Junior associate at Big Law -- help!

[Anonymous]

I'm a rising 3rd year at big law but just finished my first year at the firm because I did a clerkship. I have two very young children (both under 5!). I'm drowning. What do I do?

1. Ask for reduced hours? If so, 50, 60, 70, 80? What is ideal?
2. Go in-house?
3. Go to a non-profit?
4. Go to a smaller firm?
5. Tell my husband to quit his job (I noticed that the male associates with children have SAHM or part-time working wives)

It's gotten harder throughout the year and at this point, I am expecting to be fired even though I do good work. I just have too many other responsibilities and even with a full-time nanny, I need to be home at a decent hour at least 50% of the time to relieve her. DH does relieve her half the time too but we are both exhausted.

I'm on track for 1800 hours and the firm min is 2000 so I will not make my hours. I think the most hours that I can do and lead a normal life is 1600 (80%) because this year was very difficult. My firm also has mandatory training during the year and none of those hours count toward the billable requirement. And then there is an expectation to participate in recruiting and pitching -- neither count toward billable. Plus, there is pro bono and those hours only partially count. If all my work counted, I would bill 2500+ hours. I did not take vacation and I worked every day.

I need help navigating where I should be trying to go in the next year. I'm not in a rush but I do not want to be in this position next year.

[Anonymous]

Harsh question: Why did you think your experience in Big Law would be different than those you've read about in Above the Law, etc.? Nothing that you've described is remotely outside the norm of expectations. It was foolish for you to try to attempt the impossible with young children. You need to get out now - or wait until you are given the boot with 3 months severance to find something more realistic for your stage in life.

I know this sounds mean, but I get so tired of my associates thinking the rules/expectations don't apply to them. I guarantee your partners feel the same about you.

[Anonymous]

I'm sorry, OP. I don't know how anyone does it - or even wants to! - with young kids. I moved to the government, so my advice is to get out.

[Anonymous]

If you want to stay at your firm or any firm, you should consider having your DH stay at home or work part time. My DH has been a SAHD for four years now and it works great for our family. It also allows me to litigate, meet my hours requirements, travel to promote my practice, teach a class at a local law school and all with a parent at home every day.

[Anonymous]

Do NOT have your husband stop working. Big Law is brutal and if you feel like you're going to be counseled out AND you are not meeting your hours requirement, that is likely to happen.

I'd ask for a reduced schedule (60% seems good - most associates I knew who asked for 80% ended up getting no real break besides working from home more). I'd look for a new job that is not in Big Law. I'd make sure your husband is able to maintain his job security in the event you lose yours.

You are not a bad person or a bad attorney or a failure because you can't make Big Law and its insane lifestyle demands work for you and your family. You are smart to see this coming, and you would be wise to seek your way out now.

[Anonymous]

I think you need to find a new job. and in-house or non-profit is probably best. If you take reduced hours now, you're taking yourself off the partner track before you've even established that you're someone they eventually might want on the partner track, so you'd be hanging out in a dead-end job while still dealing with a lot of the pressures you're struggling with now (I say that from experience as a part-time associate). A small firm will not necessarily give you a meaningful better lifestyle, because they will often be more eat-what-you-kill, and you'll have to spend a lot of time networking to bring in your own clients in addition to your billable work. You're too early in your career to have your husband quit his job, you could find yourself being pushed out in three or four years anyway, having to take a job with a big pay cut, and a spouse who's been out of the work force for a while and may struggle to get back in if needed. So in-house or non-profit. You could also consider government.

[Anonymous]

Somehow it's verboten to ask a man to quit work but it's ok for a woman to lean out rather than lean in huh?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Somehow it's verboten to ask a man to quit work but it's ok for a woman to lean out rather than lean in huh?

14:44 here, I would never tell a man he should tell his wife to quit her job to support his, either. That's a decision the spouse has to want for themselves as well as for the family.

[Anonymous]

Why are your hours under the minimum?

Are you doing all the work that you are being asked to do, and still only coming up with 1800 hours? Or are you turning down billable work? If you're not getting enough work in the first place, then you should probably figure out why before making any decisions.

Also, do your practice area and firm culture allow for working remotely? If not, then you might be able to improve your situation at another firm or working for different partners. The partners I work for just want work done well and on time, as well as fast responses to calls and emails. Apart from scheduled in-person meetings, I come and go mostly as I please and do my work during the hours that work for me.

-female associate with FT working husband and two toddlers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm a rising 3rd year at big law but just finished my first year at the firm because I did a clerkship. I have two very young children (both under 5!). I'm drowning. What do I do?

1. Ask for reduced hours? If so, 50, 60, 70, 80? What is ideal?
2. Go in-house?
3. Go to a non-profit?
4. Go to a smaller firm?
5. Tell my husband to quit his job (I noticed that the male associates with children have SAHM or part-time working wives)

It's gotten harder throughout the year and at this point, I am expecting to be fired even though I do good work. I just have too many other responsibilities and even with a full-time nanny, I need to be home at a decent hour at least 50% of the time to relieve her. DH does relieve her half the time too but we are both exhausted.

