AAP Center Elimination Rumors

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Every parent will insist their child should be in the advanced class, to get away from the ESOL kids and others slowing the class down if nothing else. That is what the tests are for. Prove it.

They barely use the tests for AAP admissions. The equity report showed that the teacher ratings were the primary factor for admissions. If high test scores guaranteed a spot in AAP, fewer parents would be complaining.

Why should a teacher be able to gatekeep advanced classes any more than some arbitrary score be required to access them? Simply allow all the kids access to the advanced work and see who actually does it - and does it well. Those are the kids who belong in that group.
DP

Precisely because parents like you will never accept that their child doesn't belong in the top group. You refuse to accept either test scores or teacher evaluation to sort who goes where. The teacher evaluation is literally picking which kids could go faster and which need extra help - but you refuse to accept their evaluation. Try again next year with a new teacher, or pay for a third part WISC evaluation to show your child belongs there. Don't make everyone else slow down because you refuse to accept the truth you don't want to hear.

Oh good grief. It's you again. The selection panel is not perfect. Teacher evaluations are not perfect. There are kids getting rejected who have high CogAT scores, high iready scores, and high teacher recommendations. There are other kids getting rejected with high test scores, but for whatever reason, the teacher didn't like the kid. If a kid is above grade level in all measures, the kid should be allowed to access advanced materials. They will slow no one down. Why are you refusing to accept the truth that AAP selection is very imperfect?

I'll throw more anecdotes out there. My gen ed kid frequently didn't have a reading group, because there weren't enough above grade level kids. Meanwhile, my AAP kid got no attention from the AAP teacher, because she had a below grade level group and a few on grade level groups that needed her attention. My gen ed kid had a better math experience than my AAP kid, and the gen ed advanced math class moved faster and had more interesting projects. The reason is that the AAP class constantly had to slow down for the kids who were completely average in math, but in AAP because they were strong at language arts. How does any of this make sense?

DP. Well said. I find it incomprehensible that many kids are accepted into AAP with below grade level reading and writing skills. The rationale seems to be, “Oh, Johnny is really good at math - his reading skills will develop in time.” Math seems to be the main criteria for being chosen. Meanwhile, kids who are leap years ahead in reading /writing, are considered ineligible because they aren’t advanced in math. So idiotic!

Just have advanced groups for all subjects so that each kid can access the correct level per subject. And no - not in one classroom. Different classes for different levels per subject.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't care if they get rid of Centers or not. What I do care about is that they drop kids who don't belong in AAP every year. Didn't get pass advanced in SOLs or 90+ percentile on both iready tests? OUT.

Exactly. The whole point is to not be slow the class down pulling up the stragglers. And to the poster who is just sure her child belongs if not for the mean test scores saying no - maybe you should prep your kid for the test if you are so convinced they'd be fine with all the work. Tests are the most fair way to evaluate aptitude that we have. The line has to be drawn somewhere. It's already too low, as shown by all the whining here about other kids that got in. I'd love for it to be higher. However, we'd just be hearing from a different set of parents instead of you.

No, the whole point is that fcps should keep their word and start meeting all kids where they are at.
The fact that there are kids in aap dragging it down and kids in ge sitting around running out of work to do (per the teacher, not just the kids saying it) illustrates the problems with the current system. Maybe if all kids were met where they were at, less on the fringe parents would apply just because.

Sounds like your problem is with the gen ed class experience. Why don't you complain and do something about that and quit bringing the AAP kids into it?

I doubt it is happening in GenED as you say. And, if it is happening in GenED, it would also be applicable to AAP.. Do you not think that the ones who just barely slip in AAP could be bringing down the truly GT kids?

And, did you never take a test and finish before everyone else and have to wait for others to finish?

The irony of the parents here arguing their kid who was denied entrance should have AAP full time but also arguing about "the ones who just barely slip in AAP could be bringing down the truly GT kids."

DP. Once again: no one is arguing their kids should have "full time" AAP. The argument has been made that each core subject should have flexible groupings so that one teacher would handle the advanced language arts kids, another the grade-level - LA kids, another the remedial LA kids. And so on for each subject.

The point - which you are no doubt deliberately missing because you just enjoy arguing - is that ALL KIDS should be able to access the ability grouping that is best for THEM, per subject. Not that there should be this idiotic division of students as either/or AAP / Gen Ed. There is a huge amount of overlap and gray area here.

Go back and read. There are definitely parents who believe their kid should be in it full time.

And no, I'm not deliberately missing the point. What you are missing is that your kid IS accessing the program that is best for them. I get that you believe they should be placed higher for certain subjects, but you aren't exactly an objective source.

