ED to UVA or W&M

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your child is male, chances of admission to W&M are much better than UVA, whether you apply ED or RD.

Maybe? Yes in the past. But, no DEI means not giving preference to any protected group to balance the class. This should include males, as well as women, URMs, etc. the numbers rent out yet for 2025 and it won’t be fully know how no DEI plays out until the next application cycle. ED was already done when Trump signed his EOs.

And I support DEI in college admissions. I think a diverse class is important. But if the only group getting a preference is UMC white guys from NOVA? That would piss me off.

Males aren't a protected class. Indeed, all the wailing about DEI is about giving whites and especially white males more advantages, so it is crazy to think that a school that preferences men will be in any kind of trouble. At any rate, there is nothing to my knowledge that prevents colleges from seeking to balance their m/f ratio. It may piss you off, but males have had a better chance of admission to W&M for many years.

Does not piss me off. I like balanced classes. But realistically, sex is a protected class and no DEI is no DEI. There is definitely a lawsuit there, especially if women lose preference to in state Engineering CS due to DEI. I think both WM and Engineering should be able o balance if the applicant is qualified. But, you can’t pick and choose what parts of sex based DEI you want.

[Anonymous]

Don't know what to tell you. According to the common data set on W&M's website, 32% of first time female applicants were admitted and 37% of first time male applicants were admitted for fall 2024.

It's about 50% for both for transfer admits.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The schools are different enough that one probably "fits" your student better, and your student will seem like a better fit from the AO perspective. EDing to that one (as opposed to trying to figure out which of the two has "more likely" ED stats) will likely yield a better outcome for your student.

THIS. They are both great schools, but not interchangeable. My current WM (post-COVID) junior got in with a 4.1W and 35 ACT out of FCPS by going ED. She was an amazing fit for WM for multiple reasons, including best in her high school strength in foreign languages and history/government/econ. Very pointy and applied for IR and languages, which is WM’s strength (and a path she has followed at WM very successfully) . But GPA for white girl in NOVA was 25%. UVA never would have looked at her.

+1 WM seems more interested in finding the kids who really want to be there. UVA, at least in our naviance stats, has more of a hard cutoff on GPA.

THIS! “Who comes here belongs here”. WM moto and they live this.

I always thought the bigger meaning of that was to be welcome everyone who comes and treat them like they belong as much as anyone else.

Your take is better. People are weird about this!

It’s both. They also say “welcome home” a lot. I think it starts with choosing kids who have knowledge of the school or would be a good fit so they are more likely to feel at home. And extended to a campus ethos of treating everyone who attends like they belong. The first helps actualize the second.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your child is male, chances of admission to W&M are much better than UVA, whether you apply ED or RD.

Maybe? Yes in the past. But, no DEI means not giving preference to any protected group to balance the class. This should include males, as well as women, URMs, etc. the numbers rent out yet for 2025 and it won’t be fully know how no DEI plays out until the next application cycle. ED was already done when Trump signed his EOs.

And I support DEI in college admissions. I think a diverse class is important. But if the only group getting a preference is UMC white guys from NOVA? That would piss me off.

Males aren't a protected class. Indeed, all the wailing about DEI is about giving whites and especially white males more advantages, so it is crazy to think that a school that preferences men will be in any kind of trouble. At any rate, there is nothing to my knowledge that prevents colleges from seeking to balance their m/f ratio. It may piss you off, but males have had a better chance of admission to W&M for many years.

Ummm sex is a protected class. And in a zero sum game of college admissions, preferring men harms women, who are a protected class. Also, a lot of girl parents would be up in arms if women lost a VT Engineering advantage to “DEI,” but men kept one at WM. Do you really think that would be fair?

Right but do you really think this administration or Supreme Court has a problem with policies that favor men?

I personally am a supporter of policies that seek balance and fairness, so I'm fine with attempts to enroll more women at Tech engineering and more men at a school that women historically favor, like W&M. And I'm a woman who went to W&M.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your child is male, chances of admission to W&M are much better than UVA, whether you apply ED or RD.

Maybe? Yes in the past. But, no DEI means not giving preference to any protected group to balance the class. This should include males, as well as women, URMs, etc. the numbers rent out yet for 2025 and it won’t be fully know how no DEI plays out until the next application cycle. ED was already done when Trump signed his EOs.

And I support DEI in college admissions. I think a diverse class is important. But if the only group getting a preference is UMC white guys from NOVA? That would piss me off.

Males aren't a protected class. Indeed, all the wailing about DEI is about giving whites and especially white males more advantages, so it is crazy to think that a school that preferences men will be in any kind of trouble. At any rate, there is nothing to my knowledge that prevents colleges from seeking to balance their m/f ratio. It may piss you off, but males have had a better chance of admission to W&M for many years.

Ummm sex is a protected class. And in a zero sum game of college admissions, preferring men harms women, who are a protected class. Also, a lot of girl parents would be up in arms if women lost a VT Engineering advantage to “DEI,” but men kept one at WM. Do you really think that would be fair?

