that L'Enfant's plan to build a national cathedral was done in the hope that atheists and non-christians (people of other religions) would convert to Christianity. Never heard that one before. Besides, it's un-American.

I did not say that it was intended to create converts. But it was intended to showcase what was then the normative religious behavior of the American political class—which was Episcopalianism—when Congress chartered it in 1893. (It opened in my lifetime, but it took a VERY long time to build; cathedrals always do.)

So it was intended to "draw visitors to DC closer to Christianity", but not to create converts. Got it

I don’t know what you find so contradictory about this. The people who conceived of and created this cathedral thought of mainstream institutional Protestant Christianity as the national civil religion. When they thought about showing off the country to visitors, this was one of the things they wanted to show off.

OK to build a national cathedral; Not OK to imply L'Enfant wanted to draw visitors closer to Christianity.

If you have evidence to the contrary, by all means present it. In his time, that goal would have been regarded as absolutely legitimate, and L’Enfant would have had to be something of a renegade to have openly rejected it. But perhaps he was, IDK. What have you got?

If you have actual evidence that L'Enfant was trying to draw people to Christ, please present it. Otherwise, please desist.

DP. There is ample evidence. Go look in the L’Enfant papers in the historical section at the Library of Congress.

That kind of language: "trying to draw people to Christ" wasn't used in L'Enfant's time. L'Enfant was a nominal Christian, like everyone else in France and England and the US.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My God, who cares? Bizarre thing to be thinking or posting about.

.

So it seems weird to care if people in church believe in god?

Why would you care?

People go to church to praise God, right?

It’s a National Cathedral. It was specifically intended—back to L’Enfant’s original plan for the city—to draw visitors to DC closer to Christianity, and a lot of those visitors are not Christian. Atheists visiting is a feature, not a bug.

I seriously doubt that L'Enfant's plan to build a national cathedral was done in the hope that atheists and non-christians (people of other religions) would convert to Christianity. Never heard that one before. Besides, it's un-American.

I did not say that it was intended to create converts. But it was intended to showcase what was then the normative religious behavior of the American political class—which was Episcopalianism—when Congress chartered it in 1893. (It opened in my lifetime, but it took a VERY long time to build; cathedrals always do.)

So it was intended to "draw visitors to DC closer to Christianity", but not to create converts. Got it

I don’t know what you find so contradictory about this. The people who conceived of and created this cathedral thought of mainstream institutional Protestant Christianity as the national civil religion. When they thought about showing off the country to visitors, this was one of the things they wanted to show off.

OK to build a national cathedral; Not OK to imply L'Enfant wanted to draw visitors closer to Christianity.

If you have evidence to the contrary, by all means present it. In his time, that goal would have been regarded as absolutely legitimate, and L’Enfant would have had to be something of a renegade to have openly rejected it. But perhaps he was, IDK. What have you got?

If you have actual evidence that L'Enfant was trying to draw people to Christ, please present it. Otherwise, please desist.

DP. There is ample evidence. Go look in the L’Enfant papers in the historical section at the Library of Congress.

That kind of language: "trying to draw people to Christ" wasn't used in L'Enfant's time. L'Enfant was a nominal Christian, like everyone else in France and England and the US.

OF COURSE modern evangelical English terms were not being used in L’Enfant’s time. That has nothing to do with what his aim was, which included the promulgation of a civic religion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My God, who cares? Bizarre thing to be thinking or posting about.

.

So it seems weird to care if people in church believe in god?

Why would you care?

People go to church to praise God, right?

It’s a National Cathedral. It was specifically intended—back to L’Enfant’s original plan for the city—to draw visitors to DC closer to Christianity, and a lot of those visitors are not Christian. Atheists visiting is a feature, not a bug.

I seriously doubt that L'Enfant's plan to build a national cathedral was done in the hope that atheists and non-christians (people of other religions) would convert to Christianity. Never heard that one before. Besides, it's un-American.

I did not say that it was intended to create converts. But it was intended to showcase what was then the normative religious behavior of the American political class—which was Episcopalianism—when Congress chartered it in 1893. (It opened in my lifetime, but it took a VERY long time to build; cathedrals always do.)

So it was intended to "draw visitors to DC closer to Christianity", but not to create converts. Got it

I don’t know what you find so contradictory about this. The people who conceived of and created this cathedral thought of mainstream institutional Protestant Christianity as the national civil religion. When they thought about showing off the country to visitors, this was one of the things they wanted to show off.

OK to build a national cathedral; Not OK to imply L'Enfant wanted to draw visitors closer to Christianity.

If you have evidence to the contrary, by all means present it. In his time, that goal would have been regarded as absolutely legitimate, and L’Enfant would have had to be something of a renegade to have openly rejected it. But perhaps he was, IDK. What have you got?

If you have actual evidence that L'Enfant was trying to draw people to Christ, please present it. Otherwise, please desist.

DP. There is ample evidence. Go look in the L’Enfant papers in the historical section at the Library of Congress.

That kind of language: "trying to draw people to Christ" wasn't used in L'Enfant's time. L'Enfant was a nominal Christian, like everyone else in France and England and the US.

OF COURSE modern evangelical English terms were not being used in L’Enfant’s time. That has nothing to do with what his aim was, which included the promulgation of a civic religion.

L'Enfant was a city planner who OF COURSE wanted to build something big and impressive on such a high hill. Pp has shown us no evidence that he was anything else.