Why are renters or people who live with their parents allowed to vote on matters of zoning &

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"Missing middle" is quite the branding, I must say.

So these cops, teachers, etc who can't afford a 1.5 million dollar single family home, are going to be able to afford 750k quadplexes?

Just call it what it is. We want to upzone for density. We think that is good.

But the idea that the middle class is somehow going to be able to afford to live where they work because of this is just not backed up by the numbers.

The "middle" in "missing middle" is not a reference to the middle class. It's a reference to the middle types of housing, which are generally absent in Arlington. Big apartment buildings on one end, attached and detached houses on the other end, nothing in the middle.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I think this post was a parody but the YIMBYs are taking it seriously? I guess searching for things to be offended by is easier/more entertaining than getting housing built.

Why would you think that? I have heard plenty of people express this opinion, at public meetings, in real life.

I go to more than my share of public meetings and have not heard this view espoused a single time. Show me a transcript from a government meeting in the Washington metropolitan area where someone advocates disenfranchising renters.

What government meetings do you go to that have published transcripts?

Video is fine too as long as you provide the time stamp.

What government meetings (for the public) do you go to that have posted videos with time stamps?

Montgomery County, MD does.
https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/COUNCIL/OnDemand/index.html

Yeah, that's for if you want to watch the Montgomery County Council. There are a lot of meetings in Montgomery County where members of the public speak that aren't Montgomery County Council meetings.

So you are claiming that there are “government meetings” that are not Council meetings where people are saying that renters should not be allowed the right to vote but those meetings are not recorded? Right…………

What I said: "I have heard plenty of people express this opinion, at public meetings, in real life."

What meetings are those?

Community association meetings, HOA meetings, public outreach meetings, meet-the-candidate meetings, etc. People have also said various jaw-dropping things on the record at formal public hearings, of course.

You attend both community association meetings and HOA meetings? Right…..

Not on the same evening, obviously.

Nice fantasy. If you have a community association then you don’t have a HOA. Also, neither a community association nor an HOA meeting would be a public meeting. Have any other stories?

This statement is factually incorrect.

Okay, where do you live that has both a community association and HOA?

https://mcatlas.org/viewer/
on the left, click the box for "civic and home owner associations"

However, you're also operating on faulty assumptions, including:

1. the only people who ever go to a community association or HOA meeting are residents of that community association or HOA
2. people never move

When you go to a lot of meetings attended by members of the public, you quickly learn that members of the public say a lot of things you wouldn't have thought anybody even believed, let alone would say in public.

Neither are open to the public. Thanks for wasting everyone’s time with your fantasies.

I'm starting to think you've never been to any community association or HOA meetings?

If showed up to my monthly community association meeting and you were not a member you’d be asked to leave. HOAs are private organizations, so again the meetings are not open to the public. You seem to have invented a story in your head that doesn’t match reality because, obviously, you don’t have any experience. Or you could just clear all of this up and name the HOA and community association meetings that you attend and where you claim to have heard these comments. Not sure why you think lying about mundane things is clever, but I’m not holding my breath.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think this post was a parody but the YIMBYs are taking it seriously? I guess searching for things to be offended by is easier/more entertaining than getting housing built.

Why would you think that? I have heard plenty of people express this opinion, at public meetings, in real life.

I go to more than my share of public meetings and have not heard this view espoused a single time. Show me a transcript from a government meeting in the Washington metropolitan area where someone advocates disenfranchising renters.

What government meetings do you go to that have published transcripts?

Video is fine too as long as you provide the time stamp.

What government meetings (for the public) do you go to that have posted videos with time stamps?

Montgomery County, MD does.
https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/COUNCIL/OnDemand/index.html

Yeah, that's for if you want to watch the Montgomery County Council. There are a lot of meetings in Montgomery County where members of the public speak that aren't Montgomery County Council meetings.

