Can I ask. If you're screaming about teachers taking childcare leave

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just looked at the teachers' contract in the county I live in. It actually provides that teachers may be given a leave of absence, without pay, for up to two years for "child rearing." The leave being granted might be a matter of contract that is a benefit that teachers receive, but that other professions do not receive.

Does it say they can take it at any time? Anyway, I'm fine with it, particularly the "without pay" part.

Ditto. You've got a benefit that you are entitled to take. I haven't seen anyone mad about teachers taking benefits allowed to them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:FFS, daycares have been open for months now.

Going back should not have come as a surprise. It's poor planning on their part if they can't find childcare NOW at the last minute.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just looked at the teachers' contract in the county I live in. It actually provides that teachers may be given a leave of absence, without pay, for up to two years for "child rearing." The leave being granted might be a matter of contract that is a benefit that teachers receive, but that other professions do not receive.

Does it say they can take it at any time? Anyway, I'm fine with it, particularly the "without pay" part.

Ditto. You've got a benefit that you are entitled to take. I haven't seen anyone mad about teachers taking benefits allowed to them.

Certainly does put the lie to the idea that teachers are the most put-upon profession. Good salaries, good benefits, 10 month employment, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just looked at the teachers' contract in the county I live in. It actually provides that teachers may be given a leave of absence, without pay, for up to two years for "child rearing." The leave being granted might be a matter of contract that is a benefit that teachers receive, but that other professions do not receive.

Does it say they can take it at any time? Anyway, I'm fine with it, particularly the "without pay" part.

Ditto. You've got a benefit that you are entitled to take. I haven't seen anyone mad about teachers taking benefits allowed to them.

Certainly does put the lie to the idea that teachers are the most put-upon profession. Good salaries, good benefits, 10 month employment, etc.

That's it exactly. Teachers, and particular women as teachers who have their own childcare responsibilities, are given priority status that other working professionals are not. We are told, falsely in the DMV, that they are underpaid. In addition, while nothing would prevent teachers from using a benefit to which they are entitled, it is also not unreasonable to view their professionalism unfavorably, when taking advantage of the benefit has a harmful impact on the students. The most valued professionals in my office are not the ones who use every last hour of leave, regardless of how it impacts their performance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just looked at the teachers' contract in the county I live in. It actually provides that teachers may be given a leave of absence, without pay, for up to two years for "child rearing." The leave being granted might be a matter of contract that is a benefit that teachers receive, but that other professions do not receive.

Does it say they can take it at any time? Anyway, I'm fine with it, particularly the "without pay" part.

Ditto. You've got a benefit that you are entitled to take. I haven't seen anyone mad about teachers taking benefits allowed to them.

Certainly does put the lie to the idea that teachers are the most put-upon profession. Good salaries, good benefits, 10 month employment, etc.

That's it exactly. Teachers, and particular women as teachers who have their own childcare responsibilities, are given priority status that other working professionals are not. We are told, falsely in the DMV, that they are underpaid. In addition, while nothing would prevent teachers from using a benefit to which they are entitled, it is also not unreasonable to view their professionalism unfavorably, when taking advantage of the benefit has a harmful impact on the students. The most valued professionals in my office are not the ones who use every last hour of leave, regardless of how it impacts their performance.

+1

My child's teacher decided to take leave with just over a week to go before in-person. I do think that was unprofessional. She knew that this was coming for months.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just looked at the teachers' contract in the county I live in. It actually provides that teachers may be given a leave of absence, without pay, for up to two years for "child rearing." The leave being granted might be a matter of contract that is a benefit that teachers receive, but that other professions do not receive.

So negotiate for it. We should have more options like unpaid leave.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just looked at the teachers' contract in the county I live in. It actually provides that teachers may be given a leave of absence, without pay, for up to two years for "child rearing." The leave being granted might be a matter of contract that is a benefit that teachers receive, but that other professions do not receive.

