GA & MLS NEXT Form Strategic Alliance

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is strategic, not something that will happen overnight.

When DA folded, ECNL was there, established, and had positioned themselves to take over the girls game.

That is the position GA is in right now. No one knows where college will be in the next 3+ years. Last I heard they were wanting to be governed by US Soccer as well…

1000% true.

Eventually NWSL is going to need to focus on the quality of the product they put on the field. Once this happens GA MLSN and US Soccer will be where they turn.

Lol. Why the GA?

Firstly because they are self sanctioned now, less red tape compared to ECNL.

Second, NWSL will get more of what it wants. ECNL doesn’t need a pro pathway, and they’re not setup for it, easier to set the pathway up from GA than a platform that is largely a scholarship program.

Third, have you seen women’s college soccer? It’s awful. Watch the national championship, first touches bouncing 8 yards like a u-little match. That is what academy soccer produces for NCAA. If you were NWSL wouldn’t you want a platform that you can shape almost ground up vs current brick-touch Academy soccer?

I assumed the atrocious technical skills at the “top” local clubs was a reflection of the DMV ECNL-G programs and things were different in the bigger US soccer markets, but, after watching several women’s games in the NCAA tournament a few weeks ago, it seems to me we have a universal and systemic problem in the US. I don’t watch much NWSL, but it’s not like this in the pro women’s leagues in England and Spain. I’m not commenting on overall quality as it goes without saying that a pro in one of those leagues should be a better player than someone playing even in a top college program. I’m commenting on basic skills, like receiving the ball, that young adults should have developed years ago. But I don’t see how GA is any better positioned to fix things—there just aren’t enough good coaches in the US.

Outside of Real Madrid and Barcelona, NWSL teams are better than teams in the Spanish league. NWSL is also a better league than the English League based on quality of players and teams.

Nobody on UNC or Wake Forest could “receive the ball”? Please stop.

Tell me you know nothing about women’s sports without telling me you know nothing about women’s sports.

Did you watch the match? The best ECNL teams could compete against either WFU or UNC. Neither UNC nor WFU could hold a candle to the Houston Dash.

The college soccer technical skills is seriously lacking. It is no longer a stepping stone or development stage for pro-soccer. They just aren’t doing the right sort of work at that level to create pro-level talent. If you can’t see that, you know nothing about soccer.

College sports has never been a developmental stage for pros in any sport. Just because it’s where players sometimes go first does not make it developmental. College coaches are just trying to win games. That is their job and they’ll lose it otherwise. Every coaching decision they make is to win games. As it should be. Rosters, playing time, positions, game strategy, recruiting.

The only ones with any vested interest in true development for the pros would be the pro teams themselves. Not because they love the game of soccer but because they want to win games.

That's the weird thing. Both college and pro coaches are just trying to win + development means nothing to either. However women's college soccer for the most part is just bad soccer. You'd think that eventually some of the top youth coaches that do play very good soccer would eventually filter up to college levels but they don't.

I think the issue with college sports is that it's all a who you know type of environment. Wins are important but knowing the dean on a first name basis is more important. This type of mentality trickles down into who gets recruited and which divisions colleges play in, etc etc etc.

Hopefully NCAA blowing up will bring a new environment.

What does bad soccer even mean to a college coach? There is only winning and losing. Winning is good for them.

Bad soccer is wins from playing a style that won't scale up. Yes you can win against terrible teams playing bootball. But no you will never beat good teams with bootball.

I agree with you at the end of the day wins are all that matter. If you can see a team that's winning but they're doing something that won't work against better teams that is bad soccer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is strategic, not something that will happen overnight.

When DA folded, ECNL was there, established, and had positioned themselves to take over the girls game.

That is the position GA is in right now. No one knows where college will be in the next 3+ years. Last I heard they were wanting to be governed by US Soccer as well…

1000% true.

Eventually NWSL is going to need to focus on the quality of the product they put on the field. Once this happens GA MLSN and US Soccer will be where they turn.