Right but do you really think this administration or Supreme Court has a problem with policies that favor men?

I personally am a supporter of policies that seek balance and fairness, so I'm fine with attempts to enroll more women at Tech engineering and more men at a school that women historically favor, like W&M. And I'm a woman who went to W&M.

The only way to know will be to look at Class of 2030 numbers. Until then we are all just guessing on whether gender preferences holds (2029 may signal, but half the class was admitted before the ED on this, and RD decision making had started, so 2029 isn’t a great barometer). May also depend on who wins the governors elation in the fall as to how gender preferences holds plays out at both WM and VT engineering. And I do think this should be one decision, not two. You should not be able to wipe female balancing in engineering but not male balancing at WM or vice versa— either both or neither. I prefer both, because I think there are systemic reasons for both to be unbalanced coming from the expectations of what different genders “should” be good at and there are more than enough highly quailed women to balance engineering and men to balance WM. But, my opinions on DEI don’t seem to the mainstream right now. So, we’ll see.

At any rate, the male preference at WM is marginal. I think I saw 33% vs 37% admit in state. That’s like 64 people affected in a freshman class of 1600.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your child is male, chances of admission to W&M are much better than UVA, whether you apply ED or RD.

how do you know? do the statistics show this? can you link to them?

The data needed to calculate are in the common data set: male vs female acceptances divided by applicants.

Which does not prove there was a DEI preference for men, no matter how much butthurt DCUMers think it does.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your child is male, chances of admission to W&M are much better than UVA, whether you apply ED or RD.

Maybe? Yes in the past. But, no DEI means not giving preference to any protected group to balance the class. This should include males, as well as women, URMs, etc. the numbers rent out yet for 2025 and it won’t be fully know how no DEI plays out until the next application cycle. ED was already done when Trump signed his EOs.

And I support DEI in college admissions. I think a diverse class is important. But if the only group getting a preference is UMC white guys from NOVA? That would piss me off.

Males aren't a protected class. Indeed, all the wailing about DEI is about giving whites and especially white males more advantages, so it is crazy to think that a school that preferences men will be in any kind of trouble. At any rate, there is nothing to my knowledge that prevents colleges from seeking to balance their m/f ratio. It may piss you off, but males have had a better chance of admission to W&M for many years.

Does not piss me off. I like balanced classes. But realistically, sex is a protected class and no DEI is no DEI. There is definitely a lawsuit there, especially if women lose preference to in state Engineering CS due to DEI. I think both WM and Engineering should be able o balance if the applicant is qualified. But, you can’t pick and choose what parts of sex based DEI you want.

Any such suit will have to establish that the male applicants were less qualified than the female.

It won’t be able to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your child is male, chances of admission to W&M are much better than UVA, whether you apply ED or RD.

how do you know? do the statistics show this? can you link to them?

The data needed to calculate are in the common data set: male vs female acceptances divided by applicants.

Which does not prove there was a DEI preference for men, no matter how much butthurt DCUMers think it does.

Ok, but I'm one of the people talking about this, and I have a DS at W&M, so not all of us are butthurt.

[Anonymous]

OP it all comes down to numbers. What is your DC’s GPA? 4.4+, did they take 4 years of the same language? In the top 3 to 4% of their class and counselor will check highest rigor box. If so you have a shot at UVA and it can be improved by going ED.

Is DC male? If so then a better shot at W&M, simply due to the math from an historical perspective. Many more female candidates at W&M so lower admit rate.

DEI folks can cry all they want schools seek some balance between genders and no one is going to win a court case against a TO school with holistic admissions process when the advantage is in the high single digits.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP it all comes down to numbers. What is your DC’s GPA? 4.4+, did they take 4 years of the same language? In the top 3 to 4% of their class and counselor will check highest rigor box. If so you have a shot at UVA and it can be improved by going ED.

Is DC male? If so then a better shot at W&M, simply due to the math from an historical perspective. Many more female candidates at W&M so lower admit rate.

DEI folks can cry all they want schools seek some balance between genders and no one is going to win a court case against a TO school with holistic admissions process when the advantage is in the high single digits.

Most schools have significantly more women applying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How is UVA that much different than W&M? They both have kids from similar places and similar SAT scores and grades. Some of the majors are different, but I don't see these schools as all that different.

I attended UVA and my sibling attended W& M. At least in the aughts, the gender balance was very different, which makes for a very different dating experience. Class sizes were very different at the introductory level. UVA has some great niche communities that give that small school feel.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How is UVA that much different than W&M? They both have kids from similar places and similar SAT scores and grades. Some of the majors are different, but I don't see these schools as all that different.

I attended UVA and my sibling attended W& M. At least in the aughts, the gender balance was very different, which makes for a very different dating experience. Class sizes were very different at the introductory level. UVA has some great niche communities that give that small school feel.

Gender balance has changed significantly. UVA is 43% male vs 41% W&M.