So you are claiming that there are “government meetings” that are not Council meetings where people are saying that renters should not be allowed the right to vote but those meetings are not recorded? Right…………

What I said: "I have heard plenty of people express this opinion, at public meetings, in real life."

What meetings are those?

Community association meetings, HOA meetings, public outreach meetings, meet-the-candidate meetings, etc. People have also said various jaw-dropping things on the record at formal public hearings, of course.

You attend both community association meetings and HOA meetings? Right…..

Not on the same evening, obviously.

Nice fantasy. If you have a community association then you don’t have a HOA. Also, neither a community association nor an HOA meeting would be a public meeting. Have any other stories?

This statement is factually incorrect.

Okay, where do you live that has both a community association and HOA?

https://mcatlas.org/viewer/
on the left, click the box for "civic and home owner associations"

However, you're also operating on faulty assumptions, including:

1. the only people who ever go to a community association or HOA meeting are residents of that community association or HOA
2. people never move

When you go to a lot of meetings attended by members of the public, you quickly learn that members of the public say a lot of things you wouldn't have thought anybody even believed, let alone would say in public.

Neither are open to the public. Thanks for wasting everyone’s time with your fantasies.

I'm starting to think you've never been to any community association or HOA meetings?

If showed up to my monthly community association meeting and you were not a member you’d be asked to leave. HOAs are private organizations, so again the meetings are not open to the public. You seem to have invented a story in your head that doesn’t match reality because, obviously, you don’t have any experience. Or you could just clear all of this up and name the HOA and community association meetings that you attend and where you claim to have heard these comments. Not sure why you think lying about mundane things is clever, but I’m not holding my breath.

Do you belong to one of those community associations that don't allow renters to be members?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think this post was a parody but the YIMBYs are taking it seriously? I guess searching for things to be offended by is easier/more entertaining than getting housing built.

Why would you think that? I have heard plenty of people express this opinion, at public meetings, in real life.

I go to more than my share of public meetings and have not heard this view espoused a single time. Show me a transcript from a government meeting in the Washington metropolitan area where someone advocates disenfranchising renters.

What government meetings do you go to that have published transcripts?

Video is fine too as long as you provide the time stamp.

What government meetings (for the public) do you go to that have posted videos with time stamps?

Montgomery County, MD does.
https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/COUNCIL/OnDemand/index.html

Yeah, that's for if you want to watch the Montgomery County Council. There are a lot of meetings in Montgomery County where members of the public speak that aren't Montgomery County Council meetings.

So you are claiming that there are “government meetings” that are not Council meetings where people are saying that renters should not be allowed the right to vote but those meetings are not recorded? Right…………

What I said: "I have heard plenty of people express this opinion, at public meetings, in real life."

What meetings are those?

Community association meetings, HOA meetings, public outreach meetings, meet-the-candidate meetings, etc. People have also said various jaw-dropping things on the record at formal public hearings, of course.

You attend both community association meetings and HOA meetings? Right…..

Not on the same evening, obviously.

Nice fantasy. If you have a community association then you don’t have a HOA. Also, neither a community association nor an HOA meeting would be a public meeting. Have any other stories?

This statement is factually incorrect.

Okay, where do you live that has both a community association and HOA?

https://mcatlas.org/viewer/
on the left, click the box for "civic and home owner associations"

However, you're also operating on faulty assumptions, including:

1. the only people who ever go to a community association or HOA meeting are residents of that community association or HOA
2. people never move

When you go to a lot of meetings attended by members of the public, you quickly learn that members of the public say a lot of things you wouldn't have thought anybody even believed, let alone would say in public.

Neither are open to the public. Thanks for wasting everyone’s time with your fantasies.

I'm starting to think you've never been to any community association or HOA meetings?