Lol. Why the GA?

Firstly because they are self sanctioned now, less red tape compared to ECNL.

Second, NWSL will get more of what it wants. ECNL doesn’t need a pro pathway, and they’re not setup for it, easier to set the pathway up from GA than a platform that is largely a scholarship program.

Third, have you seen women’s college soccer? It’s awful. Watch the national championship, first touches bouncing 8 yards like a u-little match. That is what academy soccer produces for NCAA. If you were NWSL wouldn’t you want a platform that you can shape almost ground up vs current brick-touch Academy soccer?

I assumed the atrocious technical skills at the “top” local clubs was a reflection of the DMV ECNL-G programs and things were different in the bigger US soccer markets, but, after watching several women’s games in the NCAA tournament a few weeks ago, it seems to me we have a universal and systemic problem in the US. I don’t watch much NWSL, but it’s not like this in the pro women’s leagues in England and Spain. I’m not commenting on overall quality as it goes without saying that a pro in one of those leagues should be a better player than someone playing even in a top college program. I’m commenting on basic skills, like receiving the ball, that young adults should have developed years ago. But I don’t see how GA is any better positioned to fix things—there just aren’t enough good coaches in the US.

Outside of Real Madrid and Barcelona, NWSL teams are better than teams in the Spanish league. NWSL is also a better league than the English League based on quality of players and teams.

Nobody on UNC or Wake Forest could “receive the ball”? Please stop.

Tell me you know nothing about women’s sports without telling me you know nothing about women’s sports.

Did you watch the match? The best ECNL teams could compete against either WFU or UNC. Neither UNC nor WFU could hold a candle to the Houston Dash.

The college soccer technical skills is seriously lacking. It is no longer a stepping stone or development stage for pro-soccer. They just aren’t doing the right sort of work at that level to create pro-level talent. If you can’t see that, you know nothing about soccer.

College sports has never been a developmental stage for pros in any sport. Just because it’s where players sometimes go first does not make it developmental. College coaches are just trying to win games. That is their job and they’ll lose it otherwise. Every coaching decision they make is to win games. As it should be. Rosters, playing time, positions, game strategy, recruiting.

The only ones with any vested interest in true development for the pros would be the pro teams themselves. Not because they love the game of soccer but because they want to win games.

That's the weird thing. Both college and pro coaches are just trying to win + development means nothing to either. However women's college soccer for the most part is just bad soccer. You'd think that eventually some of the top youth coaches that do play very good soccer would eventually filter up to college levels but they don't.

I think the issue with college sports is that it's all a who you know type of environment. Wins are important but knowing the dean on a first name basis is more important. This type of mentality trickles down into who gets recruited and which divisions colleges play in, etc etc etc.

Hopefully NCAA blowing up will bring a new environment.

What does bad soccer even mean to a college coach? There is only winning and losing. Winning is good for them.

Bad soccer is wins from playing a style that won't scale up. Yes you can win against terrible teams playing bootball. But no you will never beat good teams with bootball.

I agree with you at the end of the day wins are all that matter. If you can see a team that's winning but they're doing something that won't work against better teams that is bad soccer.

I think you have hit on it. Winning vs development. We are with a well known club. The club consistently underperforms at the younger ages and then tends to dominate at the older ages. At u13, we are not allowed to punt. Period. We are forced to play out of the back EVERY SINGLE TIME and then opposing teams catch on and jump lanes. This drives the parents nuts but they are prioritizing development over wins. Then there are teams we play every year that have 2-3 dominate athletes, usually a CB, a 9 and maybe an 8 or 6. They do exactly what you are talking about. kick the ball long to their fast 9 and hope for a lucky bounce or a mistake from the opposing CB. But guess what, those teams start going down the standings as they get older. Punts and long ball connections against older teams start to decease significantly until it becomes almost a guaranteed turnover. So it is all in what you are trying to solve for. Yes you can win a ton of games playing boot ball, especially at the younger ages, and taht is fine, but give me an outside back that has had to play out of the back 1000 times by the time they are u17 every single time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is strategic, not something that will happen overnight.