So negotiate for it. We should have more options like unpaid leave.

And who would do the work when people take advantage of this unpaid leave? Just curious. It makes sense in teaching where someone can do the job and fill in for a year or two, but extended absences from the the workforce in other professions aren't as easy to address.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just looked at the teachers' contract in the county I live in. It actually provides that teachers may be given a leave of absence, without pay, for up to two years for "child rearing." The leave being granted might be a matter of contract that is a benefit that teachers receive, but that other professions do not receive.

So negotiate for it. We should have more options like unpaid leave.

And who would do the work when people take advantage of this unpaid leave? Just curious. It makes sense in teaching where someone can do the job and fill in for a year or two, but extended absences from the the workforce in other professions aren't as easy to address.

That would be specific to your employment Internet stranger. But we do have to push back in order to have the culture change. There should be more allowance for unpaid leave.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did you take parental leave for your children's birth? Do you think family leave is something that should only be offered to you and not other people? Or only in professions that aren't female dominated?

How does it feel, if you're a woman who has benefited from feminism to be on the other side?

I am not screaming about this or anything else. But I'd ask you, what were these teachers doing for childcare pre-Covid? Some teachers are saying they can't afford to pay for childcare, but are also saying that parents that have to work outside ( as more and more things continue to open) should go hire someone and stop complaining.

The few teachers who have had to quit are not complaining; they are taking the hit by leaving their jobs or taking a leave of absence. For many people, their pre-covid childcare plans have disappeared. Not sure why you would expect teachers to not have similar problems.

MOST of everyone's pre-covid childcare plans were public schooling. It's like the chicken or the egg problem. We all need every public school to open so that we ALL can return to work, teachers included.

People with young children did not have public school as an option. I think we seem to forget that school-aged children are not the only children out there. I know as a parent of a teenager, I sometimes do, but I see my all my friends with younger kids struggling, teachers and non-teachers. I think there needs to be more room for everyone for empathy and understanding that schools aren't closed to make our lives difficult.

PP here. I HAVE 2 toddlers and a Kindergartner. I had to make other arrangements when my daycare went bankrupt last June! This shouldn't still be an issue 9 months later.

[Anonymous]

It also occurs to me that if OP would like to continue virtual teaching because of a young child not yet in school, what she's really saying is that (perhaps indirectly) some other person (likely a woman) should have to quit/go broke/etc for her. How very feminist!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It also occurs to me that if OP would like to continue virtual teaching because of a young child not yet in school, what she's really saying is that (perhaps indirectly) some other person (likely a woman) should have to quit/go broke/etc for her. How very feminist!

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It also occurs to me that if OP would like to continue virtual teaching because of a young child not yet in school, what she's really saying is that (perhaps indirectly) some other person (likely a woman) should have to quit/go broke/etc for her. How very feminist!

The answer to all of this is that an individual's job should be subject to a level of professionalism, absent emergency circumstances, but general leave policies require systemic support. Individuals in a workforce cannot enter and exit at random without collateral consequences. Emergencies, like a spouse having a stroke or a child needing cancer treatment, require co-workers to step up to fill the hole to allow a co-worker to address those family needs. Leave granted for reasons like I'm not going to bother to find childcare for a few months is less professional and more likely to be received unsympathetically. Take your leave, but don't complain when the public doesn't respect your profession.

As a feminist, a working mother, and a committed public servant, I feel strongly that we should not demand accommodations for family without holding up our end of the bargain as professionals. I work in a low paid, public interest job and have great benefits and liberal leave policies. Sometimes, my job requires me to work well in excess of my scheduled hours and to outsource family help that I really can't afford. I do it, because I value the unique benefits I have, the stable nature of my employment, and because I'm committed to the stakeholders I serve. Approaching your profession as a victim, convinced you are undervalued and taken advantage of tends to make your performance worse. I think that's the way it is for many teachers. They feel disrespected, undervalued, and act accordingly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It also occurs to me that if OP would like to continue virtual teaching because of a young child not yet in school, what she's really saying is that (perhaps indirectly) some other person (likely a woman) should have to quit/go broke/etc for her. How very feminist!

