Woke dems rename Lee-Jackson Hwy in Fairfax County, Virginia

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As someone with a European parent whose native country endured a civil war in the 20th century (losing side were communists), I find it bizarre that there are ANY monuments, roads, schools, and other public facilities/structures in the US that bear the name of the losing side. There certainly aren't any in my parent's native country.

Good riddance to all the names of the traitors who wanted to rip the country apart--and their white supremacist, slavery-loving ideology.

Oh well this is easy. It’s because the war didn’t stay won. By 1876 it’s all over, and the Southern states are lost as far as the Constitution for the next several decades, depending on where you want to draw the line to bring them back.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As someone with a European parent whose native country endured a civil war in the 20th century (losing side were communists), I find it bizarre that there are ANY monuments, roads, schools, and other public facilities/structures in the US that bear the name of the losing side. There certainly aren't any in my parent's native country.

Good riddance to all the names of the traitors who wanted to rip the country apart--and their white supremacist, slavery-loving ideology.

Oh well this is easy. It’s because the war didn’t stay won. By 1876 it’s all over, and the Southern states are lost as far as the Constitution for the next several decades, depending on where you want to draw the line to bring them back.

Also want to add that the point of all the statues and highways was to enshrine Redemption more than the actual Confederates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As someone with a European parent whose native country endured a civil war in the 20th century (losing side were communists), I find it bizarre that there are ANY monuments, roads, schools, and other public facilities/structures in the US that bear the name of the losing side. There certainly aren't any in my parent's native country.

Good riddance to all the names of the traitors who wanted to rip the country apart--and their white supremacist, slavery-loving ideology.

Oh well this is easy. It’s because the war didn’t stay won. By 1876 it’s all over, and the Southern states are lost as far as the Constitution for the next several decades, depending on where you want to draw the line to bring them back.

It’s interesting because in the interest of preserving the union, the North was probably more forgiving and gracious than it should have been. In hindsight, all of the traitors should have been summarily executed, starting with Lee, who should have been castrated and had his testes shoved down his throat in a public square before being shot in the head. Jefferson Davis, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

But that's the thing, I don't think it was. This only became a big deal just recently starting in 2020. People here are screaming about "traitors," but at the time, the Union forgave the South and welcomed back those that fought against it. If folks who can do that who lost family and had their lives uprooted because of a war the South started, why can't we 150 years later, forgive our fellow countrymen who fought against us?

Honestly, I don't really care either way, but do feel we lose part of our history and culture and risk repeating the mistakes of our past.

That's because you don't know what you're talking about. That sounds rude, and I regret it, but I can't think of a more polite way to say it. The basic fact is that you don't know what you're talking about. You say it's nothing to you - so please stop talking and start listening to the people whom it actually is something to.

Yes, you are rude, and it tells me a lot about you that you can’t figure out how to be polite or don’t even want to bother. I come here with a different perspective that hasn’t been shared or considered and frankly neutral and open to dfferent perspectives. I really don’t care and don’t have a dog in this fight, and you come at me insulting me. All you have to offer this discussion is “stfu you’re ignorant.” You have no idea who I am or what I’ve learned or what I know. Having a different opinion doesn’t mean someone’s ignorant or uneducated. Are you interested in persuading people to your point of view or just want to win the internet? Oh wait. I forgot. This is DCUM.

Yes, you're right. Having a different opinion doesn't mean someone is ignorant or uneducated. However, sometimes an opinion just is, factually, ignorant. For example, the opinion that people only started caring in 2020 about not naming things after Confederates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

But that's the thing, I don't think it was. This only became a big deal just recently starting in 2020. People here are screaming about "traitors," but at the time, the Union forgave the South and welcomed back those that fought against it. If folks who can do that who lost family and had their lives uprooted because of a war the South started, why can't we 150 years later, forgive our fellow countrymen who fought against us?

Honestly, I don't really care either way, but do feel we lose part of our history and culture and risk repeating the mistakes of our past.

That's because you don't know what you're talking about. That sounds rude, and I regret it, but I can't think of a more polite way to say it. The basic fact is that you don't know what you're talking about. You say it's nothing to you - so please stop talking and start listening to the people whom it actually is something to.