When DA folded, ECNL was there, established, and had positioned themselves to take over the girls game.

That is the position GA is in right now. No one knows where college will be in the next 3+ years. Last I heard they were wanting to be governed by US Soccer as well…

1000% true.

Eventually NWSL is going to need to focus on the quality of the product they put on the field. Once this happens GA MLSN and US Soccer will be where they turn.

Lol. Why the GA?

Firstly because they are self sanctioned now, less red tape compared to ECNL.

Second, NWSL will get more of what it wants. ECNL doesn’t need a pro pathway, and they’re not setup for it, easier to set the pathway up from GA than a platform that is largely a scholarship program.

Third, have you seen women’s college soccer? It’s awful. Watch the national championship, first touches bouncing 8 yards like a u-little match. That is what academy soccer produces for NCAA. If you were NWSL wouldn’t you want a platform that you can shape almost ground up vs current brick-touch Academy soccer?

I assumed the atrocious technical skills at the “top” local clubs was a reflection of the DMV ECNL-G programs and things were different in the bigger US soccer markets, but, after watching several women’s games in the NCAA tournament a few weeks ago, it seems to me we have a universal and systemic problem in the US. I don’t watch much NWSL, but it’s not like this in the pro women’s leagues in England and Spain. I’m not commenting on overall quality as it goes without saying that a pro in one of those leagues should be a better player than someone playing even in a top college program. I’m commenting on basic skills, like receiving the ball, that young adults should have developed years ago. But I don’t see how GA is any better positioned to fix things—there just aren’t enough good coaches in the US.

Outside of Real Madrid and Barcelona, NWSL teams are better than teams in the Spanish league. NWSL is also a better league than the English League based on quality of players and teams.

Nobody on UNC or Wake Forest could “receive the ball”? Please stop.

Tell me you know nothing about women’s sports without telling me you know nothing about women’s sports.

Did you watch the match? The best ECNL teams could compete against either WFU or UNC. Neither UNC nor WFU could hold a candle to the Houston Dash.

The college soccer technical skills is seriously lacking. It is no longer a stepping stone or development stage for pro-soccer. They just aren’t doing the right sort of work at that level to create pro-level talent. If you can’t see that, you know nothing about soccer.

College sports has never been a developmental stage for pros in any sport. Just because it’s where players sometimes go first does not make it developmental. College coaches are just trying to win games. That is their job and they’ll lose it otherwise. Every coaching decision they make is to win games. As it should be. Rosters, playing time, positions, game strategy, recruiting.

The only ones with any vested interest in true development for the pros would be the pro teams themselves. Not because they love the game of soccer but because they want to win games.

Are you under 35?

That’s the only reason why you’d think what you’d said is correct. There used to be a time when some leagues couldn’t take a kid until they had two years of college or turned a certain age.

[Anonymous]

Why most youth coaches or coaches in general don’t coach college…?

1) cause it’s who you know
2) job stability, why coach college and get paid anywhere from 40k-6 figures (rare) when you can get paid that coaching travel and won’t be fired for having a bad season..
3) recruiting is a hassle
4) travel

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is strategic, not something that will happen overnight.

When DA folded, ECNL was there, established, and had positioned themselves to take over the girls game.

That is the position GA is in right now. No one knows where college will be in the next 3+ years. Last I heard they were wanting to be governed by US Soccer as well…

1000% true.

Eventually NWSL is going to need to focus on the quality of the product they put on the field. Once this happens GA MLSN and US Soccer will be where they turn.

Lol. Why the GA?

Firstly because they are self sanctioned now, less red tape compared to ECNL.

Second, NWSL will get more of what it wants. ECNL doesn’t need a pro pathway, and they’re not setup for it, easier to set the pathway up from GA than a platform that is largely a scholarship program.

