South West County HS?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What was the wording on the last school bond we voted on?

For high schools:, planning/design for Centreville,construction for Falls Church, site acquisition for Future Western.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

It seems reasonably clear they might expand Centreville to at least 2500 during its upcoming renovation, maybe more (Oakton is being built out to 2625). If they did that, and used some of the existing surplus capacity at Westfield, how much of the needed relief at Centreville would that provide? It seems like Robinson and Lake Braddock also are projected to have some capacity.

Or is your point that people should hold out for a new high school closer to Chantilly and Centreville - maybe in the western part of the current Oakton district? If so, that would suggest Centreville shouldn't be expanded as much during its renovation.

It also seems like FCPS needs to decide what it's future relationship with the City of Fairfax will be. It seems many people in the Fairfax HS island in the county further west would rather be at Centreville or Chantilly. That might be a good location for a school as well, if they could find the land. But then Fairfax would end up about 50% capacity if the island were attending a different school.

It's crazy how boxed in we seem to be when discussing different options due to the haphazard FCPS planning over the years.

Bingo!

The Hutchison site would be full with the closest elementary schools without even touching Chantilly kids. So, there would necessarily have to be major redistricting to include South Lakes, Westfield, and Herndon, Oakton, Langley, McLean, etc, in addition to Chantilly and Centreville. This would involve many additional split feeder middle schools.

Somehow, I am not sure the SB really wants to deal with this large a boundary issue. Find another site that gives direct relief to the schools that need it most. The Fairfax families in Centreville's backyard want to be redistricted to Centreville. There would be plenty of students to fill a school in that area with Centreville, Chantilly, and Fairfax.

If they build a new high school then major boundary changes will be needed.

They don’t have much good will built up so a contentious boundary change could easily derail or end political careers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here again.

I had also thought that the new HS would be built on a Hutchison site.

But let’s look at the CIPs.

2021-2025 CIP: the new Western HS was clearly marked above 267 near Hutchison in Additional Maps
2022-2026 CIP: the HS mark was gone in Additional Maps. It still says the new HS will be built in Region 1.
2023-2027 CIP: the Addtional Maps say the location for the new HS is NOT determined. .

I don’t know the future, but if you ask my opinion, I think it will be built in South West area. If it were going to be built on the Hutchison site, there is no reason to say that the location is undermined and no need to bring back the mention of South West HS.

In additon, one of the PPs who actually atteneded the board meeting said that the debate on the location would go on. The board will keep two options open and maybe even hire an outside consultant group. But at the end of the day, we all know which location the Langley parents do not want. So I would bet against the Hutchison site.

Personally I prefer the original Carson site but if that’s not possible, I rather want to have a new school in South West. Hutchison location is not good logistically.

I am a Sully parent. I do not want it. Giving relief to Chantilly and Centreville has nothing to do with Langley and the Hutcheson site will not solve the problem.

Agree. The SB needs to do whats best for the Centreville/Chantilly communities and leave us out of the Langley fight. Frankly, I don't give AF.
I do not want our schools expanded to be even larger. Its so hard for high schoolers to get opportunities for sports and leadership at the size of the schools already. My son's friend tried out for 9th grade basketball and there were over 100 boys! Its absurd. Why can Loudoun build reasonably-sized, beautiful new schools and Fairfax cnanot?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here again.

I had also thought that the new HS would be built on a Hutchison site.

But let’s look at the CIPs.

2021-2025 CIP: the new Western HS was clearly marked above 267 near Hutchison in Additional Maps
2022-2026 CIP: the HS mark was gone in Additional Maps. It still says the new HS will be built in Region 1.
2023-2027 CIP: the Addtional Maps say the location for the new HS is NOT determined. .

I don’t know the future, but if you ask my opinion, I think it will be built in South West area. If it were going to be built on the Hutchison site, there is no reason to say that the location is undermined and no need to bring back the mention of South West HS.

In additon, one of the PPs who actually atteneded the board meeting said that the debate on the location would go on. The board will keep two options open and maybe even hire an outside consultant group. But at the end of the day, we all know which location the Langley parents do not want. So I would bet against the Hutchison site.

Personally I prefer the original Carson site but if that’s not possible, I rather want to have a new school in South West. Hutchison location is not good logistically.

