Moco and crime

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:PG is tough on crime, unlike MoCo. We don't have woke officials on our County Board.

https://wtop.com/prince-georges-county/2022/09/prince-georges-co-to-enforce-teen-curfew-to-combat-crime-these-kids-dont-just-need-a-hug/

Prince George’s County Executive Angela Alsobrooks says police in the Maryland county will begin stepping up enforcement of an already on-the-books curfew to keep teens off the streets at night, amid a rise in carjackings and other violent crime.

Wow, this might be the first time ever, in way too many years on DCUM, that somebody used Prince George's County as a positive example (as opposed to an example of their own racism). I'm going to check out the window for pigs flying.

Yup. I do think Black politicians - who understand the very real effects of crime in PG - know they need to get tough, while ensuring their police aren't doing it in a racially biased way.

This is exactly right. And what's wrecking Montgomery County, at least, is a bunch of white progressives who think they are being allies, but who are in fact bringing more pain to marginalized communities in the form of increased crime. I invite Elrich, the entire Council, and all their little activist buddies to spend a week living in the Enclave. And see how they like it.

So let's see. The Enclave is in state district 20 and county council district 5. And whom did the voters who actually live in state district 20 and county council district 5 (which you probably don't) elect as their representatives, just last month? 4 non-white progressives and 1 white progressive. How about that.

DP. And do any of these politicians live in the Enclave? Have they even visited?

I grimace when I think of this council addressing crime. I don’t see how they are remotely qualified to do so. Have they attended the MCPD Citizen’s Academy? Have they even done a ride-along?

It’s pretty easy to address crime from afar, when it doesn’t touch the street you live on. I’ve been the victim of a crime in Montgomery County. I want a present and supported police force, and I worry that’s not what we’ll get with this council. The current plan is to reduce police presence to reduce crime. How does that even remotely make sense?

I'm guessing the voters who live in the Enclave have a better understanding of living in the Enclave, and of their own interests and priorities, than you do.

Perhaps, but I am pretty confident saying I know more about our police department than they do. At least I’ve done several ride-alongs. Let’s not pretend for a second that the previous council improved safety in Montgomery County. You don’t have to look any further than the crime reports to see that. They also decimated MCPD, which used to be the most sought-out department by recruits. Now they can’t even fill a class because recruits can go to neighboring counties for better pay and more support.

And listening to constituents? No, they didn’t do that, either. The council and exec listened to a task force of 3 students before removing SROs. 3, out of 160,000. Meanwhile, PGCPS actually sent out a community-wide survey. 80% of respondents said to keep them. I doubt there will be a ton of listening going on by the current council, but I would love to see them prove me wrong.

So, are they prepared to handle crime? Not remotely. I’ll change my mind when I see one of them learn a little bit about policing instead of issuing self-serving statements.

That's some chutzpah there. You've done several ride-alongs, so you know more about what's good for east county voters than the east county voters themselves and the people they just elected/re-elected. Wow.

Um… why did you assume I don’t live in east county?

I stand by my statements. I’ve watched the council for the past few years because I am very concerned about increasing crime. All I’ve seen are things that make me worry. The Reimagining Public Safety Task force? Recommendations to decrease police presence by 50% in Silver Spring and Wheaton? Stopping enforcement of quality of life crimes? A suggestion to remove guns from the officers? How does any of this come across as logical and reasoned?

Look at the incidents in MCPS. It was Elrich and the past council who removed SROs against the desire of the school system. How do they know what’s better for students and staff than the educators and administrators?

I live in reality. I want to feel safe in my community. So you call it “churzpah.” I call it holding these representatives accountable.

Ok, so you live in the east county. Well, the majority of your voting neighbors disagree with you. That's democracy.

You have yet to comment on crime itself: the increasing statistics, the task force recommendations, the lack of research before removing SROs, etc.

Is it just “my candidate won,” or is it “let’s get to work”? I’m not seeing that you’re actually concerned about crime. I guess it hasn’t affected you as it has me.

No. It's that east county voters JUST voted to elect progressives (of whom 4 of 5 are non-white, and 4 of 5 were actually RE-elected) to represent them in the Maryland General Assembly and the County Council, and your take on this is "a bunch of white progressives who think they are being allies, but who are in fact bringing more pain to marginalized communities in the form of increased crime". Terrible take.

I am not that poster. I have made no statement about “a bunch of white progressives.” I have ONLY provided true facts about crime and the previous council’s affect on the county.

Once again: will you only comment on the election, or do you have a comment about crime?

You haven't provided any "true facts" about crime. You have only provided your personal opinions.

Here you go! Read away:
https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/pol/Resources/Files/Annual-Reports/CrimeandSafety/2021%20MCPD%20Annual%20Report%20on%20Crime%20and%20Safety.pdf

One note: when you see that “crimes against society” are down 37%, know that is because police are now discouraged from stopping people from using drugs or drinking in public, urinating / defecating, etc. It’s still happening, just isn’t reported.

