Disappointment

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I smell a 🧌

Do you think her profile is too "basic"? She says she regrets not picking more creative ECs, although I think her ECs were perfectly suited for her major + demonstrated her passion.

Yeah, I agree there is nothing that stands out in her ECs.

ECs:
not impressive: - A few regional awards (STEM)
Actually good: - 200+ volunteer hours @ local hospital
everyone has one: - Founder of non-profit
this year AOs don't like research for some reason: - Research w/ prof at T30
everyone has one: - Competitive summer program for BME
everyone has this: - Lots of community service

This year I heard Stanford retracted an acceptance because the applicant lied about volunteer hours.
Are those 200 volunteer hours @ local hospital registered with the school?

Yes, she made sure that everything was registered. I'm assuming the more "basic" ECs were the factor harming her application?

No, it's just a bizarre system that makes kids do these things. In other countries kids don't have to do these admissions acrobatics.

No, other countries instead track kids around age 11/12 (or earlier). You are tracked at this age, based on a one day test. Do well, you can be on tract for pre-med/stem/engineering. Do okay, and you can focus on humanities and social sciences (non stem), do worse, and you won't be tracked for much college at all. And without $$$$$$ it is damn near impossible to get off those tracks.
So yeah, I 1000% prefer what we have, where a kid can grow academically after 5th/6th grade and still decide to be an engineer or a doctor after age 12.

Nah. You can pretty much tell where a kid should be by the end of 6th grade. Pretending that kids can “grow” after that is a waste of everyone’s time and of public resources.

This is so un-American!
I am an immigrant from Asia. What attracts us so much about America is precisely that, as long as you work hard, you always have another opportunity.
Tiger parents often pushed kids hard in their childhood, then the kids lost motivation once they left home.

America doesn’t do everything right. The education system is a perfect example of this! It is a huge waste of time, money, and effort to try and get every kid to go to college. Many kids should be put on a vocational track in high school, as many countries do.

Could not agree more. Open enrollment in Honors and AP classes at our public HS has been an unmitigated disaster for the kids who actually deserve to be there. Tons of kids are literally flunking. It should not even be possible to flunk an AP class. It means someone screwed up somewhere.

Yes, I agree open enrollment into AP courses should not be allowed. Kids should be required to at minimum get a B or better in the honors/honor equivalent course the prior year or an B+ or better in a regular course. But many do allow open enrollment because it means less work for the overworked staff and teachers, it means they don't have to deal with nasty pushy parents who want "my kid belongs in AP X or Honors X, I don't care that they got a C in regular X this year" This way with open enrollment, any failures are totally on the parents/student.

DP. I completely disagree. How does someone else's kid potentially doing badly in an AP affect you or your kid? EVERY student should have the opportunity to excel, and most do. And if they do badly or fail, then it is indeed on them/their parents - no one else is affected.

Because teachers have to teach to the class, and if a group is struggling, they often focus on helping those kids, and that means a different class structure. My kids take AP courses/Honors courses to avoid "the general population"

And with that last sentence, you have shown your true colors, and those of your kids.

deplorable? lol

nauseating

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I smell a 🧌

Do you think her profile is too "basic"? She says she regrets not picking more creative ECs, although I think her ECs were perfectly suited for her major + demonstrated her passion.

Yeah, I agree there is nothing that stands out in her ECs.

ECs:
not impressive: - A few regional awards (STEM)
Actually good: - 200+ volunteer hours @ local hospital
everyone has one: - Founder of non-profit
this year AOs don't like research for some reason: - Research w/ prof at T30
everyone has one: - Competitive summer program for BME
everyone has this: - Lots of community service

This year I heard Stanford retracted an acceptance because the applicant lied about volunteer hours.
Are those 200 volunteer hours @ local hospital registered with the school?

Yes, she made sure that everything was registered. I'm assuming the more "basic" ECs were the factor harming her application?

No, it's just a bizarre system that makes kids do these things. In other countries kids don't have to do these admissions acrobatics.