Yes, you are rude, and it tells me a lot about you that you can’t figure out how to be polite or don’t even want to bother. I come here with a different perspective that hasn’t been shared or considered and frankly neutral and open to dfferent perspectives. I really don’t care and don’t have a dog in this fight, and you come at me insulting me. All you have to offer this discussion is “stfu you’re ignorant.” You have no idea who I am or what I’ve learned or what I know. Having a different opinion doesn’t mean someone’s ignorant or uneducated. Are you interested in persuading people to your point of view or just want to win the internet? Oh wait. I forgot. This is DCUM.

Yes, you're right. Having a different opinion doesn't mean someone is ignorant or uneducated. However, sometimes an opinion just is, factually, ignorant. For example, the opinion that people only started caring in 2020 about not naming things after Confederates.

Read what I wrote. We weren’t making a big deal out of the names of NoVA streets until recently. I fully acknowledge and agree that having the confederate flag flying above state houses wasn’t appropriate and am aware that this was a concern 30 years ago. But I think anyone can acknowledge, that people are recently making a much much bigger deal out of this in the last few years than before.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I remember growing up in Virginia as a white person and wondering why an actual paved highway was named after Civil War generals. It made no sense to me, even in the 70s.

Yep. I’m a black woman who grew up in VA off of Jefferson Davis Highway and thought it was f***** up then. Was I crying myself to sleep over it? No, but I knew it was there and I didn’t like it. Does changing the name solve racism? No, but it’s another step in the right direction.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

But that's the thing, I don't think it was. This only became a big deal just recently starting in 2020. People here are screaming about "traitors," but at the time, the Union forgave the South and welcomed back those that fought against it. If folks who can do that who lost family and had their lives uprooted because of a war the South started, why can't we 150 years later, forgive our fellow countrymen who fought against us?

Honestly, I don't really care either way, but do feel we lose part of our history and culture and risk repeating the mistakes of our past.

That's because you don't know what you're talking about. That sounds rude, and I regret it, but I can't think of a more polite way to say it. The basic fact is that you don't know what you're talking about. You say it's nothing to you - so please stop talking and start listening to the people whom it actually is something to.

Yes, you are rude, and it tells me a lot about you that you can’t figure out how to be polite or don’t even want to bother. I come here with a different perspective that hasn’t been shared or considered and frankly neutral and open to dfferent perspectives. I really don’t care and don’t have a dog in this fight, and you come at me insulting me. All you have to offer this discussion is “stfu you’re ignorant.” You have no idea who I am or what I’ve learned or what I know. Having a different opinion doesn’t mean someone’s ignorant or uneducated. Are you interested in persuading people to your point of view or just want to win the internet? Oh wait. I forgot. This is DCUM.

Assuming you have a black child, you DO have a dog in this fight. Learn your child’s history. Stand up for policies and decisions that treat them and their family’s legacy with respect and dignity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

But that's the thing, I don't think it was. This only became a big deal just recently starting in 2020. People here are screaming about "traitors," but at the time, the Union forgave the South and welcomed back those that fought against it. If folks who can do that who lost family and had their lives uprooted because of a war the South started, why can't we 150 years later, forgive our fellow countrymen who fought against us?

Honestly, I don't really care either way, but do feel we lose part of our history and culture and risk repeating the mistakes of our past.

That's because you don't know what you're talking about. That sounds rude, and I regret it, but I can't think of a more polite way to say it. The basic fact is that you don't know what you're talking about. You say it's nothing to you - so please stop talking and start listening to the people whom it actually is something to.

Yes, you are rude, and it tells me a lot about you that you can’t figure out how to be polite or don’t even want to bother. I come here with a different perspective that hasn’t been shared or considered and frankly neutral and open to dfferent perspectives. I really don’t care and don’t have a dog in this fight, and you come at me insulting me. All you have to offer this discussion is “stfu you’re ignorant.” You have no idea who I am or what I’ve learned or what I know. Having a different opinion doesn’t mean someone’s ignorant or uneducated. Are you interested in persuading people to your point of view or just want to win the internet? Oh wait. I forgot. This is DCUM.

Yes, you're right. Having a different opinion doesn't mean someone is ignorant or uneducated. However, sometimes an opinion just is, factually, ignorant. For example, the opinion that people only started caring in 2020 about not naming things after Confederates.

