Independent schools and "advanced" kids: national problem?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Of course you're not impressed -- it's actual data that doesn't fit your preconceived claim. I'll wait for you to post some counter-data.

Different poster here. Isn't the counter-data in your own link? TPMS beats the privates, only Sidwell comes close, and even then it's behind by a notch or two.

It depends on what you're trying to claim. If your claim is that some public schools (for instance a math magnet like TPMS) can outperform all privates in math, you've got no argument from me. We're in agreement. But if your claim is that even top private schools provide sub-standard math education, then I think the contest results are inconsistent with your claim.

My view is that both private schools and public schools can (and do) provide solid education. I'd think that's not a very controversial position. But it seems like some on this thread were trying to claim that private schools cannot provide a solid education. I think they're flat wrong.

Quick question: Did all the schools participate? Did all students participate? These academic contests are taken seriously by some schools, and completely ignored by others. What is our sample here?

No idea. I just have the same contest results as you. I can draw certain inferences from those results, but not much different than you could.

[Anonymous]

To my knowledge or review no one has stated area private schools do not provide a solid education. Private school boosters have this noxious habit of assigning these imaginary conclusions to data and facts about comparative performance of magnet schools in the area.

For all the private school boosters : these schools do provide a solid education in the context of the potpouri of American education.

[Anonymous]

It's a "national problem" that some people prefer a true liberal arts education free from excessive testing and with the benefit of small class sizes rather than attending a MoCo magnet school education?!!! Please.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Your argument seems to be shifting. Previously, someone (you?) was claiming that private schools cannot provide a solid education. Now, are you shifting to just claiming that public better, while recognizing that privates can provide solid education? If that's your new position, then maybe we're a little closer to agreeing. I'd agree that some publics are better than some privates. But I don't think it makes much sense to generalize, since each school is different.

I challenge you to retrieve the post claiming that private schools "cannot provide a solid education". Do not insinuate your conclusions as the words of other posters. Simply provide the quote.

Here are a few examples for you.

So for a bright child, it is simply better to attend MoCo elementary and certainly their magnets in elementary and middle than even the best independent school. I think a number of threads have now made this clear. I am confused by how many people we know, who are leaders in their fields, choose Big 3 schools.

To answer the question in much broader terms, yes this is a problem, and it's one reason why the US isn't producing top scholars in math. Math instruction in the US, compared to the rest of the world, is weak, and my impression is that it is weaker still in independent schools.

In yesteryear, this outside performance meant nothing compared to the near guarantee of an Ivy league education and a rich social network of connections for life. Those were high barriers to scale ...even for the best public schools. Today, with entitlements dying a slow death on the Ivy vine and higher demands for performance and accountability, private schools had better get off their laurels and innovate lest many will fold.

[Anonymous]

Just curious. I wonder does the PP think these statements are plainly false and inaccurate?

[Anonymous]

So for a bright child, it is simply better to attend MoCo elementary and certainly their magnets in elementary and middle than even the best independent school. I think a number of threads have now made this clear. I am confused by how many people we know, who are leaders in their fields, choose Big 3 schools.

The above statement seems attributable to a Big 3 and not a TJ booster.

Confused as usual.

[Anonymous]

This is getting very confusing. I don't know if some posts are sarcastic or not, so they lose meaning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Your argument seems to be shifting. Previously, someone (you?) was claiming that private schools cannot provide a solid education. Now, are you shifting to just claiming that public better, while recognizing that privates can provide solid education? If that's your new position, then maybe we're a little closer to agreeing. I'd agree that some publics are better than some privates. But I don't think it makes much sense to generalize, since each school is different.
I challenge you to retrieve the post claiming that private schools "cannot provide a solid education". Do not insinuate your conclusions as the words of other posters. Simply provide the quote.

Here are a few examples for you.
So for a bright child, it is simply better to attend MoCo elementary and certainly their magnets in elementary and middle than even the best independent school. I think a number of threads have now made this clear. I am confused by how many people we know, who are leaders in their fields, choose Big 3 schools.
To answer the question in much broader terms, yes this is a problem, and it's one reason why the US isn't producing top scholars in math. Math instruction in the US, compared to the rest of the world, is weak, and my impression is that it is weaker still in independent schools.
In yesteryear, this outside performance meant nothing compared to the near guarantee of an Ivy league education and a rich social network of connections for life. Those were high barriers to scale ...even for the best public schools. Today, with entitlements dying a slow death on the Ivy vine and higher demands for performance and accountability, private schools had better get off their laurels and innovate lest many will fold.

I still can't find where a poster says private schools do not provide a solid education vis a vis public school magnets. What is your definition of solid education?

[Anonymous]

If public school boosters want to boost -- the proper forum for that is on the public school forum choices of DC, MD & Va...not here. Of course private schools are better..but it's ok if you want to save your money...just say so

[Anonymous]

I honestly don't think that many people that send their kids to private school care that much about test scores, statistics, etc. It seems that public school boosters are frequently presenting statistics about how great the magnet schools/TJ/Blair are. Many parents, including me, like the whole package that many private schools provide...... the culture, the traditions, the individualized attention, the emphasis on ethics/morality, the high motivation of almost all the students, the involved and accomplished parents, the small classes, the future network of accomplished adults, the fact that everyone goes to college, no "teaching to the test," the beauty of the facilities, the college counseling.....
For most of the well known DC prep schools, the excellent academics are a given. I know there are a lot of good public schools, but they don't offer the benefits that I mentioned above. Maybe you either are or are not a fan of private school - - I just don't think that test scores/statistics are useful in the private/public school debate. Now if I saw evidence that a particular private school was consistenly having problems getting their students into good colleges I might have second thoughts.

[Anonymous]

I agree pp -- it's the whole package we were after and it worked for us. We wanted a place where our daughter was treated as a person and not a statistic.

[Anonymous]

Go for it private school booster. Why all the concern about Big 3, Little 3, and Bottom 3 ? entry to Ivy ? etc. If private schools are better why the need for the granularity? From what I am reading some area private schools are lousy and some are very good. Is my analysis upside down?

[Anonymous]

This is a private school thread afterall...if you want to boost for TJ or Blair or some public school in DC -- go to those threads.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If public school boosters want to boost -- the proper forum for that is on the public school forum choices of DC, MD & Va...not here. Of course private schools are better..but it's ok if you want to save your money...just say so

The relevant question is not whether private vs. public provides a better education for on-level or one-level-above kids. The question is, which provides a better education for "advanced" kids, i.e. two or more levels above grade level.


No question, the top privates provide a great education for kids who are on-level or one level above. For these kids, you can compare top privates to public, and start arguing about the merits of smaller class sizes, less testing, the value of connections versus what is real diversity (and no, I don't actually want to go there, just throwing out some hypotheticals). You could also start asking whether some of the less competitive privates are really better than publics, depending on your public options (but I don't want to go there, either).

But for kids who are "advanced" to 2 or more levels - which is OP's question I believe - there is also no question that public magnets do better. It's not a question of boosting the public magnets, either. Just a fact that magnets are willing to accelerate to meet the needs of advanced kids, further and faster than the privates are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's a "national problem" that some people prefer a true liberal arts education free from excessive testing and with the benefit of small class sizes rather than attending a MoCo magnet school education?!!! Please.

Prepping for tests is not a big deal in the MoCo magnets, because they assume the kids will pass anyway. We haven't seen any test prep so far this year, with kids in two magnets.