No, other countries instead track kids around age 11/12 (or earlier). You are tracked at this age, based on a one day test. Do well, you can be on tract for pre-med/stem/engineering. Do okay, and you can focus on humanities and social sciences (non stem), do worse, and you won't be tracked for much college at all. And without $$$$$$ it is damn near impossible to get off those tracks.
So yeah, I 1000% prefer what we have, where a kid can grow academically after 5th/6th grade and still decide to be an engineer or a doctor after age 12.

Nah. You can pretty much tell where a kid should be by the end of 6th grade. Pretending that kids can “grow” after that is a waste of everyone’s time and of public resources.

This is so un-American!
I am an immigrant from Asia. What attracts us so much about America is precisely that, as long as you work hard, you always have another opportunity.
Tiger parents often pushed kids hard in their childhood, then the kids lost motivation once they left home.

America doesn’t do everything right. The education system is a perfect example of this! It is a huge waste of time, money, and effort to try and get every kid to go to college. Many kids should be put on a vocational track in high school, as many countries do.

Could not agree more. Open enrollment in Honors and AP classes at our public HS has been an unmitigated disaster for the kids who actually deserve to be there. Tons of kids are literally flunking. It should not even be possible to flunk an AP class. It means someone screwed up somewhere.

Yes, I agree open enrollment into AP courses should not be allowed. Kids should be required to at minimum get a B or better in the honors/honor equivalent course the prior year or an B+ or better in a regular course. But many do allow open enrollment because it means less work for the overworked staff and teachers, it means they don't have to deal with nasty pushy parents who want "my kid belongs in AP X or Honors X, I don't care that they got a C in regular X this year" This way with open enrollment, any failures are totally on the parents/student.

DP. I completely disagree. How does someone else's kid potentially doing badly in an AP affect you or your kid? EVERY student should have the opportunity to excel, and most do. And if they do badly or fail, then it is indeed on them/their parents - no one else is affected.

Except the rest of the students in an AP class where the teacher is spending way too much time trying to help those failing kids. What a waste of everyone’s time, including the kids who could be learning a lot more in a class appropriate for their level.

That doesn't happen in high school. In AP classes, all kids are expected to keep up. If they don't, the teacher will counsel them to drop down a level. What you're describing is an elementary school situation.

Apparently you are not in a district where kids can self select to take AP/ Honors courses, or you would understand that yes this does exactly happen in many courses.

who cares if kids can self select. As long as the workload and expectations are communicated, and the course is not diluted, why should anyone care if some kid wants to stand and deliver?

+100

[Anonymous]

Don’t worry your dd will come off waitlist. Most students and parents with the economy and layoffs coming and limited financial aid will drop from ivys. Atleast domestic applicants. I think getting off waitlist for public ivys will be much harder.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What we learn from this thread:
1. Half of DCUM are realists.
2. The other half are not. They believe they have Ivies/JHU/CMU/UNC oos in the bag. They believe their kids are special and cannot fathom why Princeton would not admit them. They don't understand that if they apply to 10 schools/program where the admit rate is 4%, then the probability of getting admitted to "at least one" is still only 33.5%. i e., there is a 72.5% CHANCE OF GETTIGNG REJECTED FROM ALL OF THEM. Then they get angry with those pointing out facts and want to key their Teslas.

+1

However, the admit rate is still basically 4% even if you apply to 15+. They are all separate events and have no impact on the other. It's not 33.5%.

But yes, half are not realistic and do not understand basic math/statistics.

+2 The admit rate does not change by applying to more schools. Each application is a separate event. Perhaps the lack of basic statistics understanding is why so many people are upset when they strike out at all their reaches.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lehigh is a hidden gem, particularly if you could get financial aid from Lehigh.

Hidden? Not.

Hidden to the uninformed. Asian parents often only recognize top 20 schools.

Curious why Asian parents are so hung up on USNWR top 20? So ignorant.