Therefore, my opinions are grounded in fact. As for other facts I have posted, would you care to comment on the way SROs were removed without community comment? That’s another fact.

"SROs were removed without community comment" is the opposite of fact.

Sure, if you consider a panel of 3 students sufficient for a population of 160,000 students and no community-wide survey. Meanwhile, Prince George’s handled it this way:
https://go.boarddocs.com/mabe/pgcps/Board.nsf/files/BXNW286FF2A9/$file/SRO%20Presentation%20v1%20PPT%20(1).pdf

There was plenty of community comment. It's just that most of the comments were from community members with opinions you disagree with.

Where were these advertised? Was everybody given ample opportunity to comment? If the council and exec wanted to do this properly, they would have had a community-wide survey. Does it shock you that PGCPS’s survey shows 80% support for SROs? Is it so unreasonable to assume that a similar survey conducted here would show the same? Until this is done for MCPS, no… this was NOT a well-handled, community-informed decision. (Does it matter that the principals unanimously wanted to keep them? No. They were ignored.)

Can you really support a 3-student panel? You’re okay with that?

You're complaining about process because you don't like the outcome.

NP
Do you honestly and truly think that was a fair process?

What was unfair about it?

The fact they ignored dissenting voices, which happened to be the very people with knowledge and expertise in this subject?

I’m in awe of the fact you’re comfortable with 3 voices representing 160,000, and that you think that was a fair process. Where were the surveys? The widely-advertised panel discussions? Wide-net calls for community input?

I expect more. Elected officials MUST rely on those who have subject expertise, which did not happen. You’re okay with that, perhaps because it doesn’t affect you. It does affect me and I find it disgusting.

They didn't ignore dissenting voices. The opinions of the principals were no secret. What they did was make a decision that was different from what the principals wanted. That's what we elect them to do. And it happens all the time, generally, in government. And it SHOULD happen all the time. Otherwise we'd have the "unelected bureaucrats" making the decisions.

So we have uninformed, myopic elected officials making decisions instead. Got it.

No, we have elected officials making decisions you disagree with. Again, this is democracy.

This isn’t a difficult concept. I want my elected officials to make EDUCATED and INFORMED decisions. You have yet to comment on their focus group of 3. Let’s take a close look at the “research” that went into this decision:
two community focus groups that had a total of 7 participants
two school administrator focus groups that had a total of 8 participants
One focus group containing 2 SROs
One student/family group containing 3 participants

This is, again, for a school population of 160,000 and a community population over 1,000,000.

I do disagree with their decision, but what I disagree with MORE is the ridiculous farce of a process. This is not good governance, and there is absolutely nothing you can say to refute that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’ll be (not) awesome when the purple line brings all of this crime right to downtown Bethesda.

Love how you take the mythical racist story of the Georgetown metro and update it for today.

The idea that Bethesda will suddenly become more accessible to crime because of an electric trolley makes me smile.

Tysons Corner has become more accessible to crime. No doubt about it

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:PG is tough on crime, unlike MoCo. We don't have woke officials on our County Board.

https://wtop.com/prince-georges-county/2022/09/prince-georges-co-to-enforce-teen-curfew-to-combat-crime-these-kids-dont-just-need-a-hug/

Prince George’s County Executive Angela Alsobrooks says police in the Maryland county will begin stepping up enforcement of an already on-the-books curfew to keep teens off the streets at night, amid a rise in carjackings and other violent crime.

Wow, this might be the first time ever, in way too many years on DCUM, that somebody used Prince George's County as a positive example (as opposed to an example of their own racism). I'm going to check out the window for pigs flying.

Yup. I do think Black politicians - who understand the very real effects of crime in PG - know they need to get tough, while ensuring their police aren't doing it in a racially biased way.

This is exactly right. And what's wrecking Montgomery County, at least, is a bunch of white progressives who think they are being allies, but who are in fact bringing more pain to marginalized communities in the form of increased crime. I invite Elrich, the entire Council, and all their little activist buddies to spend a week living in the Enclave. And see how they like it.

So let's see. The Enclave is in state district 20 and county council district 5. And whom did the voters who actually live in state district 20 and county council district 5 (which you probably don't) elect as their representatives, just last month? 4 non-white progressives and 1 white progressive. How about that.

DP. And do any of these politicians live in the Enclave? Have they even visited?

I grimace when I think of this council addressing crime. I don’t see how they are remotely qualified to do so. Have they attended the MCPD Citizen’s Academy? Have they even done a ride-along?

It’s pretty easy to address crime from afar, when it doesn’t touch the street you live on. I’ve been the victim of a crime in Montgomery County. I want a present and supported police force, and I worry that’s not what we’ll get with this council. The current plan is to reduce police presence to reduce crime. How does that even remotely make sense?

I'm guessing the voters who live in the Enclave have a better understanding of living in the Enclave, and of their own interests and priorities, than you do.