I am a Sully parent. I do not want it. Giving relief to Chantilly and Centreville has nothing to do with Langley and the Hutcheson site will not solve the problem.

Agree. The SB needs to do whats best for the Centreville/Chantilly communities and leave us out of the Langley fight. Frankly, I don't give AF.
I do not want our schools expanded to be even larger. Its so hard for high schoolers to get opportunities for sports and leadership at the size of the schools already. My son's friend tried out for 9th grade basketball and there were over 100 boys! Its absurd. Why can Loudoun build reasonably-sized, beautiful new schools and Fairfax cnanot?

Which school? All of the schools are pretty large. Do they all have 100 kids trying out for basketball? What is it like for other sports?

[Anonymous]

Which school? All of the schools are pretty large. Do they all have 100 kids trying out for basketball? What is it like for other sports?

DP. My kids are older. Basketball has broken lots of hearts for years. There are only five players on the court at a time. Now look at the numbers who play youth basketball. Baseball also breaks a lot of hearts. Even smaller schools deal with the basketball issue.

[Anonymous]

Which school? All of the schools are pretty large. Do they all have 100 kids trying out for basketball? What is it like for other sports?

Depends on the sport. Track, cross-country, swim are pretty inclusive.

But, if you have a drama kid--all kids don't get leading roles. Music? Everyone does not get in the select group.

It's called Life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If they have $23.5 million already set aside to acquire land for a school few now seem to want built, could the money be used instead for the overdue addition to McLean? McLean has a higher than average enrollment (2367 students) and less current/planned instructional space than any other high school in the county:

Mount Vernon: 458,181 SF
West Potomac: 432,450 SF
Fairfax: 431,954 SF
Westfield: 431,638 SF
Falls Church: 429,956 SF
Lake Braddock: 418,336 SF [space at SS allocated to HS]
Herndon: 415,722 SF
Oakton: 409,661 SF
Chantilly: 402,883 SF
Robinson: 391,082 SF [space at SS allocated to HS]
TJHSST: 388,767 SF
West Springfield: 387,429 SF
South County: 385,732 SF
South Lakes: 366,295 SF
Edison: 359,470 SF
Woodson: 373,849 SF
Marshall: 372,343 SF
Madison: 347,588 SF
Centreville: 345,951 SF
Annandale: 342,935 SF
Hayfield: 340,199 SF [space at SS allocated to HS]
Langley: 337,966 SF
Lewis: 310,405 SF
Justice: 306,667 SF [does not include upcoming addition]
McLean: 303, 578 SF

Or is Elaine Tholen just too lazy to pay attention?

I think that enrollment (over and under) as opposed to physical space is the driver for new construction/renovation. I saw earlier up thread that Chantilly and Centreville had the highest over-enrollment projections, followed closely by McLean. New HS should address Chantilly and Centreville, but maybe a redrawing of the boundaries for Falls Church/Marshall/McLean could alleviate the McLean overcrowding? Falls Church is going to be expanded with their renovation and could take some surplus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If they have $23.5 million already set aside to acquire land for a school few now seem to want built, could the money be used instead for the overdue addition to McLean? McLean has a higher than average enrollment (2367 students) and less current/planned instructional space than any other high school in the county:

Mount Vernon: 458,181 SF
West Potomac: 432,450 SF
Fairfax: 431,954 SF
Westfield: 431,638 SF
Falls Church: 429,956 SF
Lake Braddock: 418,336 SF [space at SS allocated to HS]
Herndon: 415,722 SF
Oakton: 409,661 SF
Chantilly: 402,883 SF
Robinson: 391,082 SF [space at SS allocated to HS]
TJHSST: 388,767 SF
West Springfield: 387,429 SF
South County: 385,732 SF
South Lakes: 366,295 SF
Edison: 359,470 SF
Woodson: 373,849 SF
Marshall: 372,343 SF
Madison: 347,588 SF
Centreville: 345,951 SF
Annandale: 342,935 SF
Hayfield: 340,199 SF [space at SS allocated to HS]
Langley: 337,966 SF
Lewis: 310,405 SF
Justice: 306,667 SF [does not include upcoming addition]
McLean: 303, 578 SF

Or is Elaine Tholen just too lazy to pay attention?