DP. Wow, the snobbery here. You do realize, I hope, that the AAP selection is based on feelings rather than data. There are kids with high test scores who are above grade level in all measures who get rejected from AAP. Some even have the support from their teachers and still get rejected. For some, they get rejected because even though all objective evidence says that the kid is highly gifted, the teacher just didn't like the kid and gave a low rating. Many kids are rejected from AAP when it IS the program that is best for them. Many are accepted when AAP absolutely IS NOT the program that is best for them. Even the AARTs are often confused by kids who are rejected who look like they have the profile of an AAP kid and kids who are accepted with very little to suggest that they belong in AAP.

Years ago, my kid who was rejected from AAP with a 97th percentile unprepped CogAT, above grade level in math and reading, and with high teacher recommendation. They earned perfect scores on the 3rd grade SOLs. Meanwhile, over half of the kids in AAP at the center failed to even earn pass advanced on the reading SOL. Are you really going to insist that those kids "needed" AAP, but mine was unworthy?

If you are still this worked up over a rejection that happened years ago, seek therapy.

How do you know so much about what AAP kids are scoring and your kid wasn't even in the class? According to DCUM if he was rejected and relegated to GenEd, then no one would talk to him. Tracking other people's kids academic progress is very strange and unhealthily obsessive. Especially when you remember that info years later.

DP. Trust me my 'gen ed' kid knows which aap kids he's smarter than. They all know which kids aren't keeping up and are getting pulled out for extra help. It all comes out in the end.

You trust the word of a 10 year old claiming he is smarter than some other random kids? Bizarre and embarrassing that you are using that as a serious argument.

I know, right? Kind of like 8 yr. olds (and up) telling their Gen Ed peers how much smarter they are because they were placed in AAP. Who would actually believe that? I would be mortified if my own kids ever did something like that. Bizarre and embarrassing, indeed.
DP

I agree! I would be even more mortified if I took what an 8 year old said to heart and obsessed over it for years and even tried to dismantle the program because my kid didn't get in! Embarrassing indeed.

Wildly pathetic. If it's true that "all the non AAP kids are in the HS honors classes anyway" then why are they fighting like hell to get their kids in? Jealously is so unbecoming.

DP. A better question would be, why are AAP parents fighting like hell to exclude all of the other kids who are perfectly able to do what amounts to a slightly advanced curriculum - especially since you know full well our kids will be together in high school honors and AP classes. Not to mention, colleges...

News flash: We aren’t. Your kid is selected, great! And I don’t care that our kids will be together in HS. It’s the peer group now that helps set the important path.

Segregation

It's not segregation when every student has the opportunity to be selected for the group.

Not having your student is selected for something is not a valid claim of discrimination. Everyone is eligible, not everyone can be selected. This same logic applies to sports teams and theater shows and a thousand other things in life.

Filling your student's head with this nonsense is a real misrepresentation all around.

Technically, everyone CAN be selected. There is no cap on AAP admissions. It is segregation when the selection process is opaque and not based on any objective metrics. It also is segregation when the bottom half of the AAP kids and the top 10% of the gen ed kids are completely indistinguishable.

This ^^. Which is why the previous GT program worked. Only the very few truly gifted kids were in the gifted program. Advanced work was available to all the other kids (as well as remedial, etc). That was back when FCPS actually had common sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Jealous GenEd parents are so embarrassing. Get a grip. Sorry your kid isn't my kid.

Karma....

+1
Karma will roll around in high school.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't care if they get rid of Centers or not. What I do care about is that they drop kids who don't belong in AAP every year. Didn't get pass advanced in SOLs or 90+ percentile on both iready tests? OUT.

Exactly. The whole point is to not be slow the class down pulling up the stragglers. And to the poster who is just sure her child belongs if not for the mean test scores saying no - maybe you should prep your kid for the test if you are so convinced they'd be fine with all the work. Tests are the most fair way to evaluate aptitude that we have. The line has to be drawn somewhere. It's already too low, as shown by all the whining here about other kids that got in. I'd love for it to be higher. However, we'd just be hearing from a different set of parents instead of you.

No, the whole point is that fcps should keep their word and start meeting all kids where they are at.
The fact that there are kids in aap dragging it down and kids in ge sitting around running out of work to do (per the teacher, not just the kids saying it) illustrates the problems with the current system. Maybe if all kids were met where they were at, less on the fringe parents would apply just because.

Sounds like your problem is with the gen ed class experience. Why don't you complain and do something about that and quit bringing the AAP kids into it?