I'm on track for 1800 hours and the firm min is 2000 so I will not make my hours. I think the most hours that I can do and lead a normal life is 1600 (80%) because this year was very difficult. My firm also has mandatory training during the year and none of those hours count toward the billable requirement. And then there is an expectation to participate in recruiting and pitching -- neither count toward billable. Plus, there is pro bono and those hours only partially count. If all my work counted, I would bill 2500+ hours. I did not take vacation and I worked every day.

I need help navigating where I should be trying to go in the next year. I'm not in a rush but I do not want to be in this position next year.

Too many variables to give good advice here. Firms vary, practice groups vary, and candidly attorneys vary. If you are perceived as good you will be able to get more flexibility than if you are just kind of meh. There should be some kind of women's group--there are at most firms these days, I think--and the best bet is to reach out to someone active in that context but more senior. Like a sixth- or seventh-year outside your practice group. They might be able to give you better feedback about options. Are the partners you work for decent people? Some are, and if they are you can maybe discuss things directly. Truthfully, everyone at big law has had these kinds of feelings at times, especially early on, so it won't be a shock if you talk to people about this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a rising 3rd year at big law but just finished my first year at the firm because I did a clerkship. I have two very young children (both under 5!). I'm drowning. What do I do?

1. Ask for reduced hours? If so, 50, 60, 70, 80? What is ideal?
2. Go in-house?
3. Go to a non-profit?
4. Go to a smaller firm?
5. Tell my husband to quit his job (I noticed that the male associates with children have SAHM or part-time working wives)

It's gotten harder throughout the year and at this point, I am expecting to be fired even though I do good work. I just have too many other responsibilities and even with a full-time nanny, I need to be home at a decent hour at least 50% of the time to relieve her. DH does relieve her half the time too but we are both exhausted.

I'm on track for 1800 hours and the firm min is 2000 so I will not make my hours. I think the most hours that I can do and lead a normal life is 1600 (80%) because this year was very difficult. My firm also has mandatory training during the year and none of those hours count toward the billable requirement. And then there is an expectation to participate in recruiting and pitching -- neither count toward billable. Plus, there is pro bono and those hours only partially count. If all my work counted, I would bill 2500+ hours. I did not take vacation and I worked every day.

I need help navigating where I should be trying to go in the next year. I'm not in a rush but I do not want to be in this position next year.

Too many variables to give good advice here. Firms vary, practice groups vary, and candidly attorneys vary. If you are perceived as good you will be able to get more flexibility than if you are just kind of meh. There should be some kind of women's group--there are at most firms these days, I think--and the best bet is to reach out to someone active in that context but more senior. Like a sixth- or seventh-year outside your practice group. They might be able to give you better feedback about options. Are the partners you work for decent people? Some are, and if they are you can maybe discuss things directly. Truthfully, everyone at big law has had these kinds of feelings at times, especially early on, so it won't be a shock if you talk to people about this.

Also, if you do good work you are NOT going to get fired for 1800 hours during your first year at the the firm. The worst case is you will get a talking to about hours. Our firm has a formal 2000 hour minimum for bonus consideration, and I wouldn't bat an eye at someone who billed 1800 their first year. That really doesn't seem bad at all to me.

[Anonymous]

Former Biglaw associate here. It sounds like you either need to go in house or to a government role, or you need to lean way in and your DH needs to scale back or quit and take over the majority of domestic responsibilities. Part time in Biglaw is a useless concept at most firms/in most practice areas. Most people end up working more hours than they are technically required to, while sacrificing the opportunity to advance. It's just not reasonable to expect to control your hours in a client-facing role. I billed 2200-2400 hours/year for the six years I was in Biglaw, and was middle of the pack at my firm. I quit and went to government before having my first child because I knew I couldn't perform up to expectations and care for a child without two nannies and a full time housekeeper (my practice area involves a lot of night time work), and my husband travels every week. One note about in house: choose carefully because some of these companies also have brutal hours. So those are the options: you scale back, your DH scales back so you can step up professionally, or you both lean in and you hire more help.

[Anonymous]

I can't really speak to your other options, but I'm happy to plug making a jump to government. it's a pretty good life for a lawyer with a family. atmosphere is good, benefits are great, money is good enough. typically, for a lateral, though, they'll be looking for someone with a bit more experience under their belt. so, unless you have something uniquely in demand, it will be tough sell to get a good spot at DOJ. but if none of your other options seems viable, a number of agencies are hiring for in-house counsel.

[Anonymous]

I think it is very difficult for parents with young kids to both have Big Law associate type jobs. It's time to have a heart to heart with your spouse about what options there are for both of you. What's the life you want to lead, how much money do you need to live that life? The trade-off can't be all on your shoulders.

[Anonymous]

1800 hours and the firm min is 2000

Don't be sacked based on billable hours. That's BS. You should be billing when you are merely thinking about a case, no matter where you are. That's how it works, isn't it?