Perhaps, but I am pretty confident saying I know more about our police department than they do. At least I’ve done several ride-alongs. Let’s not pretend for a second that the previous council improved safety in Montgomery County. You don’t have to look any further than the crime reports to see that. They also decimated MCPD, which used to be the most sought-out department by recruits. Now they can’t even fill a class because recruits can go to neighboring counties for better pay and more support.

And listening to constituents? No, they didn’t do that, either. The council and exec listened to a task force of 3 students before removing SROs. 3, out of 160,000. Meanwhile, PGCPS actually sent out a community-wide survey. 80% of respondents said to keep them. I doubt there will be a ton of listening going on by the current council, but I would love to see them prove me wrong.

So, are they prepared to handle crime? Not remotely. I’ll change my mind when I see one of them learn a little bit about policing instead of issuing self-serving statements.

That's some chutzpah there. You've done several ride-alongs, so you know more about what's good for east county voters than the east county voters themselves and the people they just elected/re-elected. Wow.

Um… why did you assume I don’t live in east county?

I stand by my statements. I’ve watched the council for the past few years because I am very concerned about increasing crime. All I’ve seen are things that make me worry. The Reimagining Public Safety Task force? Recommendations to decrease police presence by 50% in Silver Spring and Wheaton? Stopping enforcement of quality of life crimes? A suggestion to remove guns from the officers? How does any of this come across as logical and reasoned?

Look at the incidents in MCPS. It was Elrich and the past council who removed SROs against the desire of the school system. How do they know what’s better for students and staff than the educators and administrators?

I live in reality. I want to feel safe in my community. So you call it “churzpah.” I call it holding these representatives accountable.

Ok, so you live in the east county. Well, the majority of your voting neighbors disagree with you. That's democracy.

You have yet to comment on crime itself: the increasing statistics, the task force recommendations, the lack of research before removing SROs, etc.

Is it just “my candidate won,” or is it “let’s get to work”? I’m not seeing that you’re actually concerned about crime. I guess it hasn’t affected you as it has me.

No. It's that east county voters JUST voted to elect progressives (of whom 4 of 5 are non-white, and 4 of 5 were actually RE-elected) to represent them in the Maryland General Assembly and the County Council, and your take on this is "a bunch of white progressives who think they are being allies, but who are in fact bringing more pain to marginalized communities in the form of increased crime". Terrible take.

I am not that poster. I have made no statement about “a bunch of white progressives.” I have ONLY provided true facts about crime and the previous council’s affect on the county.

Once again: will you only comment on the election, or do you have a comment about crime?

You haven't provided any "true facts" about crime. You have only provided your personal opinions.

Here you go! Read away:
https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/pol/Resources/Files/Annual-Reports/CrimeandSafety/2021%20MCPD%20Annual%20Report%20on%20Crime%20and%20Safety.pdf

One note: when you see that “crimes against society” are down 37%, know that is because police are now discouraged from stopping people from using drugs or drinking in public, urinating / defecating, etc. It’s still happening, just isn’t reported.

Therefore, my opinions are grounded in fact. As for other facts I have posted, would you care to comment on the way SROs were removed without community comment? That’s another fact.

"SROs were removed without community comment" is the opposite of fact.

Sure, if you consider a panel of 3 students sufficient for a population of 160,000 students and no community-wide survey. Meanwhile, Prince George’s handled it this way:
https://go.boarddocs.com/mabe/pgcps/Board.nsf/files/BXNW286FF2A9/$file/SRO%20Presentation%20v1%20PPT%20(1).pdf

There was plenty of community comment. It's just that most of the comments were from community members with opinions you disagree with.

Where were these advertised? Was everybody given ample opportunity to comment? If the council and exec wanted to do this properly, they would have had a community-wide survey. Does it shock you that PGCPS’s survey shows 80% support for SROs? Is it so unreasonable to assume that a similar survey conducted here would show the same? Until this is done for MCPS, no… this was NOT a well-handled, community-informed decision. (Does it matter that the principals unanimously wanted to keep them? No. They were ignored.)

Can you really support a 3-student panel? You’re okay with that?

You're complaining about process because you don't like the outcome.

NP
Do you honestly and truly think that was a fair process?

What was unfair about it?

The fact they ignored dissenting voices, which happened to be the very people with knowledge and expertise in this subject?

I’m in awe of the fact you’re comfortable with 3 voices representing 160,000, and that you think that was a fair process. Where were the surveys? The widely-advertised panel discussions? Wide-net calls for community input?

I expect more. Elected officials MUST rely on those who have subject expertise, which did not happen. You’re okay with that, perhaps because it doesn’t affect you. It does affect me and I find it disgusting.

They didn't ignore dissenting voices. The opinions of the principals were no secret. What they did was make a decision that was different from what the principals wanted. That's what we elect them to do. And it happens all the time, generally, in government. And it SHOULD happen all the time. Otherwise we'd have the "unelected bureaucrats" making the decisions.