[Anonymous]

I can't believe this pathetic thread is still going.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Class ‘24 parent her. This thread has generated so many comments because it taps into a lot of our anxieties, stress, confusion and frustration over a process that unfortunately, is too intertwined with our personal/collective insecurities and aspirations. Many of us can relate to this thread because we all know someone or know of someone who “had high stats and did all the right things” and was still rejected at a lot of top schools. The problem isn’t going to get fixed with Supreme Court decisions, SAT tutors or high priced college counselors. It has to start at the parent level. We parents created the market for this craziness by paying for Kumon, elite sports camps, private college counselors, pay-to-play programs. Kids are jumping through all these hoops because we as parents have certain hopes and aspirations for them. I’m glad I was warned early on that my high stats kid was likely to be rejected by T-25 schools. It’s not the easiest pill to swallow for many of us who were easily accepted into these same top schools with B’s, limited extracurricular involvement, and few AP’s (and no non-profits or research back then!). However, being warned before hand was a blessing because it forced me to recalibrate expectations early on and focus more on fit and admissibility over prestige for my kid. Another great thing was seeing the examples set by top students from our local area who showed little or no interest in T-25 or WASP schools. They opted for our state flagship, service academies, less selective schools with prestigious niche programs, etc. There’s a big world of opportunity out there, and maybe if we parents start placing less importance on prestige schools and stop feeding the market for them, for this madness might abate.

These posts always get me to chuckle. You are just trying to get other parents to give up in order to give your kid an edge

The colleges created this problem by having opaque admissions with moving targets. They can fix it by laying out exact criteria for students to meet in order to gain acceptance.

This will never happen. And can’t. Ok, Princeton says, “You must have perfect SATs, at least 7 APs with 5, sports captain, 4.0. …” that still leaves more candidates than first-year seats.

And eliminate so many others who bring other things to a campus.

and that is why Harvard has remedial math classes

Harvard has remedial math classes because kids were pushed through math too fast, too young, and lack the basics. Remedial math is for students who arrive thinking they are far ahead in math, but actually can't pass the placement test. They are finding that 'foundational' skills are lacking -- basic algebra and geometry. Every kid admitted took those courses, but too many took them in middle school and learned/retained nothing.

+1
Which is why insisting all kids take Algebra by 8th grade, or advanced math in 6th grade is ridiculous. Many need more time to master the basics and there is no shame in that.

This is why the US sucks so bad at math. That algebra in 8th grade is a heavy lift

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Don’t worry your dd will come off waitlist. Most students and parents with the economy and layoffs coming and limited financial aid will drop from ivys. Atleast domestic applicants. I think getting off waitlist for public ivys will be much harder.

Take a look at how many waitlisted, and how many acceptance after waitlist offered. Very small chance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lehigh is a hidden gem, particularly if you could get financial aid from Lehigh.

Hidden? Not.

Hidden to the uninformed. Asian parents often only recognize top 20 schools.

Curious why Asian parents are so hung up on USNWR top 20? So ignorant.

The parents came here for graduate schools in the 80s to 90s, dreaming of ivy league but often ended up in PhD at U of Mississippi. They are familiar with state universities because that's where they studied, they are familiar with T20 because the doors were close for them once. Small schools like LACs do not have PhD programs so they knew very little about them.

[Anonymous]

This is so true just a few days ago. I ran into a few students who got into ivys but were thinking of dropping and committing to uc. Because of limited aid and parents stress of layoffs , and no guarantee of great job prospects 4 years from now based on ai etc

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lehigh is a hidden gem, particularly if you could get financial aid from Lehigh.

Hidden? Not.

Hidden to the uninformed. Asian parents often only recognize top 20 schools.

Curious why Asian parents are so hung up on USNWR top 20? So ignorant.

The parents came here for graduate schools in the 80s to 90s, dreaming of ivy league but often ended up in PhD at U of Mississippi. They are familiar with state universities because that's where they studied, they are familiar with T20 because the doors were close for them once. Small schools like LACs do not have PhD programs so they knew very little about them.

oh they know LACs... they don't want their kids getting a deadend major

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lehigh is a hidden gem, particularly if you could get financial aid from Lehigh.