Third, have you seen women’s college soccer? It’s awful. Watch the national championship, first touches bouncing 8 yards like a u-little match. That is what academy soccer produces for NCAA. If you were NWSL wouldn’t you want a platform that you can shape almost ground up vs current brick-touch Academy soccer?

I assumed the atrocious technical skills at the “top” local clubs was a reflection of the DMV ECNL-G programs and things were different in the bigger US soccer markets, but, after watching several women’s games in the NCAA tournament a few weeks ago, it seems to me we have a universal and systemic problem in the US. I don’t watch much NWSL, but it’s not like this in the pro women’s leagues in England and Spain. I’m not commenting on overall quality as it goes without saying that a pro in one of those leagues should be a better player than someone playing even in a top college program. I’m commenting on basic skills, like receiving the ball, that young adults should have developed years ago. But I don’t see how GA is any better positioned to fix things—there just aren’t enough good coaches in the US.

Outside of Real Madrid and Barcelona, NWSL teams are better than teams in the Spanish league. NWSL is also a better league than the English League based on quality of players and teams.

Nobody on UNC or Wake Forest could “receive the ball”? Please stop.

Tell me you know nothing about women’s sports without telling me you know nothing about women’s sports.

Did you watch the match? The best ECNL teams could compete against either WFU or UNC. Neither UNC nor WFU could hold a candle to the Houston Dash.

The college soccer technical skills is seriously lacking. It is no longer a stepping stone or development stage for pro-soccer. They just aren’t doing the right sort of work at that level to create pro-level talent. If you can’t see that, you know nothing about soccer.

College sports has never been a developmental stage for pros in any sport. Just because it’s where players sometimes go first does not make it developmental. College coaches are just trying to win games. That is their job and they’ll lose it otherwise. Every coaching decision they make is to win games. As it should be. Rosters, playing time, positions, game strategy, recruiting.

The only ones with any vested interest in true development for the pros would be the pro teams themselves. Not because they love the game of soccer but because they want to win games.

Are you under 35?

That’s the only reason why you’d think what you’d said is correct. There used to be a time when some leagues couldn’t take a kid until they had two years of college or turned a certain age.

There is a difference between college being the path to the pros (which it has been), and college being for pro development. Even when it is the path players take to become pro, to college coaches, it’s still only about winning not developing players. College coaches recruit the players who can help them win, not someone they think can be developed to eventually be a good pro. They put players in positions to win games, not the positions that are best for their development. They give playing time to players to have the best chance to win, not equal time for players to develop. They’ll play a conservative boot and run strategy because it gives a better chance to win, not giving players a chance to get better at passing through the pressure. This is what I mean that college is not for development.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is strategic, not something that will happen overnight.

When DA folded, ECNL was there, established, and had positioned themselves to take over the girls game.

That is the position GA is in right now. No one knows where college will be in the next 3+ years. Last I heard they were wanting to be governed by US Soccer as well…

1000% true.

Eventually NWSL is going to need to focus on the quality of the product they put on the field. Once this happens GA MLSN and US Soccer will be where they turn.

Lol. Why the GA?

Firstly because they are self sanctioned now, less red tape compared to ECNL.

Second, NWSL will get more of what it wants. ECNL doesn’t need a pro pathway, and they’re not setup for it, easier to set the pathway up from GA than a platform that is largely a scholarship program.

Third, have you seen women’s college soccer? It’s awful. Watch the national championship, first touches bouncing 8 yards like a u-little match. That is what academy soccer produces for NCAA. If you were NWSL wouldn’t you want a platform that you can shape almost ground up vs current brick-touch Academy soccer?