This is how you can tell PP is fundamentally being dishonest. If the principals were "ignored,' there's no amount of process that would satisfy them. The principals were asked and they made the other choice, which is what SHOULD happen if the elected officials disagree with a stakeholder's opinion. I can vote for someone other than Mark Elrich, but we can't vote out the principal of a high school.

I'm actually a supporter of SROs, and I voted for Sullivan, but I'm not going to lie about what happened or throw democracy out the window to get SROs back in schools. It's not worth that.

Asking elected officials to do a thorough investigation of a topic before voting is throwing democracy out the window? That’s all I’ve asked. Why didn’t they thoroughly investigate the desires of the community before making this decision, especially in light of the school administration’s 100% support of the program. You don’t find that odd?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

This isn’t a difficult concept. I want my elected officials to make EDUCATED and INFORMED decisions. You have yet to comment on their focus group of 3. Let’s take a close look at the “research” that went into this decision:
two community focus groups that had a total of 7 participants
two school administrator focus groups that had a total of 8 participants
One focus group containing 2 SROs
One student/family group containing 3 participants

This is, again, for a school population of 160,000 and a community population over 1,000,000.

I do disagree with their decision, but what I disagree with MORE is the ridiculous farce of a process. This is not good governance, and there is absolutely nothing you can say to refute that.

This is how our government works: decisions are made by elected officials, who are elected by getting the most votes in the election.
This is now how our government works, except under certain extremely limited circumstances (for example, ballot measures): decisions are made by public referendum.

However, if you want the decision about SROs to be made by public referendum, then you should work to get a ballot measure about SROs on the ballot at the next election.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PG is tough on crime, unlike MoCo. We don't have woke officials on our County Board.

https://wtop.com/prince-georges-county/2022/09/prince-georges-co-to-enforce-teen-curfew-to-combat-crime-these-kids-dont-just-need-a-hug/

Prince George’s County Executive Angela Alsobrooks says police in the Maryland county will begin stepping up enforcement of an already on-the-books curfew to keep teens off the streets at night, amid a rise in carjackings and other violent crime.

Wow, this might be the first time ever, in way too many years on DCUM, that somebody used Prince George's County as a positive example (as opposed to an example of their own racism). I'm going to check out the window for pigs flying.

Yup. I do think Black politicians - who understand the very real effects of crime in PG - know they need to get tough, while ensuring their police aren't doing it in a racially biased way.

This is exactly right. And what's wrecking Montgomery County, at least, is a bunch of white progressives who think they are being allies, but who are in fact bringing more pain to marginalized communities in the form of increased crime. I invite Elrich, the entire Council, and all their little activist buddies to spend a week living in the Enclave. And see how they like it.

So let's see. The Enclave is in state district 20 and county council district 5. And whom did the voters who actually live in state district 20 and county council district 5 (which you probably don't) elect as their representatives, just last month? 4 non-white progressives and 1 white progressive. How about that.

DP. And do any of these politicians live in the Enclave? Have they even visited?

I grimace when I think of this council addressing crime. I don’t see how they are remotely qualified to do so. Have they attended the MCPD Citizen’s Academy? Have they even done a ride-along?

It’s pretty easy to address crime from afar, when it doesn’t touch the street you live on. I’ve been the victim of a crime in Montgomery County. I want a present and supported police force, and I worry that’s not what we’ll get with this council. The current plan is to reduce police presence to reduce crime. How does that even remotely make sense?

I'm guessing the voters who live in the Enclave have a better understanding of living in the Enclave, and of their own interests and priorities, than you do.

Perhaps, but I am pretty confident saying I know more about our police department than they do. At least I’ve done several ride-alongs. Let’s not pretend for a second that the previous council improved safety in Montgomery County. You don’t have to look any further than the crime reports to see that. They also decimated MCPD, which used to be the most sought-out department by recruits. Now they can’t even fill a class because recruits can go to neighboring counties for better pay and more support.

And listening to constituents? No, they didn’t do that, either. The council and exec listened to a task force of 3 students before removing SROs. 3, out of 160,000. Meanwhile, PGCPS actually sent out a community-wide survey. 80% of respondents said to keep them. I doubt there will be a ton of listening going on by the current council, but I would love to see them prove me wrong.

So, are they prepared to handle crime? Not remotely. I’ll change my mind when I see one of them learn a little bit about policing instead of issuing self-serving statements.

That's some chutzpah there. You've done several ride-alongs, so you know more about what's good for east county voters than the east county voters themselves and the people they just elected/re-elected. Wow.

Um… why did you assume I don’t live in east county?

I stand by my statements. I’ve watched the council for the past few years because I am very concerned about increasing crime. All I’ve seen are things that make me worry. The Reimagining Public Safety Task force? Recommendations to decrease police presence by 50% in Silver Spring and Wheaton? Stopping enforcement of quality of life crimes? A suggestion to remove guns from the officers? How does any of this come across as logical and reasoned?