Read what I wrote. We weren’t making a big deal out of the names of NoVA streets until recently. I fully acknowledge and agree that having the confederate flag flying above state houses wasn’t appropriate and am aware that this was a concern 30 years ago. But I think anyone can acknowledge, that people are recently making a much much bigger deal out of this in the last few years than before.

The fact that people are making a bigger deal out of it now is a good thing. When you know better, you do better. There’s all kinds of things that white people recognize as racist now that they didn’t give any thought to 20, 30, 40 years ago, but that doesn’t mean it was ok.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:National Anthem should be next. Because where it says “ land of the free” it was actually just white men who were free, well I guess white women sort of where, but not really.

I would love that. Replace it with This Land is My Land. Or even God Bless America. Both superior songs musically and better lyrics. No more straining to sing that god awful last bit of the anthem.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do they have nothing better to do than to rename every single street and school, most of which residents don’t care enough about? So sad that northern virginia’s rich confederate history (Robert E Lee’s Army of Northern Virginia, Arlington Cemetery, etc.) history has attempted to be erased, as evident in changes to Lee Hwy, Jackson Lee Hwy, Jefferson Davis Hwy, many of Fairfax City and Alexandria City’s streets, Robert E Lee HS, JEB Stuart HS, Fairfax HS Rebels, Loudoun County Raiders in LoCo, and PWC’s Stonewall Jackson HS, just to name a few.

You'll get no sympathy on these boards Op, it's as if they learned nothing about the Civil War and what President Lincoln and the soldiers who lost their lives meant to the end of slavery. They have a belief that if we just rewrite every history book, and erase all monuments then hate will go away. But it won't, because hate will always live in these peoples hearts and minds, always.

I grew up in a northern state that wasn't part of the Union during the Civil War with no ancestors that lived in America at the time, so there was no evidence of the Civil War around me growing up nor have I ever had strong opinions about it other than I have always supported the Union and do not support slavery and the cause of the Confederacy. Perhaps I may have a unique take, but I kind of find all the remnants (streets, schools, bases, etc.) of the Confederacy to be some quaint anachronism that is part of the charm and character of Virginia that gives it culture and flavor. I recognize that many of these names were given decades ago and maybe not for good reasons, but don't feel that in keeping them, we are honoring anything. It's part of the culture and the history of this area and every time I drive on "Jefferson Davis Hwy" or see one of these names, I chuckle, remember that I'm in Virginia, and I am reminded of this area's past and its lessons. I find it odd that in the 150 years since the Civil War ended and long after the children and even grandchildren of anyone who lived during that era have died, it's become such a controversy and source of great pain to people. I just feel something unique is lost when we go around and erase unique reminders of our history even the bad parts. We can keep them but at the same time remember what they meant. As another example, I'm very anti-communist and fully aware of how evil Lenin and Stalin were, but feel the same way about tearing down their statues.

Do you feel the same way about all those Nazi flags and pictures of Hitler in Germany? All the streets that had their "quaint" Nazi names stripped off after 1945, do you think that's too bad? Please answer. Do you think statues of Adolf Hitler should have remained in Germany?

Also let me guess, you are white and so names and statues of Confederates who might have owned or abused your ancestors isn't really something you have to deal with. Must be nice to be able to "chuckle" at all that sordid history. Rape and whippings and babies taken from mothers and sold. Chuckle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

But that's the thing, I don't think it was. This only became a big deal just recently starting in 2020. People here are screaming about "traitors," but at the time, the Union forgave the South and welcomed back those that fought against it. If folks who can do that who lost family and had their lives uprooted because of a war the South started, why can't we 150 years later, forgive our fellow countrymen who fought against us?

Honestly, I don't really care either way, but do feel we lose part of our history and culture and risk repeating the mistakes of our past.

That's because you don't know what you're talking about. That sounds rude, and I regret it, but I can't think of a more polite way to say it. The basic fact is that you don't know what you're talking about. You say it's nothing to you - so please stop talking and start listening to the people whom it actually is something to.

Yes, you are rude, and it tells me a lot about you that you can’t figure out how to be polite or don’t even want to bother. I come here with a different perspective that hasn’t been shared or considered and frankly neutral and open to dfferent perspectives. I really don’t care and don’t have a dog in this fight, and you come at me insulting me. All you have to offer this discussion is “stfu you’re ignorant.” You have no idea who I am or what I’ve learned or what I know. Having a different opinion doesn’t mean someone’s ignorant or uneducated. Are you interested in persuading people to your point of view or just want to win the internet? Oh wait. I forgot. This is DCUM.