I think that enrollment (over and under) as opposed to physical space is the driver for new construction/renovation. I saw earlier up thread that Chantilly and Centreville had the highest over-enrollment projections, followed closely by McLean. New HS should address Chantilly and Centreville, but maybe a redrawing of the boundaries for Falls Church/Marshall/McLean could alleviate the McLean overcrowding? Falls Church is going to be expanded with their renovation and could take some surplus.

I know how McLean centric DCUM is but let’s leave McLean/Langley out of the discussion for this topic. The new HS is about WESTERN Fairfax.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Which school? All of the schools are pretty large. Do they all have 100 kids trying out for basketball? What is it like for other sports?

DP. My kids are older. Basketball has broken lots of hearts for years. There are only five players on the court at a time. Now look at the numbers who play youth basketball. Baseball also breaks a lot of hearts. Even smaller schools deal with the basketball issue.

I played basketball at a very competitive HS program. I cannot imagine 100’people trying out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here again.

I had also thought that the new HS would be built on a Hutchison site.

But let’s look at the CIPs.

2021-2025 CIP: the new Western HS was clearly marked above 267 near Hutchison in Additional Maps
2022-2026 CIP: the HS mark was gone in Additional Maps. It still says the new HS will be built in Region 1.
2023-2027 CIP: the Addtional Maps say the location for the new HS is NOT determined. .

I don’t know the future, but if you ask my opinion, I think it will be built in South West area. If it were going to be built on the Hutchison site, there is no reason to say that the location is undermined and no need to bring back the mention of South West HS.

In additon, one of the PPs who actually atteneded the board meeting said that the debate on the location would go on. The board will keep two options open and maybe even hire an outside consultant group. But at the end of the day, we all know which location the Langley parents do not want. So I would bet against the Hutchison site.

Personally I prefer the original Carson site but if that’s not possible, I rather want to have a new school in South West. Hutchison location is not good logistically.

I am a Sully parent. I do not want it. Giving relief to Chantilly and Centreville has nothing to do with Langley and the Hutcheson site will not solve the problem.

I hear you. I live in Hunter Mill district and I would rather send my kids to crowded South Lakes than a new HS on Hutchison site. I think the only people who want the Hutchison site are Herndon parents and One Fairfax supporters who wish sending Great Falls kids to Herndon High.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Agree. The SB needs to do whats best for the Centreville/Chantilly communities and leave us out of the Langley fight. Frankly, I don't give AF.
I do not want our schools expanded to be even larger. Its so hard for high schoolers to get opportunities for sports and leadership at the size of the schools already. My son's friend tried out for 9th grade basketball and there were over 100 boys! Its absurd. Why can Loudoun build reasonably-sized, beautiful new schools and Fairfax cnanot?

Loudoun is decades behind Fairfax County and is just now going through their era of idyllic suburbia that Fairfax County had at it's peak some 30 years ago. Fairfax County is on it's way to turning into the next LA/Chicago metropolitan area over the next couple of decades population-wise, and Loudoun County will eventually follow.

In the meantime, FCPS needs to start preparing county-wide. Relieving the current issue in the western parts is temporary, but complete overhaul of boundaries will be needed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here again.

I had also thought that the new HS would be built on a Hutchison site.

But let’s look at the CIPs.

2021-2025 CIP: the new Western HS was clearly marked above 267 near Hutchison in Additional Maps
2022-2026 CIP: the HS mark was gone in Additional Maps. It still says the new HS will be built in Region 1.
2023-2027 CIP: the Addtional Maps say the location for the new HS is NOT determined. .

I don’t know the future, but if you ask my opinion, I think it will be built in South West area. If it were going to be built on the Hutchison site, there is no reason to say that the location is undermined and no need to bring back the mention of South West HS.

In additon, one of the PPs who actually atteneded the board meeting said that the debate on the location would go on. The board will keep two options open and maybe even hire an outside consultant group. But at the end of the day, we all know which location the Langley parents do not want. So I would bet against the Hutchison site.

Personally I prefer the original Carson site but if that’s not possible, I rather want to have a new school in South West. Hutchison location is not good logistically.

I am a Sully parent. I do not want it. Giving relief to Chantilly and Centreville has nothing to do with Langley and the Hutcheson site will not solve the problem.