I assumed the atrocious technical skills at the “top” local clubs was a reflection of the DMV ECNL-G programs and things were different in the bigger US soccer markets, but, after watching several women’s games in the NCAA tournament a few weeks ago, it seems to me we have a universal and systemic problem in the US. I don’t watch much NWSL, but it’s not like this in the pro women’s leagues in England and Spain. I’m not commenting on overall quality as it goes without saying that a pro in one of those leagues should be a better player than someone playing even in a top college program. I’m commenting on basic skills, like receiving the ball, that young adults should have developed years ago. But I don’t see how GA is any better positioned to fix things—there just aren’t enough good coaches in the US.

Outside of Real Madrid and Barcelona, NWSL teams are better than teams in the Spanish league. NWSL is also a better league than the English League based on quality of players and teams.

Nobody on UNC or Wake Forest could “receive the ball”? Please stop.

Tell me you know nothing about women’s sports without telling me you know nothing about women’s sports.

Oh the irony in your last sentence.

It is pretty clear that there are 8-10 teams in Europe that would win the NWSL year in and year out. The NWSL has parity, which is great, but no team in NWSL would win England, France, Spain league at this point.

Of the top 50 best womens footballers in the world. 10 play in the NWSL. 40 play in Europe…………

I think that's pretty wrong, but let's say you are right, what does that say about the current state of girls youth soccer in the U.S.? ECNL getting it done? Switching to SY going to change things? Title IX and the college system gave us a head start but is it good enough now?

I did not just make it up. You can quibble that it is Eurocentric list but I dont have much to argue against its accuracy.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/ng-interactive/2024/dec/03/the-100-best-female-footballers-in-the-world-2024

The WSL is an Academy structure. They start playing the club style at u12/u13 and they focus on technical as well as team play.

There is nothing fundamentally wrong with US style of soccer but it is still trying to “out athlete” or “send Trinity” style, which will work against the 2nd tier of nations. But what is more likely, that the US dominated womens soccer on the world stage for years because A) for some reason the US understood womens soccer better than Europe or B) that nobody in Europe cared about womens soccer?

Now that there is investment in the womens side of things (coaching, facilities, salaries) in Europe my bet is that the US will still be competitive but it wont dominate ever again.

I love the athlete that Rodman is but I could have made a 15 minute lowlight reel of her first touch in the Gold Cup games.

I am being a little facetious but I would take 11 Rose Lavelles over 11 Trinity Rodmans all day every day.

But that is just my opinion having been a coach, referee and dad to high level girls soccer players.

I like Trinity, you have to keep in mind that she's a huge natural talent that's a product of a US youth development process.

She could have been much much more. But what's to complain about she made it to the USWNT and NWSL.

Why shoot for perfection when good enough pays the bills.

This tangent started with a comment about GA paired with NWSL on a MLSN model potentially being able to develop players who are better prepared to play the evolving women’s professional game, which clearly is different than college kickball. Is there any reason to think the coaches in GA are suited to this? And don’t you need to start developing these technical skills much younger than U13?

Zero chance either ECNL or GA, regardless of affiliation, could ever standardize a curriculum. Too many egos, profit motives and conflicts of interest. USSF is honestly a joke. Might not be their fault because they dont get funded like other nations but it is the Wild West out there in girls youth soccer. Even the US ID scouts are all over the place. There is simply no standardization anywhere in the pyramid.

Do you think academies in England and Spain are following curriculums from their national governing body? It’s club by club.

DCUM. Full of “knowledgeable” parents.

So confidently incorrect……….

Yes, clubs have a club curriculum, but if you dont think the FA has MUCH more influence over the strategy for womens soccer development in the UK than USSF does in the US, you are 100% wrong.

I just laugh that you think USSF actually holds sway over Lavers/ECNL? He is openly contemptuous of USSF as is evidenced by almost everything he says on his podcast.

Just as one example of FA. They actually have a multi year strategy for development of women’s soccer. Rather than take shots at DCUM parents knowledge, try doing just the bare minimum of research before you clown yourself.

https://www.thefa.com/news/2024/sep/27/women-and-girls-stratgy-progress-inspiring-positive-change-20242709

I just laughed at you.