Look at the incidents in MCPS. It was Elrich and the past council who removed SROs against the desire of the school system. How do they know what’s better for students and staff than the educators and administrators?

I live in reality. I want to feel safe in my community. So you call it “churzpah.” I call it holding these representatives accountable.

Ok, so you live in the east county. Well, the majority of your voting neighbors disagree with you. That's democracy.

You have yet to comment on crime itself: the increasing statistics, the task force recommendations, the lack of research before removing SROs, etc.

Is it just “my candidate won,” or is it “let’s get to work”? I’m not seeing that you’re actually concerned about crime. I guess it hasn’t affected you as it has me.

No. It's that east county voters JUST voted to elect progressives (of whom 4 of 5 are non-white, and 4 of 5 were actually RE-elected) to represent them in the Maryland General Assembly and the County Council, and your take on this is "a bunch of white progressives who think they are being allies, but who are in fact bringing more pain to marginalized communities in the form of increased crime". Terrible take.

I am not that poster. I have made no statement about “a bunch of white progressives.” I have ONLY provided true facts about crime and the previous council’s affect on the county.

Once again: will you only comment on the election, or do you have a comment about crime?

You haven't provided any "true facts" about crime. You have only provided your personal opinions.

Here you go! Read away:
https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/pol/Resources/Files/Annual-Reports/CrimeandSafety/2021%20MCPD%20Annual%20Report%20on%20Crime%20and%20Safety.pdf

One note: when you see that “crimes against society” are down 37%, know that is because police are now discouraged from stopping people from using drugs or drinking in public, urinating / defecating, etc. It’s still happening, just isn’t reported.

Therefore, my opinions are grounded in fact. As for other facts I have posted, would you care to comment on the way SROs were removed without community comment? That’s another fact.

"SROs were removed without community comment" is the opposite of fact.

Sure, if you consider a panel of 3 students sufficient for a population of 160,000 students and no community-wide survey. Meanwhile, Prince George’s handled it this way:
https://go.boarddocs.com/mabe/pgcps/Board.nsf/files/BXNW286FF2A9/$file/SRO%20Presentation%20v1%20PPT%20(1).pdf

There was plenty of community comment. It's just that most of the comments were from community members with opinions you disagree with.

Where were these advertised? Was everybody given ample opportunity to comment? If the council and exec wanted to do this properly, they would have had a community-wide survey. Does it shock you that PGCPS’s survey shows 80% support for SROs? Is it so unreasonable to assume that a similar survey conducted here would show the same? Until this is done for MCPS, no… this was NOT a well-handled, community-informed decision. (Does it matter that the principals unanimously wanted to keep them? No. They were ignored.)

Can you really support a 3-student panel? You’re okay with that?

You're complaining about process because you don't like the outcome.

NP
Do you honestly and truly think that was a fair process?

What was unfair about it?

The fact they ignored dissenting voices, which happened to be the very people with knowledge and expertise in this subject?

I’m in awe of the fact you’re comfortable with 3 voices representing 160,000, and that you think that was a fair process. Where were the surveys? The widely-advertised panel discussions? Wide-net calls for community input?

I expect more. Elected officials MUST rely on those who have subject expertise, which did not happen. You’re okay with that, perhaps because it doesn’t affect you. It does affect me and I find it disgusting.

They didn't ignore dissenting voices. The opinions of the principals were no secret. What they did was make a decision that was different from what the principals wanted. That's what we elect them to do. And it happens all the time, generally, in government. And it SHOULD happen all the time. Otherwise we'd have the "unelected bureaucrats" making the decisions.

This is how you can tell PP is fundamentally being dishonest. If the principals were "ignored,' there's no amount of process that would satisfy them. The principals were asked and they made the other choice, which is what SHOULD happen if the elected officials disagree with a stakeholder's opinion. I can vote for someone other than Mark Elrich, but we can't vote out the principal of a high school.

I'm actually a supporter of SROs, and I voted for Sullivan, but I'm not going to lie about what happened or throw democracy out the window to get SROs back in schools. It's not worth that.

Asking elected officials to do a thorough investigation of a topic before voting is throwing democracy out the window? That’s all I’ve asked. Why didn’t they thoroughly investigate the desires of the community before making this decision, especially in light of the school administration’s 100% support of the program. You don’t find that odd?

I find it odd that you don't respect the will of the voters who elected and reelected the people who made the decision. That's how we "investigate the desires of the community" in America. We're governed by elected officials, not ruled by focus groups; your desire to toss that principal out might not be the most pressing threat to democracy, but the inability to accept elections (and their policy outcomes) is similar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This isn’t a difficult concept. I want my elected officials to make EDUCATED and INFORMED decisions. You have yet to comment on their focus group of 3. Let’s take a close look at the “research” that went into this decision:
two community focus groups that had a total of 7 participants
two school administrator focus groups that had a total of 8 participants
One focus group containing 2 SROs
One student/family group containing 3 participants

This is, again, for a school population of 160,000 and a community population over 1,000,000.