I doubt it is happening in GenED as you say. And, if it is happening in GenED, it would also be applicable to AAP.. Do you not think that the ones who just barely slip in AAP could be bringing down the truly GT kids?

And, did you never take a test and finish before everyone else and have to wait for others to finish?

The irony of the parents here arguing their kid who was denied entrance should have AAP full time but also arguing about "the ones who just barely slip in AAP could be bringing down the truly GT kids."

DP. Once again: no one is arguing their kids should have "full time" AAP. The argument has been made that each core subject should have flexible groupings so that one teacher would handle the advanced language arts kids, another the grade-level - LA kids, another the remedial LA kids. And so on for each subject.

The point - which you are no doubt deliberately missing because you just enjoy arguing - is that ALL KIDS should be able to access the ability grouping that is best for THEM, per subject. Not that there should be this idiotic division of students as either/or AAP / Gen Ed. There is a huge amount of overlap and gray area here.

Go back and read. There are definitely parents who believe their kid should be in it full time.

And no, I'm not deliberately missing the point. What you are missing is that your kid IS accessing the program that is best for them. I get that you believe they should be placed higher for certain subjects, but you aren't exactly an objective source.

DP. Wow, the snobbery here. You do realize, I hope, that the AAP selection is based on feelings rather than data. There are kids with high test scores who are above grade level in all measures who get rejected from AAP. Some even have the support from their teachers and still get rejected. For some, they get rejected because even though all objective evidence says that the kid is highly gifted, the teacher just didn't like the kid and gave a low rating. Many kids are rejected from AAP when it IS the program that is best for them. Many are accepted when AAP absolutely IS NOT the program that is best for them. Even the AARTs are often confused by kids who are rejected who look like they have the profile of an AAP kid and kids who are accepted with very little to suggest that they belong in AAP.

Years ago, my kid who was rejected from AAP with a 97th percentile unprepped CogAT, above grade level in math and reading, and with high teacher recommendation. They earned perfect scores on the 3rd grade SOLs. Meanwhile, over half of the kids in AAP at the center failed to even earn pass advanced on the reading SOL. Are you really going to insist that those kids "needed" AAP, but mine was unworthy?

If you are still this worked up over a rejection that happened years ago, seek therapy.

How do you know so much about what AAP kids are scoring and your kid wasn't even in the class? According to DCUM if he was rejected and relegated to GenEd, then no one would talk to him. Tracking other people's kids academic progress is very strange and unhealthily obsessive. Especially when you remember that info years later.

DP. Trust me my 'gen ed' kid knows which aap kids he's smarter than. They all know which kids aren't keeping up and are getting pulled out for extra help. It all comes out in the end.

You trust the word of a 10 year old claiming he is smarter than some other random kids? Bizarre and embarrassing that you are using that as a serious argument.

I know, right? Kind of like 8 yr. olds (and up) telling their Gen Ed peers how much smarter they are because they were placed in AAP. Who would actually believe that? I would be mortified if my own kids ever did something like that. Bizarre and embarrassing, indeed.
DP

I agree! I would be even more mortified if I took what an 8 year old said to heart and obsessed over it for years and even tried to dismantle the program because my kid didn't get in! Embarrassing indeed.

Wildly pathetic. If it's true that "all the non AAP kids are in the HS honors classes anyway" then why are they fighting like hell to get their kids in? Jealously is so unbecoming.

DP. A better question would be, why are AAP parents fighting like hell to exclude all of the other kids who are perfectly able to do what amounts to a slightly advanced curriculum - especially since you know full well our kids will be together in high school honors and AP classes. Not to mention, colleges...

News flash: We aren’t. Your kid is selected, great! And I don’t care that our kids will be together in HS. It’s the peer group now that helps set the important path.

My kids Gen Ed peer group is fine. It's the access to the curriculum kids needs that is lacking

+1
My kid’s Gen Ed peers are bright and capable and most would have no issues with the AAP work.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't care if they get rid of Centers or not. What I do care about is that they drop kids who don't belong in AAP every year. Didn't get pass advanced in SOLs or 90+ percentile on both iready tests? OUT.

Exactly. The whole point is to not be slow the class down pulling up the stragglers. And to the poster who is just sure her child belongs if not for the mean test scores saying no - maybe you should prep your kid for the test if you are so convinced they'd be fine with all the work. Tests are the most fair way to evaluate aptitude that we have. The line has to be drawn somewhere. It's already too low, as shown by all the whining here about other kids that got in. I'd love for it to be higher. However, we'd just be hearing from a different set of parents instead of you.