Are you the person who says they have a black husband? If so I think it’s pretty awful that your take is to forgive the south.
Why do you think the Union forgave the south? (Hint - it was about money.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do they have nothing better to do than to rename every single street and school, most of which residents don’t care enough about? So sad that northern virginia’s rich confederate history (Robert E Lee’s Army of Northern Virginia, Arlington Cemetery, etc.) history has attempted to be erased, as evident in changes to Lee Hwy, Jackson Lee Hwy, Jefferson Davis Hwy, many of Fairfax City and Alexandria City’s streets, Robert E Lee HS, JEB Stuart HS, Fairfax HS Rebels, Loudoun County Raiders in LoCo, and PWC’s Stonewall Jackson HS, just to name a few.

You'll get no sympathy on these boards Op, it's as if they learned nothing about the Civil War and what President Lincoln and the soldiers who lost their lives meant to the end of slavery. They have a belief that if we just rewrite every history book, and erase all monuments then hate will go away. But it won't, because hate will always live in these peoples hearts and minds, always.

I grew up in a northern state that wasn't part of the Union during the Civil War with no ancestors that lived in America at the time, so there was no evidence of the Civil War around me growing up nor have I ever had strong opinions about it other than I have always supported the Union and do not support slavery and the cause of the Confederacy. Perhaps I may have a unique take, but I kind of find all the remnants (streets, schools, bases, etc.) of the Confederacy to be some quaint anachronism that is part of the charm and character of Virginia that gives it culture and flavor. I recognize that many of these names were given decades ago and maybe not for good reasons, but don't feel that in keeping them, we are honoring anything. It's part of the culture and the history of this area and every time I drive on "Jefferson Davis Hwy" or see one of these names, I chuckle, remember that I'm in Virginia, and I am reminded of this area's past and its lessons. I find it odd that in the 150 years since the Civil War ended and long after the children and even grandchildren of anyone who lived during that era have died, it's become such a controversy and source of great pain to people. I just feel something unique is lost when we go around and erase unique reminders of our history even the bad parts. We can keep them but at the same time remember what they meant. As another example, I'm very anti-communist and fully aware of how evil Lenin and Stalin were, but feel the same way about tearing down their statues.

Do you feel the same way about all those Nazi flags and pictures of Hitler in Germany? All the streets that had their "quaint" Nazi names stripped off after 1945, do you think that's too bad? Please answer. Do you think statues of Adolf Hitler should have remained in Germany?

Also let me guess, you are white and so names and statues of Confederates who might have owned or abused your ancestors isn't really something you have to deal with. Must be nice to be able to "chuckle" at all that sordid history. Rape and whippings and babies taken from mothers and sold. Chuckle.

Good lord. calm down. I said I do not support slavery. No one is chuckling at it. I find it silly to have all these things named after confederate leaders but can also at the same time be against what the confederacy stood for and also think it provides local color/culture/flavor/whatever.

But you know when you are calling people Nazis and telling them they support slavery despite the fact that they don’t really care about the issue either way, you’ve lost and are just a bully and an extremist.

Stalin, Lenin, and Mao killed more people and committed genocide against several ethnic groups. And I still see value in keeping evidence of their existence and crimes around with the appropriate historical context provided on any monuments. Considering the cult of personality around Hitler, Holocaust denial, indoctrination that occurred, and recentness of Nazism, i support having no statues and the denazisification that occurred at the end of the war, etc.

But tell me how does removing evidence of something associated with something that happened 150 years ago actually help anyone?

[Anonymous]

I don’t understand why things like this aren’t voted on in the ballot box. (I’m no opposed to this change). We need more direct democracy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"Rich confederate history" is a funny way to spell slave-owning traitors.

Agreed. I wonder if Germans celebrate their “rich nazi history”…somehow I doubt it. And yes, slavery was just as bad as nazism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do they have nothing better to do than to rename every single street and school, most of which residents don’t care enough about? So sad that northern virginia’s rich confederate history (Robert E Lee’s Army of Northern Virginia, Arlington Cemetery, etc.) history has attempted to be erased, as evident in changes to Lee Hwy, Jackson Lee Hwy, Jefferson Davis Hwy, many of Fairfax City and Alexandria City’s streets, Robert E Lee HS, JEB Stuart HS, Fairfax HS Rebels, Loudoun County Raiders in LoCo, and PWC’s Stonewall Jackson HS, just to name a few.