The answer to all of this is that an individual's job should be subject to a level of professionalism, absent emergency circumstances, but general leave policies require systemic support. Individuals in a workforce cannot enter and exit at random without collateral consequences. Emergencies, like a spouse having a stroke or a child needing cancer treatment, require co-workers to step up to fill the hole to allow a co-worker to address those family needs. Leave granted for reasons like I'm not going to bother to find childcare for a few months is less professional and more likely to be received unsympathetically. Take your leave, but don't complain when the public doesn't respect your profession.

As a feminist, a working mother, and a committed public servant, I feel strongly that we should not demand accommodations for family without holding up our end of the bargain as professionals. I work in a low paid, public interest job and have great benefits and liberal leave policies. Sometimes, my job requires me to work well in excess of my scheduled hours and to outsource family help that I really can't afford. I do it, because I value the unique benefits I have, the stable nature of my employment, and because I'm committed to the stakeholders I serve. Approaching your profession as a victim, convinced you are undervalued and taken advantage of tends to make your performance worse. I think that's the way it is for many teachers. They feel disrespected, undervalued, and act accordingly.

+1 and teachers are acting very victimized here, as though they are not being treated exactly like (and maybe a bit better than) the majority of people who go to work in person at least some of the time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just looked at the teachers' contract in the county I live in. It actually provides that teachers may be given a leave of absence, without pay, for up to two years for "child rearing." The leave being granted might be a matter of contract that is a benefit that teachers receive, but that other professions do not receive.

So negotiate for it. We should have more options like unpaid leave.

And who would do the work when people take advantage of this unpaid leave? Just curious. It makes sense in teaching where someone can do the job and fill in for a year or two, but extended absences from the the workforce in other professions aren't as easy to address.

I wonder how employers in Canada manage? 12 - 18 months leave.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think this is the childcare leave people are talking about. Parents have been unable to work because teachers aren't back in person. Teachers and school districts have no sympathy- they said to hire childcare. And now teachers are saying they can't work because of daycare and childcare issues.

Yes, this.

Yes, the issue is teachers saying they can't work because they have kids at home. It's mindblowing.

"Parental leave" is generally related to birth or adoption of a newborn. Is that what OP is talking about? Because I don't see anyone in the schools debate talking about preventing people from taking leave related to a newborn.

I asked if people who took Parental Leave realize the hypocrisy of then protesting when people take other types of FMLA leave.

It doesn't surprise me, I got attacked here for making a comment about taking FMLA when my child had a fatal degenerative disorder, and was told that people only supported it for healthy newborns.

The OP is probably long gone here, but I really wonder what the story is here.

OP, if started your post talking about FMLA leave, I think you would have mostly gotten support. But instead you seemed to be equating parental leave (which is generally understood to mean shortly after birth for recovery and bonding) with "childcare leave." And then later equating that to FMLA.

I've never heard anyone call leave taken for the purposes of caring for a sick child "childcare leave." Childcare leave instead sounds like leave taken because you don't have a childcare provider. In general, that would not be covered by FMLA unless the child needs care due to a serious health condition.

FMLA for newborns/adoption, or other forms of parental leave, are not intended as entitlements to help people avoid child care costs. I do recognize some people look at that as a side (or perhaps even the primary benefit), but the intended benefit is to give parents time to form a bond with a new child, for which there is reasonably good evidence supporting the benefits of that for development, health and safety of the child.

So, FMLA is not intended to be a catch-all covering all cases where parents want to keep their jobs, but don't want to seek alternative child care arrangements. And specifically, even in the time of COVID, FMLA is for caring for a family member that is already sick, not for avoiding exposure in the first place. I wonder if that is really what the OP is running into.