No, the whole point is that fcps should keep their word and start meeting all kids where they are at.
The fact that there are kids in aap dragging it down and kids in ge sitting around running out of work to do (per the teacher, not just the kids saying it) illustrates the problems with the current system. Maybe if all kids were met where they were at, less on the fringe parents would apply just because.

Sounds like your problem is with the gen ed class experience. Why don't you complain and do something about that and quit bringing the AAP kids into it?

I doubt it is happening in GenED as you say. And, if it is happening in GenED, it would also be applicable to AAP.. Do you not think that the ones who just barely slip in AAP could be bringing down the truly GT kids?

And, did you never take a test and finish before everyone else and have to wait for others to finish?

The irony of the parents here arguing their kid who was denied entrance should have AAP full time but also arguing about "the ones who just barely slip in AAP could be bringing down the truly GT kids."

DP. Once again: no one is arguing their kids should have "full time" AAP. The argument has been made that each core subject should have flexible groupings so that one teacher would handle the advanced language arts kids, another the grade-level - LA kids, another the remedial LA kids. And so on for each subject.

The point - which you are no doubt deliberately missing because you just enjoy arguing - is that ALL KIDS should be able to access the ability grouping that is best for THEM, per subject. Not that there should be this idiotic division of students as either/or AAP / Gen Ed. There is a huge amount of overlap and gray area here.

Go back and read. There are definitely parents who believe their kid should be in it full time.

And no, I'm not deliberately missing the point. What you are missing is that your kid IS accessing the program that is best for them. I get that you believe they should be placed higher for certain subjects, but you aren't exactly an objective source.

DP. Wow, the snobbery here. You do realize, I hope, that the AAP selection is based on feelings rather than data. There are kids with high test scores who are above grade level in all measures who get rejected from AAP. Some even have the support from their teachers and still get rejected. For some, they get rejected because even though all objective evidence says that the kid is highly gifted, the teacher just didn't like the kid and gave a low rating. Many kids are rejected from AAP when it IS the program that is best for them. Many are accepted when AAP absolutely IS NOT the program that is best for them. Even the AARTs are often confused by kids who are rejected who look like they have the profile of an AAP kid and kids who are accepted with very little to suggest that they belong in AAP.

Years ago, my kid who was rejected from AAP with a 97th percentile unprepped CogAT, above grade level in math and reading, and with high teacher recommendation. They earned perfect scores on the 3rd grade SOLs. Meanwhile, over half of the kids in AAP at the center failed to even earn pass advanced on the reading SOL. Are you really going to insist that those kids "needed" AAP, but mine was unworthy?

If you are still this worked up over a rejection that happened years ago, seek therapy.

How do you know so much about what AAP kids are scoring and your kid wasn't even in the class? According to DCUM if he was rejected and relegated to GenEd, then no one would talk to him. Tracking other people's kids academic progress is very strange and unhealthily obsessive. Especially when you remember that info years later.

DP. Trust me my 'gen ed' kid knows which aap kids he's smarter than. They all know which kids aren't keeping up and are getting pulled out for extra help. It all comes out in the end.

You trust the word of a 10 year old claiming he is smarter than some other random kids? Bizarre and embarrassing that you are using that as a serious argument.

I know, right? Kind of like 8 yr. olds (and up) telling their Gen Ed peers how much smarter they are because they were placed in AAP. Who would actually believe that? I would be mortified if my own kids ever did something like that. Bizarre and embarrassing, indeed.
DP

I agree! I would be even more mortified if I took what an 8 year old said to heart and obsessed over it for years and even tried to dismantle the program because my kid didn't get in! Embarrassing indeed.

Wildly pathetic. If it's true that "all the non AAP kids are in the HS honors classes anyway" then why are they fighting like hell to get their kids in? Jealously is so unbecoming.

DP. A better question would be, why are AAP parents fighting like hell to exclude all of the other kids who are perfectly able to do what amounts to a slightly advanced curriculum - especially since you know full well our kids will be together in high school honors and AP classes. Not to mention, colleges...

News flash: We aren’t. Your kid is selected, great! And I don’t care that our kids will be together in HS. It’s the peer group now that helps set the important path.

Segregation

It's not segregation when every student has the opportunity to be selected for the group.

Not having your student is selected for something is not a valid claim of discrimination. Everyone is eligible, not everyone can be selected. This same logic applies to sports teams and theater shows and a thousand other things in life.

Filling your student's head with this nonsense is a real misrepresentation all around.