Agree. The SB needs to do whats best for the Centreville/Chantilly communities and leave us out of the Langley fight. Frankly, I don't give AF.
I do not want our schools expanded to be even larger. Its so hard for high schoolers to get opportunities for sports and leadership at the size of the schools already. My son's friend tried out for 9th grade basketball and there were over 100 boys! Its absurd. Why can Loudoun build reasonably-sized, beautiful new schools and Fairfax cnanot?

The main differences between Loudoun and Fairfax are:

1. Loudoun is very disciplined in planning for new schools when existing ones get overcrowded;

2. There is more land in Loudoun to build new schools;

3. There isn't much difference between high schools in Loudoun, apart from Park View in Sterling; and

4. They don't spend a lot of time indulging parents who object; instead, they just change boundaries.

Contrast that to Fairfax, where:

1. There is no rhyme or reason to when FCPS builds new schools, or favors existing schools with additions;

2. Land is scarce for new schools;

3. There are major differences between high schools, both in terms of programs and student performance; and

4. The School Board consists largely of risk-averse aspirants to higher political office who hate the idea of offending vocal parents.

FCPS is a total mess when it comes to facilities planning and management. They pat themselves on the back for assembling more data in each year's Capital Improvement Program, but their actual analysis and planning could hardly be worse.

Most likely, when it comes to the "Western HS," it will never get built, because land won't be available in the ideal location and they'll do anything to avoid antagonizing people worried they'll get moved if they build elsewhere. So you can probably count on trailers, modulars, and long-delayed additions for years to come.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here again.

I had also thought that the new HS would be built on a Hutchison site.

But let’s look at the CIPs.

2021-2025 CIP: the new Western HS was clearly marked above 267 near Hutchison in Additional Maps
2022-2026 CIP: the HS mark was gone in Additional Maps. It still says the new HS will be built in Region 1.
2023-2027 CIP: the Addtional Maps say the location for the new HS is NOT determined. .

I don’t know the future, but if you ask my opinion, I think it will be built in South West area. If it were going to be built on the Hutchison site, there is no reason to say that the location is undermined and no need to bring back the mention of South West HS.

In additon, one of the PPs who actually atteneded the board meeting said that the debate on the location would go on. The board will keep two options open and maybe even hire an outside consultant group. But at the end of the day, we all know which location the Langley parents do not want. So I would bet against the Hutchison site.

Personally I prefer the original Carson site but if that’s not possible, I rather want to have a new school in South West. Hutchison location is not good logistically.

I am a Sully parent. I do not want it. Giving relief to Chantilly and Centreville has nothing to do with Langley and the Hutcheson site will not solve the problem.

I hear you. I live in Hunter Mill district and I would rather send my kids to crowded South Lakes than a new HS on Hutchison site. I think the only people who want the Hutchison site are Herndon parents and One Fairfax supporters who wish sending Great Falls kids to Herndon High.

Easier for you to say, since FCPS built an addition to South Lakes in 2016 when it wasn't otherwise up for a renovation.

They have zero plan at all for Chantilly, already @ 2900 kids, if they don't build a new HS somewhere in the western part of the county.

[Anonymous]

So let's say they could actually find a large enough parcel for a new school closer to Chantilly or Centreville, rather than at the previously identified Hutchison site.

If they just focused on reducing the enrollments at Chantilly and Centreville, that would mean 3 high schools each with about 1850 kids.

That would mean Centreville and Chantilly would likely have to scale back their electives and number of teachers quite a bit. It also would leave Westfield potentially overcrowded soon if a significant fraction of the approved housing units near Phase 2 of the Silver Line get built and yield the projected number of students.

Again, a relevant consideration is whether FCPS might want to sever ties with the City of Fairfax schools and stop sending county kids to Daniels Run, Providence, Johnson and Fairfax. If FCPS severed ties, and moved the Fairfax island to Chantilly and/or Centreville, they might want to both expand Centreville during its upcoming renovation and include Fairfax HS within the scope of the necessary boundary study if/when a new HS is built. That would be a very big expenditure by FCPS to give those kids a shorter commute and leave the City of Fairfax middle and high school well under capacity.

[Anonymous]

A new school in Centreville/Chantilly area could also draw some kids now zoned to Westfield.

PP's idea of taking some county land from EC Lawrence park is excellent. That is the right area geographically.