Thr FA should try to develop girls and womens soccer in England. After all, thry banned females from being able to play. They kind of need to do right by females.

[Anonymous]

SUSA (ECNL) just announced a partnership with Gotham FC (NWSL).

Will SUSA join GA now?

DD is little and I am trying to navigate all of this for her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:SUSA (ECNL) just announced a partnership with Gotham FC (NWSL).

Will SUSA join GA now?

DD is little and I am trying to navigate all of this for her.

I don't see why it would. "Gotham FC today announced the launch of Gotham FC Alliance, in which Gotham FC will team up with clubs in the local market and beyond to identify top youth talent and provide development opportunities to create a professional player pathway. " nothing in here about which league said clubs are affiliated with.

[Anonymous]

That’s step 1… watch what happens next

[Anonymous]

SUSA will stay ECNL, no reason to change. Plenty of ECNL clubs have a “pro” pathway, there are other leagues beside MLS. MLS clubs are also changing their system. Spending lots of money and not getting the return. NWSL will follow, have to be smart about where money is spent.

[Anonymous]

Same song and dance with leagues 🙄

https://www.mlssoccer.com/news/mls-partners-girls-academy-largest-all-girls-youth-soccer-organization-usa?fbclid=IwY2xjawHVWJ9leHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHfKWaZWT1cIr8QlYitDdFUVh3CW_cwkGDlQkGn4xD6762A-DKxWlcMC3XQ_aem_NM_KC5SK-Hkonr26U9h-Hg

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:That’s step 1… watch what happens next

Bingo.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:SUSA (ECNL) just announced a partnership with Gotham FC (NWSL).

Will SUSA join GA now?

DD is little and I am trying to navigate all of this for her.

NWSL doesn't seem to care about locking down youth talent under contract the way MLS does with the boys.

Because of this there's no clear path to NWSL for girls. All Berman (NWSL commissioner) seems to care about is new franchise clubs, getting cities to pay for exclusive NWSL stadiums, and TV contracts. I guess this makes sense in a growth phase. But eventually NSWL will need to focus on providing a better product on the field. This will mean youth players under contracts, acadamies, and homegrown player rules.

MLS is trying to provide leadership / assistance to NWSL via GA hopefully NWSL starts investing in soccer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That’s step 1… watch what happens next

Bingo.

This is the first step of fully funded NWSL academies playing in the GA. Watch out for step 2.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:SUSA (ECNL) just announced a partnership with Gotham FC (NWSL).

Will SUSA join GA now?

DD is little and I am trying to navigate all of this for her.

NWSL doesn't seem to care about locking down youth talent under contract the way MLS does with the boys.

Because of this there's no clear path to NWSL for girls. All Berman (NWSL commissioner) seems to care about is new franchise clubs, getting cities to pay for exclusive NWSL stadiums, and TV contracts. I guess this makes sense in a growth phase. But eventually NSWL will need to focus on providing a better product on the field. This will mean youth players under contracts, acadamies, and homegrown player rules.

MLS is trying to provide leadership / assistance to NWSL via GA hopefully NWSL starts investing in soccer.

NWSL only gets two spots for development projects currently. And they have to be picky about it because the requirements for care of minors come from FIFA, it’s an undertaking and investment. Gotham seems to be experimenting with this now that the draft is gone. It’s a good thing.

The long term solution is a proof of concept for minor development (ie Gotham model), expand the spots for minors once the foundation is built, and then add an academy so they can have B teams or 2nd tier teams (like Courage with USL) they can add more minors into for development.

Again, if people don’t see the groundwork being laid for this, and the GA elevation to the sanctioning level (peers with MLS, NWSL, etc) as well MLS partnership, Gotham expansion, Koge, OL entering in 2020 and adding an academy, Kang investment at YNT and TID, etc etc etc….if you cants see the momentum, writing on the wall, etc…you’re blind either willfully or ignorantly.