If showed up to my monthly community association meeting and you were not a member you’d be asked to leave. HOAs are private organizations, so again the meetings are not open to the public. You seem to have invented a story in your head that doesn’t match reality because, obviously, you don’t have any experience. Or you could just clear all of this up and name the HOA and community association meetings that you attend and where you claim to have heard these comments. Not sure why you think lying about mundane things is clever, but I’m not holding my breath.

Do you belong to one of those community associations that don't allow renters to be members?

Fabulist refuses to answer the question. Not surprised.

[Anonymous]

Because zoning isn't just meant for homeowners, doofus.

[Anonymous]

I attend ALL public HOA and community association meetings where people secretly plan to end voting rights for renters. Hurr durrr.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think this post was a parody but the YIMBYs are taking it seriously? I guess searching for things to be offended by is easier/more entertaining than getting housing built.

Why would you think that? I have heard plenty of people express this opinion, at public meetings, in real life.

I go to more than my share of public meetings and have not heard this view espoused a single time. Show me a transcript from a government meeting in the Washington metropolitan area where someone advocates disenfranchising renters.

What government meetings do you go to that have published transcripts?

Video is fine too as long as you provide the time stamp.

What government meetings (for the public) do you go to that have posted videos with time stamps?

Montgomery County, MD does.
https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/COUNCIL/OnDemand/index.html

Yeah, that's for if you want to watch the Montgomery County Council. There are a lot of meetings in Montgomery County where members of the public speak that aren't Montgomery County Council meetings.

So you are claiming that there are “government meetings” that are not Council meetings where people are saying that renters should not be allowed the right to vote but those meetings are not recorded? Right…………

What I said: "I have heard plenty of people express this opinion, at public meetings, in real life."

What meetings are those?

Community association meetings, HOA meetings, public outreach meetings, meet-the-candidate meetings, etc. People have also said various jaw-dropping things on the record at formal public hearings, of course.

You attend both community association meetings and HOA meetings? Right…..

Not on the same evening, obviously.

Nice fantasy. If you have a community association then you don’t have a HOA. Also, neither a community association nor an HOA meeting would be a public meeting. Have any other stories?

This statement is factually incorrect.

Okay, where do you live that has both a community association and HOA?

https://mcatlas.org/viewer/
on the left, click the box for "civic and home owner associations"

However, you're also operating on faulty assumptions, including:

1. the only people who ever go to a community association or HOA meeting are residents of that community association or HOA
2. people never move

When you go to a lot of meetings attended by members of the public, you quickly learn that members of the public say a lot of things you wouldn't have thought anybody even believed, let alone would say in public.

Neither are open to the public. Thanks for wasting everyone’s time with your fantasies.

I'm starting to think you've never been to any community association or HOA meetings?

If showed up to my monthly community association meeting and you were not a member you’d be asked to leave. HOAs are private organizations, so again the meetings are not open to the public. You seem to have invented a story in your head that doesn’t match reality because, obviously, you don’t have any experience. Or you could just clear all of this up and name the HOA and community association meetings that you attend and where you claim to have heard these comments. Not sure why you think lying about mundane things is clever, but I’m not holding my breath.

Do you belong to one of those community associations that don't allow renters to be members?

Fabulist refuses to answer the question. Not surprised.

Probably did not expect to get called out because in the yimby echo chamber the real world is far away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"Missing middle" is quite the branding, I must say.

So these cops, teachers, etc who can't afford a 1.5 million dollar single family home, are going to be able to afford 750k quadplexes?

Just call it what it is. We want to upzone for density. We think that is good.

But the idea that the middle class is somehow going to be able to afford to live where they work because of this is just not backed up by the numbers.

YIMBYs use poor people and the middle class as props in their stories so they can vilify anyone who they view as an opponent. Developers don’t build for the middle class, let alone poor people. Upzone all you want but let’s also make developers use that density so housing becomes more affordable. You never hear this last part from YIMBYs because it’s an astroturf movement supported by developers who profit from shortage and want to get rid of all regulation so they can make even more money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would more annoyed at the 25yr old kids who live in their parent's basement voting versus renters.