I do disagree with their decision, but what I disagree with MORE is the ridiculous farce of a process. This is not good governance, and there is absolutely nothing you can say to refute that.

This is how our government works: decisions are made by elected officials, who are elected by getting the most votes in the election.
This is now how our government works, except under certain extremely limited circumstances (for example, ballot measures): decisions are made by public referendum.

However, if you want the decision about SROs to be made by public referendum, then you should work to get a ballot measure about SROs on the ballot at the next election.

We are talking in two directions. I simply think elected officials should be held to an expectation of *informed* decision-making. That was not done in this case. If you’re comfortable with fewer than 20 people surveyed out of 1,000,000, then we’ll simply have to disagree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

We are talking in two directions. I simply think elected officials should be held to an expectation of *informed* decision-making. That was not done in this case. If you’re comfortable with fewer than 20 people surveyed out of 1,000,000, then we’ll simply have to disagree.

Who should hold them to this expectation? Presumably the voters, no?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’ll be (not) awesome when the purple line brings all of this crime right to downtown Bethesda.

Love how you take the mythical racist story of the Georgetown metro and update it for today.

The idea that Bethesda will suddenly become more accessible to crime because of an electric trolley makes me smile.

Tysons Corner has become more accessible to crime. No doubt about it

Tysons Corner has become more accessible to people. Generally that's thought to be a good thing.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PG is tough on crime, unlike MoCo. We don't have woke officials on our County Board.

https://wtop.com/prince-georges-county/2022/09/prince-georges-co-to-enforce-teen-curfew-to-combat-crime-these-kids-dont-just-need-a-hug/

Prince George’s County Executive Angela Alsobrooks says police in the Maryland county will begin stepping up enforcement of an already on-the-books curfew to keep teens off the streets at night, amid a rise in carjackings and other violent crime.

Wow, this might be the first time ever, in way too many years on DCUM, that somebody used Prince George's County as a positive example (as opposed to an example of their own racism). I'm going to check out the window for pigs flying.

Yup. I do think Black politicians - who understand the very real effects of crime in PG - know they need to get tough, while ensuring their police aren't doing it in a racially biased way.

This is exactly right. And what's wrecking Montgomery County, at least, is a bunch of white progressives who think they are being allies, but who are in fact bringing more pain to marginalized communities in the form of increased crime. I invite Elrich, the entire Council, and all their little activist buddies to spend a week living in the Enclave. And see how they like it.

So let's see. The Enclave is in state district 20 and county council district 5. And whom did the voters who actually live in state district 20 and county council district 5 (which you probably don't) elect as their representatives, just last month? 4 non-white progressives and 1 white progressive. How about that.

DP. And do any of these politicians live in the Enclave? Have they even visited?

I grimace when I think of this council addressing crime. I don’t see how they are remotely qualified to do so. Have they attended the MCPD Citizen’s Academy? Have they even done a ride-along?

It’s pretty easy to address crime from afar, when it doesn’t touch the street you live on. I’ve been the victim of a crime in Montgomery County. I want a present and supported police force, and I worry that’s not what we’ll get with this council. The current plan is to reduce police presence to reduce crime. How does that even remotely make sense?

I'm guessing the voters who live in the Enclave have a better understanding of living in the Enclave, and of their own interests and priorities, than you do.

Perhaps, but I am pretty confident saying I know more about our police department than they do. At least I’ve done several ride-alongs. Let’s not pretend for a second that the previous council improved safety in Montgomery County. You don’t have to look any further than the crime reports to see that. They also decimated MCPD, which used to be the most sought-out department by recruits. Now they can’t even fill a class because recruits can go to neighboring counties for better pay and more support.

And listening to constituents? No, they didn’t do that, either. The council and exec listened to a task force of 3 students before removing SROs. 3, out of 160,000. Meanwhile, PGCPS actually sent out a community-wide survey. 80% of respondents said to keep them. I doubt there will be a ton of listening going on by the current council, but I would love to see them prove me wrong.

So, are they prepared to handle crime? Not remotely. I’ll change my mind when I see one of them learn a little bit about policing instead of issuing self-serving statements.

That's some chutzpah there. You've done several ride-alongs, so you know more about what's good for east county voters than the east county voters themselves and the people they just elected/re-elected. Wow.

Um… why did you assume I don’t live in east county?

I stand by my statements. I’ve watched the council for the past few years because I am very concerned about increasing crime. All I’ve seen are things that make me worry. The Reimagining Public Safety Task force? Recommendations to decrease police presence by 50% in Silver Spring and Wheaton? Stopping enforcement of quality of life crimes? A suggestion to remove guns from the officers? How does any of this come across as logical and reasoned?