Technically, everyone CAN be selected. There is no cap on AAP admissions. It is segregation when the selection process is opaque and not based on any objective metrics. It also is segregation when the bottom half of the AAP kids and the top 10% of the gen ed kids are completely indistinguishable.

I think you should do more research on the definition of segregation and how it does not apply here. Tossing around inflammatory words without any real application is not only ignorant, it's harmful.

DP. I would say using phrases such as, “better peer group” is just as ignorant and harmful. Wouldn’t you?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't care if they get rid of Centers or not. What I do care about is that they drop kids who don't belong in AAP every year. Didn't get pass advanced in SOLs or 90+ percentile on both iready tests? OUT.

Exactly. The whole point is to not be slow the class down pulling up the stragglers. And to the poster who is just sure her child belongs if not for the mean test scores saying no - maybe you should prep your kid for the test if you are so convinced they'd be fine with all the work. Tests are the most fair way to evaluate aptitude that we have. The line has to be drawn somewhere. It's already too low, as shown by all the whining here about other kids that got in. I'd love for it to be higher. However, we'd just be hearing from a different set of parents instead of you.

No, the whole point is that fcps should keep their word and start meeting all kids where they are at.
The fact that there are kids in aap dragging it down and kids in ge sitting around running out of work to do (per the teacher, not just the kids saying it) illustrates the problems with the current system. Maybe if all kids were met where they were at, less on the fringe parents would apply just because.

Sounds like your problem is with the gen ed class experience. Why don't you complain and do something about that and quit bringing the AAP kids into it?

I doubt it is happening in GenED as you say. And, if it is happening in GenED, it would also be applicable to AAP.. Do you not think that the ones who just barely slip in AAP could be bringing down the truly GT kids?

And, did you never take a test and finish before everyone else and have to wait for others to finish?

The irony of the parents here arguing their kid who was denied entrance should have AAP full time but also arguing about "the ones who just barely slip in AAP could be bringing down the truly GT kids."

DP. Once again: no one is arguing their kids should have "full time" AAP. The argument has been made that each core subject should have flexible groupings so that one teacher would handle the advanced language arts kids, another the grade-level - LA kids, another the remedial LA kids. And so on for each subject.

The point - which you are no doubt deliberately missing because you just enjoy arguing - is that ALL KIDS should be able to access the ability grouping that is best for THEM, per subject. Not that there should be this idiotic division of students as either/or AAP / Gen Ed. There is a huge amount of overlap and gray area here.

Go back and read. There are definitely parents who believe their kid should be in it full time.

And no, I'm not deliberately missing the point. What you are missing is that your kid IS accessing the program that is best for them. I get that you believe they should be placed higher for certain subjects, but you aren't exactly an objective source.

DP. Wow, the snobbery here. You do realize, I hope, that the AAP selection is based on feelings rather than data. There are kids with high test scores who are above grade level in all measures who get rejected from AAP. Some even have the support from their teachers and still get rejected. For some, they get rejected because even though all objective evidence says that the kid is highly gifted, the teacher just didn't like the kid and gave a low rating. Many kids are rejected from AAP when it IS the program that is best for them. Many are accepted when AAP absolutely IS NOT the program that is best for them. Even the AARTs are often confused by kids who are rejected who look like they have the profile of an AAP kid and kids who are accepted with very little to suggest that they belong in AAP.

Years ago, my kid who was rejected from AAP with a 97th percentile unprepped CogAT, above grade level in math and reading, and with high teacher recommendation. They earned perfect scores on the 3rd grade SOLs. Meanwhile, over half of the kids in AAP at the center failed to even earn pass advanced on the reading SOL. Are you really going to insist that those kids "needed" AAP, but mine was unworthy?

If you are still this worked up over a rejection that happened years ago, seek therapy.

How do you know so much about what AAP kids are scoring and your kid wasn't even in the class? According to DCUM if he was rejected and relegated to GenEd, then no one would talk to him. Tracking other people's kids academic progress is very strange and unhealthily obsessive. Especially when you remember that info years later.

DP. Trust me my 'gen ed' kid knows which aap kids he's smarter than. They all know which kids aren't keeping up and are getting pulled out for extra help. It all comes out in the end.

You trust the word of a 10 year old claiming he is smarter than some other random kids? Bizarre and embarrassing that you are using that as a serious argument.

I know, right? Kind of like 8 yr. olds (and up) telling their Gen Ed peers how much smarter they are because they were placed in AAP. Who would actually believe that? I would be mortified if my own kids ever did something like that. Bizarre and embarrassing, indeed.
DP

I agree! I would be even more mortified if I took what an 8 year old said to heart and obsessed over it for years and even tried to dismantle the program because my kid didn't get in! Embarrassing indeed.