You'll get no sympathy on these boards Op, it's as if they learned nothing about the Civil War and what President Lincoln and the soldiers who lost their lives meant to the end of slavery. They have a belief that if we just rewrite every history book, and erase all monuments then hate will go away. But it won't, because hate will always live in these peoples hearts and minds, always.

I grew up in a northern state that wasn't part of the Union during the Civil War with no ancestors that lived in America at the time, so there was no evidence of the Civil War around me growing up nor have I ever had strong opinions about it other than I have always supported the Union and do not support slavery and the cause of the Confederacy. Perhaps I may have a unique take, but I kind of find all the remnants (streets, schools, bases, etc.) of the Confederacy to be some quaint anachronism that is part of the charm and character of Virginia that gives it culture and flavor. I recognize that many of these names were given decades ago and maybe not for good reasons, but don't feel that in keeping them, we are honoring anything. It's part of the culture and the history of this area and every time I drive on "Jefferson Davis Hwy" or see one of these names, I chuckle, remember that I'm in Virginia, and I am reminded of this area's past and its lessons. I find it odd that in the 150 years since the Civil War ended and long after the children and even grandchildren of anyone who lived during that era have died, it's become such a controversy and source of great pain to people. I just feel something unique is lost when we go around and erase unique reminders of our history even the bad parts. We can keep them but at the same time remember what they meant. As another example, I'm very anti-communist and fully aware of how evil Lenin and Stalin were, but feel the same way about tearing down their statues.

Do you feel the same way about all those Nazi flags and pictures of Hitler in Germany? All the streets that had their "quaint" Nazi names stripped off after 1945, do you think that's too bad? Please answer. Do you think statues of Adolf Hitler should have remained in Germany?

Also let me guess, you are white and so names and statues of Confederates who might have owned or abused your ancestors isn't really something you have to deal with. Must be nice to be able to "chuckle" at all that sordid history. Rape and whippings and babies taken from mothers and sold. Chuckle.

Good lord. calm down. I said I do not support slavery. No one is chuckling at it. I find it silly to have all these things named after confederate leaders but can also at the same time be against what the confederacy stood for and also think it provides local color/culture/flavor/whatever.

But you know when you are calling people Nazis and telling them they support slavery despite the fact that they don’t really care about the issue either way, you’ve lost and are just a bully and an extremist.

Stalin, Lenin, and Mao killed more people and committed genocide against several ethnic groups. And I still see value in keeping evidence of their existence and crimes around with the appropriate historical context provided on any monuments. Considering the cult of personality around Hitler, Holocaust denial, indoctrination that occurred, and recentness of Nazism, i support having no statues and the denazisification that occurred at the end of the war, etc.

But tell me how does removing evidence of something associated with something that happened 150 years ago actually help anyone?

Where were you called a Nazi or accused of "supporting slavery"? Cite the specific lines. Oh sorry, you obviously can't because that didn't happen. You were asked a simple question that you reacted to in an extreme way. Why the vehement reaction? By the way, you did say you "chuckled" when you came across reminders of slavery in the names of streets.

It's fine to leave the evidence of slavery -- preserve the slave cabins. Preserve the plantations and turn them into teaching institutions (not places to get married). Put up historical markers in places where lynchings took place. We could learn a lot from how Germans dealt with their ugly past.

Statues erected in the 20th century to honor slavers are not evidence of slavery. They are evidence of backlash against progress and point to attempts to put black people in "their place" and terrorize them. Put the statues in a museum with context. Streets get renamed all the time and there is no need to preserve such names for the sake of history or local color and charm (really???) There are plenty of history books, museums, historical plaques, movies, and tv shows to learn about history. There is no need to honor perpetrators of evil by having their statues remain in places of honor. Take them to a museum.

p.s. you didn't answer the question of if you are white. Because no duh that you can't understand the pain Black people might feel when surrounded by constant reminders of the horrors of our history. You haven't lived that. Why not talk to your Black friends and family members about it and get their viewpoint?