Look at the incidents in MCPS. It was Elrich and the past council who removed SROs against the desire of the school system. How do they know what’s better for students and staff than the educators and administrators?

I live in reality. I want to feel safe in my community. So you call it “churzpah.” I call it holding these representatives accountable.

Ok, so you live in the east county. Well, the majority of your voting neighbors disagree with you. That's democracy.

You have yet to comment on crime itself: the increasing statistics, the task force recommendations, the lack of research before removing SROs, etc.

Is it just “my candidate won,” or is it “let’s get to work”? I’m not seeing that you’re actually concerned about crime. I guess it hasn’t affected you as it has me.

No. It's that east county voters JUST voted to elect progressives (of whom 4 of 5 are non-white, and 4 of 5 were actually RE-elected) to represent them in the Maryland General Assembly and the County Council, and your take on this is "a bunch of white progressives who think they are being allies, but who are in fact bringing more pain to marginalized communities in the form of increased crime". Terrible take.

I am not that poster. I have made no statement about “a bunch of white progressives.” I have ONLY provided true facts about crime and the previous council’s affect on the county.

Once again: will you only comment on the election, or do you have a comment about crime?

You haven't provided any "true facts" about crime. You have only provided your personal opinions.

Here you go! Read away:
https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/pol/Resources/Files/Annual-Reports/CrimeandSafety/2021%20MCPD%20Annual%20Report%20on%20Crime%20and%20Safety.pdf

One note: when you see that “crimes against society” are down 37%, know that is because police are now discouraged from stopping people from using drugs or drinking in public, urinating / defecating, etc. It’s still happening, just isn’t reported.

Therefore, my opinions are grounded in fact. As for other facts I have posted, would you care to comment on the way SROs were removed without community comment? That’s another fact.

"SROs were removed without community comment" is the opposite of fact.

Sure, if you consider a panel of 3 students sufficient for a population of 160,000 students and no community-wide survey. Meanwhile, Prince George’s handled it this way:
https://go.boarddocs.com/mabe/pgcps/Board.nsf/files/BXNW286FF2A9/$file/SRO%20Presentation%20v1%20PPT%20(1).pdf

There was plenty of community comment. It's just that most of the comments were from community members with opinions you disagree with.

Where were these advertised? Was everybody given ample opportunity to comment? If the council and exec wanted to do this properly, they would have had a community-wide survey. Does it shock you that PGCPS’s survey shows 80% support for SROs? Is it so unreasonable to assume that a similar survey conducted here would show the same? Until this is done for MCPS, no… this was NOT a well-handled, community-informed decision. (Does it matter that the principals unanimously wanted to keep them? No. They were ignored.)

Can you really support a 3-student panel? You’re okay with that?

You're complaining about process because you don't like the outcome.

NP
Do you honestly and truly think that was a fair process?

What was unfair about it?

The fact they ignored dissenting voices, which happened to be the very people with knowledge and expertise in this subject?

I’m in awe of the fact you’re comfortable with 3 voices representing 160,000, and that you think that was a fair process. Where were the surveys? The widely-advertised panel discussions? Wide-net calls for community input?

I expect more. Elected officials MUST rely on those who have subject expertise, which did not happen. You’re okay with that, perhaps because it doesn’t affect you. It does affect me and I find it disgusting.

They didn't ignore dissenting voices. The opinions of the principals were no secret. What they did was make a decision that was different from what the principals wanted. That's what we elect them to do. And it happens all the time, generally, in government. And it SHOULD happen all the time. Otherwise we'd have the "unelected bureaucrats" making the decisions.

This is how you can tell PP is fundamentally being dishonest. If the principals were "ignored,' there's no amount of process that would satisfy them. The principals were asked and they made the other choice, which is what SHOULD happen if the elected officials disagree with a stakeholder's opinion. I can vote for someone other than Mark Elrich, but we can't vote out the principal of a high school.

I'm actually a supporter of SROs, and I voted for Sullivan, but I'm not going to lie about what happened or throw democracy out the window to get SROs back in schools. It's not worth that.

Asking elected officials to do a thorough investigation of a topic before voting is throwing democracy out the window? That’s all I’ve asked. Why didn’t they thoroughly investigate the desires of the community before making this decision, especially in light of the school administration’s 100% support of the program. You don’t find that odd?

I find it odd that you don't respect the will of the voters who elected and reelected the people who made the decision. That's how we "investigate the desires of the community" in America. We're governed by elected officials, not ruled by focus groups; your desire to toss that principal out might not be the most pressing threat to democracy, but the inability to accept elections (and their policy outcomes) is similar.

Have I once questioned the election process? No. I’ve questioned whether elected officials have a responsibility to their constituents to be thorough and honest when making decisions. This process was neither thorough nor honest.