Wildly pathetic. If it's true that "all the non AAP kids are in the HS honors classes anyway" then why are they fighting like hell to get their kids in? Jealously is so unbecoming.

DP. A better question would be, why are AAP parents fighting like hell to exclude all of the other kids who are perfectly able to do what amounts to a slightly advanced curriculum - especially since you know full well our kids will be together in high school honors and AP classes. Not to mention, colleges...

News flash: We aren’t. Your kid is selected, great! And I don’t care that our kids will be together in HS. It’s the peer group now that helps set the important path.

Segregation

It's not segregation when every student has the opportunity to be selected for the group.

Not having your student is selected for something is not a valid claim of discrimination. Everyone is eligible, not everyone can be selected. This same logic applies to sports teams and theater shows and a thousand other things in life.

Filling your student's head with this nonsense is a real misrepresentation all around.

Trying to keep your kid away from the poors is segregation.

Shame on you for calling the non AAP kids "the poors." Do better.

Shame on the people who are using AAP to isolate themselves from “the poors”.

Sorry, PP. You tipped your hand. Now we all know your desperate reason to try to get your kid in AAP. Disgusting

DP. My kids attend a high SES elementary center. There are no “poors.” The vast majority of the kids there are bright and from highly educated families. The base schools that feed to this center also have AAP. This is the case in many schools across FCPS - centers are wasteful, divisive, and redundant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We should stop commenting on this post people AAP centers aren’t being eliminated.

I will continue to advocate for centers to end whether you approve or not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe the school board (or County Board of Supervisors) would move to eliminate a program that is an attraction for county residents (and thereby tax dollars/county revenue). Plenty of people look at FCPS as a model system, believe it or not. Why would they give the appearance that they are dumbing down anything? Like it or lump it, the AAP program and centers are here to stay.

I think there is a difference between eliminating AAP as a program and eliminating or reducing centers. An easy fix is if local level IV is available if you choose to go to center you provide transportation.

Center haters are salty that AAP kids get to choose centers as an option. They claim the cost of bussing to the centers is too high but they would still complain if parents were required to drive AAP students to the centers.

Well, yes. Why on earth should any kid get to “choose” a different school when the curriculum is offered at their base school? How is that in any way fair?

If a high schooler was zoned to a school that offered Russian or Chinese (just as examples) but decided they wanted to transfer to another school to take the same language, that request would be denied. As it should be.
DP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe the school board (or County Board of Supervisors) would move to eliminate a program that is an attraction for county residents (and thereby tax dollars/county revenue). Plenty of people look at FCPS as a model system, believe it or not. Why would they give the appearance that they are dumbing down anything? Like it or lump it, the AAP program and centers are here to stay.

I think there is a difference between eliminating AAP as a program and eliminating or reducing centers. An easy fix is if local level IV is available if you choose to go to center you provide transportation.

Center haters are salty that AAP kids get to choose centers as an option. They claim the cost of bussing to the centers is too high but they would still complain if parents were required to drive AAP students to the centers.

Why should they get to choose? If there are enough AAP kids at a school to fill at least two classes, why should there be school choice?

Middle school centers are the most ridiculous.

+1
But I think all centers are ridiculous. At this point, there are very few schools which don’t offer AAP. What a redundant waste of resources to keep offering centers (and free transportation) to kids who already have AAP in their base school.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't care if they get rid of Centers or not. What I do care about is that they drop kids who don't belong in AAP every year. Didn't get pass advanced in SOLs or 90+ percentile on both iready tests? OUT.

Exactly. The whole point is to not be slow the class down pulling up the stragglers. And to the poster who is just sure her child belongs if not for the mean test scores saying no - maybe you should prep your kid for the test if you are so convinced they'd be fine with all the work. Tests are the most fair way to evaluate aptitude that we have. The line has to be drawn somewhere. It's already too low, as shown by all the whining here about other kids that got in. I'd love for it to be higher. However, we'd just be hearing from a different set of parents instead of you.

No, the whole point is that fcps should keep their word and start meeting all kids where they are at.
The fact that there are kids in aap dragging it down and kids in ge sitting around running out of work to do (per the teacher, not just the kids saying it) illustrates the problems with the current system. Maybe if all kids were met where they were at, less on the fringe parents would apply just because.

Sounds like your problem is with the gen ed class experience. Why don't you complain and do something about that and quit bringing the AAP kids into it?

I doubt it is happening in GenED as you say. And, if it is happening in GenED, it would also be applicable to AAP.. Do you not think that the ones who just barely slip in AAP could be bringing down the truly GT kids?