Can't afford houses because greatest generation and boomers put in place single family only zoning ordinances which encourages development of primarily higher tier properties leaving them completely priced out of markets.

The "starter home" is a thing of the past.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would more annoyed at the 25yr old kids who live in their parent's basement voting versus renters.

Can't afford houses because greatest generation and boomers put in place single family only zoning ordinances which encourages development of primarily higher tier properties leaving them completely priced out of markets.

The "starter home" is a thing of the past.

Dunno, I bought a starter home in a crappy condo in Annandale in 2015 with savings from living with roommates. Three years later, I got married, and I sold the condo with a good paint job and netted $43,000 more than I paid for it. We used that plus savings from working two jobs each to buy a crappy townhouse in South Arlington. We are preparing to put that townhouse on the market and should net about $80,000 from it. We are using that equity plus saving my net salary for a year and money from side jobs for the down payment on dated single family house in Arlington. First baby due in April and we will use our maternity and paternity leaves to work on the house. Not sure if the condo is the starter home, the townhouse, or the single family house. What do you think?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Missing middle" is quite the branding, I must say.

So these cops, teachers, etc who can't afford a 1.5 million dollar single family home, are going to be able to afford 750k quadplexes?

Just call it what it is. We want to upzone for density. We think that is good.

But the idea that the middle class is somehow going to be able to afford to live where they work because of this is just not backed up by the numbers.

YIMBYs use poor people and the middle class as props in their stories so they can vilify anyone who they view as an opponent. Developers don’t build for the middle class, let alone poor people. Upzone all you want but let’s also make developers use that density so housing becomes more affordable. You never hear this last part from YIMBYs because it’s an astroturf movement supported by developers who profit from shortage and want to get rid of all regulation so they can make even more money.

I was so disappointed when I went to a VOICE (Virginians Organized for Interfaith Community Engagement) and saw how the YIMBYs and two members of the Arlington County Board used both lower income people and POC to imply that Missing Middle Housing would create "affordable" housing rather than housing for higher income people. One woman who organized a tenant's group was in tears explaining how she lived in a run down one bedroom apartment with her children and the ACB member "promised' that Missing Middle Housing would make her life better. I was there with my church group, and we left disgusted with the process.

While I support Missing Middle Housing, I think Arlington County has made a mess of it and used people to make it more appealing to the liberals of Arlington. A law firm partner would probably be happy to know that his kid's nanny might have a chance for a nicer home in Arlington rather than his law firm associate who can buy one of the townhouses at $1.3 M.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would more annoyed at the 25yr old kids who live in their parent's basement voting versus renters.

Can't afford houses because greatest generation and boomers put in place single family only zoning ordinances which encourages development of primarily higher tier properties leaving them completely priced out of markets.

The "starter home" is a thing of the past.

Nah, it's because the boomers raised spoiled brats who will not sacrifice or work hard to buy the houses they sacrificed and worked hard to buy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would more annoyed at the 25yr old kids who live in their parent's basement voting versus renters.

Can't afford houses because greatest generation and boomers put in place single family only zoning ordinances which encourages development of primarily higher tier properties leaving them completely priced out of markets.

The "starter home" is a thing of the past.

Nah, it's because the boomers raised spoiled brats who will not sacrifice or work hard to buy the houses they sacrificed and worked hard to buy.

I don't know, it doesn't seem to me like "The REAL housing problem is that people in their 30s and 40s are lazy and entitled" is a winning political message. But you do you.

[Anonymous]

What a dumb thread. Of course people who rent are impacted by zoning and property taxes, plus anyone who doesn't own property could own property in the future.

Also, you know, fundamentals of democracy and all that. Gatekeeping like this is so obnoxious. "Only people like me who share my exact priorities and preferences should vote." Get over yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:property taxes? This is absurd.

I agree. Only people with property should vote.