Hidden? Not.

Hidden to the uninformed. Asian parents often only recognize top 20 schools.

Curious why Asian parents are so hung up on USNWR top 20? So ignorant.

Immigrants from Asia often find the US education system confusing. In that part of the world there are national exams given in HS and the score on that one exam will determine not only which college one goes to and also what field one can study. So they think that their kids need to go to the top few schools to have a good career and life.

In my experience, Asian families where both parents were born here are just like any other family where both parents were born here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lehigh is a hidden gem, particularly if you could get financial aid from Lehigh.

Hidden? Not.

Hidden to the uninformed. Asian parents often only recognize top 20 schools.

Curious why Asian parents are so hung up on USNWR top 20? So ignorant.

Immigrants from Asia often find the US education system confusing. In that part of the world there are national exams given in HS and the score on that one exam will determine not only which college one goes to and also what field one can study. So they think that their kids need to go to the top few schools to have a good career and life.

In my experience, Asian families where both parents were born here are just like any other family where both parents were born here.

+1. Offspring of Asian immigrant parents here, LAC grad, and parent of ‘24 kid. I strongly encouraged them to look at LAC’s but they preferred T-50 universities. I had to remind myself to be more open-minded about my kid looking at larger universities that have name recognition. Things skip a generation?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lehigh is a hidden gem, particularly if you could get financial aid from Lehigh.

Hidden? Not.

Hidden to the uninformed. Asian parents often only recognize top 20 schools.

Curious why Asian parents are so hung up on USNWR top 20? So ignorant.

Immigrants from Asia often find the US education system confusing. In that part of the world there are national exams given in HS and the score on that one exam will determine not only which college one goes to and also what field one can study. So they think that their kids need to go to the top few schools to have a good career and life.

In my experience, Asian families where both parents were born here are just like any other family where both parents were born here.

+1. Offspring of Asian immigrant parents here, LAC grad, and parent of ‘24 kid. I strongly encouraged them to look at LAC’s but they preferred T-50 universities. I had to remind myself to be more open-minded about my kid looking at larger universities that have name recognition. Things skip a generation?

NP. Also offspring of Asian immigrants. Mom was an scientist, Dad an engineer - both got graduate degrees from a public university in the South. My sibs and I were all humanities majors at H/Y/P, and ended up in law, consulting, and banking. LACs weren’t on my family’s radar at that time, but I would’ve loved for my own kid to have considered them. As you said, however, things sometimes skip a generation, and it turns out they’re rather STEM-y like their grandparents - they’re headed to S/M this fall.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lehigh is a hidden gem, particularly if you could get financial aid from Lehigh.

Hidden? Not.

Hidden to the uninformed. Asian parents often only recognize top 20 schools.

Curious why Asian parents are so hung up on USNWR top 20? So ignorant.

Immigrants from Asia often find the US education system confusing. In that part of the world there are national exams given in HS and the score on that one exam will determine not only which college one goes to and also what field one can study. So they think that their kids need to go to the top few schools to have a good career and life.

In my experience, Asian families where both parents were born here are just like any other family where both parents were born here.

+1. Offspring of Asian immigrant parents here, LAC grad, and parent of ‘24 kid. I strongly encouraged them to look at LAC’s but they preferred T-50 universities. I had to remind myself to be more open-minded about my kid looking at larger universities that have name recognition. Things skip a generation?

NP. Also offspring of Asian immigrants. Mom was an scientist, Dad an engineer - both got graduate degrees from a public university in the South. My sibs and I were all humanities majors at H/Y/P, and ended up in law, consulting, and banking. LACs weren’t on my family’s radar at that time, but I would’ve loved for my own kid to have considered them. As you said, however, things sometimes skip a generation, and it turns out they’re rather STEM-y like their grandparents - they’re headed to S/M this fall.

*”a,” not “an”