And, did you never take a test and finish before everyone else and have to wait for others to finish?

The irony of the parents here arguing their kid who was denied entrance should have AAP full time but also arguing about "the ones who just barely slip in AAP could be bringing down the truly GT kids."

DP. Once again: no one is arguing their kids should have "full time" AAP. The argument has been made that each core subject should have flexible groupings so that one teacher would handle the advanced language arts kids, another the grade-level - LA kids, another the remedial LA kids. And so on for each subject.

The point - which you are no doubt deliberately missing because you just enjoy arguing - is that ALL KIDS should be able to access the ability grouping that is best for THEM, per subject. Not that there should be this idiotic division of students as either/or AAP / Gen Ed. There is a huge amount of overlap and gray area here.

Go back and read. There are definitely parents who believe their kid should be in it full time.

And no, I'm not deliberately missing the point. What you are missing is that your kid IS accessing the program that is best for them. I get that you believe they should be placed higher for certain subjects, but you aren't exactly an objective source.

DP. Wow, the snobbery here. You do realize, I hope, that the AAP selection is based on feelings rather than data. There are kids with high test scores who are above grade level in all measures who get rejected from AAP. Some even have the support from their teachers and still get rejected. For some, they get rejected because even though all objective evidence says that the kid is highly gifted, the teacher just didn't like the kid and gave a low rating. Many kids are rejected from AAP when it IS the program that is best for them. Many are accepted when AAP absolutely IS NOT the program that is best for them. Even the AARTs are often confused by kids who are rejected who look like they have the profile of an AAP kid and kids who are accepted with very little to suggest that they belong in AAP.

Years ago, my kid who was rejected from AAP with a 97th percentile unprepped CogAT, above grade level in math and reading, and with high teacher recommendation. They earned perfect scores on the 3rd grade SOLs. Meanwhile, over half of the kids in AAP at the center failed to even earn pass advanced on the reading SOL. Are you really going to insist that those kids "needed" AAP, but mine was unworthy?

If you are still this worked up over a rejection that happened years ago, seek therapy.

How do you know so much about what AAP kids are scoring and your kid wasn't even in the class? According to DCUM if he was rejected and relegated to GenEd, then no one would talk to him. Tracking other people's kids academic progress is very strange and unhealthily obsessive. Especially when you remember that info years later.

DP. Trust me my 'gen ed' kid knows which aap kids he's smarter than. They all know which kids aren't keeping up and are getting pulled out for extra help. It all comes out in the end.

You trust the word of a 10 year old claiming he is smarter than some other random kids? Bizarre and embarrassing that you are using that as a serious argument.

I know, right? Kind of like 8 yr. olds (and up) telling their Gen Ed peers how much smarter they are because they were placed in AAP. Who would actually believe that? I would be mortified if my own kids ever did something like that. Bizarre and embarrassing, indeed.
DP

I agree! I would be even more mortified if I took what an 8 year old said to heart and obsessed over it for years and even tried to dismantle the program because my kid didn't get in! Embarrassing indeed.

Wildly pathetic. If it's true that "all the non AAP kids are in the HS honors classes anyway" then why are they fighting like hell to get their kids in? Jealously is so unbecoming.

DP. A better question would be, why are AAP parents fighting like hell to exclude all of the other kids who are perfectly able to do what amounts to a slightly advanced curriculum - especially since you know full well our kids will be together in high school honors and AP classes. Not to mention, colleges...

News flash: We aren’t. Your kid is selected, great! And I don’t care that our kids will be together in HS. It’s the peer group now that helps set the important path.

Segregation

It's not segregation when every student has the opportunity to be selected for the group.

Not having your student is selected for something is not a valid claim of discrimination. Everyone is eligible, not everyone can be selected. This same logic applies to sports teams and theater shows and a thousand other things in life.

Filling your student's head with this nonsense is a real misrepresentation all around.

Trying to keep your kid away from the poors is segregation.

Shame on you for calling the non AAP kids "the poors." Do better.

Shame on the people who are using AAP to isolate themselves from “the poors”.

Sorry, PP. You tipped your hand. Now we all know your desperate reason to try to get your kid in AAP. Disgusting

Cute gaslighting.

We chose to send our kids to our neighborhood school.

Some parents, including the “peer group” PP above, choose AAP because they want to avoid “the poors”.

AAP should be dismantled.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We should stop commenting on this post people AAP centers aren’t being eliminated.