They have already backpedaled with the new MOU, likely because of increasing violence and multiple major incidents in the news.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PG is tough on crime, unlike MoCo. We don't have woke officials on our County Board.

https://wtop.com/prince-georges-county/2022/09/prince-georges-co-to-enforce-teen-curfew-to-combat-crime-these-kids-dont-just-need-a-hug/

Prince George’s County Executive Angela Alsobrooks says police in the Maryland county will begin stepping up enforcement of an already on-the-books curfew to keep teens off the streets at night, amid a rise in carjackings and other violent crime.

Wow, this might be the first time ever, in way too many years on DCUM, that somebody used Prince George's County as a positive example (as opposed to an example of their own racism). I'm going to check out the window for pigs flying.

Yup. I do think Black politicians - who understand the very real effects of crime in PG - know they need to get tough, while ensuring their police aren't doing it in a racially biased way.

So glad that we don't have the white and woke politicians like in MoCo.

[Anonymous]

MoCo also rolled out the carpet for illegal immigration. Just be friggin' honest, we have no idea who is living amongst us and their criminal background history. We have no idea if they're MS13 or in some other gang. Gang activity is now very prevalent in MoCo, many of whom are coming from Central America. And the county rolls out the carpet for illegal immigrants who stay here with basically zero background checks because somehow tolerance of breaking our immigration laws equates to progress. We have buttloads of human trafficking, drug trafficking, shootings, and murders often related to our out of control gang activity in communities with heavy illegal immigrant populations


https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2022/05/13/gang-homicide-montgomery-county/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PG is tough on crime, unlike MoCo. We don't have woke officials on our County Board.

https://wtop.com/prince-georges-county/2022/09/prince-georges-co-to-enforce-teen-curfew-to-combat-crime-these-kids-dont-just-need-a-hug/

Prince George’s County Executive Angela Alsobrooks says police in the Maryland county will begin stepping up enforcement of an already on-the-books curfew to keep teens off the streets at night, amid a rise in carjackings and other violent crime.

Wow, this might be the first time ever, in way too many years on DCUM, that somebody used Prince George's County as a positive example (as opposed to an example of their own racism). I'm going to check out the window for pigs flying.

PG is now doing many mannnny things more right than MoCo. PG gets tougher on crime and is probusiness. PG actually now creates more new jobs than jobs killing MoCo.. All of the 'progressive' reform happening in MoCo sure looks like regression. Loss of jobs, anemic economic growth, rising crime. So.much
.progress.


Just wait until the last leg for MoCo collapses and people start moving out. MoCo will be decimated and turn into Baltimore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PG is tough on crime, unlike MoCo. We don't have woke officials on our County Board.

https://wtop.com/prince-georges-county/2022/09/prince-georges-co-to-enforce-teen-curfew-to-combat-crime-these-kids-dont-just-need-a-hug/

Prince George’s County Executive Angela Alsobrooks says police in the Maryland county will begin stepping up enforcement of an already on-the-books curfew to keep teens off the streets at night, amid a rise in carjackings and other violent crime.

Wow, this might be the first time ever, in way too many years on DCUM, that somebody used Prince George's County as a positive example (as opposed to an example of their own racism). I'm going to check out the window for pigs flying.

PG is now doing many mannnny things more right than MoCo. PG gets tougher on crime and is probusiness. PG actually now creates more new jobs than jobs killing MoCo.. All of the 'progressive' reform happening in MoCo sure looks like regression. Loss of jobs, anemic economic growth, rising crime. So.much
.progress.


Just wait until the last leg for MoCo collapses and people start moving out. MoCo will be decimated and turn into Baltimore.

OMG, you're right: https://www.bls.gov/regions/mid-atlantic/news-release/countyemploymentandwages_maryland.htm

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PG is tough on crime, unlike MoCo. We don't have woke officials on our County Board.

https://wtop.com/prince-georges-county/2022/09/prince-georges-co-to-enforce-teen-curfew-to-combat-crime-these-kids-dont-just-need-a-hug/

Prince George’s County Executive Angela Alsobrooks says police in the Maryland county will begin stepping up enforcement of an already on-the-books curfew to keep teens off the streets at night, amid a rise in carjackings and other violent crime.

Wow, this might be the first time ever, in way too many years on DCUM, that somebody used Prince George's County as a positive example (as opposed to an example of their own racism). I'm going to check out the window for pigs flying.

Yup. I do think Black politicians - who understand the very real effects of crime in PG - know they need to get tough, while ensuring their police aren't doing it in a racially biased way.

This is exactly right. And what's wrecking Montgomery County, at least, is a bunch of white progressives who think they are being allies, but who are in fact bringing more pain to marginalized communities in the form of increased crime. I invite Elrich, the entire Council, and all their little activist buddies to spend a week living in the Enclave. And see how they like it.

So let's see. The Enclave is in state district 20 and county council district 5. And whom did the voters who actually live in state district 20 and county council district 5 (which you probably don't) elect as their representatives, just last month? 4 non-white progressives and 1 white progressive. How about that.

privileged people vote. marginalized people don't