I don't know about eliminated but there are certainly some School Board members who think every middle school should be its own AAP center and continuing to bus out-of-boundary kids to schools like Carson is ridiculous. Unfortunately, their silly boundary study is now well underway and the consultants are making recommendations based on current enrollments that include AAP placements. It's hard to advocate for a change in the current AAP model when you sit back and do nothing when Reid and her staff approach a county-wide boundary study ass-backwards.

Someone has sense. It is ridiculous to bus to MS centers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe the school board (or County Board of Supervisors) would move to eliminate a program that is an attraction for county residents (and thereby tax dollars/county revenue). Plenty of people look at FCPS as a model system, believe it or not. Why would they give the appearance that they are dumbing down anything? Like it or lump it, the AAP program and centers are here to stay.

I think there is a difference between eliminating AAP as a program and eliminating or reducing centers. An easy fix is if local level IV is available if you choose to go to center you provide transportation.

Center haters are salty that AAP kids get to choose centers as an option. They claim the cost of bussing to the centers is too high but they would still complain if parents were required to drive AAP students to the centers.

Center haters hate when their base school is a center because some of the families are a holes about it. If people could stop being so pretentious about an elementary school accomplishment AND if the center schools could find a way to meet every student where they are at including the top of GE kids who are sitting around waiting half the time, then it would be fine ...

DP. I agree and disagree. Our community school became a center only after we had moved to the neighborhood. So much for that nice community school we thought we were getting.

I think centers should be a thing of the past and FCPS should stop sticking labels on elementary schoolers. Just offer all the levels needed in different classrooms and let the kids attend whichever suits their needs at any given time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe the school board (or County Board of Supervisors) would move to eliminate a program that is an attraction for county residents (and thereby tax dollars/county revenue). Plenty of people look at FCPS as a model system, believe it or not. Why would they give the appearance that they are dumbing down anything? Like it or lump it, the AAP program and centers are here to stay.

I think there is a difference between eliminating AAP as a program and eliminating or reducing centers. An easy fix is if local level IV is available if you choose to go to center you provide transportation.

Center haters are salty that AAP kids get to choose centers as an option. They claim the cost of bussing to the centers is too high but they would still complain if parents were required to drive AAP students to the centers.

Well, yes. Why on earth should any kid get to “choose” a different school when the curriculum is offered at their base school? How is that in any way fair?

If a high schooler was zoned to a school that offered Russian or Chinese (just as examples) but decided they wanted to transfer to another school to take the same language, that request would be denied. As it should be.
DP

Our base ES is in a "nearly" Title I school with LLIV; few kids qualify for full-time AAP and even fewer stay at the base school for LLIV. Not nearly enough for a full class per grade. The LLIV kids are a handful per grade and "clustered." It's really a Gen Ed program in the guise of LLIV because the teacher has to teach the kids she is assigned, including a significant number who are in danger of failing the third grade SOLs.

[Anonymous]

I have only two requests for AAP, and I think it's really telling that some AAP parents don't like these ideas:

1. Reevaluate based on in class performance and standardized test scores each year.

2. Eliminate middle school centers and have dedicated AAP classes available at every middle school.

Would love to hear why AAP parents don't like these two ideas. if your child belongs, your child belongs. If your child is offered dedicated AAP classes, then your child gets to take them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe the school board (or County Board of Supervisors) would move to eliminate a program that is an attraction for county residents (and thereby tax dollars/county revenue). Plenty of people look at FCPS as a model system, believe it or not. Why would they give the appearance that they are dumbing down anything? Like it or lump it, the AAP program and centers are here to stay.

I think there is a difference between eliminating AAP as a program and eliminating or reducing centers. An easy fix is if local level IV is available if you choose to go to center you provide transportation.

Center haters are salty that AAP kids get to choose centers as an option. They claim the cost of bussing to the centers is too high but they would still complain if parents were required to drive AAP students to the centers.

Well, yes. Why on earth should any kid get to “choose” a different school when the curriculum is offered at their base school? How is that in any way fair?

If a high schooler was zoned to a school that offered Russian or Chinese (just as examples) but decided they wanted to transfer to another school to take the same language, that request would be denied. As it should be.
DP

Our base ES is in a "nearly" Title I school with LLIV; few kids qualify for full-time AAP and even fewer stay at the base school for LLIV. Not nearly enough for a full class per grade. The LLIV kids are a handful per grade and "clustered." It's really a Gen Ed program in the guise of LLIV because the teacher has to teach the kids she is assigned, including a significant number who are in danger of failing the third grade SOLs.

Wouldn't the cohort of local level IV be larger reducing that issue if they all stayed?